Ryanair
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incidentally, I have never flown with an ex-Ryanair pilot in Virgin.
Hi Scroggs,
MMmmm... I have a very good friend who is a SFO in Virgin on the A340 fleet who knows of pilots from FR!!! He is the one who has said go for FR and work hard for 3-5yrs and then go for Virgin.
Must be a big group of pilots for you not to have come across any!!
Anyhow this post is in danger of becoming tit for tat, and the whole point was that different routes suite different people. I happen to know from my contact at FR that there has been a lot of change in the last 12 months with middle management and that new joiners are being treated much better, it is possible for companies to change you know.
I have a friend who is going through line training now, he has been treated fairly and should complete his line training in 7 weeks. He had to wait 2 weeks from finishing his TR to be based checked. He has no complaints so far. It is very easy to slate FR with articles that were written in 2004, when things may well have been worse, but good for them for improving things. Everyone is an adult on here (supposedly) do what you think is best for you, not what others may think they know about.
All the best
Dan
Hi Scroggs,
MMmmm... I have a very good friend who is a SFO in Virgin on the A340 fleet who knows of pilots from FR!!! He is the one who has said go for FR and work hard for 3-5yrs and then go for Virgin.
Must be a big group of pilots for you not to have come across any!!
Anyhow this post is in danger of becoming tit for tat, and the whole point was that different routes suite different people. I happen to know from my contact at FR that there has been a lot of change in the last 12 months with middle management and that new joiners are being treated much better, it is possible for companies to change you know.
I have a friend who is going through line training now, he has been treated fairly and should complete his line training in 7 weeks. He had to wait 2 weeks from finishing his TR to be based checked. He has no complaints so far. It is very easy to slate FR with articles that were written in 2004, when things may well have been worse, but good for them for improving things. Everyone is an adult on here (supposedly) do what you think is best for you, not what others may think they know about.
All the best
Dan
Join Date: Dec 1997
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Dan98, I did not say there weren't any - simply that I had not flown with any and I wasn't aware of any. On the other hand, I have flown with several from EZ and other airlines. There is, as far as I know, no published list of Virgin pilots' previous companies! There are around 400 pilots on the A340 at VS.
If Ryanair have improved their Terms and Conditions over the past year, that's great - but it will not, I suspect, have much to do with pressure from the line pilots as the company does not allow union representation and has allegedly applied considerable pressure to dissuade pilots from joining any union. A bit of research on REPA (the nascent Ryanair European Pilots' Association) will provide some interesting background information on the subject. The changes to Ts & Cs will have been almost entirely driven by market forces - other airlines' better offers are simply more attractive to potential Ryanair pilots, and the company's reputation among pilots seems to have been steadily deteriorating over the past couple of years. The recent court case, and particularly the judges statement about the company's use of intimidation as a management tool, are worth further study. This month's BALPA Log magazine covers it quite well, and it received a lot of coverage on Pprune.
I should add that I have no personal axe to grind about Ryanair. However, I think you should go in with your eyes open, and fully informed by those who are currently employed there. To that end, there are several Ryanair threads in T&E which it would be worth your while reading.
Scroggs
If Ryanair have improved their Terms and Conditions over the past year, that's great - but it will not, I suspect, have much to do with pressure from the line pilots as the company does not allow union representation and has allegedly applied considerable pressure to dissuade pilots from joining any union. A bit of research on REPA (the nascent Ryanair European Pilots' Association) will provide some interesting background information on the subject. The changes to Ts & Cs will have been almost entirely driven by market forces - other airlines' better offers are simply more attractive to potential Ryanair pilots, and the company's reputation among pilots seems to have been steadily deteriorating over the past couple of years. The recent court case, and particularly the judges statement about the company's use of intimidation as a management tool, are worth further study. This month's BALPA Log magazine covers it quite well, and it received a lot of coverage on Pprune.
I should add that I have no personal axe to grind about Ryanair. However, I think you should go in with your eyes open, and fully informed by those who are currently employed there. To that end, there are several Ryanair threads in T&E which it would be worth your while reading.
Scroggs
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Not done it myself, but I understand the sim detail is a departure, followed by steep turns, NDB hold, ILS followed by an engine failure. One shot to impress, and very little training input. Practice for low houred or non-type rated guys is essential.
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I'm not sure if Ryanair uses different selection procedures for experienced and inexperienced pilots, but this forum is only for the inexperienced guys who have never been employed. Terms and Endearments is the appropriate forum for people looking to move from another airline position.
Scroggs
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Scroggs - did it ever occur to you that you may not have come across ex Fr drivers in Virgin because contrary to popular belief they are largely happy with their lot in FR and are not leaving?
TightYorksherMan
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I know as a low houred pilot - we get NO choice whether its Flybe, BA, Virgin, FCA or Ryanair we go to!!
