ATC VOLUNTARY OVERTIME BAN: Dublin Flights Delayed 25th January
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: euroland
Posts: 6
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
an apology from DFC (jr)
To all of the ATCOS that dfc has wronged
I wish to offer my apologies to you all for the way that dfc has conducted himself
- Deliberately making up “facts”
- Failing to check if his information is out of date
- Constantly failing to qualify anything he says
- Insulting the intelligence of the ATCO community
- Stating that he is only trying to understand you all
- Always ignoring anything that doesn’t fit his agenda
- Creating a lot of tension on this thread
- Using a public forum to out people
- Never thinking he’s wrong
- Trying to deflect this thread from the real issue
He’ll try to be a better person, for the greater good
Regards,
dfc (jr)
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: ireland
Posts: 6
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
To whom it concerns I have just learned that the IAA management in Shannon have blocked the internet access to none other than the PPRuNe website.... how petty can they get... lucky for us guys that we installed the pc out in the bike shed eh ....... oops! I mean... there is nothin out in the eh...bike shed.... sorry lads ! Well lads if they take that one off us, we just let the air out of their bouncy castle... thay wont know what to do with themselves at break time ! 
Book Token
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: emerald isle
Posts: 47
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Oh Dear does the IAA really live in the past where the only internet access we had was in work.
Do they not realise that you can read PPRuNe or your mobile phone and that most ATCO's have the Tinternet at home.
Booked it, Packed it, Fecked off.
Do they not realise that you can read PPRuNe or your mobile phone and that most ATCO's have the Tinternet at home.
Booked it, Packed it, Fecked off.
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Dublin
Posts: 2
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Why do you all keep answering that plonker DFC.
What a waste of life to spend time composing a reply to her(or him?)!
I for one think we should all just ignore her.
There are bigger battles to be fought.......
The reason she posts is to rise you - ignore ignore ignore the idiot.
Yours,
FoxyTotty.
What a waste of life to spend time composing a reply to her(or him?)!
I for one think we should all just ignore her.
There are bigger battles to be fought.......
The reason she posts is to rise you - ignore ignore ignore the idiot.
Yours,
FoxyTotty.
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Euroland
Posts: 2,814
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
290Kts,
One of the combinations which was used and did have some popularity was;
A,A Off, M,M,N/D,N/D,Sleep/O,O,O
N/D = Night duty or Day shift
Sleep/O = Sleep after night or day off if folowing day shifts.
Some however did not like the day off in the middle which they felt could be better used when combined with the other days off.
Management did not really like starting with an Afternoon shift because staff at times travelled back from holidays or other outings on the morning of the first day and when delayed it really caused problems.
Management did however prefer the flexibility that being able to start the day shifts early without having to also let them go early from the previous afternoon shift (in the case of the M,M,A,A,N/D,N,D,Sleep/O,O,O,O).
Can't say that I would ever propose a roster with less then 11 hours between shifts.
AS for distance between safety regulator and providor, you will find that it is very hard to deal with ATS standards in regard to area control issues without dealing with ex-NATS ATCOs.
They are separate organisations but the regulator has little choice in where to obtain people from the respect of Area ATS inspectors, examminers etc.
--------
Sir Alex,
Dundalk is just down the road these days. Not much aircraft noise there.
Imagine the cheek of me for suggesting that people employed at an airport such as Tower and Aproach controllers should ever live in an area where they might hear the noise of that airport operating.
The point I was making is that in the example provided there was no indication of how much was commuting and how much was other personal committments.
--------
thorisgod,
Many enroute providers use single staffed sectors at certain times. I don't think safety is risked by such measures. Enroute flight in the UK is safe is it not?
Declared sector capacity is another thing and I agree. However how often is the capacity declared at say 36 and the flow person comes over and asks if you can squeeze 1 more in to save a guy getting a 3 hour delay?
Regards,
DFC
This pattern also involves your first duty being a E duty which mucks up your last rest day
A,A Off, M,M,N/D,N/D,Sleep/O,O,O
N/D = Night duty or Day shift
Sleep/O = Sleep after night or day off if folowing day shifts.
