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BA Direct Entry Pilot.

Terms and Endearment The forum the bean counters hoped would never happen. Your news on pay, rostering, allowances, extras and negotiations where you work - scheduled, charter or contract.

BA Direct Entry Pilot.

Old 6th Apr 2017, 23:21
  #3521 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: SE England
Age: 46
Posts: 118
I'm with the guys who are happy - it's all about perspective I guess. Beats my previous jobs into a cocked hat.

Gross generalisation of course, but the main grumbles seem to come from people who don't know what the rest of the world is like. You hear moans about pay, rostering, ops, seniority, crew food...the list goes on. But there aren't many leaving. On this thread there have been mentions of people leaving to go back to LoCo, well at most we must be talking single figures because it sure as hell isn't reflected in the seniority numbers.

As previously mentioned, even the most junior guys have a degree of control over ther roster construction. And once it's published it's very easy to swap trips - there's a really good mix of people who do or don't like earlies, lates, day trips, tours etc. I'm in the bottom 20% and I haven't worked an early for three months and believe I've done 3 day trips all year. All through my choice. And even if you can't find somebody to swap with it's usually fairly easy to manage your 'bank' carefully and drop the odd trip you don't like. Also easy enough to engineer a 7-day block off in most months if you're cute with your leave and roster bidding and willing to sacrifice weekends elsewhere in the month.

Horses for courses, not for everybody I'm sure but to the guys swimming and waiting on news, I hope it comes for you soon. There are plenty of happy folk here even if the moaners tend to speak louder.
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Old 7th Apr 2017, 07:17
  #3522 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: UK
Posts: 194
Gross generalisation of course, but the main grumbles seem to come from people who don't know what the rest of the world is like
I know that BA Short Haul is nothing like EJ or Ryanair.

I would take 5/4/5/3 right now at BA. But that would mean I'd be doing about 15 days less at work each year!
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Old 7th Apr 2017, 07:42
  #3523 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: The Winchester
Posts: 5,428
At the risk of thread drift: I think people need to be a bit careful about completely dismissing the "moaners" at BA to much. We're seeing a increasing slide in T&Cs, and whilst no doubt BA is still better than some outfits it's a question of for how long?

BA management style has changed in the last few years, a recent event shows they are now seem willing to unilaterally impose changes on T&Cs, and a lot of the extras that made the package attractive are slowly being nibbled away at.

So whilst I would say don't let the grumblers wear you down their are some (IMHO) valid gripes out there and the danger of insisting in seeing BA through rose tinted glasses now is that in 10-15 years times you could just end working at a bigger version of the company you just escaped from.

Last edited by wiggy; 7th Apr 2017 at 10:25.
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Old 7th Apr 2017, 11:21
  #3524 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: uk
Age: 51
Posts: 89
I too am very happy as a shorthauler at BA, like others have said it has it's great points and some not so good ones, like Rex I don't recognise the points raised on the "cut and paisted" post above.

Wiggy raises some interesting points and I think he is right, unfortunately every business in every field is about trying to cut costs and they try and do that by reducing T&Cs it's a race to the bottom in every industry and who knows where it will end. I am by no means a socialist (far from it) but I do think that capitalism needs a bit of a reboot and the rights of workers should be the most important factor, unfortunately I don't see it happening.
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Old 7th Apr 2017, 13:08
  #3525 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Uk
Posts: 25
Events

Do any of you guys worry that with current world events this hold pool may never drain? It seems ambitious that with what is going on it's likely for expansion and a willingness for people to travel, seems one bad news story after another! Hopefully me being a pessimist but what are your thoughts?
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Old 7th Apr 2017, 14:30
  #3526 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: somewhere in the middle
Posts: 206
I must admit I'm not as confident as I was even 3-4 weeks ago. I'm bus rated, but amongst the last into the pool.

The big "red flags" for me are the FPP grads having their A320 courses put back to September and into 2018. That's going to take a big dent out of the vacancies for 2018, both rated and non. That, and the ongoing cost cutting going on under Cruz, I think they are going to sweat the assets (pilots) as much as they can, with little comeback. Pilots aren't going to leave, and other IAG companies can take the edge off any strike action.

