Coronavirus Impact on Air Travel
If I was in an "at risk" category or over 80 then yes I'd be banging on the door for the vaccine obviously. The short term benefits far outweigh any potential long term issues.
But take myself for instance, I'm in a category that takes up less than 1% of total deaths and the mortality rate of the disease in general is far less than 1%.
But take myself for instance, I'm in a category that takes up less than 1% of total deaths and the mortality rate of the disease in general is far less than 1%.
Scenario 1: I've been vaccinated with the Oxford vaccine and am 70% protected. I sit next to you on a flight for 4 hours and you have the virus and I happen to be in the 30% for whom the vaccine does not work so I catch the virus from you.
Scenario 2: We've both had the Oxford vaccine injections so the chances of you having the virus is much lower and I'm much less likely to contract it from contact with you.
I would certainly feel happier with Scenario 2. I know it's not proven that you cannot carry the virus after having been vaccinated but that is a different discussion point.
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You and others are perfectly entitled to have questions about the vaccine, but please don't expect that if you decide not to take the vaccine when it is available to you, that you will still be able to carry on doing all the things that others who have accepted it do. That's not a UK issue, it's worldwide, and I'd lay a pound to a penny that many nations, especially in the Far East and Australasia will demand that anyone travelling there has been vaccinated.
So the equation is clear, if you want the freedoms to travel as you might wish; get vaccinated. if you're happy to wait a while before travelling, well that's fine too, it's you're choice.
LTNman isn't a troll, they are just putting forward a perfectly rational position that you simply don't find pallatable.
So the equation is clear, if you want the freedoms to travel as you might wish; get vaccinated. if you're happy to wait a while before travelling, well that's fine too, it's you're choice.
LTNman isn't a troll, they are just putting forward a perfectly rational position that you simply don't find pallatable.
But one thing that seems to have been missed here is that the vaccines do not stop transmission. Only 1 drug showed signs of reduced transmission and even that wasn't consistent. So why should I pose any heightened risk to others by not being vaccinated? Other than the miniscule risk to myself?
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At least Ryanair is optimistic for next summer. Not so good for those still working at airports as MOL still wants lower airport fees, which means lower wages.
https://www.routesonline.com/news/29...r-summer-2021/
https://www.routesonline.com/news/29...r-summer-2021/
What can we expect from first-generation COVID-19 vaccines?
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Don't worry, even I have questions and even the odd doubt or two but none of these questions are going to be answered anytime soon. It will need a leap of faith I guess that many won’t find acceptable. I get that.
Last edited by LTNman; 26th Nov 2020 at 11:00.
Aruba, Bhutan, East Timor, Kiribati, Micronesia, Mongolia, Samoa, Solomon Islands, Tonga and Vanuatu are all put on the Xmas card list
None of them have direct flights to the UK - unless you have a private jet
Denmark is taken out of solitary confinement and goes back to a standard jail cell
Estonia and Latvia go on the naughty list
None of them have direct flights to the UK - unless you have a private jet
Denmark is taken out of solitary confinement and goes back to a standard jail cell
Estonia and Latvia go on the naughty list
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Some might find this interesting, which is about flying through my local airport during the pandemic and why he would not recommend it.
Last edited by LTNman; 28th Nov 2020 at 14:16.
Paxing All Over The World
Normally, vaccines have a 10+ years of testing in order to check all the things people are worried about, such as still being able to infect others, unexpected side effects, conflicts with other medications and how long the protection lasts. But (almost everyone) agrees that the problem is so great that proceeding now is the least worst option.
With some 1.5 million dead already and countless people now with life-long health complications that are not yet understood, people can decide to stay home or get vaccinated.
With some 1.5 million dead already and countless people now with life-long health complications that are not yet understood, people can decide to stay home or get vaccinated.
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Paxboy sums it up nicely. Today I have just had my 5th holiday or mini break cancelled so no holiday for Christmas this year. For many people that would be the least of their problems. I would love to see an alternative to a vaccine for a return to a normal life but the brutal truth is that there isn’t one.
As for not staying at home, any suggestions what I can do next weekend, as all my normal haunts are remaining closed, which is a real bummer.
As for not staying at home, any suggestions what I can do next weekend, as all my normal haunts are remaining closed, which is a real bummer.
Last edited by LTNman; 28th Nov 2020 at 13:51.
