The Irish invite US pilots to work in Europe...
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By the way the CAA in England have been letting FAA people fly BA/ATLAS 747's for yrs now (same deal)...so I think you know where you can put your flag of convenience
Edited cos its more hassle than its worth
Last edited by haughtney1; 18th Jul 2006 at 13:32.
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Lets face it... MOR is just has nothing else better to do but to complain about yanks coming over to Europe and fly new jets. Why is he complaining? Beats me. He is sitting pretty in the South Pacific flying... so he claims. on a dual nationality passport... again so he claims. I just don't get what his gripe is about. Perhaps he has way to much time on his hands. If he has a job, and is making a respectable living then give the gripe a rest already... unless MOR's friends have hired him to be their offical spokesman. Yes I know, those that are not in agreement with MOR will reciece the typical, "you don't have a clue". Time to give it a rest MOR.
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Let's face it... captjns is just an American expat, working in Europe, with everything to gain and nothing to lose to the policies of the IAA. He cannot argue on the pertinent issues, so he continues with the personal attacks that one comes to expect of arrogant Americans. reminds me a lot of the times I have visited New York... the rudeness, the arrogance, the complete failure to grasp the argument.
Although we already know that our American visitor will not be able to grasp the argument, I will reiterate it. It is really exceedingly simple.
1). The IAA is acting under pressure from a company that is trying to gain an economic advantage by hiring foreigners. That in itself is corrupt.
2). The IAA is extending a facility to foreign pilots that is not being reciprocated by the FAA. That is simply foolish.
I am also rather amused that our American expat is so keen to stifle debate on the basis of where one lives. That is such a completely spurious tactic that I just have to laugh. As a British and EU citizen, I am far more qualified to make the argument than he is.
No, I think if anyone should give it a rest, it should be captnjs. Unless, of course, he can argue the issues... no. Probably not.
Although we already know that our American visitor will not be able to grasp the argument, I will reiterate it. It is really exceedingly simple.
1). The IAA is acting under pressure from a company that is trying to gain an economic advantage by hiring foreigners. That in itself is corrupt.
2). The IAA is extending a facility to foreign pilots that is not being reciprocated by the FAA. That is simply foolish.
I am also rather amused that our American expat is so keen to stifle debate on the basis of where one lives. That is such a completely spurious tactic that I just have to laugh. As a British and EU citizen, I am far more qualified to make the argument than he is.
No, I think if anyone should give it a rest, it should be captnjs. Unless, of course, he can argue the issues... no. Probably not.
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Originally Posted by MOR
reminds me a lot of the times I have visited New York... the rudeness, the arrogance, the complete failure to grasp the argument.
No, I think if anyone should give it a rest, it should be captnjs. Unless, of course, he can argue the issues... no. Probably not.
No, I think if anyone should give it a rest, it should be captnjs. Unless, of course, he can argue the issues... no. Probably not.
Shareholders, and members of the Board of Directors would be up in arms when they review the reports as to why they are taking delivery of aircraft and there are not enough crews to fly the equipment. I don't know but what do you think??? can an airline make money with airplanes sitting on the ground? I know... it may be a tough one for you... but hey... give it a go.
Do you think in your right mind that the IAA or any aviation agency for that matter would allow so many expats to fill these seats if there was not a need to bolster the economy of the EU??? to keep up with the demand of passenger travel??? to keep up with international commerce??? I know... it’s another tough one for you but give a go.
Don't you think that once there are EU member pilots qualified to fill these seats that the expats' services will be terminated? I know for sure you will be thrilled when that day comes. But hey... then you can give up you exiled life in the South Pacific and come back to and fly in your home land.
Hey by the way... it's quite apparent, from your posts, as to why you may have received such treatment from citizens of the former colonies. Don't worry, you're not missed.
If I were not a gentleman I would say you should add ON to the end of your screen name.
Last edited by captjns; 19th Jul 2006 at 12:15.
