Aer Lingus - 5
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The Irish Sunday Business Post suggests the new route LHR-BFS will start as a loss-making one.
Aer Lingus sells just one third of Belfast seats
Aer Lingus has sold an average of just one third of its seats on the controversial new Belfast to London Heathrow route for the first month of its operation. The service begins tomorrow, as the Shannon-Heathrow route ends.
A total of 32,364 seats are available on the return route for the first month, with three 174-seat aircraft flying three return trips daily. With an average load factor of just 35 per cent, it means only 11,327 of these flights have been sold to date - despite being available online since early August last.
Many Aer Lingus return flights from Heathrow to Belfast Aldergrove for the first month of service cost stg£1, and £1 fares can also be secured from Belfast to Heathrow for this period. These fares and a 35 per cent load factor compare with an average load factor of almost 80 per cent - and €80 one-way flights - on the axed Shannon-Heathrow route.
Aer Lingus has sold an average of just one third of its seats on the controversial new Belfast to London Heathrow route for the first month of its operation. The service begins tomorrow, as the Shannon-Heathrow route ends.
A total of 32,364 seats are available on the return route for the first month, with three 174-seat aircraft flying three return trips daily. With an average load factor of just 35 per cent, it means only 11,327 of these flights have been sold to date - despite being available online since early August last.
Many Aer Lingus return flights from Heathrow to Belfast Aldergrove for the first month of service cost stg£1, and £1 fares can also be secured from Belfast to Heathrow for this period. These fares and a 35 per cent load factor compare with an average load factor of almost 80 per cent - and €80 one-way flights - on the axed Shannon-Heathrow route.
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CAPT J - I have heard that EI will now stay in T1, where they are currently, rather than move to T3. This will in fact make life easier for passengers travelling to Ireland as all flights will still depart from one terminal.
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Why anyone thinks there is money to be made out of LHRBFS is beyond me. The market will not bear any sort of economically viable fare. BA used to lose around £5-6 million a year on this route but due to the political sensitivities decided that they had to operate it until more recent times.
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Maybe its an easy way to sell off/lease out the slots. If BFS/LHR does not work then they can sell the slots without too much fuss. Imagine if they tried to sell the slots straight from the SNN-LHR route?
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Aer Lingus prepares for new route
2 hours ago
Aer Lingus is preparing for the launch of its new service between Belfast and Heathrow.
The three times a day service, due to begin on Monday, is to use landing slots at the main London airport which the airline controversially decided to switch to the Belfast route by scrapping long standing services from Shannon.
There was consternation in the Mid-West when Aer Lingus announced it was shutting the route and moving across the border. Politicians and businessmen in the Shannon area said the move would hit both business and tourism but the airline said it had made a commercial decision which would be proved right.
2 hours ago
Aer Lingus is preparing for the launch of its new service between Belfast and Heathrow.
The three times a day service, due to begin on Monday, is to use landing slots at the main London airport which the airline controversially decided to switch to the Belfast route by scrapping long standing services from Shannon.
There was consternation in the Mid-West when Aer Lingus announced it was shutting the route and moving across the border. Politicians and businessmen in the Shannon area said the move would hit both business and tourism but the airline said it had made a commercial decision which would be proved right.
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TartinTon: BA's losses were partially due to its status as a feed for LHR long haul, to which the Waterworld beancounters assigned all but a token percentage of the fare paid. EI's codeshare agreement is likely to see them receive a far higher fare per seat on BA connections than the old BA route ever did, plus their full O&D revenue. Given the EI slashing and burning one would assume their costs to be lower than the bloated BA overhead of the prior times.
That doesn't mean the route can't lose money, but it won't be for the artificial reason the old one did if in the long run they attract a similar load factor.
That doesn't mean the route can't lose money, but it won't be for the artificial reason the old one did if in the long run they attract a similar load factor.
