BA CC industrial relations (current airline staff only)
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Gatwick Fleet - Don't forget us
It may be a shining example but not for the Cabin Crew who have to work on pretty awful salaries and a lousy contract. Fine if you are 21years and living at home. And please, do not say that accepting the job is their choice - it is not - MF are taking advantage of Cabin Crew. They will leave in their droves when other airlines start advertising and they have had their taste of flying... doen't sould llike good business to me.
We come in do our job, have fun, give great service and just generally get on with it. And you would be shocked just how much I earn as a Cabin Manager, I'm sure CSMs will be very equal, looking at their package.
In fact posters on here seem to have forgotten that we exist - it isn't just legacy fleets vs MF
When I read, "it's been a pleasure to fly with MF" it hurts. It's been a pleasure to fly with us too, especially since we started doing mixed flying. It's what I hear every trip from the B777 flightdeck.
Please remember us!
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Ice and slice,
you have said that once other airlines start recruiting, crew on MF will leave.
Other airlines ARE recruiting. Flybe, easy, ryan etc. Why would someone go there since they pay less? Plus most of the MF crew are ex crew coming from those or similar airlines.
One thing we should all remember, is that those crew are happy to have a PERMANENT job, in an environment that they are not bullied, harassed or discriminated, and they can come and do their trips having fun and not spend their rest in the bunks crying.
I don't know which contract you are on, but people who have been around, know that BA is the best place to be, regardless of which contract they have. The only thing that makes people's life hard in BA are the militants.
Now if you are referring to middle eastern airlines, well this option is applicable to certain people only, and as the climate in those airlines is similar to the climate they have experienced when they were doing their temp contracts, many people would avoid that.
Mixed fleet is the "happy fleet" at the moment and for as long as this will be the case, I don't think anyone will go anywhere soon. I know that maybe not everyone is happy on MF, but I can only say that from MY experience, most of the CC are or at least look happy. What will happen in a year, is something we will all have to wait and see.
Yellow dog, you are absolutely right. I am very often on a LGW flight on staff travel and I have always admired your standards. And my only question when chatting with the crew was "why every time I am on a LGW flight, the crew seem genuinely happy?" Now that I have joined MF, I think I have found the answer!
Thanks Yellow dog and keep your standards high!
you have said that once other airlines start recruiting, crew on MF will leave.
Other airlines ARE recruiting. Flybe, easy, ryan etc. Why would someone go there since they pay less? Plus most of the MF crew are ex crew coming from those or similar airlines.
One thing we should all remember, is that those crew are happy to have a PERMANENT job, in an environment that they are not bullied, harassed or discriminated, and they can come and do their trips having fun and not spend their rest in the bunks crying.
I don't know which contract you are on, but people who have been around, know that BA is the best place to be, regardless of which contract they have. The only thing that makes people's life hard in BA are the militants.
Now if you are referring to middle eastern airlines, well this option is applicable to certain people only, and as the climate in those airlines is similar to the climate they have experienced when they were doing their temp contracts, many people would avoid that.
Mixed fleet is the "happy fleet" at the moment and for as long as this will be the case, I don't think anyone will go anywhere soon. I know that maybe not everyone is happy on MF, but I can only say that from MY experience, most of the CC are or at least look happy. What will happen in a year, is something we will all have to wait and see.
Yellow dog, you are absolutely right. I am very often on a LGW flight on staff travel and I have always admired your standards. And my only question when chatting with the crew was "why every time I am on a LGW flight, the crew seem genuinely happy?" Now that I have joined MF, I think I have found the answer!
Thanks Yellow dog and keep your standards high!
Last edited by blue____; 16th Nov 2010 at 14:17.
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They will leave in their droves when other airlines start advertising and they have had their taste of flying... doen't sould llike good business to me.
Ironically the business model points to the low time/financial cost to train CC and the lack of necessity to retain crew on a long term basis except those crew the company wish to retain as FTC or the CSM based upon their performance management. This, in the long term, significantly reduces the cost overheads associated with incremental payscales and the attached NI and pension contributions. The company is actively looking at an increased turn around of crew which will be to the benefit of the customer in the long run as fresh, enthusiastic crew work the aircraft instead of an aircraft full of older, disguntled crew who can't get the same pay for any other job anywhere else.
As I have already said previously the MF crews have been excellent so far (early days but the outlook seems very positive for the future) but then so are the vast majority of our usual 'legacy' crews. The biggest difference from my point of view is that, in disruption, I don't have to pussy foot around the BASSA 'laminated card/Rabid Reps' and can concentrate on getting our paying customers to their destination. Hopefully the days of the CC being on more restrictive working practices than the FC are well and truly over. 48hours local diversion rest anyone?
