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Norwegian B787 - LGW based

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Norwegian B787 - LGW based

Old 19th Nov 2016, 13:59
  #781 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
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It is the same in Emirates, and as far as I know in every company in the world. Each flight has ONE designated commander, wether he is in the cockpit, taking a piss or in the bunk...
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Old 25th Nov 2016, 11:37
  #782 (permalink)  
 
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The US DOT has linked the Norwegian UK permit application to the “Ireland based” NAI application. The permits affect the long haul ambition of Kjos. Most recently the EU has appointed Giorgio Sacerdoti as its arbitrator in the ongoing NAI matter:

https://www.irishexaminer.com/irelan...ck-431867.html

“Under arbitration, the EU and US will each name an arbitrator, while a third arbitrator will be appointed by mutual consent”

A new DOT Secretary has yet to be appointed:

http://ttnews.com/articles/basetempl...-DOT-Secretary

Those supporting NAI appear worried the new administration of President elect Trump may decide to review the NAI application. Ireland South MEP, Deirdre Clune, has written to DOT Secretary Foxx asking that he “swiftly conclude this matter within the time frame of the current US political administration”:

http://www.irishcentral.com/business...-by-arbitrator

It may not have been prudent for EU Transport Commissioner, Violeta Bulc, to notify the DOT that not granting NAI a US permit could affect trade agreements. Given the rhetoric of President elect Trump, Bulc’s communication is likely to hinder rather than assist the NAI and NA UK applications.

The Irish Times published a letter from the Irish Airline Pilots’ Association President, Captain Evan Cullen, regarding Norwegian’s Irish venture, in which he states, “The objection is purely on the undermining of EU-US labor standards that the Norwegian proposal represents”:

http://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/le...plan-1.2749410

In an interview with Kjos, Norway’s VG newspaper reported that; ”Norwegian boss is crystal clear that he is not at all interested in negotiating the pilots demands for connection to the parent NAS - This will eliminate our ability to finance the 240 planes. With such a model we would not have gotten the funding of the banks to operate”:

http://www.vg.no/nyheter/innenriks/k...lt/a/23408996/

Article 17 of the EU-US Air Transport Agreement (Open Skies) does not permit an undermining of labor standards, labor rights and labor principles by the participating parties. This may include using novel and complex labor models to circumvent direct employment relationships. Particularly if doing so would provide an unfair competitive advantage over those participating parties fully complying with the Agreement.
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Old 26th Nov 2016, 20:35
  #783 (permalink)  

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In an interview with Kjos, Norway’s VG newspaper reported that; ”Norwegian boss is crystal clear that he is not at all interested in negotiating the pilots demands for connection to the parent NAS - This will eliminate our ability to finance the 240 planes. With such a model we would not have gotten the funding of the banks to operate”:

Kjos om pilotenes hovedkrav: ? Uaktuelt - VG
This is a staggering admission.

One wonders what exactly it was that Kjos told the banks about the relationship between his employees and their airline?

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Old 28th Nov 2016, 11:10
  #784 (permalink)  
 
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Norwegian slips and ugly treatment

Last Friday, 25th, a Norwegian 737 slipped off the hard surface at Umea, Sweden:

“The landing went well, but the aircraft came off the runway”:

http://www.vk.se/1869794/flygplan-gled-av-landningsbanan

I hope the crew is directly employed with trade union representation. In the past, agency crew without trade union representation were summarily terminated after an occurrence, but before any official investigation to determine cause (ref JFK).

In an unrelated incident:

“I was so angry I was shaking when I saw the ugly treatment dogs got”

http://www.dagbladet.no/nyheter/hundeeier---jeg-ble-sa-sint-at-jeg-skalv-da-jeg-sa-den-stygge-behandlingen-hundene-fikk/65365847

I doubt the dogs’ owner will be voting Norwegian ‘best in show’ after their rough treatment.
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Old 28th Nov 2016, 12:16
  #785 (permalink)  
 
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I think that begs the question...


