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Coronavirus Impact on Air Travel

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Coronavirus Impact on Air Travel

Old 21st Nov 2020, 17:43
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Reticence around Covid vaccines

Reposted to JetBlast - how to persuade the public to take one of the Covid vaccines
https://www.pprune.org/jet-blast/629...l#post10931747

Last edited by davidjohnson6; 21st Nov 2020 at 18:03.
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Old 21st Nov 2020, 17:52
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DJ6 - you normally one of the first to direct this thread back towards aviation. THis subject is worthy of its own JB thread...
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Old 21st Nov 2020, 17:58
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Originally Posted by davidjohnson6
As many will be aware, there is a considerable amount of reticence amongst many people, including those who have a high level of education, around having either the Pfizer or Moderna vaccines. Without mass uptake of the vaccine(s), relaxation of lockdown would see high death rates (or borders being closed) and will likely mean flying in 2021 remains at 2020 levels
I imagine that Govts all round the world know of this reluctance and presumably are planning public education films / campaigns to try to persuade the masses that the vaccine is absolutely fine

The question is then - what sort of strategy should be taken ? Should it be just a recording of someone with grey hair (beard optional), wearing a white lab coat saying "I am a scientist and I say it is safe so do as you are told" or maybe instead it will be something with a suitable A-lister telling everyone to "be cool" instead ? I'd like to think that the campaign would involve explaining the science in some way that sidesteps the deep detail that requires a biosciences degree, but still avoids treating the public like idiots (i.e. more than just a few graphics). However I worry that even the concept of RNA being separate from DNA is too much for most people to understand and the PR people will act accordingly. My knowledge of mRNA is from 25+ years ago - enough to have specific worries but not enough to really understand what's going on in any kind of substantive detail and certainly not enough to read (properly) any kind of scientific paper or claim ability to peer review test results

I've seen very little in the press explaining how these vaccines work, why assertions of safety are valid or questions about what might go wrong with the vaccines - it's almost as if the political journalists (who didn't do science at university) don't know what to ask of senior medics at press briefings, and the science journalists who do know what to ask don't get an invite to the major press briefings
Why not wait a little longer for Astrazeneca's Monkey vaccine - I believe it doesn't use the RNA method and comes with a 6 month supply of Bananas to sweeten the deal.
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Old 21st Nov 2020, 18:04
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SWBKCB - my apologies - you're absolutely right to throw that back in my face
https://www.pprune.org/jet-blast/629...l#post10931747
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Old 23rd Nov 2020, 12:23
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So Qantas CEO has said that he expects their airline and others will implement T&C changes which mandates vaccination ahead of travel. But perhaps not domestically (of course Coroni can tell what a domestic and international flight is!)

As Iíve mentioned on this thread and elsewhere, this cannot be the exit plan for APAC. The vaccine isnít 100% effective and most of the working age population will not be able to get call vaccinated at least until next summer.
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Old 23rd Nov 2020, 13:01
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Interesting, not unexpected, and perhaps a sign of what will follow. A couple of practical points are - How will the airline receive proof that the passenger is vaccinated? Also, if vaccinated - for how long after vaccination will the passenger be considered protected?
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Old 23rd Nov 2020, 13:07
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Will airlines accept all vaccines, or just a subset of them ? For example, might a Chinese airline (possibly as a Chinese Govt legal requirement) accept only a Chinese-developed vaccine ?
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Old 23rd Nov 2020, 13:23
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Originally Posted by Dannyboy39
So Qantas CEO has said that he expects their airline and others will implement T&C changes which mandates vaccination ahead of travel. But perhaps not domestically (of course Coroni can tell what a domestic and international flight is!)

As Iíve mentioned on this thread and elsewhere, this cannot be the exit plan for APAC. The vaccine isnít 100% effective and most of the working age population will not be able to get call vaccinated at least until next summer.
This appears to be the only exit plan they have. I hope they're sitting on a big cash pile because they're going to be isolated for a long time if that's the case..
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Old 24th Nov 2020, 04:30
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Originally Posted by LTNman
Vaccinate their own population and demand proof of those arriving have been vaccinated. I expect in the early days of vaccination there will be no proof from the U.K. but then someone will cotton on when restrictions on U.K. citizens are not lifted.
Seems my idea of 10 days ago, that was condemned here, is under active consideration by IATA. Maybe they read pprune? Lol

The International Air Transportation Association (IATA) revealed Monday that it is developing a “Travel Pass” that would enable travellers to log and identify their COVID-19 test results or vaccination certificate before being approved to travel.
https://globalnews.ca/news/7478787/c...assports-iata/

Last edited by LTNman; 24th Nov 2020 at 08:08.
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Old 24th Nov 2020, 07:04
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I can understand the logic behind it, but at the same time it is a hammer blow on the tourism industry - airlines are potless and more will go bankrupt.

The best way to go is to continually expand travel corridors (not just a one way thing which is what we appear to have here in the UK) and reassess high risk areas with a common global approach, although of course it has proven that it is impossible, even in the EU, to have consistent rules cross border. As soon as next week comes around and people start to get jabbed, death rates and hospitalisations will come down tremendously as the most high risk patients get vaccinated.

Come the spring, I can't see why countries who are well underway in their vaccine programmes cannot start fully opening up.

To have a strategy to lockdown as soon as you have a handful of cases is just unsustainable. It is so ingrained in the population globally and the virus will still be in the system for a very long time - maybe years.
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Old 24th Nov 2020, 16:03
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Post-vaccinee - In Flight Magazines - will they return ?

