Ryanair

[Fancy Navigator]

Hi
Any updates on how quickly you go through the Type rating training, Line training, and eventually employment?

If you are offered a place on the Cadet scheme, does it mean you are guaranteed employment at the end of your training? When do you start getting piad?

Cheers for your answers, please do not launch more rumours.

[Dan 98]

Hi Fancy Navigator,
If you're offered a cadet place with Ryanair, you are offered a fixed term 6 monthly training contract, which commences upon successful completion of a "Base Check" when you have returned from either CAE in Amsterdam or SAS in Sweden, having completed your Type rating on the B737-800. It is at this point you start getting paid.
This contract is not a guarantee of employment, but I think it is fairly safe to say that you would either need unforseen circumstances ie. Terrorism, or some other major down turn in Aviation, (if this was the case all companies would be affected not just FR) or for the cadet not to have reached the required standard, thereby not qualifying to be offered a job, at the end of the 6 month training contract. Which is probably not unique to Ryanair, I expect most companies have means of terminating a Cadets employment during the probationary period.
Hope this helps

Dan98

[zooloflyer]

It is indeed common practice - although most companies I know will give you almost full FO pay from first flight with pax and it must be said that line training normally takes 2 to 3 months...

Anyone an idea what comes after the 6 month trng contract?

[inner]

Are we talking here about salaries AFTER taxes??

grtz

[-8AS]

Inner, sector pay in FR is tax free - basic salary is taxable.

[inner]

ok thx,

So if i read this, it sounds that only during the line training period (lets say 8-9 weeks)it is a financial difficult period. (15000/12) 1.250eur/month before taxes.

So assume you have 30.000eur and have an extra of, let's say 1500 eur for the line training period (2 o 3 month), it is afterall not that bad???

Or am i too optimistic?

[zooloflyer]

When you do your base check you start getting paid the basic training salary which is equivalent to about 15000 euro / year .

During line training (6-8 weeks ) you are paid this .

After line training you get a new contract - you recieve about 19000 euro or 17000 pounds depending where you are based - UK or EU . You are also paid half sector pay for 6 months from thwe time you were line checked . This is approx an extra 900 - 1300 euro / month . So total about 2300 / month .

After 6 months from initial line check you get full sector pay of around 2500 euro / month . So all in all you should survive it .

Thanks pressman! Helps a lot in doing the maths.

One question - when will you ever get to the mentioned 80.000euros???

Thanks.

[Dan 98]

Pressman,
I stand corrected .


Cheers

Dan

[Benny71]

Any word on at what point you are given a base and how much you are given? Just trying to work out how this works out with family etc.

Cheers.

[Benny71]

Sorry. What I actually meant to ask is how much notice they give before you are required at the assigned base, and at what point they inform you of base placement.

Apologies if this has been covered before.

Thanks.

Ben.

[Dan 98]

Benny71,
I think the way it works is at the end of your 'Line Check' you're assigned a base. At my interview I was asked for my 3 choices, but I am not sure how much weight these carry.I have a friend who has just finished his line training, he had asked for East Mids or Luton and has got Liverpool where they're very short at the moment. He hopes to get East Mids early next year.
I to have a family and it is one of my concerns as it is very hard to just upsticks at a moments notice. However with more aircraft arriving and 2 new bases I expect there will be movement which may create an element of choice ( I hope)!!! Outside the UK would be bad news for me.
Cheers

Dan98

[Gnirren]

And the first thing you should do right after you get hired is join REPA.
Do it.
http://www.repaweb.org/

[Dan 98]

Hi Gnirren,
Thanks for the advice, I will do that.
Cheers

Dan98

[-8AS]

Base choices are recognised by the company as being important to people and a lot of effort is being done by the Flight Operations Manager to put people in the base they want. However, operational requirements sometimes dictate where you are placed - for example Liverpool has been in need of people lately so quite a few new entry and internal Command upgrades sent there. Having said that, once you are placed in a base and it does not suit you for the long term you can apply to move and most people seem to be sorted out within a year.

[Benny71]

Dan 98 and others.

Thanks for the info guys. I can see this is going to be fun by the time I get to the point of base assignment of juggling a wife and 1, possibly 2 children moving to the UK.

Cheers,
Benny.

[jayc004]

Originally Posted by TolTol

How come some pilots have this roster? I know other pilots who are on 5 on 2 off, 5 on 3 off. Does it depend on where you are based?

Thanks.

Hey guys. The difference in roster days si all due to the contract you initially signed. Ryanair direct guys who recently sign are on that deal, as well as the Brookfields guys.

You will find that Brookfields offer an hoursly pay for block times. It works out for the first 3 months, E40 p/h, then from 3 months to 12 months it becomes E50 p/h. After 12 months, it is capped at E70 p/h. These are all block times, and this is pre tax. Also, Brookfields will not pay in pounds, only euro, and they will not pay into a UK bank account, so you have to set up an off shore, and then declare your earnings in which ever country you feel you want to pay tax. So work on 30% tax bracket in general, and bare in mind there is NO flight pay to be added on that.

Originally Posted by inner

ok thx,

So if i read this, it sounds that only during the line training period (lets say 8-9 weeks)it is a financial difficult period. (15000/12) 1.250eur/month before taxes.