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Originally Posted by MOR
The IAA is acting under pressure from a company that is trying to gain an economic advantage by hiring foreigners. That in itself is corrupt.
Incidentally, I don't think it's obligatory to do all 14 JAA exams within 1 year - it depends on the CAA involved, some of them nominate a certain amount to be done every year and will continue the validation as long as this term is complied with.
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t is your opinion that EU carriers should invest in training from the start, rather than hiring current and qualified airman to fill the seats of aircraft that are arriving on their property.
More to the point... nobody is saying that it is wrong to allow expats to fly in Europe per se, simply that suitably qualified Europeans should be employed first (second post, page 2).
It does, however, make one wonder if the aircraft and the crews were a package deal...
Don't you think that once there are EU member pilots qualified to fill these seats that the expats' services will be terminated?
But hey... then you can give up you exiled life in the South Pacific and come back to and fly in your home land.
If I were not a gentleman
Now if you must bore us with a response, please try to stick to the argument, and not spear off into misunderstanding and some spurious attack on a point that was never made in the first place. Can you manage that? or would you like me to list the points under discussion, yet again?
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Originally Posted by MOR
Like I said... a complete inability to grasp the argument. Nobody is suggesting training ab initio pilots - although many airlines do so, including the likes of Easyjet. The point is that Cityjet are taking US expats over type-rated and experienced European crews. See the second post on page 2.
There aren't a lot of 146/RJ drivers around in the first place, and even fewer who are current within the last 3-6 months, which is what Cityjet have required for at least the last year or so. Cityjet clearly believe that non-current 146/RJ pilots pose a training risk, so they would rather have nice, current Americans. Once that resource dries up, they may well start taking the un-current guys, in fact they will probably end up training a whole bunch from scratch. There simply aren't that many rated people around any more, most have long since moved to the 737 or A320 or are quite happy to stay where they are, and get trained on new equipment as more 146s are retired.
There aren't a lot of 146/RJ drivers around in the first place, and even fewer who are current within the last 3-6 months, which is what Cityjet have required for at least the last year or so. Cityjet clearly believe that non-current 146/RJ pilots pose a training risk, so they would rather have nice, current Americans. Once that resource dries up, they may well start taking the un-current guys, in fact they will probably end up training a whole bunch from scratch. There simply aren't that many rated people around any more, most have long since moved to the 737 or A320 or are quite happy to stay where they are, and get trained on new equipment as more 146s are retired.
Originally Posted by MOR
More to the point... nobody is saying that it is wrong to allow expats to fly in Europe per se, simply that suitably qualified Europeans should be employed first (second post, page 2).
Originally Posted by MOR
It does, however, make one wonder if the aircraft and the crews were a package deal...
Originally Posted by MOR
Fool. I came here deliberately, for the same reason that you apparently went to Europe.
Very mature statement regarding employment out of the US... typical comment from a malevolent malcontent.
Hey don’t worry… when the expat infusion slows down, and when the carriers get desperate enough for pilots, maybe they will give you a call to come back home for an interview... maybe that is if they are desparate enough... I know… you say its your choice to be where you are. that will be our little secret.
By the way MOR... since according to you I'm not a gentleman I'll filled in the rest of the letters for your screen name. Have a nice day
Last edited by captjns; 19th Jul 2006 at 18:32.
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US pilots in the EU
I couldnt agree more with MOR . It is disgraceful that the IAA have agreed to this . Any prospective student pilot could now go to the US and take an FAA license , get some hours , pay for a cheap non JAA type rating and get a job in Europe . I myself have worked hard to get my ATPL , issued by the IAA , and am flying for a UK airline . This type of behaviour by the IAA and Cityjet, is giving irish aviation a reputation for being savagely corupt.
This type of thing has being going on for a while now , and now I am going to exchange my ATPL for a UK ATPL . If this continues , I would urge everyone in the same position to do the same while you still can .
Already , there are some well known TRE's , not associated with Cityjet or FR , making noise about insisting prospective new hires exchange their license .
