Do BA pilots really deserve our support re Openskys?
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Sorry Mike, the tailscrapes were your team. And to be fair you've been doing exactly what bluepilot described too. You may consider the BAR cabin crew disgruntled and workshy (they weren't) but at least they were there, unlike your lot who were always a hundred miles away at the wrong airport waiting for a taxi to the right airport.
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I remember that business with the Flap retraction, a BA TRAINING CAPTAIN too. Wasn't there an AAIB investigation? Could have been more spectacular than the triple 7. Birmingham if I recollect aright - can you help us out here HS or TR??? Anyone you know???
Smacks of T5 doesn't it?
Oh, and I remember the cabin crew too, they were not used to departing and arriving on time, I can't describe the amount of occasions when we'd be asked to taxi slowly in so as to arrive late and trigger the next FDP level payment. And the sulks when we said "NO". Fortunately there were always enough of our own crews to make drinking the coffee safe. Real set of prima donnas, just like their erstwhile pointy-end mates.
Smacks of T5 doesn't it?
Oh, and I remember the cabin crew too, they were not used to departing and arriving on time, I can't describe the amount of occasions when we'd be asked to taxi slowly in so as to arrive late and trigger the next FDP level payment. And the sulks when we said "NO". Fortunately there were always enough of our own crews to make drinking the coffee safe. Real set of prima donnas, just like their erstwhile pointy-end mates.
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Much to my better judgement I removed tandemrotor for my ignore list, but he /she / it just behaves like a cornered rat never admitting any wrong and worse still not learning from mistakes, in fact i am very concerned that this person is at the controls of a commercial airliner. Obviously he / she / it is emotionally unstable and incapable of rational debate. So he / she / it can re-join 411A on the ignore list.
And mr Tandem, i fully expect you to blow raspberrys behind my back as you have done with little Prince. My final words to you are....why did YOU put 411A onto your ignore list? Probably for the same reason you have joined him on mine.
And mr Tandem, i fully expect you to blow raspberrys behind my back as you have done with little Prince. My final words to you are....why did YOU put 411A onto your ignore list? Probably for the same reason you have joined him on mine.
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Wasn't a BA Training Captain moving the flap lever though was it?
Can't think why the cabin crew weren't used to arriving and departing on time, we used to have 90% punctuality on the BHX 319 fleet. They must have forgotten what is was like to be on time when you boys took over with your permatech jets.
Can't think why the cabin crew weren't used to arriving and departing on time, we used to have 90% punctuality on the BHX 319 fleet. They must have forgotten what is was like to be on time when you boys took over with your permatech jets.
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This is getting very silly.
You may consider the BAR cabin crew disgruntled and workshy (they weren't)
And sorry, but in my opinion some were. If they wanted to be in mainline on proper aeroplanes they could have easily gone back to London.My first encouter with a BAR dragon was on day three of line training in MAN, when some handbag faced old boot pointed out I was sitting in the BA section of the crewroom and should move.......How I laughed. Then I laughed even more when I realised she was being serious.
We can all quote examples because no one is perfect. Honestly Hand, I don't know why you've such a chip on your shoulder about BACX. Yes there were some oddballs there, I've met some oddballs who are BA pilots too. Mainline guys may have missed some command opportunities with the skypigs coming to BACX, I'm sure some BACX guys missed command opportunities because of the secondies - no-ones fault but the devious management gits at BA, I'm afraid playing us all for suckers. That includes the poodles inflicted upon us as BACX managers.
At least BA got some LHR slots out of the deal. What did we get? Shafted. Not by BA pilots, but by BA management who never wanted a regional airline, just a tool to sort out the BAR issue. There are a lot of quietly (and noisily)pee'd off ex BACX people out there, but the issue is with BA. I repeat, management, not pilots, so drop it.
Maybe someone should set up a thread on Jetblast where all the ex BACX and BA crews can vent their spleens about every perceived and actual slight ever commited by the other side.
Must go, Grand Designs is on, I want to watch the Grand Master of patronising in action, I might learn something.
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Actually OA, I don't have a chip on my shoulder about BACX pilots as a whole. I've drunk enough beer with them in the bars of Glasgow and Birmingham to know there were some good eggs amongst them, I've flown with some of them at mainline and I think your assessment of there being good and bad in both companies is spot on. What I do have a beef about is a handful of ex-BACX types telling the world that the whole companys woes were exclusively the fault of the big, bad BACC, accusing the BAR pilots of 'stealing' commands at their own bases, falsely attributing any airborne stuff up to BA pilots (I recognise screw ups happen, it's the nature of the business, but trying to pin them all on the secondees riles) and generally implying that they would have conquered the world if only we'd fought a few battles for them. If they could knock that off then we could all go back to doing something more worthwhile with our time.