Some however did not like the day off in the middle which they felt could be better used when combined with the other days off.
Management did not really like starting with an Afternoon shift because staff at times travelled back from holidays or other outings on the morning of the first day and when delayed it really caused problems.
Management did however prefer the flexibility that being able to start the day shifts early without having to also let them go early from the previous afternoon shift (in the case of the M,M,A,A,N/D,N,D,Sleep/O,O,O,O).
Can't say that I would ever propose a roster with less then 11 hours between shifts.
AS for distance between safety regulator and providor, you will find that it is very hard to deal with ATS standards in regard to area control issues without dealing with ex-NATS ATCOs.
They are separate organisations but the regulator has little choice in where to obtain people from the respect of Area ATS inspectors, examminers etc.
--------
Sir Alex,
Dundalk is just down the road these days. Not much aircraft noise there.
Imagine the cheek of me for suggesting that people employed at an airport such as Tower and Aproach controllers should ever live in an area where they might hear the noise of that airport operating.
The point I was making is that in the example provided there was no indication of how much was commuting and how much was other personal committments.
--------
thorisgod,
Many enroute providers use single staffed sectors at certain times. I don't think safety is risked by such measures. Enroute flight in the UK is safe is it not?
Declared sector capacity is another thing and I agree. However how often is the capacity declared at say 36 and the flow person comes over and asks if you can squeeze 1 more in to save a guy getting a 3 hour delay?
Regards,
DFC
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Destination 22
Posts: 146
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
However how often is the capacity declared at say 36 and the flow person comes over and asks if you can squeeze 1 more in to save a guy getting a 3 hour delay?
The sector capacity is there for a reason. If it gets exceeded it'll be an accident - not because the TTC guy feels like squeezing an extra one in to save a delay. Delays are mitigated / minimised by use of sector capping and other dark arts. You really are showing your expert knowledge
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Euroland
Posts: 2,814
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Asking to squeeze another in is just that no matter how you look at it.
It just goes to show that ATC is art not science.
Of course having the 12 aircraft for the H:00 to H:20 turn up in the first 8 minutes and then reading Hello for 5 minutes at the end with nothing on freq just proves that.
Regards,
DFC
It just goes to show that ATC is art not science.
Of course having the 12 aircraft for the H:00 to H:20 turn up in the first 8 minutes and then reading Hello for 5 minutes at the end with nothing on freq just proves that.
Regards,
DFC
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Euroland
Posts: 2,814
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
To whom it concerns I have just learned that the IAA management in Shannon have blocked the internet access to none other than the PPRuNe website
http://www.atc-sim.com/
See how many reds you can get on a night shift and not have to fill in a single form.
Regards,
DFC
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Near Stalyvegas
Age: 78
Posts: 2,022
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
DFC
AFAIA, the AAOMMNNSOO was a "Local" Manchester agreement....
Agreed [Although YOU haven't posted it [yet], Both PATCRU, PATCC and Manch used to work a Four Shift System...eg...
A 1330-2130 M 0700-1330 N 2130-0700 Variation, M 0630-1230 Early go
Sleep Day, Rest Day....
Then back on the 2 on, 2 off.
Seen it, Done it, thrown the Tshirt away.....
The AAOMMNNSOO, was recognised as a "non-sequential shift pattern, and was changed NATIONALLY to a Shift Pattern of MMAANNSOOO or MMAAOMM/AA or even MMAALDLDOOO [LD is Late Day 1600-0100]
watp,iktch
AFAIA, the AAOMMNNSOO was a "Local" Manchester agreement....
Agreed [Although YOU haven't posted it [yet], Both PATCRU, PATCC and Manch used to work a Four Shift System...eg...
A 1330-2130 M 0700-1330 N 2130-0700 Variation, M 0630-1230 Early go
Sleep Day, Rest Day....Then back on the 2 on, 2 off.
Seen it, Done it, thrown the Tshirt away.....