I have no problems with non EU individuals , however airlines in the EU should hire all those license holders without jobs firstly . No other industry would tolerate this and Iam glad to see the stance both the CAA and BALPA have taken on this . And of course , going back to the original debate , as I have mentioned above , this not only covers Cityjet.
Cityjet is full of ex Aircorps , with a lot of influence with the IAA . I have not worked for Cityjet , but have known some fine pilots from there .
Last edited by me109; 19th Jul 2006 at 18:51.
The irish invite US pilots to work in Europe
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I think some people here have a very high opinion of themselves and think life owes them something. when I finished university and went to learn to fly in the states there was no JAA in ireland. It only came into practice after I had shelfed out a fortune getting all my licenses and multi time. Before i left home, the standard practice was an airlaw exam and flight check to standards and you could swap your license over (which is in line with most ICAO countries). It was the bloody JAA protectionist racket that stoped me and plenty of my frineds from ireland to come home or to the uk and find a job. many of them either stayed in the states or went to canada, if they could immigrate. others went to africa. I find it very anoying listening to hot-heads bluster all about not letting people fly without JAA licenses. Im sorry people cannot find a job with only 200hrs...but thats life, nobody owes you anything, you have to make the most of it and find work where you can. I cannot tell you how crappy the last 6yr have been for me trying to build hrs and find flying work but you dont hear me complaining about it. but im now in a position to return home and work because the IAA are using some comon sense and giving people the oppertunity who are QUALIFIED to fly the planes that IRISH airlines use!! It amazes me that people here expect guys who have had to slog it out to gain experiance should have to start from scratch again just to get a job back home. we arent all multi-millionaires you know. the term SOUR GRAPES springs to mind! 
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Originally Posted by corklad
I cannot tell you how crappy the last 6yr have been for me trying to build hrs and find flying work but you dont hear me complaining about it. but im now in a position to return home and work because the IAA are using some comon sense and giving people the oppertunity who are QUALIFIED to fly the planes that IRISH airlines use!! It amazes me that people here expect guys who have had to slog it out to gain experiance should have to start from scratch again just to get a job back home. we arent all multi-millionaires you know. the term SOUR GRAPES springs to mind!
A pint of Guiness for you... well said Corklad.
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"Any prospective student pilot could now go to the US and take an FAA license , get some hours , pay for a cheap non JAA type rating and get a job in Europe"
ME109, I think your idea of getting your training, ratings and licenses in the states is ill informed. What you suggest would take yrs to accomplish. i should know I had to do it. Despite what you hear in the UK or ireland, FAA flight training standards are very tough. The theory side is more difficult in europe i totally agree, but often, the flying side is far more difficult with the FAA. you have to master more manouvers that are not taught back home. No one in their right mind would employ someone with 200-250 hrs in canada or america on to an ATR-42 never mind a boeing or airbus!!! you would still be considered far too green!! one cannot get a look in at regionals until they have at least 800hrs with 200 multi. its even higher in canada!!! how long do you think it would take a person to go to the states, get a pvt then IR then cpl then multi ir cpl, then cfi, cfii and an mei. then, build up 250 multi hrs and 1000 total, and then try and get a regional job? perhaps, after you earn a pittence over the yrs you get a type rating and get 100-500hrs+ on said type rating. I will tell you...it takes YEARS!!!!!! and lots of heartache and luck along the way!! dont believe all the JAA hype, if it was such a sucessful system there would be more qualified pilots about with the necessary hrs and experiance the airlines need to hire them. its precisely because the JAA schools fall short on giving students flying hrs/experience that we are in this mess. they are desigened to place 5% of graduates in cockpits. problem is there are now more planes than pilots...whos going to fly them??? johnny 200hrs in a cessan 150???? yeah right!
