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Southampton-3

Old 8th Jan 2024, 11:35
  #2701 (permalink)  
 
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I thought most airports incentive schemes worked on the basis that routes already served by other airlines get little or no discount, while opening routes not currently served can see a large discount. Does SOU do things differently ? Or are SOU just desperate for Easyjet to start some flights as a way of getting their foot in the door ? And yes, I can understand why SOU might be bending over backwards to favour Easyjet
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Old 8th Jan 2024, 11:41
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Originally Posted by RW20
The problem for SOU is it cannot make a profit just with Loganair,Blue island etc,it needs Easy and more routes for long time survival.
No option to cut costs and slim down to profitability? Very tough to do.
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Old 8th Jan 2024, 13:02
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Originally Posted by SealinkBF
What if they offer an incentive for new routes?
That would be a totally different proposition and not anti competitive since they wouldn't be limiting competition. I imagine this is how most airports manage their incentive policies.
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Old 8th Jan 2024, 13:05
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Originally Posted by ATNotts
That would be a totally different proposition and not anti competitive since they wouldn't be limiting competition. I imagine this is how most airports manage their incentive policies.
judging by the success AGS has had at SOU to date with new routes, I very much doubt it
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Old 8th Jan 2024, 13:47
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Originally Posted by Asturias56
They could just present Easyjet with a contract that stopped them operating on any route already served by another Operator.......................
This would be illegal under their operating licence from the CAA.
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Old 8th Jan 2024, 15:45
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What are AGS up to? Once again BOH adds another new route to regional France, Nantes (SOU bread and butter over the years) and yet the airport owners seem to be asleep at the wheel whilst all else goes on around them!
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Old 8th Jan 2024, 16:06
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Originally Posted by SKOJB
What are AGS up to? Once again BOH adds another new route to regional France, Nantes (SOU bread and butter over the years) and yet the airport owners seem to be asleep at the wheel whilst all else goes on around them!
just what I have been saying for a while,I'm afraid as long as AGS remain as operators of SOU I can't see much success for the airport with new destinations,let's face it since the runway extension there has been little to get excited about,after all Belfast,Glasgow,Geneva could operate with Easy on the old runway length,so.that leaves 2xPalma,1 Faro and Alicante ,very underwhelming !
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Old 8th Jan 2024, 16:27
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Maybe the MD left as he was fed up of being treated as a yes man within the AGS empire? The airport desperately requires new routes, not routes already served by other carriers but Iím not sure we will ever see these. Seems the usual concentration of domestics with a basic smattering of Med instead of a little out the box thinking. Been mentioned elsewhere that GLA has also suffered under this style of leadership over the years
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Old 8th Jan 2024, 18:09
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A little unfair, I think. Given the ďGreenĒ pressures how many uk airports have managed a runway extension in recent years? I think there are far too many impatient and unrealistic posters on here. I think whether EZY and others expand at SOU will be very dependent on how this yearís sunshine routes do.
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Old 9th Jan 2024, 09:55
  #2710 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by willy wombat
A little unfair, I think. Given the ďGreenĒ pressures how many uk airports have managed a runway extension in recent years? I think there are far too many impatient and unrealistic posters on here. I think whether EZY and others expand at SOU will be very dependent on how this yearís sunshine routes do.
Totally agree. Patience is needed. The small growth at BOH is irrelevant to SOU. First of all itís from an existing operator in FR and they are just filling out a gaps in a schedule they have already committed to rather than adding routes on their own merit. FR will never operate from SOU so itís not like SOU needs to be concerned with attracting them.

Another thing Iím sure no one on here has considered is how convenient it is BOH have had a flurry of activity around the time SOU opens itís longer runway. Why might that be? BOH trying to mark their territory? Giving big incentives to long standing operators FR/TUI to do a little more at BOH after 10 years of not very much at all? Have a big enough range of routes that it might make EZY think twice of moving in at SOU? Desperate acts from an airport that knows its competitor is real threat. Itís not sustainable and perhaps SOU is being run like a proper business rather than giving extreme incentives to new operators. If things return to normal then EZY will have to grow outside the usual London airports again and SOU is now ready to cater for it. Especially when they start taking the additional 200 odd neos they have on order. The market will always be here ant SOU along with the transport links.
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Old 9th Jan 2024, 11:30
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Originally Posted by Rivet Joint
Desperate acts from an airport that knows its competitor is real threat.
Why do you assume it's the airport and not simply Ryanair trying to add a bit of extra growth from an airport they've long operated from?

There is no technical reason why Ryanair couldn't operate all but two of their Bournemouth flights out of Southampton. Maybe SOU airport should have approached Ryanair?
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Old 9th Jan 2024, 11:54
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Originally Posted by cavokblues
Why do you assume it's the airport and not simply Ryanair trying to add a bit of extra growth from an airport they've long operated from?

There is no technical reason why Ryanair couldn't operate all but two of their Bournemouth flights out of Southampton. Maybe SOU airport should have approached Ryanair?


SOUzanne beware of the devil as the old song goes
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Old 9th Jan 2024, 13:19
  #2713 (permalink)  
 
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The market will always be here ant SOU along with the transport links
This is the conundrum, isn't it? SOU has the position, the market and the transport links, but has taken a massive flybe induced step backwards, whereas BOH with it's poor location and lack of transport links has the routes and the passengers through organic growth (any evidence of extreme incentives?.)

