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-   -   Is Ukraine about to have a war? (https://www.pprune.org/military-aviation/639666-ukraine-about-have-war.html)

Recc 12th May 2022 11:50


Originally Posted by NutLoose (Post 11229084)
Any Idea? A big orange cloud

According to Dan Kaszeta (who should know) it is an ammonium nitrate explosion. Likely a result of an agricultural warehouse being targeted (or hit by mistake). Almost certainly not a deliberate use of chemical weapons.


NutLoose 12th May 2022 12:11

https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune....f03e74f3e8.png

Sue Vêtements 12th May 2022 12:31


Originally Posted by NutLoose (Post 11229091)
More on the tank rolling over the troops, from the tanks view

Somehow it seems like the tank is driving a lot faster than in the other video

Wokkafans 12th May 2022 12:46


Originally Posted by Sue Vêtements (Post 11229119)
Somehow it seems like the tank is driving a lot faster than in the other video


Now they need to do it at this speed.


Ninthace 12th May 2022 12:51


Originally Posted by Recc (Post 11229096)
According to Dan Kaszeta (who should know) it is an ammonium nitrate explosion. Likely a result of an agricultural warehouse being targeted (or hit by mistake). Almost certainly not a deliberate use of chemical weapons.

https://twitter.com/DanKaszeta/statu...78308074897411

Nitrogen Dioxide by the look of the colour, Chlorine is yellowy green

MPN11 12th May 2022 14:28


Originally Posted by Wokkafans (Post 11229129)
Now they need to do it at this speed.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cTj8FnmGLTM

hmmm ... and people here mutter about flying displays? What could have gone wrong there? Bloody stupid, IMHO.

Davef68 12th May 2022 15:20


Originally Posted by Recc (Post 11229096)
According to Dan Kaszeta (who should know) it is an ammonium nitrate explosion. Likely a result of an agricultural warehouse being targeted (or hit by mistake). Almost certainly not a deliberate use of chemical weapons.

https://twitter.com/DanKaszeta/statu...78308074897411

Compare with the secondary explosion of the stored fertilliser in Beruit in 2019 - same red orange colour


WideScreen 12th May 2022 16:13


Originally Posted by NutLoose (Post 11227733)
You think that’s bad sue, have you seen his propaganda?
(Chopped a few propaganda pictures)

Actually, you can just buy this kind of pictures on shutterstock.com and so, with the right to publish online.

WideScreen 12th May 2022 16:21


Originally Posted by [email protected] (Post 11228129)
Widescreen - not a NATO job at all but the EU could act as a partner to a future Russia (they already were to some extent with the German policies of building links through trade).

The power and money of the EU could help a reborn Russia stand on it's own feet but there would have to be no military threat - which the Russians perceive NATO to be - it would have to be trade based and would need a lot of investment from the West.

The Russians have a common currency, an almost common language and a country-wide system of command and control/government - if you can remove the FSB and the thought police from their country and introduce a bit of free speech without the threat of imprisonment (or worse) the raw materials for a successful rebirth of a proud nation are there.

For me, this feels very close to the concept of "being able to bring democracy".

Those in the Power (including the FSB) aren't going to give up, or even share, their power with democratic elected competitors. That is, why I suggest, to take care the Russian Federation breaks up, etc. It removes the Nukes threat, removes the original powers and brings back a more manageable scale. See how much difficulties the US does have to keep its democracy upright.

WideScreen 12th May 2022 16:23


Originally Posted by ORAC (Post 11228759)
Not sure why you think the Chinese TV crew would fake their own footage to UKR advantage..

TBH, I do think, there are a lot of Chinese reporters, with itching fingers to report the reality, vs. China state propaganda. This footage gave them an excellent opportunity, without serious risk of being accused of damaging the CCP.

WideScreen 12th May 2022 16:40


Originally Posted by dead_pan (Post 11228134)
Whilst Russia is a country-mile from doing a Yugoslavia IMO, it does beg the question what would the likes of NATO, the EU and China do if it were to descend into civil war, with its various bits vying for control over its natural resources and nukes? If it came to some sort of sphere-of-influence carve-up, China could do quite well with the resource-rich eastern territories, Europe being left with all the lunatic-fringe territories west of the Urals...

I think, you raise a lot of interesting topics in just 2 sentences.

The Nukes: I don't think, that stuff is suitable for regional conflicts, apart from that, just too expensive to manage.

Natural resources: Oil can be relatively easily transported (though large scale is still overhead intensive), but gas needs the tubes. And those tubes will cross that many areas to reach somebody willing to pay for it at a large scale, that it is likely a conflicting area is crossed. When the tubes are already in place, it's a difficult situation. When the tubes need to be instated, forget it.

The China connection: It's a huge distance, so needs careful planning, protection, etc. Less suitable for conflicting areas. Mongolia isn't that much a China friend, on top of that pretty uninhabitable, so, difficult.

West of the Urals: Yeah, that was the thought of the NATO future, before Putin started messing around with reality and becoming more and more a NATO opponent again, early 2000. Apart from the Putin made mess (social, political and some more), Russians are quite nice people, a bit rough on the edge, though that is not that strange in other areas on the Globe, US Midwest, Mexico, Colombia, etc.


Imagegear 12th May 2022 17:18

Another ship hit today:7


IG

MPN11 12th May 2022 18:20

“Ship on fire” also reported on CNN. Waiting for more details.

peter we 12th May 2022 18:27


Originally Posted by WideScreen (Post 11229259)
TBH, I do think, there are a lot of Chinese reporters, with itching fingers to report the reality, vs. China state propaganda. This footage gave them an excellent opportunity, without serious risk of being accused of damaging the CCP.

the Chinese reporter who recorded this is quite famous for being embedded in Russian forces. He's very pro Kremlin.

macmp419 12th May 2022 19:32


Originally Posted by Imagegear (Post 11229286)
Another ship hit today:7

IG

RAF Rivet Joint taking a keen interest in the area earlier…

ORAC 12th May 2022 19:48

According to Ukrainian sources the Russians once again attempted to ford the Siverskyi Donets river, near Bilohorivka, earlier this afternoon.

It went about as well as their previous attempts...


macmp419 12th May 2022 20:04


Originally Posted by ORAC (Post 11229368)
According to Ukrainian sources the Russians once again attempted to ford the Siverskyi Donets river, near Bilohorivka, earlier this afternoon.

It went about as well as their previous attempts...

Insanity, let us hope that they do not learn the definition of it any time soon.

ORAC 12th May 2022 20:13

For the war crimes tribunal(s)…


ORAC 12th May 2022 20:20

Ukrainian army in first, that I am aware of, use of ground launched Brimstone. Anyone recognise the launcher?


macmp419 12th May 2022 20:56


Originally Posted by ORAC (Post 11229386)
Ukrainian army in first, that I am aware of, use of ground launched Brimstone. Anyone recognise the launcher?

I do not recognise the launcher, but I saw the same footage earlier claiming Ukrainian troops under training.

Either way, interesting…


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