Its the flightschools and their money making rackets that you should be complainig about not the IAA. who do you think wrote the syllabus/rules and regs for the CAA/JAA? the schools write the rules to suit themselves to stop people from going abroad and the JAA endorses it cause of the money they make from exams. It worked fine when the airlines weren't hiring after 9/11. now the recovery is in full swing and the airlines now need more bodies to fly their new orders...whopps...the jaa made it so hard and expensive that the system only spate out out qualified people in dribs and drabs... with no experience...now they need 100s. the IAA are being sensible and using common sense to solve the situation, only time will see if the pig-headed arrogant CAA will follow suit..I doubt it.
ME109, I think your idea of getting your training, ratings and licenses in the states is ill informed. What you suggest would take yrs to accomplish. i should know I had to do it. Despite what you hear in the UK or ireland, FAA flight training standards are very tough. The theory side is more difficult in europe i totally agree, but often, the flying side is far more difficult with the FAA. you have to master more manouvers that are not taught back home. No one in their right mind would employ someone with 200-250 hrs in canada or america on to an ATR-42 never mind a boeing or airbus!!! you would still be considered far too green!! one cannot get a look in at regionals until they have at least 800hrs with 200 multi. its even higher in canada!!! how long do you think it would take a person to go to the states, get a pvt then IR then cpl then multi ir cpl, then cfi, cfii and an mei. then, build up 250 multi hrs and 1000 total, and then try and get a regional job? perhaps, after you earn a pittence over the yrs you get a type rating and get 100-500hrs+ on said type rating. I will tell you...it takes YEARS!!!!!! and lots of heartache and luck along the way!! dont believe all the JAA hype, if it was such a sucessful system there would be more qualified pilots about with the necessary hrs and experiance the airlines need to hire them. its precisely because the JAA schools fall short on giving students flying hrs/experience that we are in this mess. they are desigened to place 5% of graduates in cockpits. problem is there are now more planes than pilots...whos going to fly them??? johnny 200hrs in a cessan 150???? yeah right!
Its the flightschools and their money making rackets that you should be complainig about not the IAA. who do you think wrote the syllabus/rules and regs for the CAA/JAA? the schools write the rules to suit themselves to stop people from going abroad and the JAA endorses it cause of the money they make from exams. It worked fine when the airlines weren't hiring after 9/11. now the recovery is in full swing and the airlines now need more bodies to fly their new orders...whopps...the jaa made it so hard and expensive that the system only spate out out qualified people in dribs and drabs... with no experience...now they need 100s. the IAA are being sensible and using common sense to solve the situation, only time will see if the pig-headed arrogant CAA will follow suit..I doubt it.
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the flying side is far more difficult with the FAA. you have to master more manouvers that are not taught back home
utter bilge Cork lad...just different, of course they SEEM harder if you havent learnt them
one in their right mind would employ someone with 200-250 hrs in canada or america on to an ATR-42 never mind a boeing or airbus!!! you would still be considered far too green!! one cannot get a look in at regionals until they have at least 800hrs with 200 multi
the IAA are being sensible and using common sense to solve the situation, only time will see if the pig-headed arrogant CAA will follow suit..I doubt it
I find it very anoying listening to hot-heads bluster all about not letting people fly without JAA licenses. Im sorry people cannot find a job with only 200hrs...but thats life, nobody owes you anything, you have to make the most of it and find work where you can
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There aren't many pilots in Europe that want work for Cityjet... so what other options does Cityjet have?
There are only two issues here. One is reciprocity - which you steadfastly refuse to comment on - and the other is using the local pilots first. Those are the only two issues. Once the local pool is exhausted - whatever it's size - Cityjet can do what they want.
Those are the only two issues. They are exceedingly simple. Maybe you should add your two letters and use the name for yourself.
It may be but so far there are no bites from the Mesaba group coming over to Europe... Like I said pilots are not going to go from one low paying job to another one.
maybe they will give you a call etc etc etc
But who would want to return to Europe from the relative comfort of the South Pacific? Nah, you can have the crappy weather and the crowds and the pollution all to yourself.
since according to you I'm not a gentleman I'll filled in the rest of the letters for your screen name.
corklad
It was the bloody JAA protectionist racket that stoped me and plenty of my frineds from ireland to come home or to the uk and find a job.
