Singaporean self-sponsored CPL holders - where are you?
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I don't know. But, if there's one thing I've learned, its best to get the answers direct from the horses mouth. Go to SFC with your list of questions and ask the relevant authority personally. Even better if you can get it in black and white.
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Hi guys,
After reading through all the threats and postings, I would like to advise those who wants to be a pilot to consider a few issues prior to making the steps. I am frm Massey a long time ago...
1. do you really want to fly? flying is expensive just by taking a fATPL. SFC charges about 150k, STATA is about 120K, MFA is about 90K. I mean if you or your parents can afford this amount of money, then do it ... I have a frd whom was dropped out of MFA due to financial issues and in the end it was a hell of a time repaying those money he loan from the bank. (6% interest)
2. Yes SFC and all fly schools in SG or MAS will take in people whom are 26 or below. But there will be a selection for SFC which consist of interviews and testings (similar to cadet programme). SFC private cadets are screened and the chances of getting a placing with them is quite low. They only take in abou 10 to 15 or less annually. You can pay doesnt meant that they would want you.
3. For those hoping to take a full degree with fATPL, Massey is the only university reconisged for CAAS fATPL conversion. Thus this flying hours exemption from SQ is directed to the regulations of CAAS. This will allow people will go into the learjet pharse directly. Embry riddle is one of the top schools for aviation in the world. but the only fallback is that they provide a FAA ATP which is harder to find a piloting job with only 200hrs. FAA ATP licenses are 'better' only in states. in most countries, ICAO fATPL or the JAA fATPL are more recongised and it will be easier for an entry level job, especially if you want to enter directly into a airline. on the other hand, the cost of such programmes are high, for about 150k for Massey, 200k for Embry etc. thus financial sounding must be avaliable... all the figures will only increase as retest or more flight hours will be charged if necessary
4. Apply as many flying schools and degree programmes and undergo its selection process to learn or get use to pilot selection. Take a tour on thier school and choose the correct 1 for you.
5. i would suggest that go take a PPL in malaysia before doing anything. Go taste flying and see if thats your cup of tea. This will allow you to really find out if you have the passion to fly.
just my thoughts,
cheers,
great way to fly!
After reading through all the threats and postings, I would like to advise those who wants to be a pilot to consider a few issues prior to making the steps. I am frm Massey a long time ago...
1. do you really want to fly? flying is expensive just by taking a fATPL. SFC charges about 150k, STATA is about 120K, MFA is about 90K. I mean if you or your parents can afford this amount of money, then do it ... I have a frd whom was dropped out of MFA due to financial issues and in the end it was a hell of a time repaying those money he loan from the bank. (6% interest)
2. Yes SFC and all fly schools in SG or MAS will take in people whom are 26 or below. But there will be a selection for SFC which consist of interviews and testings (similar to cadet programme). SFC private cadets are screened and the chances of getting a placing with them is quite low. They only take in abou 10 to 15 or less annually. You can pay doesnt meant that they would want you.
3. For those hoping to take a full degree with fATPL, Massey is the only university reconisged for CAAS fATPL conversion. Thus this flying hours exemption from SQ is directed to the regulations of CAAS. This will allow people will go into the learjet pharse directly. Embry riddle is one of the top schools for aviation in the world. but the only fallback is that they provide a FAA ATP which is harder to find a piloting job with only 200hrs. FAA ATP licenses are 'better' only in states. in most countries, ICAO fATPL or the JAA fATPL are more recongised and it will be easier for an entry level job, especially if you want to enter directly into a airline. on the other hand, the cost of such programmes are high, for about 150k for Massey, 200k for Embry etc. thus financial sounding must be avaliable... all the figures will only increase as retest or more flight hours will be charged if necessary
4. Apply as many flying schools and degree programmes and undergo its selection process to learn or get use to pilot selection. Take a tour on thier school and choose the correct 1 for you.