Does that make better business sense to you?
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They will leave in their droves when other airlines start advertising and they have had their taste of flying... doen't sould llike good business to me.
Having said that I accept that what BA are trying to do is move the job of cabin crew away from being a 25-30 year career and into the area of short term (2-3 year) employment. With relatively low training costs and a large pool of applicants, this is, on the contrary, very good business.
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This just in...
BA union opts not to recommend offer to cabin crew
From Reuters
The union representing cabin crew at British Airways said on Tuesday that the management's last offer in a year-long dispute could not be recommended to members.
"I am therefore contacting the company with a view to reopening discussions to seek to achieve a recommendable settlement to be put to cabin crew," Tony Woodley, Unite joint-general secretary, said in a statement.
A planned ballot of staff on the offer was suspended last week because a number of cabin crew representatives felt they could not recommend it, a union spokeswoman told Reuters.
And from the Press Association
Tony Woodley, Unite's joint leader said: "I met today with BA cabin crew representatives. It was unanimously agreed that the last offer tabled by British Airways management in the current dispute could not be recommended to the members".
Reuters
Press Association
From Reuters
The union representing cabin crew at British Airways said on Tuesday that the management's last offer in a year-long dispute could not be recommended to members.
"I am therefore contacting the company with a view to reopening discussions to seek to achieve a recommendable settlement to be put to cabin crew," Tony Woodley, Unite joint-general secretary, said in a statement.
A planned ballot of staff on the offer was suspended last week because a number of cabin crew representatives felt they could not recommend it, a union spokeswoman told Reuters.
And from the Press Association
Tony Woodley, Unite's joint leader said: "I met today with BA cabin crew representatives. It was unanimously agreed that the last offer tabled by British Airways management in the current dispute could not be recommended to the members".
Reuters
Press Association
Last edited by GayGourmet; 16th Nov 2010 at 16:45.
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Stormin' From the outside one would think that not allowing a vote on the offer would put the BASSA executive and reps in deep do-do with the membership. But we are not talking about rational people here. We are talking about either died-in-the-wool militants who would march over a cliff if Duncan asked them or souls who will meekly accept everything the union says because they must know best, after all, that's what reps do isn't it ?. I would bet that the clear sighted members left way back. In some respects it helps both Unite and BASSA not to hold a ballot right now. If they did they would be forced to reveal the true membership figures. Might be a touch embarassing. In times of industrial unrest, the norm is for union membership to rise. During this dispute Unite have seen their membership figures plummet. At the last count they had lost over 10% of the figure they had in Feb this year.
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You have to laugh at how hypocritical they are.......they have the audacity to put a definition of 'Negotiation' in their statement, which they clearly fail to understand themselves. 'Mutual discussion' - didn't they on the famous show of hands mandate no further negotiation.........
What are these people doing.........WW needs to end this whole sorry saga as it is just going round in circles and backwards.
What are these people doing.........WW needs to end this whole sorry saga as it is just going round in circles and backwards.
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Oh dear, the two Union branches fall out...AGAIN!!
16th November 2010 - AMICUS UPDATE - Report Back (Unite Meeting)
In a surprise turn of events today AMICUS have been branded terrorists by Unite and Tony Woodley in particular. The BASSA Branch Committee have now twice verbally ejected us from the negotiating committee because, apparently, our views are “too radical”, “too direct” and “not subtle enough”. They have “lost patience” with us.
The day started with a message from BASSA saying that our update of last evening (15th November 2010) was not helpful in its content. Despite a request for reconsideration, the day has ended in much the same way.
We have yet to establish why, though we accept that we have sought to address the matter of imposition, and that is where we differ from the various communications the BASSA Branch Secretary has posted.
It now appears that our friend's personal blog has somehow become the joint committee's final position – arrived at without discussion or debate. That in itself is not an issue, however, everybody and both branches are entitled to input and opinion - and in the face of that, without further debate or discussion, we, the AMICUS “branch of Unite” have, by personal communication from the BASSA Branch Secretary, been excommunicated from the BASSA negotiating team. In no uncertain terms, we have been told there will be no "joint" business from today.
So why?
We have no idea - but have the feeling this is about more than just words.
We offered to do a joint communication, but this too was declined. We hope that decision will be reconsidered by the committee as a whole, but we cannot condone a less than honest and truthful position.
We are deeply saddened and disappointed that this has happened. We have offered a line of further communication on the subject, but this has also been rejected.
The outgoing joint general secretary of Unite also today branded us as “terrorists”.
