British Airways vs. BASSA (Airline Staff Only)
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More than halve that number and you'll be closer to the true number of strikers
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Unless Willie goes for downsizing.
Lets face it, although many flights are getting away, our forward bookings have taken a hit. How would this process pan out??????????
Admittedly, there is the need for slot retention, but I'm sure Willie would have weighed it up
Lets face it, although many flights are getting away, our forward bookings have taken a hit. How would this process pan out??????????
Admittedly, there is the need for slot retention, but I'm sure Willie would have weighed it up
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I guess they meant of the total..if it is 13500 of us that makes it about 3400 people..i think that by the end of the dispute it will be 5000.. but I guess we will never know
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Originally Posted by SpinDoctor
Not wanting to sound rude but surely the best people to decide on a suitable SCCM would be Ops. It sounds a lot like you're happy to play along with BA as long as they do things the way you think they should be done, but as soon as they do something different you're out on strike.
As I said previously, I'm pretty much happy to take anything that BA throws at me during the strikes in the quest to keep things running.
This is the one thing that would niggle me if faced with it - particularly considering I was assured by almost the highest of authorities that this wouldn't actually be happening......
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NS68
With regard to strike numbers you are very wide of the mark. BASSA/UNITE have know idea how many people have actually striked
so please stop trying to second guess.
Lizanne actually said on the BASSA forum, that it is impossible to tell.
Duncan admitted on the BASSA forum that it is between 2500 and 3000 after the 2 first strikes.
UNITE admitted that they had received about 4000 claims for both sets of strikes in total.
I am told (very reliably
) that for the first 2 strikes that the number of people that went on strike was less than 3000 but greater than 2500, and that 30 new people were going on strike each day of this new wave.
Please do me a favour though so we could verify numbers and ask Lizanne or Duncan outright then come back and tell me if they know the exact number, they will not tell you the truth, cos it hurts its a lot less than they are prepared to admit, and much closer in MPE to Hotel Modes guess
Good luck with finding another job
With regard to strike numbers you are very wide of the mark. BASSA/UNITE have know idea how many people have actually striked
so please stop trying to second guess.Lizanne actually said on the BASSA forum, that it is impossible to tell.
Duncan admitted on the BASSA forum that it is between 2500 and 3000 after the 2 first strikes.
UNITE admitted that they had received about 4000 claims for both sets of strikes in total.
I am told (very reliably
) that for the first 2 strikes that the number of people that went on strike was less than 3000 but greater than 2500, and that 30 new people were going on strike each day of this new wave.Please do me a favour though so we could verify numbers and ask Lizanne or Duncan outright then come back and tell me if they know the exact number, they will not tell you the truth, cos it hurts
its a lot less than they are prepared to admit, and much closer in MPE to Hotel Modes guessGood luck with finding another job
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It's totally pointless shouting about a headline grabbing figure without understanding the movements beneath it. A good example is BASSA constantly harping on about the money lost in fines but not considering the excess profit made during the same period. Or, indeed, the monies lost by BA through incomplete BAA systems checks during the opening of T5. Are we paying the same, initially agreed, rent for T5? Nope, BA secured a refund on the mess from the BAA which, in all likelyhood, more than covers the losses.
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Can anyone confirm that BA did not have to pay the fines because the executives got acquitted?
Guess we will just have to wait and see
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to PORNPANTS1
It is very sad..I understand when that comes from managers or ground staff or else-we don't work together on a daily basis and we don't get to chance to share much,but taking that from fellow crew member or flight crew members it really is a bit sad..but it matters and it doesn't.
Don't worry it doesn't hurt,I was aware that people would back off for not wanting to lose staff travel or for the loss of income..it is normal,it is just natural to do so.it wouldn't surprise me and it wouldn't hurt if I knew it was less than I thought!
Good luck with finding another job
Please do me a favour though so we could verify numbers and ask Lizanne or Duncan outright then come back and tell me if they know the exact number, they will not tell you the truth, cos it hurts its a lot less than they are prepared to admit, and much closer in MPE to Hotel Modes guess
its a lot less than they are prepared to admit, and much closer in MPE to Hotel Modes guess
!
