CORK - 5

[boyzinblue]

Tomorrow FR are to make a base announcement in Cologne/Bonn, so maybe they want to spoil a possible Germanwings route.

[Hangar6]

FR and Eastern Europe

How's FR doing vv Whizz , too early to tell ? I really hope Whizz are not displaced here by FR moves onto these routes

[dublinaviator]

Originally Posted by Hangar6

How's FR doing vv Whizz , too early to tell ? I really hope Whizz are not displaced here by FR moves onto these routes

I hope they are considering they poached managers from Ryanair with the intention of starting a price war with them.

Wizz Air deserve everything coming their way from Ryanair.

[Hangar6]

FR and Whizz

I think FR were set up by managers from other Airlines but I take ure point its dog eat dog out there , hard to know which of these two are worst , but for the sake of ORK I hope the end game is neither carrier flying these routes as IF Whizz get muscled off , FR will always move off to the next challenge, still short term the fares will be competitive

[ryan2000]

A slot control meeting next week will advance a decision on Cork Frankfurt. Wizzair loads holding up so far and Ryanair also reasonably good but as always it's yield that is crucial. I hope people who desert Wizz for Ryanair realise that the end game might be just one carrier and higher fares.

It seems that Ryanair's Cork Krakow flighis attracting Irish City breakers most of whom probably never heard of Wizzair so that'll be an added bonus for them.

[840]

I doubt Ryanair would announce an entire base at Cologne-Bonn just to upset GermanWings if they were planning CGN-ORK.

However, if Ryanair did announce a base there, it's likely that CGN-DUB would be one of the routes announced. That could provide incentive for GermanWings to direct Irish business away from DUB.

[francis omahony]

Movements
The IAA figures for October show increase movements at
the three state airports
Dublin+10.5% 470 daily movements
Cork +1.5% 60 "" ""
Snn -12.9% 50 "" ""

[Jack1985]

I hope they are considering they poached managers from Ryanair with the intention of starting a price war with them.

Wizz Air deserve everything coming their way from Ryanair.

Fairly pro-Ryanair statement there. What was actually wrong with Wizz Air recruiting Ryanair staff? And what's wrong with Wizz Air starting a price war with Ryanair and also why do Wizz deserve everything they are getting?

Wizz are holding there own and are not leaving without a fight. I think you're forgetting dublinaviator how many poles actually flock to Cork just to travel with Wizz its something the Poles are noted for ''supporting their own'' even though Wizz is actually a hungarian airline. I believe however its due to the fact they are based all over Poland and have opened up the market thus have earned a certain loyalty to many Poles. For example ORK-POZ operates 2X weekly, DUB-POZ operate 2X Weekly. Wizz carries a better load factor ex-Cork and that's available to see on the CSO website. The fact people aren't flocking to the most accessible airport in the state and are flying ex-Cork says a lot about what I have said here.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with the recruitment of Ryanair staff by Wizz. It's a credit to them they are ultimately trying to achieve a lower cost base then Ryanair thus being able to competitively compete. How could you say that's wrong and they deserve everything they get? They're a business trying to survive and adapt to a brutal form of competitor that is Ryanair.

Wizz will survive in some shape or form ex-Cork, we will probably see routes go but the only success I'm hearing Ryanair have had so far is Krakow down to Irish passengers and not Poles.

[SNNFlyer]

I don't agree at all that "Poles are known for supporting their own" - they simply aren't. To my knowledge, and without sounding like I'm generalising, the Polish community in Ireland have a great eye for a bargain and have no problem traversing the country to save a few euros. At a recent wedding I attended in Poland, the majority of the Polish contingency travelled from ORK with Wizz whilst the Irish flew with Ryanair from Dublin. Why? The flight times from ORK were inhumane, and I felt I bit more confortable, brand-recognition wise, with RYR. There was little in the price difference.

Another noteworthy point is that Wizz offers flexible methods of booking flights for those without credit/debit cards, including bank transfer and using a Wizz account (WIZZ Account). Again, from my experience, credit cards are not as common in Poland as they are here. In addition, until now, Wizzair maintained a healthy monopoly on most of Polish routes from the Munster region, since Limerick, which has a very large Polish population, lost all-but-one of their RYR Polish routes.

That said, I firmly don't believe there are room for both these operators - RYR will wipe the floor with Wizz.

[dublinaviator]

Fairly pro-Ryanair statement there. What was actually wrong with Wizz Air recruiting Ryanair staff? And what's wrong with Wizz Air starting a price war with Ryanair and also why do Wizz deserve everything they are getting?

Wizz are holding there own and are not leaving without a fight. I think you're forgetting dublinaviator how many poles actually flock to Cork just to travel with Wizz its something the Poles are noted for ''supporting their own'' even though Wizz is actually a hungarian airline. I believe however its due to the fact they are based all over Poland and have opened up the market thus have earned a certain loyalty to many Poles. For example ORK-POZ operates 2X weekly, DUB-POZ operate 2X Weekly. Wizz carries a better load factor ex-Cork and that's available to see on the CSO website. The fact people aren't flocking to the most accessible airport in the state and are flying ex-Cork says a lot about what I have said here.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with the recruitment of Ryanair staff by Wizz. It's a credit to them they are ultimately trying to achieve a lower cost base then Ryanair thus being able to competitively compete. How could you say that's wrong and they deserve everything they get? They're a business trying to survive and adapt to a brutal form of competitor that is Ryanair.