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BFS
EI really need to get out there and push Heathrow/BFS as much as possible. My fear is that the public dont know enough about Aer Lingus' operation here. Yes theyve had a marketing campaign but thats easily noticed by aviation enthusiats, not the general public. Also, a change in the other routes is badly needed. Why no flights to Germany and interlink with LH? That one is beyond me. EI have the potenial to feed into Europes major airlines from BFS as no-one else does so, a connection with Iberia at Madrid could also have been much better than jumping on the Barcelona route with not one but TWO other carriers. I may be wrong and the original routes may survive, and i hope i am wrong, but if the initial figures arent pulling their weight, i hope EI have the confidence and clout to re think their BFS strategy.
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Can't see them going back on SNN-LHR even if BFS doesn't work. Bear in mind that this time of the year is always difficult even for existing carriers. I'd say Aerlingus will give it at least a Summer season.
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"there is also the thorny issue of a large percentage of the population of NI will never darken the cabin of an AL airplane due political reasons."
That is certainly a valid concern, but unionist politicians - chief amongst them Jeffrey Donaldson - have been very strong in encouraging EI to come to NI, so one hopes they will follow this up with support where it's needed.
Incidentally, can anyone tell me how many A320s EI is adding for the coming Summer season?
And finally ... DM spoke before Christmas about the possibility of the s/h fleet growing to above the 42 units initially predicted and said there'd be a new fleet plan coming in the near future; anyone know when that might be?
That is certainly a valid concern, but unionist politicians - chief amongst them Jeffrey Donaldson - have been very strong in encouraging EI to come to NI, so one hopes they will follow this up with support where it's needed.
Incidentally, can anyone tell me how many A320s EI is adding for the coming Summer season?
And finally ... DM spoke before Christmas about the possibility of the s/h fleet growing to above the 42 units initially predicted and said there'd be a new fleet plan coming in the near future; anyone know when that might be?
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EI on LHR BFS
Aer Lingus may have light bookings for the coming month but lets bear a few things in mind...
1 Its the low season, Jan is usually the softest month.
2 The bookings will be stronger when the service gets off the ground
3 The level of advance bookings or level of fares does not matter at this stage, the first few months will be accepted as a time to develop the route. Management will see it as an investment.
As regards a comment that how will EI make money as BA lost a fortune, it was no wonder BA lost so much money at that time. This was pre cost cutting. BA wouldnt lose money if they did it now. THey have done great work on their cost base since the BFS LHR route operated in 2001.
In addition, THe super shuttle service on the route guarnteed everyone a seat, in the 1990s, if a 757 was full and 10 more people turned up for it they would put on a back up aircraft, perhaps a B11 or a 73S. That was costly.
When BA operated BFS LHR airlines had not realised that the conventional thinking of the airline business was changing or going to change, ie cost cutting was not a high priority then but now its the name of the game.
Bmi will get a good run for there money i think that they will see their BHD LHR numbers drop from 50ks to prob 43k in the first month then with small decline until it reaches the 37k pax per month from the city the other numbers that EI get will come from Leisure pax on all 3 EASY BFS london services. What does anyone else think.
well lets say that out of the 29230 seats available per month by Aer Lingus achieves a 40% occupancy that almost 12k pax...
what do you all think.. who will sacrifice these numbers? and how much will the market grow???
1 Its the low season, Jan is usually the softest month.
2 The bookings will be stronger when the service gets off the ground
3 The level of advance bookings or level of fares does not matter at this stage, the first few months will be accepted as a time to develop the route. Management will see it as an investment.
As regards a comment that how will EI make money as BA lost a fortune, it was no wonder BA lost so much money at that time. This was pre cost cutting. BA wouldnt lose money if they did it now. THey have done great work on their cost base since the BFS LHR route operated in 2001.
In addition, THe super shuttle service on the route guarnteed everyone a seat, in the 1990s, if a 757 was full and 10 more people turned up for it they would put on a back up aircraft, perhaps a B11 or a 73S. That was costly.
When BA operated BFS LHR airlines had not realised that the conventional thinking of the airline business was changing or going to change, ie cost cutting was not a high priority then but now its the name of the game.