And people say I have a chip on my shoulder... you have an entire timber yard.
Im sorry people cannot find a job with only 200hrs
but you dont hear me complaining about it
It amazes me that people here expect guys who have had to slog it out to gain experiance should have to start from scratch again just to get a job back home.
who do you think wrote the syllabus/rules and regs for the CAA/JAA? the schools write the rules to suit themselves to stop people from going abroad and the JAA endorses it cause of the money they make from exams.
how long do you think it would take a person to go to the states, get a pvt then IR then cpl then multi ir cpl, then cfi, cfii and an mei. then, build up 250 multi hrs and 1000 total, and then try and get a regional job?
How totally naive.
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You have to also take in to account whether the aircraft are on the FAA regs or going on to the Irish Reg with all the restrictions that may impose on the flight deck operating. Also onto which AOC the aircraft falls under!
Apologise if that has been raised but I have not read each and every post! Time does not permit me to at the moment.
Apologise if that has been raised but I have not read each and every post! Time does not permit me to at the moment.
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Perhaps the CAA in gatwick should stop being such complete A-holes about letting europeans with forgein licenses come home and fly, it may stop the very situation you are complaining about!!! I did my training in USA, Cananda and have ratings on the 737 and king air and the CAA treated me like a lepper all because of their outragous JAR regs!! Last time I looked boeings were made in seattle!! I guess they build extra special ones for the UK?? how do you expect one to fork out another 64K to start flying from scratch? Also, why is it that any new member EU state can automatically convert their national license to JAA and I cant even get a look in?? I remember standing in gatwick next to an eastern european bloke who could barely string a sentence together in english, and the CAA hapily converted his national license for him, all because his country just joined the EU,
I may have missed something somewhere, but why wouldn't your first port of call to get a JAA Land licence be your own national CAA, i.e the IAA ??
Presumably they'd be more than happy to convert your licence, wouldn't they ?
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Originally Posted by MOR
Hard as it is to stoop to your level, I will say that I have several offers to return, and all from airlines far higher up the pecking order than Cityjet.
. did you think of that all by yourself without adult supervision? Give yourself a cookie.Checked with the Mesaba group... no takers.
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MOR
"Awwwww.... didn't work out quite according to plan, did it? Guess that is what happens when you decide to train overseas. Maybe you should have gone to one of the US schools that train to JAA standards... but maybe that wasn't such a bargain, huh?"
No MOR, sorry to dissappoint you. There was no JAA back when I and many of my friends left...it was some vague new system that was coming some time soon and nobody really knew what to expect of it. I was ready to start flying so why would i wait another year or 2??
"Hmmm just like you do if you go from Europe to the US... maybe you should have trained to JAA standards if you wanted to return".
Again MOR, why should I fork out another small fortune to start from scratch? Im not rich kid with an endless supply ofr funds and time is money, not that you seem to care. I guess, according to your logic I should have gone to the money tree to get the necessay funds to go back flying cessnas again
"There's that chip again... you really believe the schools write the regs? You have absolutely no idea what you are talking about."
Sorry but, i think the chips lie firmly on both of your shoulders MOR! I think you'll find I know a little more about running a business than you do, you seem to have no idea of economics! You seem quite anti-american and anti-irish having observed your comments and remarks. I note that your hostility is vented at the FAA...I hold both FAA and Transport Canada licneses. Do you also not like Canadians or Aussies coming in or is it just FAA tickect holders???
haughtney1
"That comment shows how little you understand the North American pilot market...the reason for higher minimums is simple, there are FAR FAR more experienced pilots in the US, they still train in the time honoured way (the way I did) by doing the CPL...instructing a bit...a bit of PT 135 etc....3 years and 2000hrs later they are ready for the regionals"
Sorry haughtney1, but i think i understand that market place perfectly well, I have been here on and off for almost 7 yrs!! You do make a valid point though.
"True colours coming out eh? Embittered because of the rules changed?"
