MERGED: Qantas grounded effective immediately.
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The government need to release Qantas from the shackles and let it compete in the real world. Lots of shareholders expect their company to be able to respond to competition in a competitive way.
SN
SN
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How about this?
<a href="http://tinypic.com?ref=2e3wdcp" target="_blank"><img src="http://i40.tinypic.com/2e3wdcp.jpg" border="0" alt="Image and video hosting by TinyPic"></a>
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Albanese is full of crap. His staff were briefed yesterday afternoon (fact) but they were told it was to happen Monday. QF did surprise them by bringing it forward to today.
Cabin Crew Management are currently available for cabin crew questions in LAX and SIN, coincidence they just happen to be there? Not!
Cabin Crew Management are currently available for cabin crew questions in LAX and SIN, coincidence they just happen to be there? Not!
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SimonBI
In some of the footage from Sydney airport, there was at least one red tail without the white kangaroo. Should I read anything into that?
I think it's the 767 freighter it has a red tail with no rat
In some of the footage from Sydney airport, there was at least one red tail without the white kangaroo. Should I read anything into that?
I think it's the 767 freighter it has a red tail with no rat
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Been in the industry for 25 years.
I'm not a pilot.
I have been flying QF loyally for over a decade.
I have very good friends and family in the airline and feel very sad for them. My late father gave his best years to the airline.
I have visited this site from time to time for over a decade, but generally, it's all the same whingers bitching about the same old stuff, so I don't post much. However:
It wouldn't matter whether it was Joyce, Borghetti, Branson, Dixon or John Travolta, the dinosaurs in Australian Aviation would blame everyone BUT themselves for this outcome. People on here will whinge about him eternally, but history will show that Joyce had the balls to kick the unions in the teeth and make the required changes to maintain a healthy bottom line and grow the business, which is precisely his job (nothing else).
Most people here will bitch and moan about the poor management, bringing down an icon, not having a clue, etc, but it's easy to slag off all and sundry sitting behind a laptop, and I doubt any of the 'experts' that visit here would put their hand up for the top job; and I certainly don't claim to be worthy either. I neither like or dislike Joyce, but I do admire his resilience and tenacity and he is a business man after all. And everyone seems to forget that we (Aussies) are not immune to global forces. Fail to adapt and you lose.
The union fools wanted to play with fire; well, pony up fellas, it's time to get into the kitchen. Apart from friends and relatives of mine at QF, the people I feel most sorry for are the younger guys and gals who just want to work for the airline and couldn't give a toss about the poltics, and would be happy to forgo some of the ridiculous, greedy union demands.
Borghetti must be laughing and will certainly be ready for the fallout.
I hope all the 'untouchables' in the unions have got alternative skills and beefy resumes - they might come in handy. For those that were so arrogant they thought they'd never need them; whoops!
I sincerely hope it works itself out, but whatever happens, the goal posts have shifted forever. And if the worst happens; a heads up; there is no such thing as job security; welcome to the 21st century.
Now, slag this post off til your hearts are content; no need for me to come back and respond to the garbage that will follow.
Nighty night.
SD
I'm not a pilot.
I have been flying QF loyally for over a decade.
I have very good friends and family in the airline and feel very sad for them. My late father gave his best years to the airline.
I have visited this site from time to time for over a decade, but generally, it's all the same whingers bitching about the same old stuff, so I don't post much. However:
It wouldn't matter whether it was Joyce, Borghetti, Branson, Dixon or John Travolta, the dinosaurs in Australian Aviation would blame everyone BUT themselves for this outcome. People on here will whinge about him eternally, but history will show that Joyce had the balls to kick the unions in the teeth and make the required changes to maintain a healthy bottom line and grow the business, which is precisely his job (nothing else).
Most people here will bitch and moan about the poor management, bringing down an icon, not having a clue, etc, but it's easy to slag off all and sundry sitting behind a laptop, and I doubt any of the 'experts' that visit here would put their hand up for the top job; and I certainly don't claim to be worthy either. I neither like or dislike Joyce, but I do admire his resilience and tenacity and he is a business man after all. And everyone seems to forget that we (Aussies) are not immune to global forces. Fail to adapt and you lose.
The union fools wanted to play with fire; well, pony up fellas, it's time to get into the kitchen. Apart from friends and relatives of mine at QF, the people I feel most sorry for are the younger guys and gals who just want to work for the airline and couldn't give a toss about the poltics, and would be happy to forgo some of the ridiculous, greedy union demands.