Why you ask? Because firstly we would not support the farcical ‘recommendation’. Having previously shared our intentions with our BASSA colleagues (who at that time disagreed with our position), we bit the bullet and were honest with you and Unite about this. In our humble opinion, a recommendation of the current BA offer and its Litigation appendix is morally indefensible. Unite chose to ignore our protestations about the offer, so we were left with no choice but to formally reject it.
It has subsequently and reluctantly been agreed by all parties that the consultative ballot is now dead in the water. It is our understanding, as ALL parties had previously AGREED (and is indeed promised in Unites intended letter of recommendation) we would now go straight to an industrial action ballot. This is therefore what AMICUS proposed today. We did suggest one proviso - that being, we should use the ballot period to determine if British Airways were minded to engage your reps from both branches on our issues, including the primary reason we took industrial action in the first place: IMPOSITION AND A UNILATERAL DISREGARD FOR OUR AGREEMENTS.
It is clearly unacceptable for the same offer documentation to be rehashed and re-presented for acceptance, or rejection once again. As we have said in earlier updates, for a successful resolution to this dispute, the company would need to recommence discussions with the local representatives from both AMICUS and BASSA with headline items from both sides featuring equally and settled by mutual consent.
Needless to say our point of view was again ignored. It then became once again apparent that it is not about the logic of our argument, but the weight of the numbers we represent. On basis that only 40 AMICUS members claimed strike pay, versus 7000 BASSA members, our democratic right to an opinion and our ability to represent you is extinguished. We can’t help but feel that this sounds a little like life in British Airways. Long live democracy…?
It was stated that we, the AMICUS section committee do not represent the membership, even though in an unprecedented move we took a valid and necessary stand to protect your rights which ultimately reflected the mood of the joint membership. It was not comfortable for us to do this alone, especially as we have stood shoulder to shoulder with our BASSA colleagues thus far. But we wholeheartedly believe it was the right thing to do. We have supported industrial action for the first time in our history. With clear consciences, we took the brave step of rejecting the ridiculous offer that was being pushed on you.
So where do we stand?
Our BASSA colleagues would like Tony Woodley to go back to British Airways and propose that if the points in the BASSA Branch Secretary’s latest blog are met then the deal can be salvaged as it stands. 3 of the points relate to the full reinstatement of staff travel, binding ACAS arbitration for all disciplinaries arising out of the dispute (see our earlier update on this) , and the removal of threats if a new facilities (reps) is not agreed within 8 weeks. It is also means that all the toxic elements of the deal which ultimately benefit the company will remain in place, no doubt including the litigation section, bar the stipulations in the blog regarding those off sick during the dispute and those who had pay deducted. In short, all other aspects of litigation are surrendered, including our appeal to the Supreme Court on the contractual issues of our collective agreement – the original basis of our dispute, imposition. Unite declined to comment upon the progress or intention to support any such appeal.
We then suggested, at the very least, we should put a time scale on Unites “return to talks”, and the reason for that limitation as an undertaking is because British Airways have a notorious track record for delaying. We also pointed out that we believed it is unacceptable to be constantly running to British Airways trying to resolve the dispute that British Airways initiated in its unreasonable approach and behaviour. This is even more difficult to stomach as British Airways are now in profit in spite of our industrial action, the ash cloud and numerous hefty fines being imposed for malpractice and unlawful conduct. Needless to say were any of the required "permanent structural cost savings" actually necessary?
So where do we go now?
We believe it is appropriate to offer you, the membership, the opportunity to tell us if we are not representing your best interests. Call it a vote of confidence if you will. If you don't want us to maintain the position we have taken, or indeed if you wish us to adopt another approach please communicate with us via our website. The alternative is that we withdraw from the debate altogether to allow our BASSA colleagues to determine our collective futures should you wish it.
Our previous communications did not reveal this unfortunate, untimely and quite suprising dischord as we hope that it would resolve itself quickly. However, it seems we are not being heard, and the true reasons for this are still as yet unknown.
We will in the meantime continue to represent you with humility, integrity and above all naked honesty. We will continue give you our collective opinion; we feel you deserve the direction a lot of you have been asking for and require – in fact you pay for it, and we will strive to do this subject to being involved in the proceedings.
The Amicus cabin crew section/branch
Of Unite the Union.
16th November 2010 - AMICUS UPDATE - Report Back (Unite Meeting)
In a surprise turn of events today AMICUS have been branded terrorists by Unite and Tony Woodley in particular. The BASSA Branch Committee have now twice verbally ejected us from the negotiating committee because, apparently, our views are “too radical”, “too direct” and “not subtle enough”. They have “lost patience” with us.
The day started with a message from BASSA saying that our update of last evening (15th November 2010) was not helpful in its content. Despite a request for reconsideration, the day has ended in much the same way.
