BIRMINGHAM - 4
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BHX Hangars
Years back Qualitair were going to build a 3 bay 747-400 Maintenance facility at BHX just behind where the old hangar 3 used to be.I remember getting a copy of the initial planning application from Solihull Council.
Airlines mooted to want to use it included Korean, Qantas, Singapore.Sadly though noone wanted to actually pay for it and it was scrapped.
Apart from the Eurojet facility, don't forget BHX has to build an airliner engine test facility, either a hangar or open structure with high sides.This was planned to go close to where the ground radar is positioned now..not sure if that is still the case.
This structure was one of the conditions from Solihull Council before they would approved the runway extension.
Nigel
Airlines mooted to want to use it included Korean, Qantas, Singapore.Sadly though noone wanted to actually pay for it and it was scrapped.
Apart from the Eurojet facility, don't forget BHX has to build an airliner engine test facility, either a hangar or open structure with high sides.This was planned to go close to where the ground radar is positioned now..not sure if that is still the case.
This structure was one of the conditions from Solihull Council before they would approved the runway extension.
Nigel
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Bhx Hangars
Monty GordoMaersk did use hangar 1 IIRC for maintenance.You can see the tail dock on there that was added for the 737's. Nigel OsborneI always wondered how they were going to shoehorn in the hangar with the limited space.Can you imagine how big it would have to be.I was offered an apprenticship with Qualitar at the 'Jumbo Garage' as I remember the press calling it.I cancelled my application with the RAF to remain 'civie'.Oh boy that was a mistake!Yes there were delays,a management buyout and finally a recession that finally scuppered the idea.Other airlines that were mooted, KLM and Mr Branson.The Eurojet hangar could possibly put where the proposed Ryanair single bay facility was going(by the cargo area i think)Oops sorry Call 100 didn't see you there!
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Monty GordoMaersk did use hangar 1 IIRC for maintenance.You can see the tail dock on there that was added for the 737's. Nigel OsborneI always wondered how they were going to shoehorn in the hangar with the limited space.Can you imagine how big it would have to be.I was offered an apprenticship with Qualitar at the 'Jumbo Garage' as I remember the press calling it.I cancelled my application with the RAF to remain 'civie'.Oh boy that was a mistake!Yes there were delays,a management buyout and finally a recession that finally scuppered the idea.Other airlines that were mooted, KLM and Mr Branson.The Eurojet hangar could possibly put where the proposed Ryanair single bay facility was going(by the cargo area i think)Oops sorry Call 100 didn't see you there!
There are plans for the other side of the old short (including the engine run facility), but, I think the cargo area is the more logical position for Eurojet..
I suppose it depends on how big a showroom they want for their sales...
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bmi operated flights for LH
I regularly fly from BHX to FRA and since bmi start operating these flights on behalf of Lufthansa, the 1840 departure has rarely left on time including days when the inbound has arrived on time -scheduled arrival FRA 2110.
Would those in the know advise whether I am being cynical in suspecting that bmi may be doing this deliberately to shorten the time on the ground in FRA? Would FRA increase charges if the bmi flight was on the ground there for over one hour?
The return from FRA seems to get away a few minutes early of the scheduled 2225 which has prompted this thought.
Are my suspicions justified?
Would those in the know advise whether I am being cynical in suspecting that bmi may be doing this deliberately to shorten the time on the ground in FRA? Would FRA increase charges if the bmi flight was on the ground there for over one hour?
The return from FRA seems to get away a few minutes early of the scheduled 2225 which has prompted this thought.
Are my suspicions justified?
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BMI Baby/Frankfurt
I have had a quick scan of the BMI Baby schedule in April and June 2012
and it looks very impressive especially even after Easter where the four
based are fairly active.
Prague and Alicante actually drop frequency in June to accommodate
the Nice and Palma increases.
BHX2FRA
No idea but certainly "slots" could be a consideration on some occasions
at that time. The ground time at Frankfurt is substantial at times compared to say other UK airlines but of course there is little choice when fitting in with
the departure and arrival banks of a hub system. I wonder how the delays are affecting connecting pax outbound on the late FRA long-haul departures?
