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Unpredictable DGCA

Old 5th Mar 2008, 09:59
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nothing is impossible

importent is combine the best among all the aviation.
After formation of EU ,many COUNTRIES who joined EU are becoming JAR based from there individual DGCA"s and bringing common regulations in EU.
its the matter of time when these bigger organisations sit togather and thrash out issues for the good of aviation worldwide.
it will bring more transparency for dgca as well the pilots towards licencing and flying.
which is as of now taken care by issue of spacial licences by dgca in india.
india has gone throu lots of hijacking,bomb threats ,and terrorism related issues. many of those rules concerning security will be a big question mark to change.
every country will have such issues.
even FAA has followed these security related regulations after 9-11.
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Old 6th Mar 2008, 01:47
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Change has to happen within

Corruption is a disease or rather a virus. The FAA and JAR can only provide technical and regulatory knowledge. It is impossible to change a system that thrives on being corrupt and victimises highly qualified professionals.
This is not just a bad habit - it is a disease, so "getsetgo" please tell me your ideas to cure the DGCA.
I hear some real horror stories from students/professional pilots who have interacted with the DGCA. Is it possible that all these folks are lying about a great moral source with exemplary principles?.
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Old 6th Mar 2008, 03:26
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do not bribe

simplest cure is stop bribing.
bcz in india by law is who gives favours/bribe is 101% punishable than who takes bribe.
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Old 6th Mar 2008, 05:11
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Wink getsetgo

so the word to the wise. Do not bribe, give a gift that he can forward to his child's school. Cash please , no checks.
This is a fact of life in 3rd world countries. Actually in all countries the ritual of bribing is performed in one way or the other.
In the US, some girls when stopped by a policeman for a traffic violation try to make a date with the man. Would that be considered an attempt to bribe the man?
Fly low and slow and enjoy the sights
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Old 6th Mar 2008, 07:32
  #25 (permalink)  
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I agree with HiAlt, its not the bribe that you give when you go to get your work done. Ohh its lets say the gifts that you bestow on them as Diwali gifts and now even Christmas gifts.

The question that comes in is whether you are willing to take the monetory losses that comes with not bribing? I was asked a meager INR5000 for the issue of my ATPL. I simply refused to pay the money as my paper work was in order and had all the relevant qualification. Well, rather than taking a week to issue the licence DGCA took 3 months. In my company we got a pay raise of INR 120,000 upon issue of ATPL. So I reckon I lost out on almost INR350,000 by not giving that 5K in bribe. Yes, I have self satisfaction that my licence was issued without giving bribe, but that bit costed me almost US$8500. Was it worth it? To me every penny of it

The Babu mentality is going away slowly, of course not quick enough for many people. When the current DG retires, I have learnt from reliable sourse, that the new DG will be from outside. Some really dynamic IAS officer (as if they do not take bribes.)
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Old 6th Mar 2008, 08:01
  #26 (permalink)  
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Thumbs up Kudos Desipilot

Its not good to sell ones soul in the name of money. Good for you Desipilot. I'm sure there are going to be more brave souls who will expose these corrupt derelicts. Its got to stop sometime and its folks like you who make the changes. It shows leadership and it will take you a long way in your career. All the best
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Old 6th Mar 2008, 09:44
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flightknight

"The FAA is staffed with some of some of the brightest aviation minds - design engineers, veteran pilots, ex-astronauts etc.."

Quiet agree. the FAA are also staffed with some of the rudest a***holes I have ever spoken too. Had to deal with one such moron at Fort,L, FL, early last year.
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Old 6th Mar 2008, 13:38
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getsetgo:

I admire your nationalist attitude. But with all due respect ,you and your attitude sucks big time. It is attitudes like yours that have permitted the Indian DGCA and the GOI to have their collective heads up their a****.
Forget about Katrina and all that other crap you posted earlier. How does a common man deal with the DGCA? Riddle me that,Batman.
The plain unvarnished and unpalatable (to some ) truth is that while there is progress and prosperity in India today(for which everyone should be proud), the government and the infrastructure are still in the Dark Ages. Otherwise how can you explain the fact that the nation that provides computer programmers worldwide ,has a departmnet (DGCA) that won't even respond to an email or query?How can you explain the fact that the nation that has the finest doctors in the world allows only two or three organizations to conduct a flight physical? I could go on but you get the picture.
I will tell you why.It is because the babus and people like getsetgo make the rules.They would rather stay in the last century than come out and ply with the rest of the world.
Sorry if I sound peeved but I have had enough of the DGCA and their ass kissing supporters. Those expats who want to go to India for pay, aircraft type qualification, adventure etc. you have been warned. If you want any of those things try the Gulf or SE Asia. Let the Indian private airlines park/crash their expensive new toys before they kick the DGCA into catching up.Until then nothing will or has changed.
Thanks for letting me vent. I feel better now.
Alt3.
P.S The FAA might be rude but at least they respond to emails and telephone calls and ,more times than not, they perform as advertised.
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Old 6th Mar 2008, 14:07
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Conceded.