If Ryanair will employ me - I'll take it, likewise if the Isle of Scilly Skybus do - I'll take that - but to fly a shiny jet on
terms and conditions for a couple of years and bugger off then fair enough - I've never been an airline driver before so dont know the "better" life or for that matter the "worse" life.
FR maybe very good I dunno!!
And guys....
Scroggs works for free (PPRuNe modding) so give him a break - without the mods I dont want to see what the forums would be like!
Jinkster
If Ryanair will employ me - I'll take it, likewise if the Isle of Scilly Skybus do - I'll take that - but to fly a shiny jet on
terms and conditions for a couple of years and bugger off then fair enough - I've never been an airline driver before so dont know the "better" life or for that matter the "worse" life.FR maybe very good I dunno!!
And guys....
Scroggs works for free (PPRuNe modding) so give him a break - without the mods I dont want to see what the forums would be like!
Jinkster
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...
Join Date: Feb 2003
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Jinks, you are right in your points, and yes we are sadly forced due to the way everything is, go to basically, who ever will have us!
If I had the 23k plus plus...the way things have been recently, if I really thought that would sort this terrible mess out, then yes, I'd be going to Ryanair. - Because sure as eggs is eggs, instructing on SEP's means nothing to the airlines anymore, my recent applications have proven that theory.
Questions recently whilst completely disregarding my hours as an FI so far were; "Have you got a TR?" - Me -"No"
"Have you got the money for a TR" - Me - "No"
"Have you got 1500 hours ++ in a JAR 25 OP" - Me - "No"
"Are you shafted for the time being?" - Me- "Yes, pretty much!"
I suspect its due to the change in the industry, and the job its self. They want type rated tuppys! ( Jinks knows what I mean by that)
WB (Ps Bia Hoi, Jinks, tomoro after interview?)
If I had the 23k plus plus...the way things have been recently, if I really thought that would sort this terrible mess out, then yes, I'd be going to Ryanair. - Because sure as eggs is eggs, instructing on SEP's means nothing to the airlines anymore, my recent applications have proven that theory.
Questions recently whilst completely disregarding my hours as an FI so far were; "Have you got a TR?" - Me -"No"
"Have you got the money for a TR" - Me - "No"
"Have you got 1500 hours ++ in a JAR 25 OP" - Me - "No"
"Are you shafted for the time being?" - Me- "Yes, pretty much!"
I suspect its due to the change in the industry, and the job its self. They want type rated tuppys! ( Jinks knows what I mean by that)
WB (Ps Bia Hoi, Jinks, tomoro after interview?)
Join Date: Sep 2003
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Hi all
I have an assessment coming up with Ryanair for a F/O position. After applying through their site i received an email from one of their recruitment officers asking me to email EMA hq wth my CV so that they can arrange a date for my assessment. I have done so and i have been waiting 2 weeks so far for any response with a date etc. Does anyone know how long its taking at present to be given a date for assessment for direct entry f/o's (type rated and 100hrs on type)?
I'm just trying to be patient at present but i am starting to think that they may not have received my email as all of my previous correspondance has been replied to VERY quickly indeed.
Many thanks in advance
Foil
I have an assessment coming up with Ryanair for a F/O position. After applying through their site i received an email from one of their recruitment officers asking me to email EMA hq wth my CV so that they can arrange a date for my assessment. I have done so and i have been waiting 2 weeks so far for any response with a date etc. Does anyone know how long its taking at present to be given a date for assessment for direct entry f/o's (type rated and 100hrs on type)?
I'm just trying to be patient at present but i am starting to think that they may not have received my email as all of my previous correspondance has been replied to VERY quickly indeed.
Many thanks in advance
Foil
Join Date: Mar 2006
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Scroggs
Things have changed in this industry, you are way off if you think it hasn't! Sure the T&C's aren't as good with FR as they are with Virgin, but on the other hand, I would like to know the last time YOUR company took on a talented low timer and offered him/her a chance of getting his/her career on the way!
Somebody has got to do the dirty work! Ryanair is doing it, and they know they can't offer what Virgin is offering to all of their pilots. But the blame shouldn't be on Ryanair for taking on low timers in large number - the blame should be on all of those that aren't!
Give us the choice of which airline to apply to, and we won't choose the one with the worst conditions!
It's as simple as that - but feel free to remain on your high horses and judge those that try to make it to where you are today!
Things have changed in this industry, you are way off if you think it hasn't! Sure the T&C's aren't as good with FR as they are with Virgin, but on the other hand, I would like to know the last time YOUR company took on a talented low timer and offered him/her a chance of getting his/her career on the way!
