Aer Lingus - 5
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Not involved in this in any way but the only thing I would say is I recently finished work for a heavily unionised company in the same vein as EI and regardless of the ins and outs of the issues, if the CEO had sent individual letters to staff homes in the manner and tone EI did, there would probably have been a similar and probably stronger response from the employees. Mannion was on an RTE program last night and his defence of the letter was that the unions had given vague details of the possible strike action and he wanted the employees to clarify their own position . Now that vagueness may be true but if there is a union agreement in place in the company AND there are "negotiations" underway then you follow the rules..you go back to the unions..thats what the employees have put them there to do..represent on their behalf.
I'm not a fan of unions really, they never served me well but if they have a presence in a company you work under the terms of the agreement not sidestep them when you feel like it. In the long run though i suppose that move will be judged on who wins out..
just my opinion
I'm not a fan of unions really, they never served me well but if they have a presence in a company you work under the terms of the agreement not sidestep them when you feel like it. In the long run though i suppose that move will be judged on who wins out..
just my opinion
Interesting and depressing stuff: In defence of unions and in criticism of management writing directly to employees vkid says: ".. if there is a union agreement in place in the company AND there are "negotiations" underway then you follow the rules..you go back to the unions ... thats what the employees have put them there to do ... represent on their behalf..." . Which is sort of OK by me.
But then we have missterrible who I fear represents a widespread view in Aer Lingus when she says: "Would you believe that most staff are disappointed that the union officials even speak to Mannion and Liz? They are deeply suspicious of full time officials trying to deal behind their backs..."
So one objects to direct communication from management which bypasses the union officials and the other doesn’t trust the union officials to represent her. Which only confirms my view that Aer Lingus is doomed: it has not shed its state-monopoly ethos and will not survive in the real world, which is (like it or not) highly competitive.
But then we have missterrible who I fear represents a widespread view in Aer Lingus when she says: "Would you believe that most staff are disappointed that the union officials even speak to Mannion and Liz? They are deeply suspicious of full time officials trying to deal behind their backs..."
So one objects to direct communication from management which bypasses the union officials and the other doesn’t trust the union officials to represent her. Which only confirms my view that Aer Lingus is doomed: it has not shed its state-monopoly ethos and will not survive in the real world, which is (like it or not) highly competitive.
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Strike likely to be called off ...
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EI longhaul
Hi,
I'm new to the forum
My question is: will EI'S suspension of DXB prevent them from expanding into SE Asia and Australia. With a daily EK service it is unlikely that they will resume the route at a later date
I'm new to the forum
My question is: will EI'S suspension of DXB prevent them from expanding into SE Asia and Australia. With a daily EK service it is unlikely that they will resume the route at a later date
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Hi Avair and welcome on board!
There is actually a dedicated EI forum (you might have to go back a page or two), but to answer your question, I think - unfortunately - that it's very likely to set EI back.
I think that not giving DXB its best shot was a major strategic error by EI and particularly disappointing that someone with DM's background (ex-EK) should have known the importance of a good product, interlining, marketing and scheduling, none of which they really got right. I hate to have to say that, because I really did hope EI would do well on that route; it certainly could have, if it gave DXB its best shot.
EK hasn't yet confirmed DUB (but many expect it will), but if it does, you can say goodbye to any prospect of EI coming back on the route. EK will grow it very aggressively and of course, that will make it more difficult - but certainly not impossible for EI to get onto new routes to Asia. BKK and China have been mentioned; really, they are limited by the range of the 332 (the new one, 'DUO, gives them a bit more range). However, before they decide which route to operate, the basic question they need to ask themselves is, "are we serious about this?", followed by "what lessons can be learned from the failure of DXB?"
With slowdown expected in the US, but continued growth in Asia, it might not be the best time for EI to put all of its eggs in the US/North American basket.
There is actually a dedicated EI forum (you might have to go back a page or two), but to answer your question, I think - unfortunately - that it's very likely to set EI back.
I think that not giving DXB its best shot was a major strategic error by EI and particularly disappointing that someone with DM's background (ex-EK) should have known the importance of a good product, interlining, marketing and scheduling, none of which they really got right. I hate to have to say that, because I really did hope EI would do well on that route; it certainly could have, if it gave DXB its best shot.
EK hasn't yet confirmed DUB (but many expect it will), but if it does, you can say goodbye to any prospect of EI coming back on the route. EK will grow it very aggressively and of course, that will make it more difficult - but certainly not impossible for EI to get onto new routes to Asia. BKK and China have been mentioned; really, they are limited by the range of the 332 (the new one, 'DUO, gives them a bit more range). However, before they decide which route to operate, the basic question they need to ask themselves is, "are we serious about this?", followed by "what lessons can be learned from the failure of DXB?"
With slowdown expected in the US, but continued growth in Asia, it might not be the best time for EI to put all of its eggs in the US/North American basket.