Embittered, NO, dissappointed YES, I will freely admit that one!
but who wouldnt be???
"Missing the point here....we arent talking about the 200hr pilot...we are talking about JAA licensed and experienced people being passed up because its easier and cheaper for the IAA to endorse US pilots..for their buddys in previously mentioned organisations"
I have to disagree here. I dont belive that anyone with the required experiance is being passed up for a forgeiner. I think, though i appologise if i am wrong, that you are taking a simplistic view on this one. I would say, as everyone now knows, that because there are no real cadetships anymore and that companies dont want to pay for training, they are only taking the guys who are experienced and ready to go. The policy of 500hrs on type for example springs to mind. If it makes business sense, money wise, to get pilots from abroad then thats what the companies are going to do. Again its a business not a hobby or a club that some people seem to think they are ENTITLED TO JOIN! The companies dont feel like they have to spend their money to pay pilots to fly their planes. Is that right or wrong? Not for me to decide but its been that way for a long while now. So if there is a need to get asses on cockpit seats they are going to do it in the cheapest, fastest and easiest way possible. If that helps people like me to return home and get a job, then Im sorry but Im going to take that option. Same as anyone else here would.
Pprune Radar
"I may have missed something somewhere, but why wouldn't your first port of call to get a JAA Land licence be your own national CAA, i.e the IAA ??
Presumably they'd be more than happy to convert your licence, wouldn't they ?"
Very simply really, at the time i was told that the CAA was the place to go to sort things out. thats the only reason why I went there really. After being told "soooo sorry", I went to canada to build some more hrs. What I would say was nobody there ever seemed to care about forgeiners flying in their country. the conversion process was relatively straight fwd...flying at -10 wasnt though
"Awwwww.... didn't work out quite according to plan, did it? Guess that is what happens when you decide to train overseas. Maybe you should have gone to one of the US schools that train to JAA standards... but maybe that wasn't such a bargain, huh?"
No MOR, sorry to dissappoint you. There was no JAA back when I and many of my friends left...it was some vague new system that was coming some time soon and nobody really knew what to expect of it. I was ready to start flying so why would i wait another year or 2??
"Hmmm just like you do if you go from Europe to the US... maybe you should have trained to JAA standards if you wanted to return".
Again MOR, why should I fork out another small fortune to start from scratch? Im not rich kid with an endless supply ofr funds and time is money, not that you seem to care. I guess, according to your logic I should have gone to the money tree to get the necessay funds to go back flying cessnas again
"There's that chip again... you really believe the schools write the regs? You have absolutely no idea what you are talking about."
Sorry but, i think the chips lie firmly on both of your shoulders MOR!
I think you'll find I know a little more about running a business than you do, you seem to have no idea of economics! You seem quite anti-american and anti-irish having observed your comments and remarks. I note that your hostility is vented at the FAA...I hold both FAA and Transport Canada licneses. Do you also not like Canadians or Aussies coming in or is it just FAA tickect holders??? haughtney1
"That comment shows how little you understand the North American pilot market...the reason for higher minimums is simple, there are FAR FAR more experienced pilots in the US, they still train in the time honoured way (the way I did) by doing the CPL...instructing a bit...a bit of PT 135 etc....3 years and 2000hrs later they are ready for the regionals"
Sorry haughtney1, but i think i understand that market place perfectly well, I have been here on and off for almost 7 yrs!! You do make a valid point though.
"True colours coming out eh? Embittered because of the rules changed?"