Somebody has got to do the dirty work! Ryanair is doing it, and they know they can't offer what Virgin is offering to all of their pilots. But the blame shouldn't be on Ryanair for taking on low timers in large number - the blame should be on all of those that aren't!
Give us the choice of which airline to apply to, and we won't choose the one with the worst conditions!
It's as simple as that - but feel free to remain on your high horses and judge those that try to make it to where you are today!
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I really don't understand what is bad with the T&C's in FR. Even for cadets. I would rather say their good. I've been with them for a year now and my salary is approx 5500 Euros per month and I work 5/5...But I don't stay in fancy hotels + I have to bring my own coffee, and compared to being an FI...My life has become alot better. That's the T&C's. The real problem being employed by FR is that its entire operation is based on a small company in terms of staffing...So generally speaking, it's an okay place to be.
Just remember that nobody on this forum is stating a completely unbiased view. Some might have a particular interest in trying to undermine a specific business/company. Don't believe everything you read.
Just remember that nobody on this forum is stating a completely unbiased view. Some might have a particular interest in trying to undermine a specific business/company. Don't believe everything you read.
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I am not following something here? Why is your sector pay so thin if you are a RYR employee? Isn't sector pay dependent on the number of sectors you fly whereas flight pay is determined on the length of time chock to chock?
The fact that you may get short sectors (presumably when you wanted longer ones) is surely no different to any other airline. For example the mixed 757/767 guys at BA will undoubtedly get a fair amount of LHR-MAN or LHR-NCL rather than the longer european routes so this can occur anywhere can't it?
The fact that you may get short sectors (presumably when you wanted longer ones) is surely no different to any other airline. For example the mixed 757/767 guys at BA will undoubtedly get a fair amount of LHR-MAN or LHR-NCL rather than the longer european routes so this can occur anywhere can't it?
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Hi all
I have an assessment coming up with Ryanair for a F/O position. After applying through their site i received an email from one of their recruitment officers asking me to email EMA hq wth my CV so that they can arrange a date for my assessment. I have done so and i have been waiting 2 weeks so far for any response with a date etc. Does anyone know how long its taking at present to be given a date for assessment for direct entry f/o's (type rated and 100hrs on type)?
I'm just trying to be patient at present but i am starting to think that they may not have received my email as all of my previous correspondance has been replied to VERY quickly indeed.
Many thanks in advance
Foil
I have an assessment coming up with Ryanair for a F/O position. After applying through their site i received an email from one of their recruitment officers asking me to email EMA hq wth my CV so that they can arrange a date for my assessment. I have done so and i have been waiting 2 weeks so far for any response with a date etc. Does anyone know how long its taking at present to be given a date for assessment for direct entry f/o's (type rated and 100hrs on type)?
I'm just trying to be patient at present but i am starting to think that they may not have received my email as all of my previous correspondance has been replied to VERY quickly indeed.
Many thanks in advance
Foil
Many thanks
Foil
Join Date: Nov 2003
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Hey Aerofoil,
Have you try to contact the guy who send you the first e-mail after the application on line, send him an e-mail perhaps it will work...(one or two days for the answer usually
By the way I don't know when you did the application but it's seems a little bit late to react as the interviews in Ema are full until the end of december, and that's why they rise the minimum to 500 hrs.
I wish you the best;-)
Flyingoli
Have you try to contact the guy who send you the first e-mail after the application on line, send him an e-mail perhaps it will work...(one or two days for the answer usually
By the way I don't know when you did the application but it's seems a little bit late to react as the interviews in Ema are full until the end of december, and that's why they rise the minimum to 500 hrs. I wish you the best;-)
Flyingoli
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Last night I had drinks with a mate of mine who had just turned down an interview with FR and here is why.
He has over 4000 hr, 3000+ multi turbine multi crew, TRE, TRI, world wide experience, and is rated B737 but with no time on type.
So he arranges an interview and get a package saying it would be for a cadet position…WTF?
He called back to confirm and they said that because his time is mostly under 5.7T he will be considered as a cadet…… he politely declined their offer.
FR are still taking the piss, no ifs and buts, there are literally 1000’s of type rated guys out there but they are still playing silly games.
A leopard can not change its spots.
He has over 4000 hr, 3000+ multi turbine multi crew, TRE, TRI, world wide experience, and is rated B737 but with no time on type.
So he arranges an interview and get a package saying it would be for a cadet position…WTF?
He called back to confirm and they said that because his time is mostly under 5.7T he will be considered as a cadet…… he politely declined their offer.
FR are still taking the piss, no ifs and buts, there are literally 1000’s of type rated guys out there but they are still playing silly games.
A leopard can not change its spots.
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so question. I have 1900 TT, 800 in a beech 1900. i also have a 737 type rating, but no time on the plane. if i apply with ryanair, they will only offer me a cadet position?