We have yet to establish why, though we accept that we have sought to address the matter of imposition, and that is where we differ from the various communications the BASSA Branch Secretary has posted.
It now appears that our friend's personal blog has somehow become the joint committee's final position – arrived at without discussion or debate. That in itself is not an issue, however, everybody and both branches are entitled to input and opinion - and in the face of that, without further debate or discussion, we, the AMICUS “branch of Unite” have, by personal communication from the BASSA Branch Secretary, been excommunicated from the BASSA negotiating team. In no uncertain terms, we have been told there will be no "joint" business from today.
So why?
We have no idea - but have the feeling this is about more than just words.
We offered to do a joint communication, but this too was declined. We hope that decision will be reconsidered by the committee as a whole, but we cannot condone a less than honest and truthful position.
We are deeply saddened and disappointed that this has happened. We have offered a line of further communication on the subject, but this has also been rejected.
The outgoing joint general secretary of Unite also today branded us as “terrorists”.
Why you ask? Because firstly we would not support the farcical ‘recommendation’. Having previously shared our intentions with our BASSA colleagues (who at that time disagreed with our position), we bit the bullet and were honest with you and Unite about this. In our humble opinion, a recommendation of the current BA offer and its Litigation appendix is morally indefensible. Unite chose to ignore our protestations about the offer, so we were left with no choice but to formally reject it.
It has subsequently and reluctantly been agreed by all parties that the consultative ballot is now dead in the water. It is our understanding, as ALL parties had previously AGREED (and is indeed promised in Unites intended letter of recommendation) we would now go straight to an industrial action ballot. This is therefore what AMICUS proposed today. We did suggest one proviso - that being, we should use the ballot period to determine if British Airways were minded to engage your reps from both branches on our issues, including the primary reason we took industrial action in the first place: IMPOSITION AND A UNILATERAL DISREGARD FOR OUR AGREEMENTS.
It is clearly unacceptable for the same offer documentation to be rehashed and re-presented for acceptance, or rejection once again. As we have said in earlier updates, for a successful resolution to this dispute, the company would need to recommence discussions with the local representatives from both AMICUS and BASSA with headline items from both sides featuring equally and settled by mutual consent.
Needless to say our point of view was again ignored. It then became once again apparent that it is not about the logic of our argument, but the weight of the numbers we represent. On basis that only 40 AMICUS members claimed strike pay, versus 7000 BASSA members, our democratic right to an opinion and our ability to represent you is extinguished. We can’t help but feel that this sounds a little like life in British Airways. Long live democracy…?
It was stated that we, the AMICUS section committee do not represent the membership, even though in an unprecedented move we took a valid and necessary stand to protect your rights which ultimately reflected the mood of the joint membership. It was not comfortable for us to do this alone, especially as we have stood shoulder to shoulder with our BASSA colleagues thus far. But we wholeheartedly believe it was the right thing to do. We have supported industrial action for the first time in our history. With clear consciences, we took the brave step of rejecting the ridiculous offer that was being pushed on you.
So where do we stand?
Our BASSA colleagues would like Tony Woodley to go back to British Airways and propose that if the points in the BASSA Branch Secretary’s latest blog are met then the deal can be salvaged as it stands. 3 of the points relate to the full reinstatement of staff travel, binding ACAS arbitration for all disciplinaries arising out of the dispute (see our earlier update on this) , and the removal of threats if a new facilities (reps) is not agreed within 8 weeks. It is also means that all the toxic elements of the deal which ultimately benefit the company will remain in place, no doubt including the litigation section, bar the stipulations in the blog regarding those off sick during the dispute and those who had pay deducted. In short, all other aspects of litigation are surrendered, including our appeal to the Supreme Court on the contractual issues of our collective agreement – the original basis of our dispute, imposition. Unite declined to comment upon the progress or intention to support any such appeal.
We then suggested, at the very least, we should put a time scale on Unites “return to talks”, and the reason for that limitation as an undertaking is because British Airways have a notorious track record for delaying. We also pointed out that we believed it is unacceptable to be constantly running to British Airways trying to resolve the dispute that British Airways initiated in its unreasonable approach and behaviour. This is even more difficult to stomach as British Airways are now in profit in spite of our industrial action, the ash cloud and numerous hefty fines being imposed for malpractice and unlawful conduct. Needless to say were any of the required "permanent structural cost savings" actually necessary?
So where do we go now?
We believe it is appropriate to offer you, the membership, the opportunity to tell us if we are not representing your best interests. Call it a vote of confidence if you will. If you don't want us to maintain the position we have taken, or indeed if you wish us to adopt another approach please communicate with us via our website. The alternative is that we withdraw from the debate altogether to allow our BASSA colleagues to determine our collective futures should you wish it.