The AAOMMNNSOO, was recognised as a "non-sequential shift pattern, and was changed NATIONALLY to a Shift Pattern of MMAANNSOOO or MMAAOMM/AA or even MMAALDLDOOO [LD is Late Day 1600-0100]
watp,iktch
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: ireland
Posts: 72
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Before I go to bed on my highly valued day off:
DFC,
On behalf of everyone in ATC EINN, EIDW and EICK:
THANK YOU
I don't care if you are the ex-Minister for Transport (brother of our CEO) who I have no personal issues with other than the fact I vote for Labour. (That one's for you MOL)
I don't care if you are a main news reader with Ireland's state broadcaster (sister of our corporate communications officer), again no personal issues with either of these people.
I don't care if you are Michael O' Leary's gimp (see above).
I don't even care what your motives are, be they professional or personal.
But your ignorant (unknowing and ill-informed), inflamatory, trite and generally argumentative posts have served better than any kick in the arse to unite everyone else in this thread in common purpose.
Not just to try and get you banned!
But in copper-fastening our resolve by generating debate to bring peoples real issues to the fore. Let us not forget that Debate generates (if not even provokes) Thought. More importantly Thought generates and effects Change.
Change is what we want. And by God! CHANGE IS WHAT WE WILL HAVE!
So take a bow you sanctimonious piece of excrement!
Again, Thorisgod thanks you for your patience as he rants! But he means it this time.
On behalf of everyone in ATC EINN, EIDW and EICK:
THANK YOU
I don't care if you are the ex-Minister for Transport (brother of our CEO) who I have no personal issues with other than the fact I vote for Labour. (That one's for you MOL)
I don't care if you are a main news reader with Ireland's state broadcaster (sister of our corporate communications officer), again no personal issues with either of these people.
I don't care if you are Michael O' Leary's gimp (see above).
I don't even care what your motives are, be they professional or personal.
But your ignorant (unknowing and ill-informed), inflamatory, trite and generally argumentative posts have served better than any kick in the arse to unite everyone else in this thread in common purpose.
Not just to try and get you banned!
But in copper-fastening our resolve by generating debate to bring peoples real issues to the fore. Let us not forget that Debate generates (if not even provokes) Thought. More importantly Thought generates and effects Change.
Change is what we want. And by God! CHANGE IS WHAT WE WILL HAVE!
So take a bow you sanctimonious piece of excrement!
Again, Thorisgod thanks you for your patience as he rants! But he means it this time.
Time merchant
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Belgium
Posts: 352
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
From the Ryanair website today:
“The public is entitled to know why the Irish airports are being repeatedly closed by a small group of public sector workers who earn an average of €140,000 per annum, yet have a rostered working week of 35 hours."
So now it's an average of €140,000.
It seems Ryanair's PR model is based on Animal Farm! How do they get away with this cr@p?
Good luck with any industrial action. I've scrapped my trip to DUB this week just in case but it's all in a good cause.
“The public is entitled to know why the Irish airports are being repeatedly closed by a small group of public sector workers who earn an average of €140,000 per annum, yet have a rostered working week of 35 hours."
So now it's an average of €140,000.
It seems Ryanair's PR model is based on Animal Farm! How do they get away with this cr@p?
Good luck with any industrial action. I've scrapped my trip to DUB this week just in case but it's all in a good cause.
Moderator
Join Date: Jul 1997
Location: Europe
Posts: 3,228
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Having been subject to many threatening lawyers letters from Ryanair, I am sure Danny (Captain PPRuNe) could lend all the libelled Irish ATC staff some examples which they could use as templates
Of course, in every case the threats to PPRuNe have come to nothing, because the truth isn't libel
Unfortunately the crap spouters from Ryanair probably would have difficulty recognising what the word 'truth' means.
Of course, in every case the threats to PPRuNe have come to nothing, because the truth isn't libel
Unfortunately the crap spouters from Ryanair probably would have difficulty recognising what the word 'truth' means.
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Around
Age: 47
Posts: 84
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I can't believe the crap that Ryanair are coming out with. And it has just hardened my own personal boycott of that airline.
I'll also be encouraging all my friends and family to find alternative airlines to fly with from this day on as well.