As for the Indians not answering emails, it is a national past time. Part of their culture, unless of course they stand to gain from answering.
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Old 6th Mar 2008, 23:33
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weldone desi

what money you lost today will bring you rewards tomarrow and it will be in multifications not additions.
you have not lost anything ,but maintained your principles.you are already rich on principles.
there is no end to money
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Old 6th Mar 2008, 23:42
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minister

railway minister is handling worlds biggest network.
he is planning to connect china to bulgaria rail network passing thro +25 countries.
he is engg graduate can speak +16 languages can learn more.
if i have to do so much.....i will have no time to paste my face for camera.
media alway hunting for him....when he is off and you are on
curry comes here.
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Old 6th Mar 2008, 23:58
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al fakham

minister

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

railway minister is handling worlds biggest network.
he is planning to connect china to bulgaria rail network passing thro +25 countries.
he is engg graduate can speak +16 languages can learn more.
if i have to do so much.....i will have no time to paste my face for camera.
media alway hunting for him....when he is off and you are on
curry comes here.
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Old 7th Mar 2008, 00:29
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Thumbs up do not run

do your job.
and go for jog
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Old 7th Mar 2008, 04:20
  #34 (permalink)  
 
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Gentlemen

Most of us come from "first world" Western countries. Many of us have the tendency to measure the rest of the world with our yardstick. When I leave home, I change the currency in my pocket. In this case to rupees. This affects my attitude, tolerance etc. towards the people and the country.
I take "the bitter with the sweet" and every country I have been (with the exception of Sudan) had something that I enjoyed. About bribes (tips = to insure prompt service), know when to hold and when to fold. If this people would earn the salaries of our government employees, the system could be changed. BTW 5000 rupees for 3 months wait, wellll I just don't have that much time to waste. In many ways we are fortunate to have the opportunities that exist today and see the world our parents could only dream about. Obviously most of you do not remember the 70's, the time no aviation jobs where available at home.
Yall watch that TCAS now
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Old 7th Mar 2008, 06:30
  #35 (permalink)  
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Facts of Life

I was on a visit to India a few years ago and met a retired TOP police official. He owned a modest two bedroom home and had a scooter for transportaion. He was transferred 32 times during his career.
Fact is, he never compromised on his ETHICS. I asked him WHY. He told me he will enjoy everyday to the end because he has a clear conscience.
The COCKPIT at any cost is not everyones GOAL.
Fly safe ........
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Old 7th Mar 2008, 07:09
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hopefully we don't have to pay bribe to get the job.
PS : I even had to bribe the officer to get my two wheeler license, huh
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Old 7th Mar 2008, 12:26
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authority

DGCA is indipendent regulatory body only for aviation, whereas FAA JAR work under ministry of transportation.
DGCA has more authority and powers than FAA/JAR.
so FAA JAR Cannot really follow DGCA
or DGCA EITHER WAY
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Old 7th Mar 2008, 17:09
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Thumbs down The DGCA babuism....!!

getsetgo,
Pls get yourself into a grammar school to begin with.And then with ur atitude pl "Get Set & Go".....!!
Alt3.......Kudos,my fellow aviator.I agree with you 100%. Keep up the good work.The Indian DGCA needs a complete overall. Complete with the terminators fumigating the rat holes in the floorboards and the termite ridden attics! And chasing the current heirachy (the rats and termites) right out into oblivion. Its a very sad day when an aviator has to talk about the Director General of a country like this.....a very sad day indeed...!! .
I beg you my DGCA babus....you may come to your office a little late,have your every half hourly coffee breaks,take those long lunch sessions,have that 2pm-4pm siesta,go home early and hey,even take those ridiculously unwarranted bribes ( if available).........but what differentiates a successful beaurocrat from an unsuccessful one is that even after ALL of the above,the successful beaurocrat (DGCA/CFOI) should GET THE JOB DONE.....!!! Period....!!! All these pseudo delays in 'getting the job done' are'nt going to get you folks any more importance than is due to you. Neither is anyone who is affected by these "beaurocratic delays" going to feel this projected pseudo power..!! Cause you have none... . And you never did! Change is inevitable,and this time my friends.....it right around the corner!!
So stop,and smell the roses my DGCA babus,cause thats exactly what you dont have time for now. And remember,the shit that you throw up,has no place to come but down....
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Old 7th Mar 2008, 22:33
  #39 (permalink)  
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getset,

The problem with DGCA is exactly what you said, they think they are independent body and they do not have to answer to anyone. What you are forgetting is that at the end of the day you are still a civil servant and your pay is paid by the taxes that I pay every month. If you think you (DGCA) are anywhere close to FAA or JAA you are sadly mistaken my friend. Yes, I hold all three licenses, FAA, JAA and DGCA and I can tell you that DGCA stands no where compared to FAA or JAA. The biggest difference is they treat you like a human being.

I don't think DGCA will ever change. They like their paper work too much, I guess that is how they feel important.

DGCA may be the only authority in the world that doesn't allow First officers to land the aircraft until they have done their assisted take off and landing checks.... so god forbid if the captain passes out, all the passengers are in deep sh*t since the FO has never landed the plane in normal circumstances forget about the case of crew incapacitation. Who think of these rules anyway?

Indian citizens who are flying on FATA be warned. As soon as the shortage is over, the DGCA will cancel the FATA in a heart beat, like they have done it for the RT licence. So you better pass your Indian exams as soon as possible and start flying on the Indian license.
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Old 8th Mar 2008, 02:09
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First Officers not allowed to Land ??

Please clarify : FO's not allowed to land ?. Is the Airline Passengers Association aware of this ?
This is tantamount to suicide, if the captain becomes incapacitated for any reason. I am not sure if the world aviation body is aware of this. I'm sure the insurance companies will be interested in this news , since they will be the ones shelling out the big bucks in case of a catastrophe.
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