Our previous communications did not reveal this unfortunate, untimely and quite suprising dischord as we hope that it would resolve itself quickly. However, it seems we are not being heard, and the true reasons for this are still as yet unknown.
We will in the meantime continue to represent you with humility, integrity and above all naked honesty. We will continue give you our collective opinion; we feel you deserve the direction a lot of you have been asking for and require – in fact you pay for it, and we will strive to do this subject to being involved in the proceedings.
The Amicus cabin crew section/branch
Of Unite the Union.
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What to do?
Betty and the hats
Before I go into my main topic, I would like to say I TOTALLY agree with Bettygirl on this subject. I wrote to Bill Francis recently regarding this and made the following points.
1) One of the biggest if not THE biggest complaint in
this company is a lack of consistantcy. Here we are
proactively going out of our way to make a divide between
the current fleet and the new one. What will the customers
think when a small number of crew are seen walking through
T5 wearing a hat and yet both the ground staff and current
crew dont. The same can be said about boarding the a/c.
2) I find it strange that we allow our current staff both
on the ground and in the air to have ALL sorts of uniform
standards. Would it not have been better to sort out our
own house first and then move onto the new fleet. I'm
sure there are many of our current female crew who would
like to wear a hat but are denied.
3) Finally has anyone actually thought about how this
will no doubt provoke situations happening in the current
climate. I'm sure if things are said for example to a
mixed fleet crew member, it will quite rightly be
reported, but do we need MORE problems at this difficult
time?. I was on Mid fleet in the 90's and can tell you
there were situations happening regularly from the other
fleets that we as SCCM's had to deal with.
Personally its being perceived by many non strikers in
particular that its a bit of a kick in the teeth to alienate the
crews so much straight away. I know its the beginning of
something very differant, but it seems to a lot of us who
support BA in the present crisis, that we are now second
class crew. I'm SURE thats not the intention but thats the perception.
Now back to my main point.
I have to be honest and say that I'm feeling pretty low at the moment - probably the same as many crew. The problem as I see it, is that this could go on for years IMO. Only the other day I spoke to one militant CSD who TOTALLY went along with what DH says. They just spouted the same old rhetoric/myths/lies/crap and subjective nonsence that Mr. Tomorite does. In fact he was even worse - I know thats difficult to believe but its true. At the end of our 'convesation', I said the inevitable. ' So you HATE WW, HATE the LT, HATE Bill Francis, HATE the VCC's, HATE the temps, HATE the pilots, HATE any managers in BA, HATE the scabs, HATE corporate greed, ( these were his words), so do you not think its time to leave and find something else to do. His reply was, ' You have to be joking, I'm going to milk this company for everything I can get, do as little as I can and go on for as long as I can' !!!!!!!!!!!
Then there was the conversation I overheard from a well known purser on EF who had a VCC on his crew, and was going to make it VERY difficult for them in the briefing room. Lo and behold they were offloaded just minutes later.
So here is the problem. There are many many Miss M's around and there is nothing it seems we can do to get rid of them. I personally have had enough. In the new year, I'm not messing about with these people any more. I have a good reputation ( apparently) so I'm not phased by these b******s ( sorry Mod) any more. The main crew that want to mess about with me with their yellow pens and crap will be no more. Don't get me wrong, I will do this properly and professionally. I have always trodden on egg shells when it comes to IFA's, worried about this and that, and when I have dealt with problems, have been sadly but understandably let down by some CC managers. But I feel the tide is turning and I for one will move up a gear or two.
Finally the reason I'm waiting a few weeks is that I'm hoping that TW gives Bassa their strike. Then hopefully WW will push the nuclear button, because as far as I'm concerned Bassa need to be totally eradicated from this earth once and for all.
I apologise if this is all a bit 'subjective' but quite simply I've had it with these 'co-workers' once and for all. I feel this is 'car crash TV', and I'm the fireman called to sort out the mess. I have been on the personal end of Bassa's abuse for years, and I'm hoping that 2011 will move us ALL on from this mess.
RANT OVER AND OUT!
Before I go into my main topic, I would like to say I TOTALLY agree with Bettygirl on this subject. I wrote to Bill Francis recently regarding this and made the following points.
1) One of the biggest if not THE biggest complaint in
this company is a lack of consistantcy. Here we are
proactively going out of our way to make a divide between
the current fleet and the new one. What will the customers
think when a small number of crew are seen walking through
T5 wearing a hat and yet both the ground staff and current
crew dont. The same can be said about boarding the a/c.