As a regular, what are loads like on the route now, as this is an incredible increase in the number of seats compared to last year?
This nicely brings me on to the provisional April route analysis figures,
which are missing from the CAA release this week. This is the reply I got
from the CAA: -
Thank you for your recent email.
Due to technical problems being experienced by BAA it is not possible to publish provisional routes tables 12.1 and 12.2 in our release for April 2011 data. We are hopeful that the problem will be rectified in time for our next update of April provisional data Friday 20th May.
Possibly tomorrow then but what is the connection with the BAA to the likes of BHX EMA, BRS, CWL, MAN, LGW etc or are they saying that without the BAA figures there is no point in publishing them? No, I didn't bother to ask
the CAA, which I suppose would have yielded the answer
!!!
Pete
and it looks very impressive especially even after Easter where the four
based are fairly active.
Prague and Alicante actually drop frequency in June to accommodate
the Nice and Palma increases.
BHX2FRA
No idea but certainly "slots" could be a consideration on some occasions
at that time. The ground time at Frankfurt is substantial at times compared to say other UK airlines but of course there is little choice when fitting in with
the departure and arrival banks of a hub system. I wonder how the delays are affecting connecting pax outbound on the late FRA long-haul departures?
As a regular, what are loads like on the route now, as this is an incredible increase in the number of seats compared to last year?
This nicely brings me on to the provisional April route analysis figures,
which are missing from the CAA release this week. This is the reply I got
from the CAA: -
Thank you for your recent email.
Due to technical problems being experienced by BAA it is not possible to publish provisional routes tables 12.1 and 12.2 in our release for April 2011 data. We are hopeful that the problem will be rectified in time for our next update of April provisional data Friday 20th May.
Possibly tomorrow then but what is the connection with the BAA to the likes of BHX EMA, BRS, CWL, MAN, LGW etc or are they saying that without the BAA figures there is no point in publishing them? No, I didn't bother to ask
the CAA, which I suppose would have yielded the answer
!!!Pete
Last edited by OltonPete; 19th May 2011 at 21:03.
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Olton Pete - I was on the 12:35 from FRA on Sunday and it was jam packed. In contrast, I have been on quite a few of the LH operated 09:50 from BHX recently and the loads are usually quite light.
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"Monty GordoMaersk did use hangar 1 IIRC for maintenance.You can see the tail dock on there that was added for the 737's. Nigel OsborneI always wondered how they were going to shoehorn in the hangar with the limited space.Can you imagine how big it would have to be.I was offered an apprenticship with Qualitar at the 'Jumbo Garage' as I remember the press calling it."
Most amazing things about the proposed Qualitair facility was that they proposed burying it 12 feet and then having a 8 degree ramp down to the apron!
Nigel
Most amazing things about the proposed Qualitair facility was that they proposed burying it 12 feet and then having a 8 degree ramp down to the apron!
Nigel
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bmi FRANKFURT
OltonPete -
I have heard a few (but only a few) passengers enquiring of the cabin crew whether they would miss their onward connection. Prior to April when LH operated the flight with an earlier departure time of 1825, the flight was often met in FRA with a variety of buses - some to take passengers direct to their connecting flight to other cities in Germany/Europe. Since April and the later departure time I have not seen this happen - perhaps the later timing of the flight (to allow the same aircraft to operate BHX-FRA-BHX three times a day) has resulted in the loss of these connections.
The current trend of late arrivals means that I often miss my onward train connection and have to spend an additional 1 hour 10 minutes in Frankfurt! This week I was lucky and caught the train with two minutes to spare. I still prefer to risk this rather than take the earlier departure with FlyBe.
I tend to fly the same timings each week (out 1840 in 2225 two days later) so I can't give you a general view on loadings. The flights are not full and I would estimate over 80%. I did travel back on the 1730 Friday timing one week in April when the 319 was in use and this sector was full - but I guess you might expect this at the end of the working week.
