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London City-4

Old 19th Dec 2022, 12:02
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Reported on Twitter that BACF have dropped Santorini.
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Old 19th Dec 2022, 22:34
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GCI gone also unfortunately according to London Air Travel / Sean M on Twitter - had previously been bookable.
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Old 23rd Dec 2022, 12:56
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Seems LCY wants to open on Saturdays afternoon
Hadn't noticed this under discussion before - apologies if I missed it
https://media.londoncityairport.com/london-city-submits-planning-application-to-the-london-borough-of-newham/

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Old 23rd Dec 2022, 13:47
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LCY want to open up profit. I see they are talking up how many knew jobs it will create. When they oped [1988?] I was working in the City and discussed how long it would be before the weekend limits werd lifted. Sadly, I cannot recall what we decided...
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Old 23rd Dec 2022, 21:45
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The Saturday afternoon extra hours (I think until about 5pm) is to offer the services which have in recent years developed to the Mediterranean etc with the weekdays business fleet. Opening between 7am and 1pm as currently on Saturdays just does not give a reliable round trip to the Mediterranean. There's a squadron departure as soon as it opens, but it's found just not reliable enough to be back in time before it closes, with diversions to Gatwick/Stansted or wherever, and for the longer round trips just not possible. Sundays it's not an issue, as it's open from 1pm to 10pm, a Med round trip followed by a Sunday evening outwards to a continental Business point, ready for an early inwards on Monday morning.

There was supposed to have been a local authority (Newham) consultation on this. We live closer than most, and heard absolutely nothing about any such consultation, though I'm sure John Stewart (does he still live in Twickenham ?) will be well to the fore in commenting. In passing, from my own consultations over time, none of our neighbours have any issue with the airport's hours at all.
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Old 23rd Dec 2022, 23:11
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Originally Posted by WHBM View Post
The Saturday afternoon extra hours (I think until about 5pm) is to offer the services which have in recent years developed to the Mediterranean etc with the weekdays business fleet. Opening between 7am and 1pm as currently on Saturdays just does not give a reliable round trip to the Mediterranean. There's a squadron departure as soon as it opens, but it's found just not reliable enough to be back in time before it closes, with diversions to Gatwick/Stansted or wherever, and for the longer round trips just not possible. Sundays it's not an issue, as it's open from 1pm to 10pm, a Med round trip followed by a Sunday evening outwards to a continental Business point, ready for an early inwards on Monday morning.

There was supposed to have been a local authority (Newham) consultation on this. We live closer than most, and heard absolutely nothing about any such consultation, though I'm sure John Stewart (does he still live in Twickenham ?) will be well to the fore in commenting. In passing, from my own consultations over time, none of our neighbours have any issue with the airport's hours at all.
John Stewart? Thought he lived in Vauxhall, far away from any airports. Could be wrong.....
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Old 9th Feb 2023, 14:37
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More on Saturday afternoon flights

London City Airport plans extra weekend flights https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-64581118
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Old 9th Feb 2023, 15:00
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Originally Posted by LTNman View Post
More on Saturday afternoon flights

London City Airport plans extra weekend flights https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-64581118
Initially proposed on the proviso that the added hours were flown by E2/A220 aircraft. From this article it seems this is no longer the case and instead ‘might’ incentivise greener fleets for the future!
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Old 9th Feb 2023, 15:42
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Originally Posted by Fairdealfrank View Post
John Stewart? Thought he lived in Vauxhall, far away from any airports. Could be wrong.....
IMHO Vauxhall is particularly noisy, just like Clapham. All those Heathrow inbounds turning onto final making power adjustments to make the speed requirements. It's VERY noticeable locally....
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Old 13th Feb 2023, 12:17
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Originally Posted by SKOJB View Post
Initially proposed on the proviso that the added hours were flown by E2/A220 aircraft. From this article it seems this is no longer the case and instead ‘might’ incentivise greener fleets for the future!
The main aim is to allow based aircraft to make meaningful return Saturday flights to Mediterranean destinations. The current LCY operators of E2/A220 aircraft are based in Europe, and have no issue doing an in/out on Saturday mornings, so this seems aimed squarely at BA Cityflyer, who have been suspected of looking at fleet replacements. Extra Saturday utilisation might be part of this financial justification, with each (BA for replacement and the council for permission) wanting to wait for the other to move.

If I was LCY having to pull this together I would be emphasising that allowing the Saturday flights would allow BA to justify starting to replacing their entire based fleet, with noise benefits all week, not just the new operations. Give the permission, restrict it to the new types, with an exemption for say the first three years to allow the new aircraft to be ordered and start introduction.