5. i would suggest that go take a PPL in malaysia before doing anything. Go taste flying and see if thats your cup of tea. This will allow you to really find out if you have the passion to fly.
just my thoughts,
cheers,
great way to fly!
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Airbus 380, I agree with you wholeheartedly. Especially #1 and #5.
Thanks for your input!
So, you are flying the A380? And you were a self sponsored CPL fATPL?
Thanks for your input!
So, you are flying the A380? And you were a self sponsored CPL fATPL?
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I was thinking how am i suppose to do a PPL in singapore with SYFC after my A levels when i have to serve NS? Is SYFC the only flight school that provides PPL? I checked out the SRFC website and they say they offer Restricted PPL due to the limited flying space. Which is weird though.
Can anyone confirm this.
Cheers
Mark
Can anyone confirm this.
Cheers
Mark
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Not sure if this has been raised before, but if you do wanna pursue an aviation career, and obtain your own license overseas, please do not assume that you're qualified to work for that country.
Take Aussie for example. Popular place to take up flying... but unless you're a skilled worker where they need atm, intend to stay in aussie for 2 years OR willing to fork out $100,000 to invest in Australia, you can't work in any of the 5 major cities. Wanna fly? Sure... fly in the bush where you probably only get 10 hours per MONTH and spend the rest of the time tending the farms as a farmer. Trust me on this bit. Oh... why? Cause you're short of 5 points due immigration to be able to obtain a PR and you can only work full time when you're a PR.
And a point of note, spamming your resume every 2 months is useless unless you have a license upgrade, more hours under your belt, and so forth. Think about why they don't want you in the 1st place. By spamming it, you're not doing anybody any favours. If you wanna spam it, sure, spam it... After u got your PPL, CPL, fATPL, 200 hours, 500 hours, 700 hours, 1,500 hours and not when you don't have any upgrades at all.
It's not weird. A PPL consists of more than just flying circuits in the training area and doing stalls. There is also navigation to talk about where you must ensure you know where you are, else it defeats the purpose of trying to fly for a commercial outfit. A Restricted PPL... well... you can't navigate... so... that's why it's restricted.
Take Aussie for example. Popular place to take up flying... but unless you're a skilled worker where they need atm, intend to stay in aussie for 2 years OR willing to fork out $100,000 to invest in Australia, you can't work in any of the 5 major cities. Wanna fly? Sure... fly in the bush where you probably only get 10 hours per MONTH and spend the rest of the time tending the farms as a farmer. Trust me on this bit. Oh... why? Cause you're short of 5 points due immigration to be able to obtain a PR and you can only work full time when you're a PR.
And a point of note, spamming your resume every 2 months is useless unless you have a license upgrade, more hours under your belt, and so forth. Think about why they don't want you in the 1st place. By spamming it, you're not doing anybody any favours. If you wanna spam it, sure, spam it... After u got your PPL, CPL, fATPL, 200 hours, 500 hours, 700 hours, 1,500 hours and not when you don't have any upgrades at all.
It's not weird. A PPL consists of more than just flying circuits in the training area and doing stalls. There is also navigation to talk about where you must ensure you know where you are, else it defeats the purpose of trying to fly for a commercial outfit. A Restricted PPL... well... you can't navigate... so... that's why it's restricted.
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PPL
There is nothing weird with having a restricted PPL as all flying clubs in Singapore only offer this option due to the limited airspace we have. Whether to advance with a PPL in Singapore or Malaysia is totally your call as there are many important factors to consider.
I suggest that you make an effort to look for information outside the forum. It is true that a forum is a place to exchange information, but sometimes you cannot expect people to provide you information from a to z as that will only be termed as "spoonfeeding".
I wish you all the best in your piloting dreams.
I suggest that you make an effort to look for information outside the forum. It is true that a forum is a place to exchange information, but sometimes you cannot expect people to provide you information from a to z as that will only be termed as "spoonfeeding".
I wish you all the best in your piloting dreams.
