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BA Direct Entry Pilot.

Old 17th Jun 2018, 13:18
  #4841 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: UK
Posts: 49
Originally Posted by Hans brinker View Post
Never thought I would say it but aviation is a dumpster for starting pilots in the EU compered to the US.
This is just plain wrong. I'm a newly qualified European pilot, married to an American so have the right to work in both the EU & US, so I've looked into this.

The main difference is that newly qualified cadets such as myself, rightly or wrongly, can get into the right hand seat of a commercial air liner with <200 hours. In the US (not sure on Canada) you have to do 1000 odd hours of instructing/crop dusting/parachute drops/banner towing for a hell of a lot less than a Ryanair FO. Ryanair and easyJet have or are ending the temporary/zero hour contracts, they're recognising unions and social security is built into our taxes. Now, I'm not saying their T&Cs are as good as the legacies, but I know where I would much rather do my first 1500 hours. And its my understanding from there you can get into any of the European majors off the street. In the US you have to go through a regional and have a university degree before the Majors will even look at you.
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Old 18th Jun 2018, 11:19
  #4842 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2017
Location: Hong Kong
Posts: 4
BA A320 DEP Assessment - any news regarding stage 3 (simulator assessment)?

Hi guys,

I attended stage 2 (interview and group exercise) of the A30 DEP First Officer recruitment offer on the 21st May, and I got an e-mail beginning of June telling me that I passed this stage.

However the mail was stating that there was no slot available at the moment for the next stage (simulator assessment).

Just to know, is there anyone here who is in the same position? Any idea about when these slots might be released? Anyone already invited for the upcoming sim assessment? During the lunch break at Waterside, we were told that the sim assessments would probably be in June but it seems that they are busy now, with all the applications received.

By the way, I would be more than happy to keep in touch with the persons who did their interview + group exercise on the 21st May or similar period. Feel free to send me an email. Would be nice to have a chat.

Thanks a lot in advance.

You canít use the Private Messaging system, add url links or images until you have an established posting history.
Guynemer is offline  
Old 18th Jun 2018, 15:10
  #4843 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Denver
Age: 53
Posts: 73
Originally Posted by am111 View Post
This is just plain wrong. I'm a newly qualified European pilot, married to an American so have the right to work in both the EU & US, so I've looked into this.

The main difference is that newly qualified cadets such as myself, rightly or wrongly, can get into the right hand seat of a commercial air liner with <200 hours. In the US (not sure on Canada) you have to do 1000 odd hours of instructing/crop dusting/parachute drops/banner towing for a hell of a lot less than a Ryanair FO. Ryanair and easyJet have or are ending the temporary/zero hour contracts, they're recognising unions and social security is built into our taxes. Now, I'm not saying their T&Cs are as good as the legacies, but I know where I would much rather do my first 1500 hours. And its my understanding from there you can get into any of the European majors off the street. In the US you have to go through a regional and have a university degree before the Majors will even look at you.
so it seems like ryr is finely being forced to improve, great! Also, yes you need a 4 year degree, but if you do an aviation degree you can get your flight training including ATP theory done during those 4 years, that takes a lot of people more than 2 years in the EU, yes you will not go directly into a legacy, but regional pays better than Ryanair. Maybe things are changing with the Lagacy carriers in the EU, but I personally donít know any who got hired there unless they were young and did the ďapprovedĒ school, in the USA people get hired by the mayors and nobody cares what flight school you did. I donít agree with the requirement for 1500 hours in the USA, flew with enough 200 hr guys to know that wonít make a difference. Having said that, it takes most people a year or so to get enough time after their college (1500 hrs is only for non college flight training), you make $15.000 or go to a LLC in the EU, pay Ä30.000 for a type rating and get a half year summer contract, (or a 5 year bond, so if you get that job offer, youíre still paying).
hans brinker is offline  
Old 18th Jun 2018, 16:05
  #4844 (permalink)  
VJW
Sciolist (look it up) of the first order
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: UK
Posts: 943
When did this turn into a USA vs EU thread?
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Old 18th Jun 2018, 19:40
  #4845 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Denver
Age: 53
Posts: 73
Originally Posted by VJW View Post
When did this turn into a USA vs EU thread?
Wish I knew?
hans brinker is offline  
Old 19th Jun 2018, 10:08
  #4846 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: On the side of the pitch!
Age: 44
Posts: 495
Anyway BA DEP recruitment.........Who cares about USA or EU, at BA post Brexit Britain concerns working in neither!
SinBin is offline  
Old 19th Jun 2018, 10:26
  #4847 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: FL370
Age: 34
Posts: 235
I would say less than a third of BA's recruitment comes from cadets and new flight school graduates. About 50% are probably DEPs from other airlines and the rest are probably Managed Path pilots leaving the military.
EMB-145LR is offline  
Old 3rd Jul 2018, 12:29
  #4848 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Sky
Posts: 466
Guys what were your scored before going to the day 1 test for verbal reasoning?
captain.weird is offline  
Old 4th Jul 2018, 17:15
  #4849 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Holland
Age: 36
Posts: 66
Mixed, sometimes good, sometimes bad. I would concentrate on finding a method of doing the questions as quickly as possible. When I was doing the practice ones I would read the whole passage then answer the questions, but I found this quite slow going as I'd end up rereading the passage about 3 or 4 times during the question answering process. I found it better to read the question then look in the passage for an answer as it usually was contained within one sentence.
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Old 4th Jul 2018, 17:39
  #4850 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: The Winchester
Posts: 5,913
Ladies/Gents...

