Future Carrier (Including Costs)
The lack of any statement or press release, with the eyes of the informed defence community on the carriers, is disgraceful.
Yes, we the tax-payers do indeed have a right to know what is going on.
Oh! But its Sunday and only just into the weekend.
Tuesday if we are lucky. Predicted word: ISSUES.
Sad to say, the only bit that MoD gets consistently right is ceremonial, which will frighten nobody.
Yes, we the tax-payers do indeed have a right to know what is going on.
Oh! But its Sunday and only just into the weekend.
Tuesday if we are lucky. Predicted word: ISSUES.
Sad to say, the only bit that MoD gets consistently right is ceremonial, which will frighten nobody.
Shock horror, ship at 30 days notice due to leave after 8 days not 7.
Ser Time Ship From To Method Remarks
5 1212-1410 MAIN CHANNEL CLOSED TO INBOUND AND OUTBOUND TRAFFIC
6 1300 HMS PRINCE OF WALES VJ OSB P & TE BOUNTIFUL, INDEPENDENT, INDULGENT, PHENIX, CHRISTINA (OR SMS)
7 1320 SMALL BOAT CHANNEL CLOSED TO INBOUND AND OUTBOUND TRAFFIC
8 1405 HMS PRINCE OF WALES OSB NAB P & TE BOUNTIFUL, INDEPENDENT, INDULGENT, PHENIX
HW 12:57 4.8m
Ser Time Ship From To Method Remarks
5 1212-1410 MAIN CHANNEL CLOSED TO INBOUND AND OUTBOUND TRAFFIC
6 1300 HMS PRINCE OF WALES VJ OSB P & TE BOUNTIFUL, INDEPENDENT, INDULGENT, PHENIX, CHRISTINA (OR SMS)
7 1320 SMALL BOAT CHANNEL CLOSED TO INBOUND AND OUTBOUND TRAFFIC
8 1405 HMS PRINCE OF WALES OSB NAB P & TE BOUNTIFUL, INDEPENDENT, INDULGENT, PHENIX
HW 12:57 4.8m
that's an "aspiration" right now...........................
tho given the publicity I suspect she'll leave under sail and oars today whatever the state of her machinery
tho given the publicity I suspect she'll leave under sail and oars today whatever the state of her machinery
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Ye of little faith, plenty activity on flightdeck, third Wildcat landed and unloaded.
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we await an explanation - but presumably is it was someone else's fault we'd have been told instantly. Is that not a reasonable assumption?
After all they had actually closed the channel to other traffic and on todays timings that suggests she was within a couple of hours of moving.
After all they had actually closed the channel to other traffic and on todays timings that suggests she was within a couple of hours of moving.
we await an explanation - but presumably is it was someone else's fault we'd have been told instantly. Is that not a reasonable assumption?
After all they had actually closed the channel to other traffic and on today’timings that suggests she was within a couple of hours of moving.
After all they had actually closed the channel to other traffic and on today’timings that suggests she was within a couple of hours of moving.
Through the harbour entrance c1350Z
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we await an explanation - but presumably is it was someone else's fault we'd have been told instantly. Is that not a reasonable assumption?
After all they had actually closed the channel to other traffic and on todays timings that suggests she was within a couple of hours of moving.
After all they had actually closed the channel to other traffic and on todays timings that suggests she was within a couple of hours of moving.
Secondly, late is late, delayed is delayed. I know sh1t happens, but it happens too often, not just the RN but all over Defence.
It's NAGL, as my daughters used to say of dress sense .......... Not A Good Look.
So Bon Voyage, and fingers crossed.
we await an explanation - but presumably is it was someone else's fault we'd have been told instantly. Is that not a reasonable assumption?
After all they had actually closed the channel to other traffic and on todays timings that suggests she was within a couple of hours of moving.
After all they had actually closed the channel to other traffic and on todays timings that suggests she was within a couple of hours of moving.
You're still using supposition, not evidence, but if it makes you feel happier, she looked perfectly happy sailing past the window a few minutes ago.
Thread Starter
HMS Prince of Wales sails for key NATO exercise in Norway - Royal Navy
HMS Prince of Wales will lead a carrier strike group of eight ships – four of them British, including frigate HMS Somerset and two Tide-class tankers from the Royal Fleet Auxiliary – supported by US, Spanish and Danish vessels.
They form one of the most potent naval forces of the exercise – an allied fleet of 40 vessels, drawn from more than two dozen nations, committed to the seagoing element of Steadfast Defender, which will take place off Norway’s Arctic coast from late February into March.
The carrier brings the capability of her F-35B Lightning stealth fighters from 617 ‘Dambusters’ Squadron at RAF Marham, submarine hunting and airborne early warning Merlin Mk2 helicopters from RNAS Culdrose, and battlefield Wildcat helicopters of 847 Naval Air Squadron from RNAS Yeovilton.
Before heading for Norwegian waters, HMS Prince of Wales is conducting a week’s training in the North Sea with her air group to hone the skills of the 780-strong ship’s company – plus nearly 600 men and women embarked with the F-35s and helicopters...
On a not entirely unrelated note, I saw something interesting on the BBC News site:
The fighter pilots hunting Houthi drones over the Red Sea
"We took a Harrier jet and modified it for air defence," Ehrhart tells me. "We loaded it up with missiles and that way were able to respond to their drone attacks."
