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Stobart Air-2

Old 14th Nov 2018, 11:17
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Not even if they can pick it up for a song, cherry-pick the good bits and then operate it as a BA franchise (for which there is now a precedent)?
What precedent? Aren't BA moving away from the franchise model, having just a couple of legacy contracts left?
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Old 14th Nov 2018, 11:25
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Think that by precedent they were meaning that BA are contracting STK under wet lease for two x E90s at LCY.

Totally different to a huge domestic operation as a franchise.

However bot not without merit.

BE could well turn into a kind of uk one world feeder airline, MAN, DUB etc for QR, AA, CX etc

cs
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Old 14th Nov 2018, 14:20
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The ACMI contract that Stobart Air have with BACF for the operation of two E190s is one thing, a BA/Stobart Air franchise would be totally different and most unlikely in my opinion.
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Old 14th Nov 2018, 14:57
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a BA/Stobart Air franchise would be totally different
You're right, I'm forgetting the difference between an ACMI Contract and a franchise.

Having said that, I still think a BA-branded franchise regional operation would go down well at the likes of SOU, BHX, MAN, CWL, EXT, EDI and GLA. Ops would obviously need to be de-conflicted with CFE at LCY.
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Old 14th Nov 2018, 15:07
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Originally Posted by rowly6339
FlyBe up for sale/merger with Stobart being touted as possible buyer. Don't see how it would be beneficial as Stobart don't have the time or money to turn the business around, just my opinion of course but would love to hear other opinions on the issue.
It was a bad idea then and a worse one now. Why weigh yourself down with a failing business when you have issues of your own to sort out?

(You do wonder if Flybe might be regretting rebuffing Stobart's previous overtures?)
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Old 14th Nov 2018, 15:48
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Cannot see Stobart being daft enough tto buy a lemon like flybe TBH
Flybe missed a-trick earlier this year for sure, Just another example of poor decision making thats plauged them since COW took the helm
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Old 14th Nov 2018, 19:39
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Does anyone know when Stibart are planning to take delivery of the first E90 to be leased to BACF. I am guessing it is delayed as some of the flights it was meant to operate from later this week are now showing as operated by a BACF E-jer or a RJ85, which I am guessing is being leased from Jota.
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Old 15th Nov 2018, 12:00
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Originally Posted by Brigantee
Cannot see Stobart being daft enough tto buy a lemon like flybe TBH
Flybe missed a-trick earlier this year for sure, Just another example of poor decision making thats plauged them since COW took the helm
Stobart has a major problem. If Flybe cease trading, then exactly how will flights on the franchise routes be sold? Even if the administrators allowed trading to continue for a period, the damage to the Flybe brand would in turn damage Stobart with people unwilling to book flights, no matter what reassurance they were offered.

They must have a plan.
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Old 15th Nov 2018, 12:12
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Originally Posted by BAladdy
Does anyone know when Stibart are planning to take delivery of the first E90 to be leased to BACF. I am guessing it is delayed as some of the flights it was meant to operate from later this week are now showing as operated by a BACF E-jer or a RJ85, which I am guessing is being leased from Jota.
It's reported this morning on a f/b forum that EI-GHK is due to arrive at SEN later today.

Last edited by Expressflight; 16th Nov 2018 at 06:54.
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Old 15th Nov 2018, 12:54
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DC3 Dave - they would have to either fast track their own Stobart Air site or use that of a partner, Loganair?

As I see it the ONlY advantages Stobart would have in a take over of Flybe would be overall size for improved negotiating power & consolidation of London routes to remove competition but that’s about it.

But like I said on another post Staobart Air have lost £38m in 6 months. They are clearly MORE loss making than Flybe. How would buying Flybe help them? And what exactly would Stobart management do differently to turn fortunes around?
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Old 15th Nov 2018, 16:56
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I'm not sure you can look at Stobart in this way. Sure they lost a load of money on their flying but to me, there was clearly an ulterior motive.

They own the airport and so launching flights was an investment to prove that a market exists to attract the likes of Ryanair and probably others. This will significantly increase the revenue at the airport (all of which flows to Stobart) and at the same time increases the value of the airport itself. In a few years time the 38m 'investment' could produce them a very healthy return.
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Old 15th Nov 2018, 17:24
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Stobart should be making money on the Aer Lingus and BA branded flying. The ATR routes from SEN also thought to be ok. It’s the 195s that are propurted to be the main source of losses. Interesting that many of the routes they currently fly on are being taken over by FR and U2. Makes me wonder if the 195 makes any sense at all as a P2P aircraft.
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Old 15th Nov 2018, 22:29
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It was (is) the three 195s they operate out of SEN which cause serious problems and have in part caused reputations damage to Stobart and indeed Flybe. They need to either go altogether or replace with more reliable airframes. A redundant argument now as Flybe edges closer to a point of no return and it's ultimate potential administration and possible asset fire sale. Even if Stobart in their devine wisdom make a rash business decision to acquire Flybe, the fact those three fault ridden 195s remain in the fleet will result in extended negative impacts to Stobart and indirectly SEN too. Best dispose of those leases and the aircraft's in question.
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Old 15th Nov 2018, 22:46
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I wasn’t aware that flybe forced the 3 E95 frames on STK

Stobart aren’t blameless over the issues with reliability at SEN, far from it

cs
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Old 16th Nov 2018, 06:53
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Originally Posted by cornishsimon
Stobart aren’t blameless over the issues with reliability at SEN, far from it.
Not completely no, but the poor serviceability record of the E195s (one in particular) that Flybe leased to Stobart was the main problem as I know to my cost. The one Stobart E195, EI-GGC, that has operated latterly at SEN has proven much more reliable.

Incidentally the first Stobart E190 is due into SEN this afternoon, its departure from the USA being delayed until this morning.
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Old 16th Nov 2018, 07:00
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Duplicate post.
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Old 16th Nov 2018, 07:02
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I believe Stobart actually bought the 195s, so the leases shouldn’t be onorous going forward. They are wet-leasing the 195s from flyBe currently. Which is probably pricey and real cash flowing out of the business. I think it took longer than planned to get the 195s operational.

Stobart would likely be interested in the 6 ATRs that flyBe operate for SAS, they could probably buy that without the rest of the airline.
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Old 16th Nov 2018, 07:26
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I must say the E195s were and are more reliable under Flybe’s full ownership. It only seems to be since they went to SEN. Either sensitive crew new to each warning light (quite common with new aircraft types before anyone jumps out their chair in rage) or simply lacking line engineers to the same standards that Flybe had at their stations? Just a thought
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Old 16th Nov 2018, 07:29
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“Warning lights” .....😂love it
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Old 16th Nov 2018, 08:10
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Originally Posted by Cloud1
I must say the E195s were and are more reliable under Flybe’s full ownership. It only seems to be since they went to SEN. Either sensitive crew new to each warning light (quite common with new aircraft types before anyone jumps out their chair in rage) or simply lacking line engineers to the same standards that Flybe had at their stations? Just a thought
Unlikely. As stated upthread, initially 3, but now 2 aircraft are operated by flyBe. They are responsible for line maintenance at SEN for the G- registered aircraft. As you say, line maintenance at SEN may be unfamiliar with the aircraft - they are much less common than 737/320s. As experience improves, so should performance.
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