Bmi will get a good run for there money i think that they will see their BHD LHR numbers drop from 50ks to prob 43k in the first month then with small decline until it reaches the 37k pax per month from the city the other numbers that EI get will come from Leisure pax on all 3 EASY BFS london services. What does anyone else think.
well lets say that out of the 29230 seats available per month by Aer Lingus achieves a 40% occupancy that almost 12k pax...
what do you all think.. who will sacrifice these numbers? and how much will the market grow???
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On the issue above of Aer Lingus going back to Cardiff I would very much doubt it.
From their website the Newcastle route is gone for the Summer and this is exactly what happened on the routes they started again to Liverpool and Bristol. They seem to start with a daily service during the winter and then cut it say to 5 per week for the Summer to fit in a few Jersey flights or something like that and then by the following Summer it's gone.
They seem to just use the outside London UK routes to fill in the Winter schedule as Manchester, Birmingham, Glasgow and Edinburgh all have higher frequencies in winter than summer when you would think it would be the opposite. Edinburugh goes from a morning and evening service in winter to a lunchtime service in summer - can't be good for getting business passengers who must all use Ryanair. Glasgow goes from a 2.5 daily service including early morning and evening services in winter to just twice per day in summer with a 0930 departure from Dublin thereby taking out the possibilty of connecting to the US routes.
From their website the Newcastle route is gone for the Summer and this is exactly what happened on the routes they started again to Liverpool and Bristol. They seem to start with a daily service during the winter and then cut it say to 5 per week for the Summer to fit in a few Jersey flights or something like that and then by the following Summer it's gone.
They seem to just use the outside London UK routes to fill in the Winter schedule as Manchester, Birmingham, Glasgow and Edinburgh all have higher frequencies in winter than summer when you would think it would be the opposite. Edinburugh goes from a morning and evening service in winter to a lunchtime service in summer - can't be good for getting business passengers who must all use Ryanair. Glasgow goes from a 2.5 daily service including early morning and evening services in winter to just twice per day in summer with a 0930 departure from Dublin thereby taking out the possibilty of connecting to the US routes.
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I would have to say FR and STN.
EZY have a MAJOR presence on the BFS-LON route by serving 3 of the 5 major airports in the city atleast 3x daily
BMI and EI have the link to LHR which will make connecting much easier for passengers who may have had to go BFS-MAN-LHR-US etc.
AF/KL have their MASSIVE brand with unlimited funds to fight through the 'bloodbath' while serving the major business gateway into the World City.
What do FR have...cheap fares to an airport 'outside of town.' I do think the route will work, just not 4x daily like it is now. EZY already serve the airport, wouldn't be surprised to see either EZY drop STN and increase LGW or FR reduce their STN to maybe 2x daily?
What do other people think? Somebody is going to lose, just who?
EZY have a MAJOR presence on the BFS-LON route by serving 3 of the 5 major airports in the city atleast 3x daily
BMI and EI have the link to LHR which will make connecting much easier for passengers who may have had to go BFS-MAN-LHR-US etc.
AF/KL have their MASSIVE brand with unlimited funds to fight through the 'bloodbath' while serving the major business gateway into the World City.
What do FR have...cheap fares to an airport 'outside of town.' I do think the route will work, just not 4x daily like it is now. EZY already serve the airport, wouldn't be surprised to see either EZY drop STN and increase LGW or FR reduce their STN to maybe 2x daily?
What do other people think? Somebody is going to lose, just who?
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MUFC
THanks for your feedback,
however, Ryanair will be standing last. I agree that EZY might shift capacity from STN to LGW route. EAch of the three has had x5 daily to date. I think LTN will go to 4 and STN to 3.
LGW will go to 6 at least.
BE will then lose pax i would say...
But the CAA stats wil tell the tale in a few months and i dare say the Summer timetables!!!
however, Ryanair will be standing last. I agree that EZY might shift capacity from STN to LGW route. EAch of the three has had x5 daily to date. I think LTN will go to 4 and STN to 3.
LGW will go to 6 at least.
BE will then lose pax i would say...
But the CAA stats wil tell the tale in a few months and i dare say the Summer timetables!!!