Borghetti must be laughing and will certainly be ready for the fallout.
I hope all the 'untouchables' in the unions have got alternative skills and beefy resumes - they might come in handy. For those that were so arrogant they thought they'd never need them; whoops!
I sincerely hope it works itself out, but whatever happens, the goal posts have shifted forever. And if the worst happens; a heads up; there is no such thing as job security; welcome to the 21st century.
Now, slag this post off til your hearts are content; no need for me to come back and respond to the garbage that will follow.
Nighty night.
SD
Sprucegoose
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On another point, I bet Slater and Gordon are salivating at the thought of 108plane loads of passengers joining a class action for breach of contract or similar.
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FWA Meeting Tonight
Fair Work Australia will hold an urgent hearing at 10pm (AEDT) tonight in Melbourne to deal with the Qantas dispute.
Qantas has grounded its entire fleet and is locking out its staff in response to industrial action by three unions.
The airline has grounded its 108 aircraft around the world indefinitely.
The Federal Government wants the industrial umpire to intervene.
The section of the Fair Work Act under which the Government is making its application would enable Fair Work Australia to issue an order to suspend or terminate industrial action if it is satisfied the action would threaten "personal safety, or the health, or welfare, of the population ... or cause significant damage to the Australian economy".
Under the section, the application must be determined within five days.
If FWA is unable to determine the application in that time it must make an interim order until the application can be determined.
The hearing will be video-linked to FWA's registry in Sydney.
The Federal Government was told about the Qantas move just three hours before the grounding.
Transport Minister Anthony Albanese says it is extraordinary action for Qantas to take just one day after its AGM.
ABC/wires
Qantas has grounded its entire fleet and is locking out its staff in response to industrial action by three unions.
The airline has grounded its 108 aircraft around the world indefinitely.
The Federal Government wants the industrial umpire to intervene.
The section of the Fair Work Act under which the Government is making its application would enable Fair Work Australia to issue an order to suspend or terminate industrial action if it is satisfied the action would threaten "personal safety, or the health, or welfare, of the population ... or cause significant damage to the Australian economy".
Under the section, the application must be determined within five days.
If FWA is unable to determine the application in that time it must make an interim order until the application can be determined.
The hearing will be video-linked to FWA's registry in Sydney.
The Federal Government was told about the Qantas move just three hours before the grounding.
Transport Minister Anthony Albanese says it is extraordinary action for Qantas to take just one day after its AGM.
ABC/wires
I'm afraid I have to agree with Snail Dave and Dick Smith as neville_nobody says. He was making a lot of sense. Probably not what most will want to here but....
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Slow Dave
Borghetti left QF because he knew what was coming and he did not agree with it. He knows what AJ & LC are planning (along with all of Australia now) he left and is in a position to reap the rewards of his move.
Borghetti left QF because he knew what was coming and he did not agree with it. He knows what AJ & LC are planning (along with all of Australia now) he left and is in a position to reap the rewards of his move.
Last edited by Short_Circuit; 30th Oct 2011 at 00:28.
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Joyce Gone Mad ?
Qantas' decision to ground the entire Qantas fleet is "holding a knife to the nation's throat" and CEO Alan Joyce has "gone mad", the Australian and International Pilots Association (AIPA) says.
AIPA vice president Richard Woodward said the move was "premeditated, unnecessary and grossly irresponsible".
"Alan Joyce is holding a knife to the nation's throat," Captain Woodward said.
"No-one predicted this, because no one thought Alan Joyce was completely mad.
"This is a stunning overreaction. It is straight-up blackmail.
"I knew he was trying to kill Qantas, but I didn't know he wanted to do it this quickly.
"This is a grave and serious situation and the board should move to sack Mr Joyce immediately. This is the saddest day of my 25 years with Qantas."
He said AIPA's industrial action has been limited to making brief, positive in-flight announcements and wearing red ties.
"In response to this, Mr Joyce has now locked out every pilot working for Qantas. This is nothing short of crazy behaviour," he said.
"Mr Joyce is stranding thousands of Qantas passengers all across the globe so he can engage in his mad game of one-upmanship. All so he can pursue his delusion that Qantas should be an Asian airline, instead of an Australian one.
"We believe this action is unlawful and we are currently seeking legal advice.
" He has locked out short-haul 737 pilots who aren't even involved in any action at all.
Mr Woodward said this action would have been planned months in advance.
"Let's be clear about this: Mr Joyce would have planned to strand thousands of Qantas passengers all across the globe months ago," he said.