2) I find it strange that we allow our current staff both
on the ground and in the air to have ALL sorts of uniform
standards. Would it not have been better to sort out our
own house first and then move onto the new fleet. I'm
sure there are many of our current female crew who would
like to wear a hat but are denied.
3) Finally has anyone actually thought about how this
will no doubt provoke situations happening in the current
climate. I'm sure if things are said for example to a
mixed fleet crew member, it will quite rightly be
reported, but do we need MORE problems at this difficult
time?. I was on Mid fleet in the 90's and can tell you
there were situations happening regularly from the other
fleets that we as SCCM's had to deal with.
Personally its being perceived by many non strikers in
particular that its a bit of a kick in the teeth to alienate the
crews so much straight away. I know its the beginning of
something very differant, but it seems to a lot of us who
support BA in the present crisis, that we are now second
class crew. I'm SURE thats not the intention but thats the perception.
Now back to my main point.
I have to be honest and say that I'm feeling pretty low at the moment - probably the same as many crew. The problem as I see it, is that this could go on for years IMO. Only the other day I spoke to one militant CSD who TOTALLY went along with what DH says. They just spouted the same old rhetoric/myths/lies/crap and subjective nonsence that Mr. Tomorite does. In fact he was even worse - I know thats difficult to believe but its true. At the end of our 'convesation', I said the inevitable. ' So you HATE WW, HATE the LT, HATE Bill Francis, HATE the VCC's, HATE the temps, HATE the pilots, HATE any managers in BA, HATE the scabs, HATE corporate greed, ( these were his words), so do you not think its time to leave and find something else to do. His reply was, ' You have to be joking, I'm going to milk this company for everything I can get, do as little as I can and go on for as long as I can' !!!!!!!!!!!
Then there was the conversation I overheard from a well known purser on EF who had a VCC on his crew, and was going to make it VERY difficult for them in the briefing room. Lo and behold they were offloaded just minutes later.
So here is the problem. There are many many Miss M's around and there is nothing it seems we can do to get rid of them. I personally have had enough. In the new year, I'm not messing about with these people any more. I have a good reputation ( apparently) so I'm not phased by these b******s ( sorry Mod) any more. The main crew that want to mess about with me with their yellow pens and crap will be no more. Don't get me wrong, I will do this properly and professionally. I have always trodden on egg shells when it comes to IFA's, worried about this and that, and when I have dealt with problems, have been sadly but understandably let down by some CC managers. But I feel the tide is turning and I for one will move up a gear or two.
Finally the reason I'm waiting a few weeks is that I'm hoping that TW gives Bassa their strike. Then hopefully WW will push the nuclear button, because as far as I'm concerned Bassa need to be totally eradicated from this earth once and for all.
I apologise if this is all a bit 'subjective' but quite simply I've had it with these 'co-workers' once and for all. I feel this is 'car crash TV', and I'm the fireman called to sort out the mess. I have been on the personal end of Bassa's abuse for years, and I'm hoping that 2011 will move us ALL on from this mess.
RANT OVER AND OUT!
Last edited by JUAN TRIPP; 16th Nov 2010 at 22:26.
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JUAN TRIPP,
You and me both!
I too, have had enough of these childish tantrum throwing unprofessional strikers who sadly, give us all a bad name. Today, one of the worse days so far in terms of disruption, CRC was heaving with these macho types who think they own BA.
I saw Ottergirl today and had to point out to a group of them who were at it with their usual intimidatory tactics.
I have to add that regardless of hats, Mixed Fleet crew do look fantastic with their impeccable uniform standards. Crew on current fleets could learn a thing or two about looking smart and having pride in their appearance.
You and me both!
I too, have had enough of these childish tantrum throwing unprofessional strikers who sadly, give us all a bad name. Today, one of the worse days so far in terms of disruption, CRC was heaving with these macho types who think they own BA.
I saw Ottergirl today and had to point out to a group of them who were at it with their usual intimidatory tactics.
I have to add that regardless of hats, Mixed Fleet crew do look fantastic with their impeccable uniform standards. Crew on current fleets could learn a thing or two about looking smart and having pride in their appearance.
Join Date: Jul 2010
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I have to add that regardless of hats, Mixed Fleet crew do look fantastic with their impeccable uniform standards. Crew on current fleets could learn a thing or two about looking smart and having pride in their appearance
Join Date: Dec 1998
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Juan Tripp, Tiramisu,
Don't be disheartened! Juan, I absolutely get where you're coming from WRT the hats but, as you'll know well enough, good, experienced crew (and especially SCCMs) can rise above that and provide (and have) a great experience. At the risk of being flippant, if nothing else, it means that the coiffure can always remain immaculate!