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STN was always a weak yield..ask Flybe. They used to do it from BHD. EZY have already increased the BFS-LGW...new earlier departure from BFS. I would tend to agree that the STN frequency will reduce.
I don't think EI will make much of an impression on BMI until they get their timetable sorted out. Even then, BMI have something that EI don't.. business class and a fairly busy one at that. Nice little earner at £400rtn for a 50min flight. Passengers who fly BMI biz class won't be switching to EI Low Cost. That will leave BMI in a good position to do some 'competing'
I don't think EI will make much of an impression on BMI until they get their timetable sorted out. Even then, BMI have something that EI don't.. business class and a fairly busy one at that. Nice little earner at £400rtn for a 50min flight. Passengers who fly BMI biz class won't be switching to EI Low Cost. That will leave BMI in a good position to do some 'competing'
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Thanks KiloMIke.
Well six of one and half a dozen of the other. Its handy in that way unless you are connecting. I suppose it might be no worse than connecting from terminal 4. You can walk from terminal 3, how the T5-T1 connect pans out, we have yet to experience!
EI LHR-BFS
Far, far too early to call on this one. Market is extremely soft at the minute even business travel is light. Nobody has any money.
Looking ahead, trying to book some summer holiday flights, I find EI is actually more expensive than bmi. Looking back at previous years, bmi does not seem to have reduced prices this year.
But it was all academic since I can't be sure to connect from T3 to T1 so we will have to stay in London and flay easyjet bact to BFS, saving £75 on the airfare. (We have accomodation in London)
Anyway I do wish EI well and so do the vast majority on NI passengers.
Well six of one and half a dozen of the other. Its handy in that way unless you are connecting. I suppose it might be no worse than connecting from terminal 4. You can walk from terminal 3, how the T5-T1 connect pans out, we have yet to experience!
EI LHR-BFS
Far, far too early to call on this one. Market is extremely soft at the minute even business travel is light. Nobody has any money.
Looking ahead, trying to book some summer holiday flights, I find EI is actually more expensive than bmi. Looking back at previous years, bmi does not seem to have reduced prices this year.
But it was all academic since I can't be sure to connect from T3 to T1 so we will have to stay in London and flay easyjet bact to BFS, saving £75 on the airfare. (We have accomodation in London)
Anyway I do wish EI well and so do the vast majority on NI passengers.
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The article is dumb because they're comparing past load factor with pre-sold flights. Apples and Oranges.
In the next month, I need to fly ORK-AMS twice, to London once and get to Brussels (although I'll probably use the train down when I'm in Holland). Only one of those is booked so far. Short-haul flights, particularly business short-haul flights are often booked late because arrangements haven't firmed up yet.
In the next month, I need to fly ORK-AMS twice, to London once and get to Brussels (although I'll probably use the train down when I'm in Holland). Only one of those is booked so far. Short-haul flights, particularly business short-haul flights are often booked late because arrangements haven't firmed up yet.
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BMI C cabin is hardly ever full on BHD-LHR. In the last 4 flights I have done early a.m. ex BHD late p.m. LHR the average number has been six.
I for one will be using Ei when possible. Lounge access BFS via Amex Plat, LHR via BA Gold, pre- bookable seats(same seat pitch), so only difference is the bento box and free drinks (300 pound fare difference). Only problem for ordinary passengers is the lack of an accessible pay as you go lounge at LHR. This most probably will change after March.
I for one will be using Ei when possible. Lounge access BFS via Amex Plat, LHR via BA Gold, pre- bookable seats(same seat pitch), so only difference is the bento box and free drinks (300 pound fare difference). Only problem for ordinary passengers is the lack of an accessible pay as you go lounge at LHR. This most probably will change after March.
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Belfast off to a bad start
Not the start they were looking for
http://www.independent.ie/national-n...s-1274727.html
Jet Blue link...
http://www.independent.ie/national-n...f-1274728.html
http://www.independent.ie/national-n...s-1274727.html
Jet Blue link...
http://www.independent.ie/national-n...f-1274728.html