Wizz will survive in some shape or form ex-Cork, we will probably see routes go but the only success I'm hearing Ryanair have had so far is Krakow down to Irish passengers and not Poles.

Never said they did anything wrong. But they started this price war, and poached managers from Ryanair with the intention of starting a price war. So I'm just pointing out this isn't Ryanair ruthlessly going after competition and then pulling out themselves, they're just retaliating against what Wizz Air started. So that's why I say they deserve whatever they get, because they went from avoiding Ryanair to suddenly competing with them head on and starting a price war. So I've no sympathy for them when they have to go up against Ryanair's response, which in this case is to go head-to-head on nearly every route out of Cork and undercut them.

[ryan2000]

Cork Frankfurt issue likely to be decided after a slot control meeting neXt week. 2 existing routes from Cork under threat.

[Tom the Tenor]

Any ideas what the existing routes are which may be under threat because I feel most if not all of the past summer's routes from Cork by EI have been pretty good performers and it would be a blow to the airport if some good performing routes were lost for the sake of Frankfurt which I suppose will do okay but somehow will hardly be a top performer? I cant make up my mind on Frankfurt to tell the truth - good for inbound Germans whom would hopefully spend some cash in the Cork area.

[ryan2000]

Problem is that Aerlingus are constrained by the fact that they've only 4 aircraft at Cork so if they introduce a new route it has to be at the expense of an existing one. Ideally their routes should be sustainable on a year round basis which might stop them from going back to 3 aircraft in the Winter.

[BlueSki]

Tomorrows EI712 to LHR and back is cancelled due to forecasted fog in London

[BlueSki]

The Ryanair summer routes to the likes if ALC, LRH and CCF aren't for sale yet. Will they becoming back for 2013? If they do does this mean they'll base a third aircraft in Cork for June, July and August?

[DublinPole]

The problem Wizz have on the Polish routes is that they are generally not flying much of a mix of passengers, for example whilst on Wizz you'll get 95% of passengers who are either Polish living in Poland, or Polish living in Ireland. On Ryanair there is a much more diverse passenger rang and better brand recognition overall, although I do agree W6 is stronger in Poland etc but not by such a large margin as RYR is stronger in Western Europe.

I was on one of the first flights from Warsaw to Cork myself, about 130 passengers on it, the same day as a Wizz flight, and I'd say the mix was about 30% Irish 70% Polish, I've flew with both airlines extensively over the past few years and seen this kind of thing bore out time and time again. I've never seen anything like that on a Wizz flight.

As stated previously on the Wizz thread, all of this war was started actually by Wizzair who was the first to try and duplicate a copy of RYR flights, one of the first was Lodz to Luton to compete with RYR to Stansted, and a couple more, it wasn't before this that Ryanair reacted back. Besides, you'll find that Ryanair are present in every city which has an airport in Poland,

I would expect Cork to Krakow to be the biggest success though for Ryanair, as however much W6 try to dress up Katowice, it isn't Krakow. As for the rest the jury is still out.

Oh, and don't underestimate the impact of Wizz's new cabin bag charging policy, thats annoyed a fair few people.

[Mayfly1]

Hi anyone know Cork airport managements position on Shannon's big plans for independence , aviation parks, thousands of jobs as stated by Minister Noonan yesterday and all the heavy weight task forces up there at the moment fixing their woes?
All of this must have serious competitive impact on Cork's future attractiveness for both existing and future carriers?
Or are airport management being muffled by the powers that be in Dublin?

[CCR]

Think Dublin airport is more of a competitor to Cork airport these days with the new motorway. The amount of people taking the overnight buses to Dublin airport to catch the early morning flights is phenomenal.
The state of the road between Mallow and county Limerick deters many people in Cork traveling to Shannon and vice versa.

[Tom the Tenor]

The new Ryanair Krakow service from Cork appears to be performing well from accounts which have come my way in the last week or so - last Friday afternoon's flight which, incidentally, diverted to Katowice due to fog (!!) at Krakow was jammed and yesterday's flight from Krakow to Cork was also near to full so it looks like Cork people are using the service as a new winter weekend break destination - starved as they are from not too many new weekend type destinations in recent years, I guess? I know that after yesterday's flight landed at Krakow the boarding began very quickly indeed so that may indicate the outbound load was on the lowish side. However, all in all Krakow has every chance of doing well in my opinion and this must be encouraging. So, Ryanair, any chance of Bratislava for Vienna!!?

Pretty, pretty, please even!

There is another interesting tale from yesterday at Cork Airport. What was probably Cork's longest ever bizjet flight occured yesterday when the fairly regularly Cork based A319CJ, G-NOAH, departed Cork around noon for the nearly nine hour non stop flight to Bridgetown, Barbados. Some feat when you think about it be it from Cork or indeed anywhere else.

The reconstruction work of Taxiway Charlie is continuing apace. The runway surface itself will probably need attention too in the not too distant future if, and it is a big if, funds allow. Out of curiousity, if the surface was to receive a nice new covering would it make a difference to the Pavement Classification Number?

Who knows, if it did, Cork may on occasion be in line to receive the odd KLM 777 diversion if required!

[ryan2000]

Cork records

The record distance from Cork is probably held by the Air Atlanta 767 which operated a Passenger Charter direct to the Dominican Republic in 2002. A Quantas 744 operated a Charter to from Cork to Heathrow in 2004 with around 100 pax but due to a fuel strike carried enough fuel to get it to Singapore!