"To ground your entire fleet, when doing so is completely unnecessary, is not the act of a sane and reasonable person.
"He has snatched his ill-deserved millions on Friday and grounded the airline on Saturday. It's just tragic and unnecessary."
AAP
AIPA vice president Richard Woodward said the move was "premeditated, unnecessary and grossly irresponsible".
"Alan Joyce is holding a knife to the nation's throat," Captain Woodward said.
"No-one predicted this, because no one thought Alan Joyce was completely mad.
"This is a stunning overreaction. It is straight-up blackmail.
"I knew he was trying to kill Qantas, but I didn't know he wanted to do it this quickly.
"This is a grave and serious situation and the board should move to sack Mr Joyce immediately. This is the saddest day of my 25 years with Qantas."
He said AIPA's industrial action has been limited to making brief, positive in-flight announcements and wearing red ties.
"In response to this, Mr Joyce has now locked out every pilot working for Qantas. This is nothing short of crazy behaviour," he said.
"Mr Joyce is stranding thousands of Qantas passengers all across the globe so he can engage in his mad game of one-upmanship. All so he can pursue his delusion that Qantas should be an Asian airline, instead of an Australian one.
"We believe this action is unlawful and we are currently seeking legal advice.
" He has locked out short-haul 737 pilots who aren't even involved in any action at all.
Mr Woodward said this action would have been planned months in advance.
"Let's be clear about this: Mr Joyce would have planned to strand thousands of Qantas passengers all across the globe months ago," he said.
"To ground your entire fleet, when doing so is completely unnecessary, is not the act of a sane and reasonable person.
"He has snatched his ill-deserved millions on Friday and grounded the airline on Saturday. It's just tragic and unnecessary."
AAP
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Ka.Boom
I am sure the AJ has the complete backing of the board. There is just no way he could do this without the express approval of the panel. They know what they want and they now how to get it, the only variable here is FWA and the federal government.
SN
I am sure the AJ has the complete backing of the board. There is just no way he could do this without the express approval of the panel. They know what they want and they now how to get it, the only variable here is FWA and the federal government.
SN
Snail Dave,
Firstly, many of us are capable of a mature response without the underlying tone of disdain that you displayed in your post.
Secondly, it seems that you have based your response, at least partly, on the misunderstanding that all 3 of the unions mentioned (ALAEA, AIPA, TWU) are conducting the same campaign and making the same EBA claims. AIPA members have not, at any stage, stopped work or caused any delay. The only action taken has been making polite PAs and wearing red ties instead of black ones. As for the claims being made by AIPA in the EBA, they are just that - claims. Ambit claims. You seem to have a poor understanding of what exactly is involved in the negotiation and bargaining process. (Hint: look up the word "ambit".)
Thirdly, I can assure you that every fellow LH AIPA member I have spoken to in recent times is more than willing to provide efficiencies. We understand that change is required and are willing to be part of it. We just want to know that we can partake in that process and not then be short-sheeted by a dishonest and deceitful management. If they were only prepared to take us on the "journey" with them they might be surprised at what could be achieved.
I fully support AIPA and its representatives.
Firstly, many of us are capable of a mature response without the underlying tone of disdain that you displayed in your post.
Secondly, it seems that you have based your response, at least partly, on the misunderstanding that all 3 of the unions mentioned (ALAEA, AIPA, TWU) are conducting the same campaign and making the same EBA claims. AIPA members have not, at any stage, stopped work or caused any delay. The only action taken has been making polite PAs and wearing red ties instead of black ones. As for the claims being made by AIPA in the EBA, they are just that - claims. Ambit claims. You seem to have a poor understanding of what exactly is involved in the negotiation and bargaining process. (Hint: look up the word "ambit".)
Thirdly, I can assure you that every fellow LH AIPA member I have spoken to in recent times is more than willing to provide efficiencies. We understand that change is required and are willing to be part of it. We just want to know that we can partake in that process and not then be short-sheeted by a dishonest and deceitful management. If they were only prepared to take us on the "journey" with them they might be surprised at what could be achieved.
I fully support AIPA and its representatives.
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sincerely hope it works itself out, but whatever happens, the goal posts have shifted forever. And if the worst happens; a heads up; there is no such thing as job security; welcome to the 21st century.
Glad to see the Queen got out just in time -Her BA flight wasn't a QF codeshare !!!!!
Good luck to all you Quantas folks, as a Pom SLF I can honestly say you were once the best.
Lid