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Can anyone confirm that BA did not have to pay the fines because the executives got acquitted?
The money for the UK fine has already been set aside, i.e. written off in BA's accounts, but has not been paid. Of course, now BA believe they shouldn't have to pay it; the UK authorities currently take the opposite view. I'm not sure how it will play out from here but my guess is that BA have a good case to tell the OFT to get stuffed.
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they think its all over!
Proud and happy to be backing BA, but if I got on a flight and found a VCC of any kind - ground staff or pilot - working up as Purser or CSD, I would be telling Ops that I'd like to offload myself.
I would like to think this view is alien to BA backing community. The VCC are people and are trying to help the company. Saving their jobs is saving our jobs.
Personally I still think BASSA can still cause major grief. We are paying overtime, leasing planes and taking alot of negetive heat on forward bookings. I hope there are as many crew reporting as the majority of the posts are suggesting.
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That would be me, Chesh. I said it.
And again, you represent another person just missing the point.
I applaud, respect and am grateful to the VCCs for the part they are playing in keeping the company flying. I don't particularly agree with the VCC idea but I appreciate the enormous contribution they are making and will treat any of them I fly with with the utmost respect and admiration.
My issue is ONLY - PURELY - SOLELY (how many different ways can I put it?) that the company has chosen to use our VCCs as ICCMs and as pursers AS OPPOSED TO GIVING its loyal, dedicated, strike-breaking permanent cabin crew the opportunity to gain experience working in a senior role.
THAT is my issue. Nothing else.
And again, you represent another person just missing the point.
I applaud, respect and am grateful to the VCCs for the part they are playing in keeping the company flying. I don't particularly agree with the VCC idea but I appreciate the enormous contribution they are making and will treat any of them I fly with with the utmost respect and admiration.
My issue is ONLY - PURELY - SOLELY (how many different ways can I put it?) that the company has chosen to use our VCCs as ICCMs and as pursers AS OPPOSED TO GIVING its loyal, dedicated, strike-breaking permanent cabin crew the opportunity to gain experience working in a senior role.
THAT is my issue. Nothing else.
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Eddy
I guess the treason for there being VCC SCCM is a simple one. In the run up to possible IA the company needed to be certain that they would have coverage. People may have said that they would not strike but the company would not know until the actual event, hence the training of the the VCC SCCMs.
I happen to believe that in many ways you have a very good point, in that it must be better for pursers to act as CSDs and main crew to act as pursers than have VCC's doing this.
I guess the treason for there being VCC SCCM is a simple one. In the run up to possible IA the company needed to be certain that they would have coverage. People may have said that they would not strike but the company would not know until the actual event, hence the training of the the VCC SCCMs.
I happen to believe that in many ways you have a very good point, in that it must be better for pursers to act as CSDs and main crew to act as pursers than have VCC's doing this.
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GIVING its loyal, dedicated, strike-breaking permanent cabin crew the opportunity to gain experience working in a senior role.
, this is about saving the company!
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reply to Eddy
[QUOTEThat would be me, Chesh. I said it][/QUOTE]
Your feelings are akin to mine back in my world wide days when less senior crew worked up with no willingness to take repsonsibility and ultimately I would take on the responsibility because its just how I roll when on duty.
I can respect that viewpoint but to down tools is taking an operational process a bit personal don't you think?
Your feelings are akin to mine back in my world wide days when less senior crew worked up with no willingness to take repsonsibility and ultimately I would take on the responsibility because its just how I roll when on duty.
I can respect that viewpoint but to down tools is taking an operational process a bit personal don't you think?
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My issue is ONLY - PURELY - SOLELY (how many different ways can I put it?) that the company has chosen to use our VCCs as ICCMs and as pursers AS OPPOSED TO GIVING its loyal, dedicated, strike-breaking permanent cabin crew the opportunity to gain experience working in a senior role.
Another day at BFC tomorrow!
