British Airways - 2

[The SSK]

A couple of insights here
On BA
BA plunges to £148m loss - can Walsh stop the rot? news by Email - Management Today
And on Ryanair
Ryanair loses traction. Time to leave home? | Centre for Asia Pacific Aviation

[6chimes]

MPH

I think what Sweetie76 is alluding to, is that BA are in the business of carrying passengers/cargo on a fleet of a/c that they have bought for that long term use and offload them when they have reached a grand old age. Their business has always been about offering the passengers a class of their choice and a price to match.

Ryanair on the other hand make their money in a very different way. Their passenger revenues make up much less of the percentage than BA. The buying and selling of a/c makes Ryanair a fortune, only carrying passengers to while away the hours before they flog the a/c. Very clever and smart. Although the current crisis has created a lot of headaches for MOL on the selling side.

You can only compare the two companies from the point of view, that they fly airplanes. Which is like comparing The Holiday Inn, Express and The Marriott chain. We all love getting a bargain when you just want to get your head down, when your after quality, where do you go if they have all gone bust? It seems that a lot of people are really enjoying watching BA suffer, which is very sad. You may well turn around one day and find that the only option you ever have is the MOL style of customer service.

6

[foxy2600]

Pricing themselves out of the market

I used to work for BA (retd.) and as such can still get Hotlines.
Take LHR-JNB-LHR on Business. SAA Business class is OK, fit for purpose, sleeper seats etc. £2944 BA Hotline Club £3564 !!! It's the old British Rail syndrome. Put the prices up because we're losing money. Incidentally the dates I put in were 14th August 23rd August - I notice the days before (13/22) are sold out on SAA. Virgin's usually cheaper although I don't like the product, not really flat beds.

So what's the difference? Ancient B747-400, competing with A340-200 running on fresh air? Staffing levels?

Maybe I'm comparing apples with oranges, but at times like these a full Business Class at competitive prices has got to be better than empty aircraft.

[asyncio]

The crazy thing is that BA share price has gone up by around 6% today!
Does that mean the market were expecting worse?

It seems to be more a case of, "At least we are doing better than the French"

July 31 (Bloomberg) -- British Airways Plc rose the most
in 12 weeks after the carrier said passenger numbers and seat
occupancy are showing signs of improvement, suggesting it may
recover from the recession faster than Air France-KLM Group.

British Airways had a 106 million-pound ($175 million)
net loss in the three months through June, it said today. Air
France lost 431 million euros ($608 million), more than the 194
million euros expected by analysts. The stock fell 4.1 percent.
...

[Falcon666]

Losing a client not a customer

Flew GVA-LTN with Easy on Wednesday night.
Guy next to me came out to GVA in the morning for an important meeting .Flew BA.
Flight was evidently delayed so meeting over ran.
Guy comes back to GVA airport in the evening and tries to change to next BA Flight as he missed the original return.
Lady/Gent at Customer services was obviously so rude.Wouldnt change to next flight or give him credit.Wanted £198 for Flight to LHR.
Guy went to Easyjet and got on LTN Flight for £109.

Guy was so incensed he was drafting a memo to staff on the Flight to say only use BA when there is no alternative carrier.
His staff=800 people.Works for a prestigous company

A319 left for LHR with 56pax i think.Easy with more than double and loads of suits.
He explained that the reasons he flew regularily with BA was they were always were helpful-now they are no better than a LCC

You want to know where its all going wrong for BA

Comments please?

[darren1]

This sorry tale just about sums up BA.

I wonder if they will still be around in 12 months time, do they actually realise their are other airlines out there that people will actually fly on or are the BA board still stuck in some kind of bubble?

[IB4138]

the National carrier

They may still call themselves that cloud1, but they haven't been for a number of year now.

I said the appointment of Walsh was a major mistake from the outset and I'm being proved right. He has now been reduced to reactionary measures. There is nothing proactive to stem the tide coming from him.

[MUFC_fan]

I must say, for a pioneering airline, espcially at the front of the aicraft over the past 20 years it does seem the airline has come down hill some what lately.

London is the premier international city of the world and Heathrow an airport to match - the main airline serving it should be of the highest standard.

[Skipness One Echo]

Lady/Gent at Customer services was obviously so rude.Wouldnt change to next flight or give him credit.Wanted £198 for Flight to LHR.

Hang on. He missed his flight due to his own time management and got sniffy when they wanted to get him to pay for a new ticket for another flight?
That's madness. BA are doomed charging people for new tickets!