So assume you have 30.000eur and have an extra of, let's say 1500 eur for the line training period (2 o 3 month), it is afterall not that bad???

Or am i too optimistic?

By all accounts, people are still saying there are months between finishing your base check, and going online for the line training. The 6 month training contract beconmes effective the day you pass your base check, so its in Ryanair's best interests to get you online as soon as possible as they have a very cheap first officer. You can also look at it like this, if you are sat around waiting to do you line training, go and get a temp job. You will be earning money from working for a temps agency doing something like working a factory or something, but you are also geting paid your NI, Pension, and a £800 p/m by ryanair for sitting on your butt........??

Originally Posted by Dan 98

Benny71,

I to have a family and it is one of my concerns as it is very hard to just upsticks at a moments notice. However with more aircraft arriving and 2 new bases I expect there will be movement which may create an element of choice ( I hope)!!! Outside the UK would be bad news for me.
Cheers
Dan98

Guys, with this, dont forget that you will be paid for out of base allowance, and you are given free positioning flights, which means you can fly home every night for free on a ryanair flight, or if not, then you have 5 days on, and then free flight home for 4 days at home.....Its not ideal, but it is only going to take 18 months before you have 1500 hours on B737-800....if you dont like it, almost any airline would rip your arm off, and i know this for fact as a couple of guys that finished their training when i stated have done just that. One now flying BA 737-800, one out to india as a fast track captain, and the other is in the process of doing a 777 converstion.


Personally, I am about to go to CAE to do the type rating. I have alot of options, and guys if you really dont want to pay for a type rating, or work for Ryanair because its that bad, apply to airlines in India and Bangladeshi. I applied with f(atpl) and mcc, and 3 airlines came back to me within a week offering me jobs with free flights and accomodation and type ratings, but dont think you are going to get paid much, and you are bonded.....which Im sure people here are forgetting.

I know a guy who has been waiting in the holding pool at CTC for almost a year, and people currently applying being told they would have to wait a year, and that is still going to cost £10K to do taht. They will be bonded to the airline, and then on a cadet sallery, in which time, i will have been paid my type rating costs back, gained well over 500 hours Jet time, and not be bonded, so at any time i want to leave, off i pop!!

Please guys, correct me if i am wrong, but a job isnt going to find you. You have to be prepared to take the rough with the smooth. The only way the industry will possibley change is if every shiney new cadet pilot in the country.....(make that the world because UK airlines will only start taking from outside UK), refuses to pay for type ratings.......but you and i know that will never happen. Cadets are shooting themselves in the foot buy being willing to pay, and the airlines know this. They are money making machines, so why would they spend money typing people when people will type themselves.......put yourself into the financial "bottom-line" position they are in. It makes sense doesn it!!??

[Jinkster]

I start at CAE on 2nd Jan - can anyone suggest accomodation at reasonable price within walking distance.

Thanks

[Fancy Navigator]

Originally Posted by Dan 98

Hi Fancy Navigator,
If you're offered a cadet place with Ryanair, you are offered a fixed term 6 monthly training contract, which commences upon successful completion of a "Base Check" when you have returned from either CAE in Amsterdam or SAS in Sweden, having completed your Type rating on the B737-800. It is at this point you start getting paid.
This contract is not a guarantee of employment, but I think it is fairly safe to say that you would either need unforseen circumstances ie. Terrorism, or some other major down turn in Aviation, (if this was the case all companies would be affected not just FR) or for the cadet not to have reached the required standard, thereby not qualifying to be offered a job, at the end of the 6 month training contract. Which is probably not unique to Ryanair, I expect most companies have means of terminating a Cadets employment during the probationary period.
Hope this helps
Dan98

Anybody else could confirm this one? It seems very positive!
Cheers

[-8AS]

One of the true benefits of joining Ryanair is the security of the Company. As has been illuded to in this thread, aviaton is ficle and events such as September 11 and SARs cause major problems for the pilot work force in general. After Sept 11, Virgin laid off 100 new joiners, Aer Lingus all their Cadets, Air New Zealand stopped recruitment and nearly went belly up, Cathay put pilots on unpaid leave etc etc. Ryanair RECRUITED during this period - all the Aer Lingus Cadets bar one or two joined FR. I am not saying FR are immune to such events but due to their margins and Cash reserves they are much better suited to weather such storms. (Ryanair has posted a profit every quarter for over 11 years).

Thus, Cadets who are offered courses with CAE and SAS are almost guaranteed (probably to strong a word) jobs with FR. I only know of an isolated few who have not met the required standard during line training or Sim.

Further, for a low houred Cadet, career progression could not be better. You won't progress any faster in any other company worldwide.

So, if you are considering joining do make yourself aware of all the pit falls, but also weigh up the advantages. Especially if you are decideing between FR and an SSTR with no job guarantee. I know what I would be doing.

[Fancy Navigator]

Originally Posted by -8AS

Thus, Cadets who are offered courses with CAE and SAS are almost guaranteed (probably to strong a word) jobs with FR.

What do you mean by "guaranteed" too strong a word? what would be a percentage of people who are successful?