An experienced fighter pilot, Ehrhart says he has shot down seven Houthi drones. But when flying so close to these explosive devices, he says, every interception carries great risk.
"They are shooting at us all the time, so we need to be even more focused. Our systems need to be primed so we can stay safe."
Like the Super Hornets from the USS Eisenhower, the AV-8B+ can fired Sidewinder or AMRAAM. Both weapons are considerably cheaper than the SM-2 or SM-6 missiles. Some analytical but mischievous person could probably show mathematically that it is more cost effective to use shipborne aircraft to engage UAVs and anti ship missiles than it is to use expensive missiles and then have to transit to a port to reload the VLS cells.
Then they can use some simpler calculations to show that having your air defence aircraft based aboard a carrier tasked with protecting ships carrying reinforcements is better than relying on ones based hundreds of miles away (think of the Norwegian Sea for a NATO example) and the value of defence in depth - after all nothing has one hundred percent reliability.
HMS Prince of Wales will lead a carrier strike group of eight ships – four of them British, including frigate HMS Somerset and two Tide-class tankers from the Royal Fleet Auxiliary – supported by US, Spanish and Danish vessels.
They form one of the most potent naval forces of the exercise – an allied fleet of 40 vessels, drawn from more than two dozen nations, committed to the seagoing element of Steadfast Defender, which will take place off Norway’s Arctic coast from late February into March.
The carrier brings the capability of her F-35B Lightning stealth fighters from 617 ‘Dambusters’ Squadron at RAF Marham, submarine hunting and airborne early warning Merlin Mk2 helicopters from RNAS Culdrose, and battlefield Wildcat helicopters of 847 Naval Air Squadron from RNAS Yeovilton.
Before heading for Norwegian waters, HMS Prince of Wales is conducting a week’s training in the North Sea with her air group to hone the skills of the 780-strong ship’s company – plus nearly 600 men and women embarked with the F-35s and helicopters...
On a not entirely unrelated note, I saw something interesting on the BBC News site:
The fighter pilots hunting Houthi drones over the Red Sea
"We took a Harrier jet and modified it for air defence," Ehrhart tells me. "We loaded it up with missiles and that way were able to respond to their drone attacks."
An experienced fighter pilot, Ehrhart says he has shot down seven Houthi drones. But when flying so close to these explosive devices, he says, every interception carries great risk.
"They are shooting at us all the time, so we need to be even more focused. Our systems need to be primed so we can stay safe."
Like the Super Hornets from the USS Eisenhower, the AV-8B+ can fired Sidewinder or AMRAAM. Both weapons are considerably cheaper than the SM-2 or SM-6 missiles. Some analytical but mischievous person could probably show mathematically that it is more cost effective to use shipborne aircraft to engage UAVs and anti ship missiles than it is to use expensive missiles and then have to transit to a port to reload the VLS cells.
Then they can use some simpler calculations to show that having your air defence aircraft based aboard a carrier tasked with protecting ships carrying reinforcements is better than relying on ones based hundreds of miles away (think of the Norwegian Sea for a NATO example) and the value of defence in depth - after all nothing has one hundred percent reliability.
Branch Fanatic
unfortunately we haven’t got any Harriers and it seems risky to put expensive F 35 s up against drones?
the advantage of having aircraft on hand from carriers to defend shipping is stating the b obvious but unfortunately the carrier itself being nearby is a big juicy target.
Q can our F35Bs be fitted with guns and if so so could they safely shoot down drones?
unfortunately we haven’t got any Harriers and it seems risky to put expensive F 35 s up against drones?
the advantage of having aircraft on hand from carriers to defend shipping is stating the b obvious but unfortunately the carrier itself being nearby is a big juicy target.
Q can our F35Bs be fitted with guns and if so so could they safely shoot down drones?
Last edited by mahogany bob; 12th Feb 2024 at 15:52.
MB
1) Yes they can be fitted with the GAU-22/A cannon pod
2) No, the UK didn't buy any because
Any Vietnam era F-4 pilots/WSOs/RIOs wish to disabuse them?
1) Yes they can be fitted with the GAU-22/A cannon pod
2) No, the UK didn't buy any because
- We are not going to get into dogfights 'we don't need to go there because we will make sure we play to our advantages and not theirs.' (said Air Cdre X)
- It's an air to ground weapon
Any Vietnam era F-4 pilots/WSOs/RIOs wish to disabuse them?
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Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Australia OZ
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Farnborough 2022: ‘Guns no longer required', says senior UK F-35 pilot 21 Jul 2022: https://www.janes.com/defence-news/n...-uk-f-35-pilot "...the UK has no plans to acquire [gunpod]."
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GUN POD: https://qph.cf2.quoracdn.net/main-qi...60c3353f11e978
"Seen on the centreline of an F-35B test aircraft, the pod-mounted 25 mm GAU-22/A Gatling gun has not been ordered by the UK. (Lockheed Martin)" https://www.janes.com/images/default...-jdw-18335.jpg
Last edited by SpazSinbad; 12th Feb 2024 at 19:39. Reason: _jpgs & txt
Those AIM120 cost US$ 1.37 million each - you can see the attraction of a gun to take out drones that cost less than $10k each..................
Ecce Homo! Loquitur...
But from recollection the F-35 guns couldn't shoot straight. Maybe that's been fixed.