IB4138 when was the last time, say post 1987 when BA referred to themselves as the national carrier?

[Spotter LBA]

I think if you read the full original statement about BA you will notice that his meeting over ran because BA got the passenger out late for his meeting!

I know that this is still no excuse for missing your return flight. However I do feel that it is at these kind of occassions that whoever dealt with this gentleman at the check-in desk could have been a little more flexible.

[IB4138]

Sorry skippy.

They actually now refer to themselves as wishing to firmly establish

British Airways as the world’s leading global premium airline.

to quote the Irishman in his annual report. So he must think they are in that class, when many know they are clearly not.

Dillusions of grandeur, me thinks.

[warkman]

And Willy Walsh's "enhancements" keep on coming!

From 7th October 2009 for tickets booked and travelled from that date, BA are REDUCING the baggage allowance in Economy from 2 x 23KG each to ONE x 23Kg per person


British Airways - New baggage policy

[Just Browsing]

EasyJet's flights are full of suits (except Spanish destinations). It's simple, regional airports from the UK, good price, normally on time, friendly crew, safe operation. If there's an earlier flight and you want to take it, you can, small admin charge only. If you want to take a later flight, you can, difference in fare only. Who needs a meal or free drink? Is it really that important on a short haul flight? In any case, you can always bring your own on board if you don't fancy buying something from easyJet.

It's simply, it works, it's successful. I'm afraid travelling for most is no longer about the journey, it's about being there. EasyJet, Ryanair, and others recognise that, BA doesn't - but they desperately need to.

[Skipness One Echo]

I agree that the easyJet model has been adapted well so that it is a great idea for business. No one in our firmwould balk at flying easyJet, Ryanair is a different matter but that's business. Oddly enough, out of Gatwick on the domestics, BA are often cheaper, which suggests the Orange brigade are getting the yield and the loads as the higher costs remain with BA.

[SCANDIC]

Does anyone think that BA will go under, or whether they will chop the Man -Lgw routes

[MUFC_fan]

No and no (latter dependant on the long haul future of BA at LGW which looks OK at the moment.

The Future? | Bizcovering

Could BA look at this to increase future revenue and reduce costs or is even this a step too far for BA?

[stormin norman]

I very much doubt BA will go under,however its needs to get a move on in its preservation of cash.

I flew longhaul them last week.The round trip went flawlessly with T5 again exceeding expectations.The on board product was good (except the IFE with its limited choice)
Crew were excellent and bags inside the baggage hall before the passengers.

As long as WW doesn't let the product decline they should be a good investment for the future.

[nospeedrestriction9]

Warkman, the "Global Premium Airline" means exactly that.... Premium.

Since when does the ECONOMY baggage allowance relate to Premium? It's economy, a low margin high volume segment.... probably with very little profit.

Its the first and business class sales that will bring home the bacon for BA, therefore the future strategy concentrating on these segments. When BA now has to compete on price with low cost carriers, more so than it has done in the past why should it carry excess baggage galore on short haul flights?

When airlines are loosing so much money and I believe AF KLM reported -9% recently its only natural that Walsh will look for more opportunities to plug the revenue gap... the world has changed and every airline has to change with it.

[DarkStar]

I wonder now if BA looks back at its decision to ditch 'Go' and thinks it was so shortsighted. Shorthaul ws never a big money spinner, the transfer traffic never stood a chance of working with BA's operation split into T1/4 and LGW and now its just as fragmented.

Hindsight is a wonderful thing but BA had little foresight.

[Skipness One Echo]

I wonder now if BA looks back at its decision to ditch 'Go' and thinks it was so shortsighted. Shorthaul ws never a big money spinner, the transfer traffic never stood a chance of working with BA's operation split into T1/4 and LGW and now its just as fragmented.
Hindsight is a wonderful thing but BA had little foresight.

Go was competing against BA short haul. If they had dumped short haul then long haul feed dies. You say things are fragmented, based on what? They had a succesful year last year posting the highest profits in memory paid a shareholder dividend for the first time in years. Terminal 5 is now working really well. Yet you advocate building up a Stansted based low cost airline to eat into and undermine the core BA operation to compete head on with a much bigger and angrier Ryanair. BA can't run short haul well, ( Brymon / British Regional / BA Connect / CityFlyer / Manx etc etc )but up till recently they could just about run a premium long haul airline being fed from a central hub.

Then of course the market they were focussed on died.... I don't think Go is the answer somehow.