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talking about taking PPL in msia,
if one were to take his PPL at a flying club in JB, say Fras Flying Club for example, he still have to sit for a conversion Air Law exams prior to him converting his full msian PPL to a singaporean one right?
which one is much better, in terms of study and financial, a flying club or MFA? heard that MFA isnt up to standards now?
if one were to take his PPL at a flying club in JB, say Fras Flying Club for example, he still have to sit for a conversion Air Law exams prior to him converting his full msian PPL to a singaporean one right?
which one is much better, in terms of study and financial, a flying club or MFA? heard that MFA isnt up to standards now?
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Airbus_380 where did u do yr PPL and yr CPL all at Massey university?
By the way since yr from Massey i would like to know which combine Degree and CPL course u took and finally where did u do yr fATPL which i know is not concluded at the Massey university course.
By the way since yr from Massey i would like to know which combine Degree and CPL course u took and finally where did u do yr fATPL which i know is not concluded at the Massey university course.
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I'm holding this 'wierd restricted PPL' from SYFC. Essentially we do everything a 'not so wierd non restricted PPL' does except we dont fly the cross country trip, going from tuas to changi is not cross country. Flying up north involves another FIR meaning paperwork, plus the additional costs of landing there will blow SYFC's budget. Though I didn't fly cross country, I did do the nav paper.
Hermie, SYFC does hire instructors who are not ex-rsaf.
wannabe15, flight licenses don't expire, maybe you mean your certificate of experience which, for PPL, requires 5hrs/yr, expired. You only need to take a skills test similiar to FHT to un-expire it.
macarto, I think its pointless to get an aviation degree from Massey or anywhere else for that matter. Being so excited about this professional career, I trust that you did/will do well for your A levels/diploma. Why not get a local degree in 3yrs on a partial or full scholarship then spend the next 1yr+ overseas for the flying. Its much cheaper plus you get a degree in another field as your contingency. You can also try for SYFC while doing uni here. An aviation degree w/fATPL would cost you 4yrs overseas.
A380, isn't the FAA license an ICAO license as US is an ICAO member? Likewise JAA licenses.
Trying to learn flying during NS is not advisable as you'll soon find out how easy it is to be made to stay in on weekends.
Hermie, SYFC does hire instructors who are not ex-rsaf.
wannabe15, flight licenses don't expire, maybe you mean your certificate of experience which, for PPL, requires 5hrs/yr, expired. You only need to take a skills test similiar to FHT to un-expire it.
macarto, I think its pointless to get an aviation degree from Massey or anywhere else for that matter. Being so excited about this professional career, I trust that you did/will do well for your A levels/diploma. Why not get a local degree in 3yrs on a partial or full scholarship then spend the next 1yr+ overseas for the flying. Its much cheaper plus you get a degree in another field as your contingency. You can also try for SYFC while doing uni here. An aviation degree w/fATPL would cost you 4yrs overseas.
A380, isn't the FAA license an ICAO license as US is an ICAO member? Likewise JAA licenses.
Trying to learn flying during NS is not advisable as you'll soon find out how easy it is to be made to stay in on weekends.
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Hi there,
No FAA has its own licensing systems... FAA pilots takes its PPL, CPL/MEIR... they can be qualified to look for a job at this stage.... then they will take the FAA ATP papers... if going into an airline.. most FAA pilots now will take the ATP papers as well before or after CPL/MEIR conversion. ATP consist of only 80 MCQs done with the FAA exam centre. which is different from the ICAO standard groups of papers consisting a series of exams.
US is a ICAO member but they uses thier own suplementary licensing systems... FAA is often unique and different from what ICAO countries. This can be seen in terms of airport lightings, air space regulations and their AIPs...
Pilot licenses on the other hand can under ICAO system of PPL, CPL/IR, MPL or fATPL. Full ATPL will be issued only with apporximately 1500hrs pic in a typed rated jet as accordence to the class of aircraft listed by ICAO Annex.....
Hope that Helps...