Desperate acts from an airport that knows its competitor is real threat. Itís not sustainable and perhaps SOU is being run like a proper business rather than giving extreme incentives to new operators.
Isn't this the free market in operation? Bit like when EZY move in on other operators?

Patience needed indeed.
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Old 9th Jan 2024, 13:36
  #2714 (permalink)  
 
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Perhaps worth remembering that for all the fuss about the runway extension at SOU...it's still not actually that long and significantly shorter than BOH. Fine for an A320 to Edinburgh... but doesn't quite stretch to a fully-loaded 738 going to a major leisure destination in winter, namely the Canaries
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Old 9th Jan 2024, 14:51
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Originally Posted by Rivet Joint
Giving big incentives to long standing operators FR/TUI to do a little more at BOH after 10 years of not very much at all? Have a big enough range of routes that it might make EZY think twice of moving in at SOU? Desperate acts from an airport that knows its competitor is real threat. It’s not sustainable and perhaps SOU is being run like a proper business rather than giving extreme incentives to new operators.
Can you supply some evidence of "desperate" BOH "giving big incentives" now that it's "not sustainable"? Any proper business would indeed be prepared to offer a sensible incentive if there was a chance of a good outcome. It's not enough that SOU succeed, BOH MUST ALSO FAIL.

See also GLA vs. EDI, PIK vs. GLA, INV vs. ABZ, NCL vs. MME, LPL vs. MAN vs. LBA, BRS vs. CWL and every airport with "London" in the name vs. each other...
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Old 9th Jan 2024, 15:05
  #2716 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by davidjohnson6
Perhaps worth remembering that for all the fuss about the runway extension at SOU...it's still not actually that long and significantly shorter than BOH. Fine for an A320 to Edinburgh... but doesn't quite stretch to a fully-loaded 738 going to a major leisure destination in winter, namely the Canaries
I believe that a 738 operating at SOU would have restrictions around the on going tree Heights at the end of 02,this is significant as a lot of operators use this type,TCAS FAN could give a clear answer on this.
​BOH has developed an ever increasing base of TUI and Ryanair 738,and this is the rub ,the airport operating times allow this to be effective,something SOU will not be able to do with the restrictive operation hours.
Bournemouth also seems to have a progressive and effective management team that are adding a expanding destination list ,while Southampton management team seem to be still stuck in first gear.
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Old 9th Jan 2024, 15:24
  #2717 (permalink)  
 
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Regardless of what some people seem to believe on here, airports have only a very small influence over where/when airlines fly to/from unless there's a very large cheque on the table. Most airlines have a roadmap of when/where they want to expand to/from, certainly for the next 3/4 seasons, already mapped out subject to aircraft/crew availability (at least the decent ones do!)
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Old 9th Jan 2024, 15:59
  #2718 (permalink)  
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Maybe we need to be a little patient and realistic. Because the runway extension was completed just 4 months ago doesnít constitute an immediate influx of operators and routes. The airport has already announced their intention to register 1m pax in 2024 and this with the current timetable is eminently achievable. In order to reach a break even and beyond, it will only require the likes of easyJet to add some frequency to current Med routes (assuming they are a success this summer of course) and maybe add a handful of further destinations including the likes of MAN and 1.5m is back in sight, again this will not be reached overnight and yet probably fits in with their mid term forecasts. No doubt there will be a few reductions and additions (airlines and routes) along the way but guess this is all part of the joys of regional connectivity and not being a large central hub. It can seem rather frustrating that announcements are few and far between but I am confident they will come and lead the airport back to a certain level of financial security.

Last edited by stewyb; 9th Jan 2024 at 16:12.
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Old 9th Jan 2024, 18:22
  #2719 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by stewyb
Maybe we need to be a little patient and realistic. Because the runway extension was completed just 4 months ago doesnít constitute an immediate influx of operators and routes. The airport has already announced their intention to register 1m pax in 2024 and this with the current timetable is eminently achievable. In order to reach a break even and beyond, it will only require the likes of easyJet to add some frequency to current Med routes (assuming they are a success this summer of course) and maybe add a handful of further destinations including the likes of MAN and 1.5m is back in sight, again this will not be reached overnight and yet probably fits in with their mid term forecasts. No doubt there will be a few reductions and additions (airlines and routes) along the way but guess this is all part of the joys of regional connectivity and not being a large central hub. It can seem rather frustrating that announcements are few and far between but I am confident they will come and lead the airport back to a certain level of financial security.
A very sensible and pragmatic proposition. I too really think the SOU will prosper, but it's unlikely to be flash-bang two million passengers, but I do believe the airport is going in the right direction. As I have mentioned before, and I'm sure everyone is bored with me mentioning it, but the airport simply must get the message out and about that new routes are available. My immediate next door neighbours, a wealthy educated young couple, were unaware that they could fly on their already-planned but not booked ski holiday from SOU. After I mentioned it, they booked right away. The numbers will come, but it's vital that people know about the possibilities offered from Southampton.

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Old 9th Jan 2024, 18:24
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Originally Posted by davidjohnson6
Perhaps worth remembering that for all the fuss about the runway extension at SOU...it's still not actually that long and significantly shorter than BOH. Fine for an A320 to Edinburgh... but doesn't quite stretch to a fully-loaded 738 going to a major leisure destination in winter, namely the Canaries
Perhaps those more knowledgeable in these matters can comment but the fact that Bournemouth, like Gatwick and Heathrow, has an East/West runway must offer some advantage over Southampton's North/South orientation. I've seen aircraft struggle to land at Southampton in high winds and divert to Gatwick.
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