I have heard a few (but only a few) passengers enquiring of the cabin crew whether they would miss their onward connection. Prior to April when LH operated the flight with an earlier departure time of 1825, the flight was often met in FRA with a variety of buses - some to take passengers direct to their connecting flight to other cities in Germany/Europe. Since April and the later departure time I have not seen this happen - perhaps the later timing of the flight (to allow the same aircraft to operate BHX-FRA-BHX three times a day) has resulted in the loss of these connections.
The current trend of late arrivals means that I often miss my onward train connection and have to spend an additional 1 hour 10 minutes in Frankfurt! This week I was lucky and caught the train with two minutes to spare. I still prefer to risk this rather than take the earlier departure with FlyBe.
I tend to fly the same timings each week (out 1840 in 2225 two days later) so I can't give you a general view on loadings. The flights are not full and I would estimate over 80%. I did travel back on the 1730 Friday timing one week in April when the 319 was in use and this sector was full - but I guess you might expect this at the end of the working week.
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BD/LH to FRA
Interesting reports about BHX-FRA, esp as a certain reliablity used to be LH's main argument over BE, justifying their fairly substancial fare difference. Which is probably about double these days ? My personal experience was that the 22:00 back from FRA was rarely on time on Sunday evenings. Haven't done LH for a while though. Going BE, you'd also have the issue that FRA's train stations are at terminal 1, while BE go to terminal 2. BTW, FRA might be the worst airport for short-haul in Germany, too big, too many delays, short-haul never get priority. I go for CGN and DUS when I can. Bits of FRA are also ageing. This over-tight security at BE's departure gate which has US flights at neighbour gates. Very surprising to hear BD/LH has less connections from the 18:30 departure, esp TXL but also DRS, PRG, GVA would be very obvious, and have been done. Branching-out BHX and MAN to BD has a certain smell of "Well, we don't care anymore, really." to it. LH has strategically placed LX (ok, Helvetic) as the more competitive offer fare-wise (e.g. to GVA), and also MUC, which is a much better place than FRA.
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Lufty's BHX/DUS/BHX service works fine, DUS is an all in one terminal, it's pretty much a 'Pocket Rocket' aircraft operation and I highly recommend it for European connections.
Besides that the DUS airport (ish) hotels seem competively priced, I've stayed in the DUS (airport) Holiday Inn a few times for less than I can stay in a close to home Guest House.
Besides that the DUS airport (ish) hotels seem competively priced, I've stayed in the DUS (airport) Holiday Inn a few times for less than I can stay in a close to home Guest House.
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Frankfurt
BHX2FRA & jpthomas72
Thank you both for your interesting contributions. As you know the CAA only release the global figure each month for the route and as my interest is route analysis I was wondering if there was any impact with BMI operating the route (April stats still not released)
I did notice what appeared to be a lot more return fares for £100 or less on Lufthansa albeit booking fairly well in advance but also some trip reports on other forums have revealed some decent flybe loads but as you might expect on the morning outbound and evening inbound from and to BHX respectively.
Winter is still showing 2 x LH 737's and 2 x Cityline 190's and flybe Q400's. I thought the BMI's arrangement was longer than seven months and there have been rumours of flybe using the 175 to Frankfurt post November.
Pete
Thank you both for your interesting contributions. As you know the CAA only release the global figure each month for the route and as my interest is route analysis I was wondering if there was any impact with BMI operating the route (April stats still not released)
I did notice what appeared to be a lot more return fares for £100 or less on Lufthansa albeit booking fairly well in advance but also some trip reports on other forums have revealed some decent flybe loads but as you might expect on the morning outbound and evening inbound from and to BHX respectively.
Winter is still showing 2 x LH 737's and 2 x Cityline 190's and flybe Q400's. I thought the BMI's arrangement was longer than seven months and there have been rumours of flybe using the 175 to Frankfurt post November.
Pete
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Brazil
I will want to be in Brasilia in mid-September this year but looking at BA, TAP and Iberia, the return prices seem extraordinarily high. Do any of the seasoned travellers have any suggestions as to other airlines/routes which might offer a better deal? Any help greatly appreciated.
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Dependant upon dates via Cheap Flights | Search & Compare Flight Offers - Fly.com Swiss have a £613 return fare BHX/Sao Paulo and one gets 4 engines oceanic.