Great Way to Fly
No FAA has its own licensing systems... FAA pilots takes its PPL, CPL/MEIR... they can be qualified to look for a job at this stage.... then they will take the FAA ATP papers... if going into an airline.. most FAA pilots now will take the ATP papers as well before or after CPL/MEIR conversion. ATP consist of only 80 MCQs done with the FAA exam centre. which is different from the ICAO standard groups of papers consisting a series of exams.
US is a ICAO member but they uses thier own suplementary licensing systems... FAA is often unique and different from what ICAO countries. This can be seen in terms of airport lightings, air space regulations and their AIPs...
Pilot licenses on the other hand can under ICAO system of PPL, CPL/IR, MPL or fATPL. Full ATPL will be issued only with apporximately 1500hrs pic in a typed rated jet as accordence to the class of aircraft listed by ICAO Annex.....
Hope that Helps...
Great Way to Fly
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Alright, bascially this is my Plan. Firstly like what many have recommended, get a PPL in Malaysia or in Australia to get a experience of Flying. Well I have actually considered SYFC but if i am not wrong only JC 1 students, Secondary students and Poly year 1 students are eligible. This is not the case for me. Moreover like many of you have said, The PPL issued in Singapore is Restricted due to the inability to Do a Cross country Nav. It is also not recognise by the CASA if i am not wrong. Hence even if i were to go abroad, i would have to redo my PPL again.
Next, Yes its true that I can either opt to do get a local degree locally and focus on my Flying Career After that or Get my CPL/IR, fATPL with a aviation degree at the same time which many have said will Cost me a BOMB and i am restricted to only a aviation degree and not some other degree in other sectors of the economy which will be to my disadvantage. In that Case Am i really left with a single option to only Focus on My Flying career Only after i have gotten a Local Degree, Will it be too late then? I just want some personal Opinion from the lot.
Thanks
A380 was it a four year course at Massey? Would u have done it otherwise if u could turn back time and done yr CPL in a Modular Fashion?
Singapore Flyer, thanks it is indeed true that i have a real passion for Flying. I wouldn't mind not getting into SIA even after i got my fATPL i just want to FLY! Nevermind the Money all that. Hence What is your Case then, Are u in the progress of getting yr ATPL, Care to share yr Aviation Journey?
Next, Yes its true that I can either opt to do get a local degree locally and focus on my Flying Career After that or Get my CPL/IR, fATPL with a aviation degree at the same time which many have said will Cost me a BOMB and i am restricted to only a aviation degree and not some other degree in other sectors of the economy which will be to my disadvantage. In that Case Am i really left with a single option to only Focus on My Flying career Only after i have gotten a Local Degree, Will it be too late then? I just want some personal Opinion from the lot.
Thanks
A380 was it a four year course at Massey? Would u have done it otherwise if u could turn back time and done yr CPL in a Modular Fashion?
Singapore Flyer, thanks it is indeed true that i have a real passion for Flying. I wouldn't mind not getting into SIA even after i got my fATPL i just want to FLY! Nevermind the Money all that. Hence What is your Case then, Are u in the progress of getting yr ATPL, Care to share yr Aviation Journey?
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Hi
If i ain't wrong SYFC is under RSAF. I have asked them at the recent airshow before and they told me only people who have not enlisted into NS from various specified tertiary institutions in their 1st year of enrolment are eligable.
I have actually went down to STATA before to talk to the staff. The cost for the fATPL course I last heard was USD$80K however if you are strapped for cash, there is an option. STATA has just started up so if I ain't wrong they are in need of instructors.The staff told me that they do take in ab-initio instructors (after undergoing selections etc.) and bond them for 3 years. They would be based in australia where STATA's academy is located. SFC also trains ab-initio instructors however the bond is longer but you can work locally. I am currently gunning for that.
Kinda weird STATA is a Singapore-based company that offers CASA licences. Their main market ain't Singaporeans am I right? Having heard of any Singaporeans enrolling into this academy yet. Anybody have?