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NS68,
Thank you for posting. I am sorry you feel obliged to follow through on your strike vote although I can understand the sentiment. I do understand why cabin crew strikers have come to some of the conclusions they have, even though I disagree vehemently with them.
But more importantly, from where I'm sitting your union has lied to its members, it has lied to the wider public, members have threatened to sabotage aircraft, poison pilots and a child has been threatened with kidnap. None of these actions or threats have been condemned by your union.
On the last video I watched of Bedfont FC (I think it is on youtube) there is a toddler stamping a card with a picture of Willie Walsh's face into the dirt with his feet. I know BASSA like to go in for dramatic imagery but I have to admit I wondered whether to call social services - imagine if WW were a black man - I'm sure there'd be more comment about the hatred this child's action implies then.
At some point, I hope you can see it's not worth following these people - at some point, I think the awful behaviour destroys any cause, however good that cause might have been to start with. I know it's hard to see when you are in the thick of it and your reps - Duncan Holley especially - can sound quite reasonable. Nonetheless, I would urge you to return to work. BA is running brilliantly during the strikes - it is a real breath of fresh air not to have BASSA calling the shots any more. IMHO there is nothing constructive to be gained by continuing.
Best wishes in any case,
OF
Thank you for posting. I am sorry you feel obliged to follow through on your strike vote although I can understand the sentiment. I do understand why cabin crew strikers have come to some of the conclusions they have, even though I disagree vehemently with them.
But more importantly, from where I'm sitting your union has lied to its members, it has lied to the wider public, members have threatened to sabotage aircraft, poison pilots and a child has been threatened with kidnap. None of these actions or threats have been condemned by your union.
On the last video I watched of Bedfont FC (I think it is on youtube) there is a toddler stamping a card with a picture of Willie Walsh's face into the dirt with his feet. I know BASSA like to go in for dramatic imagery but I have to admit I wondered whether to call social services - imagine if WW were a black man - I'm sure there'd be more comment about the hatred this child's action implies then.
At some point, I hope you can see it's not worth following these people - at some point, I think the awful behaviour destroys any cause, however good that cause might have been to start with. I know it's hard to see when you are in the thick of it and your reps - Duncan Holley especially - can sound quite reasonable. Nonetheless, I would urge you to return to work. BA is running brilliantly during the strikes - it is a real breath of fresh air not to have BASSA calling the shots any more. IMHO there is nothing constructive to be gained by continuing.
Best wishes in any case,
OF
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hear hear missM
If there are any crew who might think that working during the strike would be to their advantage for any future promotion opportunities should really think again.
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Aw'l right brother Overflare
On the last video I watched of Bedfont FC (I think it is on youtube) there is a toddler stamping a card with a picture of Willie Walsh's face into the dirt with his feet. I know BASSA like to go in for dramatic imagery but I have to admit I wondered whether to call social services - imagine if WW were a black man - I'm sure there'd be more comment about the hatred this child's action implies then.
On a more sensible note I agree with you over the points you raised against NS68 and the images coming over from strike HQ are not doing Unite any favours.
Is there anyone outside of the Unite union that supports their position?
Even the Miners and the printworkers at Wapping had some public sympathy. Incidently they lost.
As for the ex employee who represents BA crew. I watched some of the Lord of the Rings movie and its clear that that you cannot give up the ring of power unless it is prized from your fingers. Ask Mugabe, Blair, Brown and the ex employee who still represents cabin crew.
p/s thanks for the reply to my fines question.
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This isn't about job opportunities, this is about saving the company!
I know this isn't about job opportunities (at the moment, atleast). I know this is about saving the company. I've crossed the picket line three times - how dare you insult me by lecturing me about why I have come in to work
But everyone on here is talking about sacking the thousands of striking crew - many of them seniors (I'm not in favour of this course of action). That goes to suggest that there may well be opportunities in the near future for promotion. Infact, there almost certainly will be with New Fleet (onto which I'd be prepared to transfer if it meant promotion - money is less important to me than career progression).
So can you blame me - or anyone else - for seeking opportunities to better themselves and gain experience in working in a senior role when that experience could ultimately give them the upper hand when applying for a permanent position as a senior?