'Why is that Baggage Handler required to lift heavy objects above his head?'


Must be a Health and Safety violation by Management.
.
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Old 28th Nov 2016, 15:40
  #786 (permalink)  
 
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Got to take my hat off to you Bondi very few dogs will hang on to a bone for this long.
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Old 28th Nov 2016, 18:25
  #787 (permalink)  
 
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I have to agree with you A and C.

I have met the odd character in my long aviation career who wanted to conduct a life-long grudge about something or other but Direct Bondi definitely deserves some sort of special accolade.

Regardless of how badly I think I might have imagined I had been treated by persons or persons unknown, I would have given up a long time ago.

As a retired outsider he appears to me to be getting nowhere, for the airline seems to be getting bigger and bigger as the years go by regardless of his input.

Perhaps I could recommend him for the PYNWBG award?

(Picking Your Nose With Boxing Gloves)
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Old 28th Nov 2016, 20:08
  #788 (permalink)  
 
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JW411,
Regardless of how badly I think I might have imagined I had been treated by persons or persons unknown,

Do try and make some sense man.

Apparently, you support Kjos and his labor model race to the bottom. Perhaps you could also recommend him for an award. I suggest the accolade;

Complete, unequivocal, Norwegian talent.
Direct Bondi is offline  
Old 29th Nov 2016, 21:37
  #789 (permalink)  
 
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Although Bondi's campaign seems slightly crazed and is certainly tedious, perhaps he feels he is exacting some sort of retribution against an organisation which he clearly feels has screwed him. I can sympathise to a point but would suggest that, as he clearly failed to address his grievances while in Norwegian, he might be better served by putting it down to experience and moving on. Then again, perhaps he feels he really is making a difference with his contributions. If his aim is to tarnish the company and discourage others from joining, he might be more effective if he added some balance and came across a bit less 'rain man'.
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Old 30th Nov 2016, 09:19
  #790 (permalink)  
 
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campaign seems slightly crazed and is certainly tedious
“campaign” – not at all.
Objections and responses to ongoing reports relating to Norwegian’s abhorrent labor model. You may not be aware that others also object, including the six million members of the AFL-CIO federation of unions and; ALPA, IALPA, ECA, European Transport Workers Union ETF, Southwest Airlines Pilots Association SWAPA, Association of Flight Attendants AFA, the list goes on.

“crazed” – hardly.
Perhaps if posts were written unintelligibly and without supporting evidence in the form of factual reports, mostly with direct links to the source.

“tedious” – then read something else.

Conversely, I doubt you apply your criteria to those perpetually supporting the Kjos regime.

If his aim is to tarnish the company and discourage others from joining, he might be more effective ifhe added some balance and came across a bit less 'rain man'.
Norwegian is highly proficient at tarnishing themselves and discouraging applications without any assistance from me.

Balancing the scales of labor rights and labor principles, you will find at Norwegian it is firmly tipped against the crew member (read my posts).

The new DOT Secretary, Elaine Chao, is a former Secretary of Labor and former Deputy Administrator of the Maritime Administration. She will be familiar with 'flags of convenience' and may be sympathetic to union concerns regarding Norwegian's labor model:

http://www.theverge.com/2016/11/29/13777014/elaine-chao-transportation-secretary-trump-administration

After almost three years, Norwegian still does not have its US Permits. News from Washington would suggest it may be raining on Norwegian's application for some time:

http://centreforaviation.com/analysis/president-trump-and-us-aviation-a-likely-reversion-to-protectionism-312463

Last edited by Direct Bondi; 30th Nov 2016 at 09:59. Reason: more on new DOT Secretary
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Old 30th Nov 2016, 12:49
  #791 (permalink)  
 
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Direct Bondi is an admirable poster who can back up what he says. He's as negative about Norwegian as some here are positive.

I wouldn't fault someone who continues to be a thorn as such in Norwegian's side for as long as Norwegian keep their current tack regarding contracts, pay levels, etc.