Some reassurance from BA would be nice over the next few weeks. I can only imagine how the non rated swimmers approaching 18 months must be feeling.
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Old 7th Apr 2017, 14:35
  #3527 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2016
Location: London
Posts: 19
FPP only fills spaces in shorthaul. There is still LH aircraft arriving in 2018. Just stay positive about it however I would also recommend getting on with your current career. male the most of that then you are covering both bases. 😊
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Old 7th Apr 2017, 17:00
  #3528 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: London
Age: 40
Posts: 119
Originally Posted by wiggy View Post
At the risk of thread drift: I think people need to be a bit careful about completely dismissing the "moaners" at BA to much. We're seeing a increasing slide in T&Cs, and whilst no doubt BA is still better than some outfits it's a question of for how long?
I couldn't agree more, because of the sticking up for our terms and conditions, and the mature attitude of BALPA (compared to some foreign pilot unions) it's still one of the (if not the) best (and very/most successful) airline to work for in the U.K.
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Old 7th Apr 2017, 21:26
  #3529 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: London
Posts: 134
I would say the best has to be Thomson , very successful , legacy T&Cs , regional base for LH , just floats along in the background .
Just a shame about the time for command which is understandable but also the not so good starting conditions
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Old 8th Apr 2017, 04:36
  #3530 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Honkytown
Posts: 205
That, and their atrocious record for job security at the whiff of economic trouble.
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Old 8th Apr 2017, 09:17
  #3531 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: London
Posts: 134
Really I didn't know they were like that ?
I heard that virgin was pretty bad for doing that deed
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Old 8th Apr 2017, 09:48
  #3532 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Barcelona
Age: 36
Posts: 209
As with most operators I hear Thomson not as good a gig as it used to be due EASA FTL's. Personally I'd like to see more industrial pressure brought to bear on FTL regulation, rather than the usual depressed acceptance of "that's just the way it is". Some of the new rule sets under EASA are not safe.
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Old 8th Apr 2017, 09:57
  #3533 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: London
Posts: 134
I guess the issue is that there will always be a new pilot somewhere willing to bust there [email protected]@ on a rubbish pay to fly contract , as long as those people continue to accept poor T&Cs then other airlines just can't compete
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Old 8th Apr 2017, 10:47
  #3534 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Barcelona
Age: 36
Posts: 209
When management release a statement which affects your t's and c's, replace "due to our competitors" with "due to corporate greed".
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Old 8th Apr 2017, 18:49
  #3535 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: LONDON
Posts: 10
I'm not rated somewhere in the midst of the pool, having entered in early June. The rating doesn't worry me as for me it's LH or bust. I have no aspiration to combine a lengthy commute with high SH hours. I'm hopeful for next year but certainly not exclusively reliant on it, I'm increasing a lot of time in effort in alternatives - just in case........

I take the point on expansion but there's still sustainability to cover retirements and perhaps part time contracts. We're certainly due an update that's for sure!
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Old 8th Apr 2017, 19:02
  #3536 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: The Winchester
Posts: 5,428
I take the point on expansion but there's still sustainability to cover retirements and perhaps part time contracts. We're certainly due an update that's for sure!
It could be a while, whilst they'll have a handle on retirements ( roughly), the rearrangement of the work patterns for existing part timers has only just begun, with bid closure for those involved in May. Only then will follow the handling the new (internal) bidders for PT, my guess is only after seeing demand for that will they look at external requirements ...I short I think it will be a while before any concrete news.
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Old 8th Apr 2017, 22:50
  #3537 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: York
Posts: 680
Ea300
FPP only fills spaces in shorthaul. There is still LH aircraft arriving in 2018.
Kind of true.. But the impication that FPPs cover SH vacancies, leaving LH vacancies for new entrants is completely wrong.

BA have never, to my knowledge, recruited onto LH unless they have insufficient unfrozen internal bidders. FPPs joining at the bottom, simply enable other incumbents to move up the food chain.

So the monster feeds, and the excrement leaves at the top!😄

Oh, and anyone thinking they'll only do one month of Reserve per year, better hope they don't join on LH!🙄
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Old 9th Apr 2017, 07:31
  #3538 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: The Winchester
Posts: 5,428
As 4468 has said and as far as I'm aware there's no guarantee that BA will offer DEPs Longhaul slots. Recruitment has slowed down from the frenzy of twelve months or so ago, internal transfers to Longhaul usually trump external "bids " so unless BA can show they are restricted to recruiting direct to LH by a lack of training capacity, or there's a lack of unfrozen internal bidders, the vacancies are going to be entirely/almost entirely on Shorthaul.

Last edited by wiggy; 9th Apr 2017 at 08:08.
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Old 9th Apr 2017, 12:02
  #3539 (permalink)  
VJW
Sciolist (look it up) of the first order
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: UK
Posts: 779
With that in mind, having applied long haul, being a SH captain already for LoCo and having said I'd accept a SH offer from BA; how likely is it to get LGW as a base? LHR is a bit of a drive. For LH that drive would be fine 5 times a month, but for SH it'd be tougher to leave my 45 min drive LHS position I'm currently in.
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Old 9th Apr 2017, 12:16
  #3540 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: London
Posts: 134
A very brave move willing to give up a command for BA SH ?
I guess everyone has there individual situations
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