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EI fleet expansion
Does anyone know how many A320s are still to be delivered to EI? Can these options change to A321s. Are there any chance of A318s? They could do with restarting EI Commuter and run it as a seperate entity
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avair
keep an eye on Jethros for EI fleet news - there's a note at the end about options:
http://www.jethros.i12.com/fleets/fl...aer_lingus.htm
A320 series options are usually convertible but once they become orders it's probably trickier. Given the current pile-em-high-sell-em-cheap mentality WW bequeathed to Mannion, I suspect you have a chance of seeing more A321s for LHR and nearby bucket and spade routes but not A318s.
keep an eye on Jethros for EI fleet news - there's a note at the end about options:
http://www.jethros.i12.com/fleets/fl...aer_lingus.htm
A320 series options are usually convertible but once they become orders it's probably trickier. Given the current pile-em-high-sell-em-cheap mentality WW bequeathed to Mannion, I suspect you have a chance of seeing more A321s for LHR and nearby bucket and spade routes but not A318s.
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I agree with EI-RB on this; the A318 just wouldn't be suitable (although I've often thought that 319s would be, particularly on some less travelled routes); however, I am very pleased to see movement towards co-operation between EI and RE; I think there is huge scope for this; there are many destinations in the UK and Europe which are too big for A320s (or at least at a decent frequency); by bringing E-jets in and interlining with EI, the two carriers can create an effective hub at DUB.
Also, as Mark says, Jethros is a very useful resource.
Also, as Mark says, Jethros is a very useful resource.
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You have to wonder about the future (although not just for EI) but unfolding events in the stock market, poor Dollar, oil prices etc..would really make you think how much of EI's growth plan will ever be achieved. Even looking at EI shares price it is currently around the 1.93 EU mark which is 30c approx lower than its launch..would not really make investors too happy...add the labour issues that seem to dog the airline..how much of the talk will ever be achieved..
On one hand they are trying to compete in Europe (with mainly Ryanair) which is a difficult one to do and then on the other hand they are trying to grow long haul services with a different level of service (ie not lo-cost) and mainly to a slightly dodgy US market....add the level of dependence and interaction of the Irish economy with the US..the apparent tightening of credit from the financial institutions...are things looking as rosy as DM and co once thought they were??
How much of this planned growth can actually be achieved in a possibly very turbulent economic market coming up in future years..
A lot of if's and buts...but any thoughts?
On one hand they are trying to compete in Europe (with mainly Ryanair) which is a difficult one to do and then on the other hand they are trying to grow long haul services with a different level of service (ie not lo-cost) and mainly to a slightly dodgy US market....add the level of dependence and interaction of the Irish economy with the US..the apparent tightening of credit from the financial institutions...are things looking as rosy as DM and co once thought they were??
How much of this planned growth can actually be achieved in a possibly very turbulent economic market coming up in future years..
A lot of if's and buts...but any thoughts?
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VKID says - 'You have to wonder about the future (although not just for EI) but unfolding events in the stock market, poor Dollar, oil prices etc..would really make you think how much of EI's growth plan will ever be achieved. Even looking at EI shares price it is currently around the 1.93 EU mark which is 30c approx lower than its launch..would not really make investors too happy...add the labour issues that seem to dog the airline..how much of the talk will ever be achieved..'
I agree with you VKID.
The Unions, Staff and Management have to come together and agree, and not delay, whatever changes in work practices etc are necessary and ensure the viability and profitability of AL.
It wont be easy but the continuing threats of stoppages will surely ensure the early demise of AL.
You don't believe me?
Swiss Air, Sabena and ????
HB
I agree with you VKID.
The Unions, Staff and Management have to come together and agree, and not delay, whatever changes in work practices etc are necessary and ensure the viability and profitability of AL.
It wont be easy but the continuing threats of stoppages will surely ensure the early demise of AL.
You don't believe me?
Swiss Air, Sabena and ????
HB
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EI at LGW
Just a little tidbit for you all.
Noticed recently LGW-DUB loads seem light. They were fine the first few says at 130-150ish, down now to an (estimated) average of around 70-100.
Early days I suppose but not hugely encouraging if it continues like this.
Noticed recently LGW-DUB loads seem light. They were fine the first few says at 130-150ish, down now to an (estimated) average of around 70-100.
Early days I suppose but not hugely encouraging if it continues like this.
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The effects of the 'strike'?
I was on an EI flight from Amsterdam to Cork last night. 95 passengers on an A320 or a 55% load.
Exactly the same flight last week was 80% full.
Yesterday wasn't even one of the days where there was a stoppage proposed.
Given that I can't think of any other reason for the number of fewer passengers other than uncertainty over return flights etc., has anyone seen a similar pattern on other routes?
If so, how much money is likely to have been lost through the strike that wasn't?
I was on an EI flight from Amsterdam to Cork last night. 95 passengers on an A320 or a 55% load.
Exactly the same flight last week was 80% full.
Yesterday wasn't even one of the days where there was a stoppage proposed.
Given that I can't think of any other reason for the number of fewer passengers other than uncertainty over return flights etc., has anyone seen a similar pattern on other routes?
If so, how much money is likely to have been lost through the strike that wasn't?
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Just a little tidbit for you all.
Noticed recently LGW-DUB loads seem light. They were fine the first few says at 130-150ish, down now to an (estimated) average of around 70-100.
Early days I suppose but not hugely encouraging if it continues like this.
Noticed recently LGW-DUB loads seem light. They were fine the first few says at 130-150ish, down now to an (estimated) average of around 70-100.
Early days I suppose but not hugely encouraging if it continues like this.