As for the rest, can I just wholeheartedly exhort you to do as you say you will in the new year. In my perception, one of the biggest problems for those who backed BA is that they have, on more than the odd occasion, tended to be a little reticent in the face of the yellow pen wavers. You, quite rightly, recognise that you're employed by BA and are not in the CRC, or the aeroplane, as an extension of Duncan Holley's will. I genuinely look forward to more people with the mentality you and Tiramisu display and the firm and correct management of those who think their moral outrage usurps their obligation to abide by the professional requirements of their contract.
Happily, I'm hearing of more and more like you who have finally decided that enough is enough.
Stick with it and know that there's plenty of support out there for you, both moral and professional.
MrB
Don't be disheartened! Juan, I absolutely get where you're coming from WRT the hats but, as you'll know well enough, good, experienced crew (and especially SCCMs) can rise above that and provide (and have) a great experience. At the risk of being flippant, if nothing else, it means that the coiffure can always remain immaculate!
As for the rest, can I just wholeheartedly exhort you to do as you say you will in the new year. In my perception, one of the biggest problems for those who backed BA is that they have, on more than the odd occasion, tended to be a little reticent in the face of the yellow pen wavers. You, quite rightly, recognise that you're employed by BA and are not in the CRC, or the aeroplane, as an extension of Duncan Holley's will. I genuinely look forward to more people with the mentality you and Tiramisu display and the firm and correct management of those who think their moral outrage usurps their obligation to abide by the professional requirements of their contract.
Happily, I'm hearing of more and more like you who have finally decided that enough is enough.
Stick with it and know that there's plenty of support out there for you, both moral and professional.
MrB
Join Date: Feb 2001
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As for the rest, can I just wholeheartedly exhort you to do as you say you will in the new year. In my perception, one of the biggest problems for those who backed BA is that they have, on more than the odd occasion, tended to be a little reticent in the face of the yellow pen wavers. You, quite rightly, recognise that you're employed by BA and are not in the CRC, or the aeroplane, as an extension of Duncan Holley's will. I genuinely look forward to more people with the mentality you and Tiramisu display and the firm and correct management of those who think their moral outrage usurps their obligation to abide by the professional requirements of their contract.
Good on you guys for saying enough is enough.. heartening news for swathes of BA staff.. I hope this attitude grows and grows.
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Join Date: Oct 2010
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"United we Stand" falling to bits
How lovely to once again publicly see the disunity (as described in the judgement of Holland J) between CC89 and BASSA here. It comes only a day after CC89 wrote this;
And the next day we have this;
So no more "joint negotiating committee". 
That said they make the valid point that Dunc's blog now seems to be the negotiating strategy for the whole (striking) cabin crew workforce. Oh dear.
How we laughed
On a serious note however, I believe this is a very significant moment in this dispute. "Dysfunctional union" has been aptly demonstrated in the past 2 weeks. First a consultative ballot that was going to be endorsed wasn't- by either committee. Then said ballot was "suspended" and now CC89 and BASSA fall out on the whim of the BASSA branch sec.
I believe the latest BA offer has done exactly what it was designed to do. Split the membership, split the support but most importantly split the 2 branches.
Game over.
A select group of senior reps from the joint negotiating committee will be meeting with Tony Woodley and Co tomorrow to discuss the way forwards.
we, the AMICUS “branch of Unite” have, by personal communication from the BASSA Branch Secretary, been excommunicated from the BASSA negotiating team. In no uncertain terms, we have been told there will be no "joint" business from today.
That said they make the valid point that Dunc's blog now seems to be the negotiating strategy for the whole (striking) cabin crew workforce. Oh dear.
How we laughed
On a serious note however, I believe this is a very significant moment in this dispute. "Dysfunctional union" has been aptly demonstrated in the past 2 weeks. First a consultative ballot that was going to be endorsed wasn't- by either committee. Then said ballot was "suspended" and now CC89 and BASSA fall out on the whim of the BASSA branch sec.
I believe the latest BA offer has done exactly what it was designed to do. Split the membership, split the support but most importantly split the 2 branches.
Game over.
Join Date: May 2010
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Amicus/BASSA division
So we've now come full circle. After reading the above it seems we are back to were the imposition started - not talking and excluding each other from meetings. Wake up members, your union is taking you for complete fools! This behaviour is what started this farce with the so called 'no negotiation from BA' although your reps from both sides couldn't even sit in a room together.
So much for staying united. BASSA clearly can't stand the fact that Amicus took the lead with rejecting the proposal and left DH and LM with egg on their face.
You really couldn't make it up? What a joke.
KTF, looks like it will be an XXXXXmas to remember.
So much for staying united. BASSA clearly can't stand the fact that Amicus took the lead with rejecting the proposal and left DH and LM with egg on their face.