If LCY want further offsets, offer to withdraw the permission for the Piaggio Avanti business turboprop, only a few come through but which, whatever its official certification numbers, seems to make noise beyond anything previously used at the airport. It's even prominent when overflying at altitude !
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Old 6th Mar 2023, 05:00
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Installation of arrestor beds at LCY is underway. It is said that their installation will support the certification of the E195E2 and the A220-300.
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Old 6th Mar 2023, 07:10
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I thought arrester beds served only to provide an alternative to a RESA (Runway End Safety Area) where the latter is not available due to space limitations. I wonder why they have not been thought necessary begore now - the size of an aircraft doesn't necessarily determine the likelihood of an overrun.
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Old 6th Mar 2023, 18:36
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Originally Posted by Expressflight View Post
I thought arrester beds served only to provide an alternative to a RESA (Runway End Safety Area) where the latter is not available due to space limitations. I wonder why they have not been thought necessary begore now - the size of an aircraft doesn't necessarily determine the likelihood of an overrun.
The physical runway length is just over 1500m but declared distances are much less in order to provide RESA. I believe providing the arrestor beds will substitute for a RESA enabling more runway length to be used to increase increase declared distances. This should mean aircraft can operate at increased weight. Providing these beds must be very costly so perhaps the business case now adds up.
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Old 7th Mar 2023, 08:10
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Originally Posted by Musket90 View Post
The physical runway length is just over 1500m but declared distances are much less in order to provide RESA. I believe providing the arrestor beds will substitute for a RESA enabling more runway length to be used to increase increase declared distances. This should mean aircraft can operate at increased weight. Providing these beds must be very costly so perhaps the business case now adds up.
I thought the limiting factor at LCY was the fact that it has a Code 2 runway due to insufficient strip width being available to be Code 3 (see CAP 168). That fact alone should limit the declared distances irrespective of whether a RESA or arrester bed is in place.
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Old 7th Mar 2023, 20:20
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Originally Posted by Expressflight View Post
I thought the limiting factor at LCY was the fact that it has a Code 2 runway due to insufficient strip width being available to be Code 3 (see CAP 168). That fact alone should limit the declared distances irrespective of whether a RESA or arrester bed is in place.
London City is unique and I believe has CAA approved exemptions based on runway Code 3 criteria. CAP168 some years ago permitted runways to remain within Code 2 criteria if the length was limited to within 10% above Code 2 hence the present 1319m figure which is 10% more than the 1199m Code 2 limit. This policy, however, no longer applies. According to the CAA web site the airport has a UK Certificate which used to be an EASA Certificate before Brexit law was implemented so the EASA regulations as adopted into UK law presently apply to City rather than CAP168.which is the requirement for National licensed aerodromes.
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Old 8th Mar 2023, 06:55
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Originally Posted by Musket90 View Post
London City is unique and I believe has CAA approved exemptions based on runway Code 3 criteria. CAP168 some years ago permitted runways to remain within Code 2 criteria if the length was limited to within 10% above Code 2 hence the present 1319m figure which is 10% more than the 1199m Code 2 limit. This policy, however, no longer applies. According to the CAA web site the airport has a UK Certificate which used to be an EASA Certificate before Brexit law was implemented so the EASA regulations as adopted into UK law presently apply to City rather than CAP168.which is the requirement for National licensed aerodromes.
What do the EASA regulations have to say regarding declared distances on what is basically a Code 2 runway? Will the 1319m figure be increased or remain as is? The CAA don't seem to have applied the 10% increase to Code 3 runways, otherwise SEN would have greater declared distances than it now has. Perhaps SEN forgot to ask!
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Old 8th Mar 2023, 07:02
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Originally Posted by Musket90 View Post
London City is unique and I believe has CAA approved exemptions based on runway Code 3 criteria. CAP168 some years ago permitted runways to remain within Code 2 criteria if the length was limited to within 10% above Code 2 hence the present 1319m figure which is 10% more than the 1199m Code 2 limit. This policy, however, no longer applies. According to the CAA web site the airport has a UK Certificate which used to be an EASA Certificate before Brexit law was implemented so the EASA regulations as adopted into UK law presently apply to City rather than CAP168.which is the requirement for National licensed aerodromes.
Not sure I follow - if CAP168 applied when we were in EASA and following EASA regulations, how does it not apply now we aren't in EASA but have adopted EASA regulations into UK law?
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Old 8th Mar 2023, 18:11
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Originally Posted by SWBKCB View Post
Not sure I follow - if CAP168 applied when we were in EASA and following EASA regulations, how does it not apply now we aren't in EASA but have adopted EASA regulations into UK law?
Not all aerodromes were in EASA scope (mainly smaller ones) hence they remained as national licensed under CAP168 rules. I can only think that eventually CAA will have one regulatory document for all UK aerodromes.

As for runway coding and the previous 10% more length policy, this only applied to Code 1 and 2 runways (799m and 1199m respectively) so places like Southend wouldn't count.
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Old 8th Mar 2023, 19:42
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LCY first UK airport to allow up to 2 litres of liquids inside bags?.Teesside disagrees!

London City Airport chief executive Robert Sinclair said: ‘The good news for anyone planning a holiday or a business trip is that we will be the first mainstream UK airport to offer a fully CT security experience from the end of this month. The new lanes will not only cut hassle but also queuing times, which I know passengers will love.'
https://media.londoncityairport.com/...nce-by-easter/
Tees Valley Mayor Ben Houchen said: “Once again Teesside is at the forefront of developments in the aviation industry, with our C3 scanners in place and already being used in the roll-out of the new rules, coming into force elsewhere next year.

“Some airports have announced they’re looking to end the restriction in time for the Easter holidays, but we’re one step ahead in having already scrapped the limit – showing how local, regional airports are going further, faster for the people that they serve. Passenger safety and experience is front-and-centre of all we do at Teesside Airport, and these scanners play a massive part in both.
https://www.teessideinternational.co...ecurity-limit/

Is LCY dissing Teesside by saying they aren't a "mainstream UK airport" - fight, fight...
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Old 30th Mar 2023, 01:10
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Sadiq Khan not happy with London City having more flights at the weekend. Seems like there's going to be a long fight (well, everyone expected a long fight even if they didn't admit it publicly) with plenty of haggling involved
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-65086374
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