It's a crazy idea but how about we draw a line under things at that?
It's a crazy idea but how about we draw a line under things at that?
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Hand Solo and Tandem the same person??
Interesting thesis.
Same chips on both shoulders, same illogical approach to all who disagree with them, same 'big lie' technique to advance debate, same intransigence reference the slightest deviation from the BA line, same biaised and inaccurate propaganda, same 'strike to the death' for all industrial action (though none actually supported except their own), same phraseology, same mutual support, same silly names, same lack of syntax and poor spelling, same distortion of history, same intolerance for reasoned argument.
God help us all if this is the best BA can do to advance their cause.
I rest my case, thank you bluepilot.
(BA, but there we go, what a surprise!)
Interesting thesis.
Same chips on both shoulders, same illogical approach to all who disagree with them, same 'big lie' technique to advance debate, same intransigence reference the slightest deviation from the BA line, same biaised and inaccurate propaganda, same 'strike to the death' for all industrial action (though none actually supported except their own), same phraseology, same mutual support, same silly names, same lack of syntax and poor spelling, same distortion of history, same intolerance for reasoned argument.
God help us all if this is the best BA can do to advance their cause.
I rest my case, thank you bluepilot.
(BA, but there we go, what a surprise!)
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Somehow I doubt that!!
As long as yourself and TR are around and spouting BS, there will be someone here to try and help you guys recognise reality, to counsel you both where we think it may help, to advise on the quantities of Diazepam you require, to suggest rest and retirement homes (as early as possible) for you, to help with your modular CRM recurrent training wrt communication, self-expression, accurate and comprehensive recall and team building.........................oh no, where there's a will there's a way, and where psychiatric help is needed chaps, I'm sure one of us will be gald to help and advise!
Keep taking the pills - in fact, take more, lots more!!!
As long as yourself and TR are around and spouting BS, there will be someone here to try and help you guys recognise reality, to counsel you both where we think it may help, to advise on the quantities of Diazepam you require, to suggest rest and retirement homes (as early as possible) for you, to help with your modular CRM recurrent training wrt communication, self-expression, accurate and comprehensive recall and team building.........................oh no, where there's a will there's a way, and where psychiatric help is needed chaps, I'm sure one of us will be gald to help and advise!
Keep taking the pills - in fact, take more, lots more!!!
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It's over CJ, go back under the rock you crawled from beneath. You are a second rate mud slinger anyway. Now if TLP came out to play it might be different but I suspect he'll be honouring the very sensible truce brokered by oapilot. Perhaps you could try the jetblast forum, or maybe airliners.net, or just anywhere where they might find your put-downs incisive or witty, rather than just jaded and cliched. You bore us all.
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Merde, one of the best sources of entertainment is winding up you and TR and watching you react as predictably as a clockwork dog on the floor of a market toystall.
Mind you, you're both cheaper than a clockwork toy!
More, more - look forward to seeing you in my RHS.
Mind you, you're both cheaper than a clockwork toy!
More, more - look forward to seeing you in my RHS.
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In your dreams my boy. It takes more than attitude to be a Captain, let alone a Trainer - oops, except for BA, where trainers can confuse gear and flaps at your leisure without criticism! (Was that you perchance??)
I'm sure OS will be a FAR superior and more profitable product.
I'm sure OS will be a FAR superior and more profitable product.
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Shower of fools living in the past!!!
THE FUTURE!!
British Airways has launched its first direct services between the US and mainland Europe, with daily flights from New York to Brussels and Paris.
BA will set up a new subsidiary airline called Open Skies, which plans to start flying a Boeing 757 from Brussels or Paris in June.
The airline hopes its new carrier will operate six 757s by 2010.
The move comes after the European Union and US backed an "open skies" deal to liberalise transatlantic air travel.
The EU deal eases restrictions on travel between Europe and the US. It will also challenge BA's dominance at Heathrow airport.
Until now, BA has only been allowed to fly to the US directly from the UK.
Three other airlines - Virgin Atlantic, American Airlines and United Airlines - have also been permitted to operate flights from Heathrow to the US.
Supporters of the open skies deal say it will boost competition between airlines and lead to lower air fares.
It also may make it easier for BA to compete on other international routes outside of the UK.
'Major step'
BA chief executive Willie Walsh said: "This is an exciting new venture for us and we're confident that it will be a great success as we build on the strength of BA's brand in the US and Europe.
"By naming the airline Open Skies, we're celebrating the first major step in 60 years towards a liberalised US-EU aviation market which means we can fly between any US and EU destination.
"It also signals our determination to lobby for further liberalisation in this market when talks between the EU and US take place later this year," he said.