Plenty of connecting flights Sao Paulo / Brasilia
Plenty of connecting flights Sao Paulo / Brasilia
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Sky Wings/Olympic Holidays/LH
I wonder if Olympic Holidays will be wishing that they could have found
a way of brokering a deal with Monarch (if Monarch wanted to).
Last Sunday the aircraft failed to turn up for the first flight and Travel
Service operated it about four hours late. However that was good
compared to yesterday's Larnaca, which failed to operate on the actual day
and now seems as if it won't even make it today either!!!
Yes looking like 00.30 Monday morning departure instead of Saturday morning.
It still won't be Sky Wings but Viking Hellas which is probably somewhere
over Austria coming to do the outbound.
I can safely say - not a good start and it is now a daily operation but
luckily only one flight per day until late June.
Lufthansa
Should start all Embraer 195 service from tomorrow for the rest of summer.
Pete
a way of brokering a deal with Monarch (if Monarch wanted to).
Last Sunday the aircraft failed to turn up for the first flight and Travel
Service operated it about four hours late. However that was good
compared to yesterday's Larnaca, which failed to operate on the actual day
and now seems as if it won't even make it today either!!!
Yes looking like 00.30 Monday morning departure instead of Saturday morning.
It still won't be Sky Wings but Viking Hellas which is probably somewhere
over Austria coming to do the outbound.
I can safely say - not a good start and it is now a daily operation but
luckily only one flight per day until late June.
Lufthansa
Should start all Embraer 195 service from tomorrow for the rest of summer.
Pete
This Olympic Holidays / Sky Wings debacle serves to underline why tour operators should have a legal duty to provide proper accurate information on the carrier they are using to transport the customer, and why the customer should consider carefully which carrier they are being booked on when making the decision whether to book with tour operator "A" or "B".
I thought this legislation was already in place, courtesy of Brussels, but clearly, if it is, it isn't either strong enough, or not policed well enough.
I thought this legislation was already in place, courtesy of Brussels, but clearly, if it is, it isn't either strong enough, or not policed well enough.
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In relation to Sky Wings and passengers choosing which operator/airline they should fly with..
Most passengers are not interested in planes and very few will check which airline they fly with..as my wife says "Oh Nige theres a jet thingy with 2 big engines, is that ours"...if you catch my drift.
Most are just interested in putting a circle round the cheapest hotel, and think little of who or what they fly in.
For me.. absolutely.. wouldn't pick Olympic Holidays or Sky Wings..or other such outfits IE Strategic A/L out of MAN/LGW.
Nigel
Most passengers are not interested in planes and very few will check which airline they fly with..as my wife says "Oh Nige theres a jet thingy with 2 big engines, is that ours"...if you catch my drift.
Most are just interested in putting a circle round the cheapest hotel, and think little of who or what they fly in.
For me.. absolutely.. wouldn't pick Olympic Holidays or Sky Wings..or other such outfits IE Strategic A/L out of MAN/LGW.
Nigel
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"Once the extension is completed the door will be well and truly open for ANYONE who wants to fly those routes or any other long haul destination. 2014, 2024 or 2100? once its built its built. Its not just for pax flights either, freight operators may be interested too. Jaguar LR (India). MG (China). "
Unfortunately BHX and its Masterplan were quite clear, they are not interested in widebodied long haul freighters..actually a paragraph saying it.
Lot of freight flts are at night and BHX doesn't want to use up its allocation of airliner movements (which are restricted number wise) re noise abatement with extra large freighters.
Also says it couldn;t compete with EMA.
Having said that, surprisingly they did allow an Egypt Air A300 freighter in a few months ago, so perhaps there is still hope..fingers crossed.
Nigel
Unfortunately BHX and its Masterplan were quite clear, they are not interested in widebodied long haul freighters..actually a paragraph saying it.
Lot of freight flts are at night and BHX doesn't want to use up its allocation of airliner movements (which are restricted number wise) re noise abatement with extra large freighters.
Also says it couldn;t compete with EMA.
Having said that, surprisingly they did allow an Egypt Air A300 freighter in a few months ago, so perhaps there is still hope..fingers crossed.
Nigel