You really couldn't make it up? What a joke.
KTF, looks like it will be an XXXXXmas to remember.
Join Date: Jun 2010
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Juan Tripp,
Thank you for your post. as a SCCM I have had enough of the XXXX, yellow pen and the blinded devotion towards DH by the BASSA Militants. I cannot understand why, if they hate BA and all it stands for so much, that they are still here. The sense of their percieved entitlement is unbelievable!
Thank you for your post. as a SCCM I have had enough of the XXXX, yellow pen and the blinded devotion towards DH by the BASSA Militants. I cannot understand why, if they hate BA and all it stands for so much, that they are still here. The sense of their percieved entitlement is unbelievable!
Most interesting thing is what will BA do now?
Are the DH 'tablets of stone' having been passed down from the mountain and handed to Moses Woodley going to be slightly altered and give the Unite leadership a way out of this mess?
When a previous TGWU/BASSA Branch Secretary was sacked a negotiation went on between BA and the TGWU Gen Sec. and a package of money and reinstatement of his staff travel was arranged allowing the dispute to be ended. is this what will happen again?
BA will never re-employ DH but it could pay him a wad of money and give him his retirement entitlements to ST and move on.
Food for thought.
Are the DH 'tablets of stone' having been passed down from the mountain and handed to Moses Woodley going to be slightly altered and give the Unite leadership a way out of this mess?
When a previous TGWU/BASSA Branch Secretary was sacked a negotiation went on between BA and the TGWU Gen Sec. and a package of money and reinstatement of his staff travel was arranged allowing the dispute to be ended. is this what will happen again?
BA will never re-employ DH but it could pay him a wad of money and give him his retirement entitlements to ST and move on.
Food for thought.
Join Date: Sep 2006
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I do know that this is not going to be popular and I'm not sure how to word it without causing offence but feel it has to be said.
We are constantly being told how bad it is up at LHR. Strikers claiming they are being intimidated by non strikers/the company and non strikers claiming they are being intimidated by strikers. Accusations of bully and harrasment are being thrown about like confetti. And then I see comments such as ....
(my bold)
I'm sorry Tiramisu, but if you had to point the group out, they can't have been that intimidating. Why point them out? Why not just ignore them? It seems to me that the two groups are actually feeding off each other and keeping the tension artificially high. Could it possibly be that BOTH sides are a little oversensitive at the moment and possibly seeing things that aren't there on some occasions?
I know. I'm LGW. What could I possibly know? Well, I can say that during SEP at Cranebank recently, I was chatting to crew from both sides of the dispute and had no problems at all despite making it abundantly clear that I did not strike. I do appreciate that it was just one day out of the year but if it's really that bad, surely I would have seen something? Or felt the tension?
I don't deny that there are some nasty people about, probably on both sides of the fence. But I do think they are in the minority. And I do think that SOME people, again from both sides of the fence, are actually looking for anything that can make them feel offended or intimidated. (That's not aimed at you, Tiramisu.) And so the whole circus rumbles on and on and on, fueled as much by perceived "slights" as it is by concerns for the future.
Tin hat on...
We are constantly being told how bad it is up at LHR. Strikers claiming they are being intimidated by non strikers/the company and non strikers claiming they are being intimidated by strikers. Accusations of bully and harrasment are being thrown about like confetti. And then I see comments such as ....
Today, one of the worse days so far in terms of disruption, CRC was heaving with these macho types who think they own BA.
I saw Ottergirl today and had to point out to a group of them who were at it with their usual intimidatory tactics.
I saw Ottergirl today and had to point out to a group of them who were at it with their usual intimidatory tactics.
I'm sorry Tiramisu, but if you had to point the group out, they can't have been that intimidating. Why point them out? Why not just ignore them? It seems to me that the two groups are actually feeding off each other and keeping the tension artificially high. Could it possibly be that BOTH sides are a little oversensitive at the moment and possibly seeing things that aren't there on some occasions?
I know. I'm LGW. What could I possibly know? Well, I can say that during SEP at Cranebank recently, I was chatting to crew from both sides of the dispute and had no problems at all despite making it abundantly clear that I did not strike. I do appreciate that it was just one day out of the year but if it's really that bad, surely I would have seen something? Or felt the tension?
I don't deny that there are some nasty people about, probably on both sides of the fence. But I do think they are in the minority. And I do think that SOME people, again from both sides of the fence, are actually looking for anything that can make them feel offended or intimidated. (That's not aimed at you, Tiramisu.) And so the whole circus rumbles on and on and on, fueled as much by perceived "slights" as it is by concerns for the future.
Tin hat on...