I hope once you guys have wiped the floor with the IAA, you set your sights firmly on the to$$er$ at Ryanair!
I'll also be encouraging all my friends and family to find alternative airlines to fly with from this day on as well.
I hope once you guys have wiped the floor with the IAA, you set your sights firmly on the to$$er$ at Ryanair!
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: ireland
Posts: 72
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
More opposition?
See the Irish Times on Saturday?
Now IBEC are on our back.
http://www.ireland.com/newspaper/ire...619293221.html
Check this out:
http://www.ibec.ie/ibecweb.nsf/wvDoc...n?OpenDocument
They are providing a service to the IAA just like Impact are to us.
Surprisingly Mr. McGinty spouts the same drivel as MOL. Who is he?
He is their HR advisor and is on the LRC.
http://www.ibec.ie/ibecweb.nsf/wvDoc...8?OpenDocument
Funny isn't it that MOL is willing to ask Impact to publish our wage scales.
I thought he didn't have the time of day for Trade Unions.
Anyone interested in this thread should read this:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/environmen...try.travelnews
And in case his recent press releases smell of deja vu as well as bull**** read this:
http://www.independent.ie/national-n...y-1091378.html
or check this thread out:
http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?p=3607312
Sorry if I have overloaded you all with info.
Thorisgod
Now IBEC are on our back.
http://www.ireland.com/newspaper/ire...619293221.html
Check this out:
http://www.ibec.ie/ibecweb.nsf/wvDoc...n?OpenDocument
They are providing a service to the IAA just like Impact are to us.
Surprisingly Mr. McGinty spouts the same drivel as MOL. Who is he?
He is their HR advisor and is on the LRC.
http://www.ibec.ie/ibecweb.nsf/wvDoc...8?OpenDocument
Funny isn't it that MOL is willing to ask Impact to publish our wage scales.
I thought he didn't have the time of day for Trade Unions.
Anyone interested in this thread should read this:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/environmen...try.travelnews
And in case his recent press releases smell of deja vu as well as bull**** read this:
http://www.independent.ie/national-n...y-1091378.html
or check this thread out:
http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?p=3607312
Sorry if I have overloaded you all with info.
Thorisgod
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Twilight Zone
Age: 56
Posts: 83
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Why the **** is Mc Ginty the IAA's Hr advisor?
I mean between Kavanagh, Ryan,Hegarty Maguire and Devlin do they not have enough HR Managers for a company that only has 300 revenue generating employees without dragging in more from outside!!!!!
In the interests of fair play I think that impact should publish the pay scales and benefits packages of all the senior management paying special attention to the pay increases awarded by The Review Body on Higher Remuneration in the Public Sector. We know they got a nice pay rise out of that! maybe even more than Bertie.
If Impact don't SLAUGHTER them in the Labour Court for for this I'll be even more disappointed in them than I am now.
With regards to the IAA banning this forum from IAA computers...so ******* what!! We know how badly we're treated but now everyone outside knows as well, just look at the messages of support from around the world. Miles better than having O'Leary and IBEC on your side if you ask me.
Thanks again Everyone
By the Way
Anyone interested in Picketing outside Aviation House on Thursday?
I mean between Kavanagh, Ryan,Hegarty Maguire and Devlin do they not have enough HR Managers for a company that only has 300 revenue generating employees without dragging in more from outside!!!!!
In the interests of fair play I think that impact should publish the pay scales and benefits packages of all the senior management paying special attention to the pay increases awarded by The Review Body on Higher Remuneration in the Public Sector. We know they got a nice pay rise out of that! maybe even more than Bertie.
If Impact don't SLAUGHTER them in the Labour Court for for this I'll be even more disappointed in them than I am now.
With regards to the IAA banning this forum from IAA computers...so ******* what!! We know how badly we're treated but now everyone outside knows as well, just look at the messages of support from around the world. Miles better than having O'Leary and IBEC on your side if you ask me.
Thanks again Everyone
By the Way
Anyone interested in Picketing outside Aviation House on Thursday?