All's fair in love and war, as one manager once said to me during a dispute.
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Old 30th Nov 2016, 13:37
  #792 (permalink)  
 
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Elaine Chao has never been sympathetic to the cause of labor. There is absolutely no reason to think she will start now.
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Old 30th Nov 2016, 13:56
  #793 (permalink)  
 
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I would have more sympathy with the Bondi detractors if just once one of them could put up a reasoned argument against all the points he makes. But no, this never ever happens. As it is the labour model employed by Norwegian that occupies the central tenant of his argument I do wonder why anyone on here would support it, which is probably exactly why there remains radio silence. If you want him to quieten down, then put up a case for the defence please.
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Old 1st Dec 2016, 08:14
  #794 (permalink)  
 
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You see, I could take him more seriously if he was actually just reporting facts but that's not what he's doing. He quotes from reports out of context or uses anecdotal forum posts to support his position, like he did with that labour report or latest with that CAPA analysis, which goes much deeper than a simple suggestion, "that it might be raining on Norwegians application", which the report neither explicitly says nor implies.

So what are the facts? Norwegian employs contracted pilots through agencies. Certainly not ideal but also neither new nor abhorrent.

Terms and Conditions? I think some people need to have a serious reality check about terms and conditions outside the legacy carriers on offer nowadays and I would ask anybody to point to any operator in Europe, where you can enter directly with some experience as a Relief Captain and earn a 100k€ (total package)
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Old 1st Dec 2016, 12:43
  #795 (permalink)  
 
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Parkbremse, ermmm define exactly what you mean by out of context? A quick review of Bondi's efforts reveals very little in the way of contextual license, moreover the opinion offered is merely a reflection of the facts as they are presented.
For me Bondi has had a direct and positive influence on my decision making process thanks to me being able to ask the various contracting agencies specific questions relating to the various issues highlighted, in every case I've received at best a vague bit of waffle about nothing in particular which has convinced me to steer well clear of this sh1t outfit.
Sadly, there is always a % of koolaid drinkers everywhere, perhaps you are one of them Parkbremse? or maybe you are one of the koolaid providers?
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Old 1st Dec 2016, 13:28
  #796 (permalink)  
 
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Parkbremse. What tosh. Contracting is supposed to be used by proper employers as a means of managing peaks and troughs in demand. This way the majority are paying proper tax and social security (NI in the UK) payments and make required NI contributions - along with a lot of other labour and worker protection benefits. Norwegian do not do this.
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Old 1st Dec 2016, 15:01
  #797 (permalink)  
 
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Yeah right...

Everybody with Base LGW (and also Norwegian) will pay full NIC in the UK independent of their place of living as this is european legislation (educate yourself) and tax according to the bilateral agreement between UK and the country of living. So don't give me that BS about social security evasion...

Workers rights, yes that is better with a direct employement. Like i said, contracting work is certainly not ideal. How much that really matters when things get bad... well, i can quote a handful of examples from my home country where direct employement and supposedly very good workers rights have not mattered one bit and protected the individuals when things with the company for various reasons got bad. So ideal, certainly not like i said but abhorrent? A lot of practices in this industry are abhorrent, independent of contracts or direct employement and whether we talk about the EU or the US, if you wanna fight that, yeah more power to you but thats a totally different battle altogether.
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Old 1st Dec 2016, 18:13
  #798 (permalink)  
 
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Parkbremse. So, you think Norwegian re paying employer NI contributions for their self employed contract pilots. Hmmmmm. Education is a wonderful thing.
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Old 1st Dec 2016, 18:55
  #799 (permalink)  
 
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This is getting ridiculous...

Pilots in Norwegian are not self employed
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Old 1st Dec 2016, 22:16
  #800 (permalink)  
 
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Ok.... so I may have misunderstood the modus operandi of OSM/Rishworth. I obviously do not work for Norwegian, but then, clearly, nor does anyone else.
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