The new airline's managing director will be Dale Moss, BA's former director of worldwide sales, and the airline is registered in the UK.
The aircraft on the planned new route will carry up to 82 passengers on Boeing 757 aircraft with three onboard cabin classes: 24 business seats, 28 premium economy seats and 30 economy.
Union concerns
The planned airline is facing concerns from the British Airline Pilots' Association (Balpa), which is set to meet BA soon to discuss the issue further.
The union wants BA's existing pilots to have the chance to apply for work with the new airline before the firm embarks on hiring new staff.
Jim McAuslan, Balpa general secretary, said: "Balpa welcomes BA's decision to innovate and establish a wholly owned subsidiary company to take advantage of the new open skies agreement between the US and EU.
"But we have issues with BA on how the new service should be structured.
"Having worked so hard to secure success for BA, its pilots do not want to see its brand or its safety record put at risk.
"The new subsidiary can only fly successfully with the full support of BA's pilot force."
Mr Walsh said terms and conditions for the new venture would be different from those in BA's main operation, but said he was confident concerns could be assuaged.
BA shares were down 3% at 275 pence in late afternoon trade in London.
I say again:
"Having worked so hard to secure success for BA, its pilots do not want to see its brand or its safety record put at risk.
What a laugh - you mean - OMG, this will probably work better than our own high cost inefficient legacy carrier baseline - we'd better go on strike for the benefit of the public. ILMAO!!!! Shower of fools living in the past!!!
And as for:
well, the less the BA pilot force has to do with it the more likley it is to succeed. No contest, no question.
British Airways has launched its first direct services between the US and mainland Europe, with daily flights from New York to Brussels and Paris.
BA will set up a new subsidiary airline called Open Skies, which plans to start flying a Boeing 757 from Brussels or Paris in June.
The airline hopes its new carrier will operate six 757s by 2010.
The move comes after the European Union and US backed an "open skies" deal to liberalise transatlantic air travel.
The EU deal eases restrictions on travel between Europe and the US. It will also challenge BA's dominance at Heathrow airport.
Until now, BA has only been allowed to fly to the US directly from the UK.
Three other airlines - Virgin Atlantic, American Airlines and United Airlines - have also been permitted to operate flights from Heathrow to the US.
Supporters of the open skies deal say it will boost competition between airlines and lead to lower air fares.
It also may make it easier for BA to compete on other international routes outside of the UK.
'Major step'
BA chief executive Willie Walsh said: "This is an exciting new venture for us and we're confident that it will be a great success as we build on the strength of BA's brand in the US and Europe.
"By naming the airline Open Skies, we're celebrating the first major step in 60 years towards a liberalised US-EU aviation market which means we can fly between any US and EU destination.
"It also signals our determination to lobby for further liberalisation in this market when talks between the EU and US take place later this year," he said.
The new airline's managing director will be Dale Moss, BA's former director of worldwide sales, and the airline is registered in the UK.
The aircraft on the planned new route will carry up to 82 passengers on Boeing 757 aircraft with three onboard cabin classes: 24 business seats, 28 premium economy seats and 30 economy.
Union concerns
The planned airline is facing concerns from the British Airline Pilots' Association (Balpa), which is set to meet BA soon to discuss the issue further.
The union wants BA's existing pilots to have the chance to apply for work with the new airline before the firm embarks on hiring new staff.
Jim McAuslan, Balpa general secretary, said: "Balpa welcomes BA's decision to innovate and establish a wholly owned subsidiary company to take advantage of the new open skies agreement between the US and EU.
"But we have issues with BA on how the new service should be structured.
"Having worked so hard to secure success for BA, its pilots do not want to see its brand or its safety record put at risk.
"The new subsidiary can only fly successfully with the full support of BA's pilot force."
Mr Walsh said terms and conditions for the new venture would be different from those in BA's main operation, but said he was confident concerns could be assuaged.
BA shares were down 3% at 275 pence in late afternoon trade in London.
I say again:
"Having worked so hard to secure success for BA, its pilots do not want to see its brand or its safety record put at risk.
What a laugh - you mean - OMG, this will probably work better than our own high cost inefficient legacy carrier baseline - we'd better go on strike for the benefit of the public. ILMAO!!!! Shower of fools living in the past!!!
And as for:
"The new subsidiary can only fly successfully with the full support of BA's pilot force."
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I think it might be you living in the past Kurtz, that press release is old. Do yourself a favour and pop over to the other OS thread to see the latest release, there's a good chap.
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Jetblast time?
Jetblast would be the best place for this undignified thread now, surely? Reminds me of those fights between Hugh Grant and Colin thingy in the Bridget Jones movies. 
There will be no strike now until July, anyway.
There will be no strike now until July, anyway.