Embittered, NO, dissappointed YES, I will freely admit that one!
but who wouldnt be??? "Missing the point here....we arent talking about the 200hr pilot...we are talking about JAA licensed and experienced people being passed up because its easier and cheaper for the IAA to endorse US pilots..for their buddys in previously mentioned organisations"
I have to disagree here. I dont belive that anyone with the required experiance is being passed up for a forgeiner. I think, though i appologise if i am wrong, that you are taking a simplistic view on this one. I would say, as everyone now knows, that because there are no real cadetships anymore and that companies dont want to pay for training, they are only taking the guys who are experienced and ready to go. The policy of 500hrs on type for example springs to mind. If it makes business sense, money wise, to get pilots from abroad then thats what the companies are going to do. Again its a business not a hobby or a club that some people seem to think they are ENTITLED TO JOIN! The companies dont feel like they have to spend their money to pay pilots to fly their planes. Is that right or wrong? Not for me to decide but its been that way for a long while now. So if there is a need to get asses on cockpit seats they are going to do it in the cheapest, fastest and easiest way possible. If that helps people like me to return home and get a job, then Im sorry but Im going to take that option. Same as anyone else here would.
Pprune Radar
"I may have missed something somewhere, but why wouldn't your first port of call to get a JAA Land licence be your own national CAA, i.e the IAA ??
Presumably they'd be more than happy to convert your licence, wouldn't they ?"
Very simply really, at the time i was told that the CAA was the place to go to sort things out. thats the only reason why I went there really. After being told "soooo sorry", I went to canada to build some more hrs. What I would say was nobody there ever seemed to care about forgeiners flying in their country. the conversion process was relatively straight fwd...flying at -10 wasnt though
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Sorry for my humble opinion. If Cityjet are getting new aircraft in, and they don't have either sufficient or suitable crews to operate them, should they not investigate the availability of crews from elsewhere, including the US?
Don't TCX, among others, have reciprocal agreements that see US pilots working in the summer in the UK, then returning to the US for the winter? The CAA seem to endorse those with no problems.
Finally, if it's such a bad deal, surely Mesaba pilots have the right to say no? Are they being drected to Cityjet?
Told you it was a humble opinion, but I don't see why Cityjet should be pilloried for taking crews from good sources, and I don't see why US pilots should be pilloried for going wherever work is available. I'd choose that over unemployment anyday.
Don't TCX, among others, have reciprocal agreements that see US pilots working in the summer in the UK, then returning to the US for the winter? The CAA seem to endorse those with no problems.
Finally, if it's such a bad deal, surely Mesaba pilots have the right to say no? Are they being drected to Cityjet?
Told you it was a humble opinion, but I don't see why Cityjet should be pilloried for taking crews from good sources, and I don't see why US pilots should be pilloried for going wherever work is available. I'd choose that over unemployment anyday.
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Originally Posted by Miles Hi
Sorry for my humble opinion. If Cityjet are getting new aircraft in, and they don't have either sufficient or suitable crews to operate them, should they not investigate the availability of crews from elsewhere, including the US?
Don't TCX, among others, have reciprocal agreements that see US pilots working in the summer in the UK, then returning to the US for the winter? The CAA seem to endorse those with no problems.
Finally, if it's such a bad deal, surely Mesaba pilots have the right to say no? Are they being drected to Cityjet?
Told you it was a humble opinion, but I don't see why Cityjet should be pilloried for taking crews from good sources, and I don't see why US pilots should be pilloried for going wherever work is available. I'd choose that over unemployment anyday.
Don't TCX, among others, have reciprocal agreements that see US pilots working in the summer in the UK, then returning to the US for the winter? The CAA seem to endorse those with no problems.
Finally, if it's such a bad deal, surely Mesaba pilots have the right to say no? Are they being drected to Cityjet?
Told you it was a humble opinion, but I don't see why Cityjet should be pilloried for taking crews from good sources, and I don't see why US pilots should be pilloried for going wherever work is available. I'd choose that over unemployment anyday.
There seems to be an exiled EU pilot living and flying in the South Pacific who can’t seem to grasp the concept of the old supply and demand concept… in other words if there are no supplies around the corner, you need to look elsewhere. He is under the delusion that the more you pay for your training the more entitled you are to a job in Europe. Now I have to ask you did you ever hear of anything as ridiculous as this? MORon should start a crusade and banish the JAA training schools in the US.
While the Mesaba jets maybe going to Europe, the pilots are going on to bigger and better in the US or Emirates for that matter.