Thread Starter
Normally, vaccines have a 10+ years of testing in order to check all the things people are worried about, such as still being able to infect others, unexpected side effects, conflicts with other medications and how long the protection lasts. But (almost everyone) agrees that the problem is so great that proceeding now is the least worst option.
With some 1.5 million dead already and countless people now with life-long health complications that are not yet understood, people can decide to stay home or get vaccinated.
With some 1.5 million dead already and countless people now with life-long health complications that are not yet understood, people can decide to stay home or get vaccinated.
But have confidence because we tell you so.
Strange that the same criteria and questioning is not being applied to the Russian vaccine where automatically western media claiming data is false.
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I hear what you are saying racedo but you never tell us your solution for the coming years. Do you think it will just die out next year without a vaccine or do we just go back to a normal life now with all the consequences or is the virus fake?
Last edited by LTNman; 28th Nov 2020 at 14:17.
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Good for you 96er all are mightily impressed...sounds obviously you have no social contract within your own bubble of unawareness.
Hardly a child of the fifties/sixties you sound a child of the eighties which descriptively I may add has nothing to do with your age.
Hardly a child of the fifties/sixties you sound a child of the eighties which descriptively I may add has nothing to do with your age.
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Good for you 96er all are mightily impressed...sounds obviously you have no social contract within your own bubble of unawareness.
Hardly a child of the fifties/sixties you sound a child of the eighties which descriptively I may add has nothing to do with your age.
Hardly a child of the fifties/sixties you sound a child of the eighties which descriptively I may add has nothing to do with your age.
The first statement is really just follows your usual derogatory dispersions, so I won’t bother.
The second statement is a correct assumption, I am a child of the 80’s, however, I’ll be lucky to have a job in the next few months as a direct consequence of this, so I’d say it has everything to do with my age group and every other age group who’s financially effected. Suppose I could just get another job eh !
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Every age group is financially affected or will be of course as is every member of society in other v important ways too which was more of my point.
The only way out of this complete miasma is for all regardless of status to work together in & for society for all to achieve ultimately better outcomes for their lives & families lives.
A sick society works badly for virtually all...a healthy society is a successful society after all.
Whilst expressing regret concerning your own predicament if it is within obviously the industry there will be no one here who has not experienced job loss within it I venture...albeit at far greater scale with this particular shock of course.
The only way out of this complete miasma is for all regardless of status to work together in & for society for all to achieve ultimately better outcomes for their lives & families lives.
A sick society works badly for virtually all...a healthy society is a successful society after all.
Whilst expressing regret concerning your own predicament if it is within obviously the industry there will be no one here who has not experienced job loss within it I venture...albeit at far greater scale with this particular shock of course.
Thread Starter
How do I know this ? Well, history is the judge of this where pandemic eventually have nobody else to infect so it happens naturally. Mother Nature is the world's greatest killer and always will be.
Greater pandemics of before burnt themselves out BUT there was a longer gestation period as travel was slow. Black Death took 5-10 years to get to Europe across the Steppes and the initial virus mutated many many times to survive. The difference now is virus can be around the world in 80 hours so it mutates a lot more which is its weakness..
Covid-19 was definitely in Italy last year as analysis of samples have shown, likely in India as well and probably a few more places. Possibly it was part of 2018-19 flu season but unless people go back and test samples people will not know.
It is likely the next potential pandemics infection is already out there, it may die before it gets a chance to find a vulnerable host to carry it elsewhere or may just die out.
Spanish Influenza was worse in terms of deaths and people numbers, people survived that. Today for me is 102 anniversary of Great Grandfather dying due to this but it didn't stop my Great Grand mother living for another 30 plus years.
It is up to individuals to decide if they wish to live a life or to live in fear. Clearly some are clinging desperately for a panacea of a vaccine like an alcoholic hoping that the next drink will cure him.
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1. The Black Death was a bacterium, not a virus.
2. A virus related to Covid19 may have been around last year. The spread pattern round the world clearly shows that the pandemic strain arose in China
3 The vast majority of deaths associated with Spanish flu were from secondary infections by the sort of bacteria that would now be controlled by antibiotics. So the death rate can't be compared with that of Covid19.
2. A virus related to Covid19 may have been around last year. The spread pattern round the world clearly shows that the pandemic strain arose in China
3 The vast majority of deaths associated with Spanish flu were from secondary infections by the sort of bacteria that would now be controlled by antibiotics. So the death rate can't be compared with that of Covid19.