I'll just chuck this into the mix for prospective joiners because I suspect some of you will no doubt be planning to "commute" to/from LHR, perhaps on a frequent basis...

Current inmates are aware that BA carried out an audit of peoples pre work travel arrangements a month or two back...the assurance given was that the idea was only to weed out and perhaps warn those who obviously fancied themselves as some later day Marco Polo.. . It now seems BA have perhaps taken a very hard line with a few and are going to sanction those who they feel have been, to use the phrase being thrown around a lot in this context.."taking the @@@@" with their travel plans.

Unfortunately ATM we have no idea as to exactly what the company are defining as "taking the @@@@" , i.e. at present we have no idea of the position of the line between what BA management think is acceptable and what they think is unacceptable in terms of a journey prior to report.....

So the point of this post is to warn that if asked at interview: "if we offer you a job where will you live? " ..the best answer might be: "Well, Windsor might be nice, but a bit expensive..but I've always fancied Hounslow or Longford"...

Once we've got a handle on what BA regard as acceptable I (or I'm sure somebody else) will post it here...

.

Last edited by wiggy; 6th Jul 2018 at 12:45.
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Old 6th Jul 2018, 06:08
  #4851 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 1999
Posts: 41
The net seems to be closing in on commuters who normally travel more than 90 minutes to work, by any mode of transport. BA may now effectively require these employees to position closer to LHR the day before a duty and stay overnight (at their own expense) to ensure they are seen to be adequately rested before report. An EASA recommendation may be implemented as a requirement.

The roster pattern, even on long haul, is trending towards only 2 days off between trips. This travel requirement could mean very few nights at home for those that live outside a normal 90 minute journey time.

Once BA management start a drive towards a goal they normally get what they want. Anyone considering joining BA should plan on a requirement to live within 90 minutes travelling time of report.
Pickled is offline  
Old 6th Jul 2018, 10:20
  #4852 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Leeds, UK
Posts: 281
BA probably woke up to the so called Marco Polo's when their Pilot got arrested for being drunk before a LH at Gatwick, and it turned out he'd commuted from JNB the night before! Shades of the ATR42 crash in Buffalo where the pilots commuted from all over the US then slept in crew room chairs. The NTSB was less than imprssed at the time.

G
groundbum is offline  
Old 6th Jul 2018, 11:42
  #4853 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Home
Posts: 947
The long commute has been going on for a long time in BA. Some 20 odd years ago as a junior B744 Capt. I turned up for a Dtw trip and was joined by the co-pilot at briefing. (2 pilot sector) First he got up my nose moaning about going to Dtw, he was very senior and spent his time in high allowance trips to Hkg and Nrt etc.
At top of climb out, I noticed his eyes drooping and less than total concentration. On asking if he felt OK, he said he was very tired as he had arrived overnight from Newark USA where he lived, on the jump seat, and 4 hours before our flight. !! I wasn't impressed.
cessnapete is offline  
Old 6th Jul 2018, 12:25
  #4854 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 1999
Posts: 41
90 minutes is not a long commute to LHR. It is still uncertain exactly how this will be resolved, but it is clear that anyone thinking of joining should very seriously consider where they may need to live.
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Old 6th Jul 2018, 12:52
  #4855 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: The Winchester
Posts: 5,913
Originally Posted by Pickled View Post
90 minutes is not a long commute to LHR. It is still uncertain exactly how this will be resolved, but it is clear that anyone thinking of joining should very seriously consider where they may need to live.