Once a vaccine has been readily available for a prolonged period of time to all who want it (and even those who don't !) - let's suppose 31-Dec-2021 - could we see airline in-flight seat-back magazine return ? On paper, or just downloadable to a phone ?
What about the food/drink menus ? Paper or just downloadable ?
Furthermore, will there be pressure on all short-haul airlines of non-trivial size to make Wifi available (maybe for a fee) to passengers ?
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Old 24th Nov 2020, 18:10
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Originally Posted by davidjohnson6
Once a vaccine has been readily available for a prolonged period of time to all who want it (and even those who don't !) - let's suppose 31-Dec-2021 - could we see airline in-flight seat-back magazine return ? On paper, or just downloadable to a phone ?
What about the food/drink menus ? Paper or just downloadable ?
Furthermore, will there be pressure on all short-haul airlines of non-trivial size to make Wifi available (maybe for a fee) to passengers ?
Looking at it from an airline perspective................. in flight mag in every seat x 230 plus spares @ 1/2 kg each, so 125kg of weight that you no longer need to carry on 8 flights a day, assume it is £2 a copy for printing, commission articles, etc etc then it is a very substantial saving both in fuel and printing costs. In addition you can have it in whatever language you wish. This is not including the hygiene aspect to it.

If you get passengers to download it and order whatever they need before flying then they get served first. 10 ham croissants ordered on Dub - Stn then make sure you have 30 when start out to look after fight 3. Also means that if Mr Nicey / Ms Sweetie take the Dub - Stn flight every Mon, return Fri and order same thing each way, a 10th purchase free or a 2 hr delay when they get on the aircraft system automatically allocates them this.

Also if pax is travelling Stn-Cia then target the advertising to them plus money offs / experiences in Rome.

There are many ways something like this can work but the end of mags is probably a given.
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Old 24th Nov 2020, 18:14
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Originally Posted by Dannyboy39
To have a strategy to lockdown as soon as you have a handful of cases is just unsustainable. It is so ingrained in the population globally and the virus will still be in the system for a very long time - maybe years.
Poland went into lockdown with a few cases, result is now in 2nd lockdown they are close to 1 million cases. Apply a measure when it is time to apply it and not knee jerk as loses its potency on 2nd occasion used.
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Old 24th Nov 2020, 18:19
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Originally Posted by Dannyboy39
So Qantas CEO has said that he expects their airline and others will implement T&C changes which mandates vaccination ahead of travel. But perhaps not domestically (of course Coroni can tell what a domestic and international flight is!)

As Iíve mentioned on this thread and elsewhere, this cannot be the exit plan for APAC. The vaccine isnít 100% effective and most of the working age population will not be able to get call vaccinated at least until next summer.
So how will they check and what happens if as per normal systems says someone has not got vaccine and they have or vice versa. Will people have to have a form ? or will airline insist taht it has a right to check a passengers personal health records ?
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Old 24th Nov 2020, 18:54
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racedo - if the in-flight magazine is scrapped, surely airlines (Ryanair included) would need to install some sort of Wifi - or at least a web server - on the aircraft so that people both can and are encouraged to download the electronic version of the in-flight mag ? It's one thing to persuade people to look at your adverts when they're bored and haven't got anything else to do.... it's another thing entirely to persuade them to download your adverts in the terminal when there are airport shops to be visited
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Old 24th Nov 2020, 18:55
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Originally Posted by davidjohnson6
racedo - if the in-flight magazine is scrapped, surely airlines (Ryanair included) would need to install some sort of Wifi - or at least a web server - on the aircraft so that people both can and are encouraged to download the electronic version of the in-flight mag ? It's one thing to persuade people to look at your adverts when they're bored and haven't got anything else to do.... it's another thing entirely to persuade them to download your adverts in the terminal when there are airport shops to be visited
I donít think Iíd even be paid to read RYRs ďmagazineĒ if thatís what itís actually called.
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Old 24th Nov 2020, 20:54
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Unfortunately it looks like many of the high yielding Xmas and NY ski flights won't be happening. President Macron said tonight that ski resorts were unlikely to open until mid to late Jan, though he left a bit of politicians wiggle room. Italian gov want the whole of Europe's ski industry to stay closed like the Italian one will be, as a measure of solidarity. Swiss ski resorts are still open but their ICUs are maxed out with covid patients so not a popular choice. Maybe a chink of optimism for half term.
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Old 25th Nov 2020, 04:18
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It is starting to look a little gloomy for the vaccine wimps who wish to travel in the future particularly long haul, as for them it might not happen.

https://www.aljazeera.com/economy/20...ew-travel-list
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Old 25th Nov 2020, 06:01
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Originally Posted by LTNman
It is starting to look a little gloomy for the vaccine wimps who wish to travel in the future particularly long haul, as for them it might not happen.

https://www.aljazeera.com/economy/20...ew-travel-list
Just a repeat of the stories posted a couple of days ago - has there been any detail on where the IATA app gets the vaccine information from?

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Old 25th Nov 2020, 06:07
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14-day self-isolation period reduced by up to two thirds on receipt of a negative COVID-19 test from a private provider after 5 days of isolation
https://www.gov.uk/government/news/t...ional-arrivals

Link above also mentions support for English airports but gives no detail - reported elsewhere as "equivalent to the business rates liabilities of each airport in 2020/21, capped at £8million per site and subject to certain conditions."
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