Yep...On another forum some kind individual posted a map showing the 90 minute (driving) isochrone ( no, I hadn't until then either...) centered on LHR....I think that must have come as a shock to more than few..

Link to the charting website here..

https://app.traveltimeplatform.com/#
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Old 6th Jul 2018, 13:36
  #4856 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Uk
Age: 39
Posts: 473
My commute takes about 1:10 - 1:15 most of the time but according to that map I am not within 90 minutes. More to the point if BA are so concerned why do they continue to roster me trips with the minimum time at base. 12hr 30 minus the 3 hours commuting (still within the rules you see) 9:30 rest really........strangely they are not bothered about that. Secondly who if anyone will be within 90 minutes when they dig up the M25 to build the third runway. Probably not an issue as we will all be retired but itís a thought.
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Old 6th Jul 2018, 14:45
  #4857 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: Centre of Universe
Posts: 141
Originally Posted by bex88 View Post
My commute takes about 1:10 - 1:15 most of the time but according to that map I am not within 90 minutes. More to the point if BA are so concerned why do they continue to roster me trips with the minimum time at base. 12hr 30 minus the 3 hours commuting (still within the rules you see) 9:30 rest really........strangely they are not bothered about that. Secondly who if anyone will be within 90 minutes when they dig up the M25 to build the third runway. Probably not an issue as we will all be retired but itís a thought.
bex88
They are not worried about you they are worried about long distance commuters (albeit you could argue is that 90 mins by road or plane?)
The sleepy scientists will tell you there is no difference driving another 90 minutes for 3 hours rather than watching Eastenders and Coronation Street then driving 90 mins.
What they will be looking for is unreasonable commuting e.g. over night as per the previous comments, or long distance then hanging around in crew rooms etc.
It can't be any coincidence that the two (may have changed) UK AOC's with approved FRMS both have commuting protocols with their Crew members.
What "they" want from you is for "we" BA and you as a crewmember being concerned about your colleague having commuted all night/day then undertaking long FDP / delays / bad weather at destination etc.
My own personal opinion is that the majority of BA crew members manage their commuting, as always it's the usual 5% that Airline management spend 95% of their time dealing with (probably even less at BA)
GKOC41 is offline  
Old 6th Jul 2018, 14:53
  #4858 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Samsonite Avenue
Posts: 1,520
Short of putting electronic tags on the ankles of BA pilots, it's nigh on impossible for the company to monitor ones travel movements to such a degree. Commuters will still commute and there has been a recommendation in CAP371 long before EASA was created, that suggested that travel time should be limited to 90 mins and this has been causally overlooked by some for a long time.

The only source of information that BA could access with ease, is ones use of their staff travel and especially on BA flights. However if you booked a standby ticket on another airline, would BA have easy access to the listing history without involving the other airline? Those not using staff travel or traveling by road will still have a great degree of carte blanche with how they choose to plan their journey to LHR, with them being totally off the radar, so to speak.

There has been a large degree of trust placed by airlines that their pilots professionalism will extend to how they plan their travel arrangements to work, however trust is really all they can exercise. I can't see this changing anytime soon at BA or any other airline for that matter.
Mister Geezer is offline  
Old 6th Jul 2018, 16:21
  #4859 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Botswana
Posts: 866
Originally Posted by Pickled View Post
The net seems to be closing in on commuters who normally travel more than 90 minutes to work, by any mode of transport......Anyone considering joining BA should plan on a requirement to live within 90 minutes travelling time of report.
More realistically translated as; BA has a bee in its bonnet at the moment about commuting which it has monitored for a short period of time in order to satisfy the regulator that they are taking the issue seriously. BA has gone through the motions and made all the right noises after which a blind eye will be turned (because realistically they can do nothing else) until the next auditing period with the same results. Rinse and repeat.
RexBanner is offline  
Old 7th Jul 2018, 18:25
  #4860 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: The Winchester
Posts: 5,913
Originally Posted by RexBanner View Post


More realistically translated as; BA has a bee in its bonnet at the moment about commuting ....

From what I've heard it is not just "commuting" from home to work that BA have taken a dislike to. I'm not sure if you've seen the latest newsletter/headsup about this out of BALPA but it seems the company has also taken issue with some end of holiday travel arrangments/timings.. " Not quite sure what the problem is but it may be BA's handling/understanding of the EASA rules regarding acclimatisation.

In any event it does seem BA have found an excuse to really look hard at any use of Staff Travel by crew members, whether you are off duty or even on leave...
wiggy is offline  

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