I have actually went down to STATA before to talk to the staff. The cost for the fATPL course I last heard was USD$80K however if you are strapped for cash, there is an option. STATA has just started up so if I ain't wrong they are in need of instructors.The staff told me that they do take in ab-initio instructors (after undergoing selections etc.) and bond them for 3 years. They would be based in australia where STATA's academy is located. SFC also trains ab-initio instructors however the bond is longer but you can work locally. I am currently gunning for that.
Kinda weird STATA is a Singapore-based company that offers CASA licences. Their main market ain't Singaporeans am I right? Having heard of any Singaporeans enrolling into this academy yet. Anybody have?
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Hi there, how is everyone. If i'm not wrong they are training cadets from a certain airline in China. Regarding the local self funded cadets there, only 2 of them are there.
Anyway, there's an AFI course available in Malaysia for those with licence and at least 140 PIC hours. upon completion work as an AFI there. The academy is in Senai airport JB, which will suit Singaporeans fine. So if there's anybody that is interested, do PM me cause Im unable to disclose further details. FYI ive already enrolled and the package sounds reasonably fair.
Selamat Hari RAyA!!
Anyway, there's an AFI course available in Malaysia for those with licence and at least 140 PIC hours. upon completion work as an AFI there. The academy is in Senai airport JB, which will suit Singaporeans fine. So if there's anybody that is interested, do PM me cause Im unable to disclose further details. FYI ive already enrolled and the package sounds reasonably fair.
Selamat Hari RAyA!!
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I know someone who is going to STATA academy in Australia leaving this week. I believe he is part of the 2nd Singapore batch of something like 14 guys. He was telling me they are processing the third intake now. Seems quite interesting.
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Kinda weird STATA is a Singapore-based company that offers CASA licences. Their main market ain't Singaporeans am I right? Having heard of any Singaporeans enrolling into this academy yet. Anybody have?
I hope for update from them by Oct.
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Perhaps another reason why STATA offers the CASA licenses is that CAAS requires all CPL/ATPL holders to gain employment with a 9V- operator. So I have a question here, can a private candidate choose to train with SFC and not be bonded(i.e. not gain employment with a local operator) and hold the CAAS CPL?
I've emailed STATA and they quoted me US$80k for the whole thing, room and board included, which is not bad considering other flight schools ask ~US$50k for training only. Being ST Aerospace make it seem more reputable and trust-worthy as well.
Yantz, SYFC is wholely sponsored by RSAF and have very strong connections with them. SYFC's current management is lead by an active RSAF COL. Local universities are tertiary institutions. As for the NS part, I think he/she meant not going to serve NS. SYFC will take up at least 3 mornings/afternoons and the whole saturday if you take it seriously so its quite impossible to do it serving NS. As I mentioned earlier, I've met NUS students there. Their recruitment staff are quite friendly and flexible.
Macarto, I'm an Infantry OCT in NS commissioning this december. I went through the entire RSAF selection process but choose not to sign on for some personal reasons. I was with SYFC from Jan JC1 to Apr JC2 for the 'wierd' license. I'll be doing a MEng in Aeronautics at Cambridge University after ORD. I'll make up the cross-country flights in UK for the JAA PPL. I've also started preparing for the JAA ATP papers and plan to take them some time during junior year. I think they are valid for 5yrs. After graduation I'm going to the US to finish up the CPL/IR as I have relatives there to stay with. Select flight schools in the US are JAA-complient. But I'll find out more about the SFC/STATA ab-initio instructor contracts as well. Of course during the process I'm hoping to get into SQ cadet. If not I'll go back to SYFC and get my papers converted to CAAS and try for TR/3K in a few yrs time.
I've emailed STATA and they quoted me US$80k for the whole thing, room and board included, which is not bad considering other flight schools ask ~US$50k for training only. Being ST Aerospace make it seem more reputable and trust-worthy as well.
Yantz, SYFC is wholely sponsored by RSAF and have very strong connections with them. SYFC's current management is lead by an active RSAF COL. Local universities are tertiary institutions. As for the NS part, I think he/she meant not going to serve NS. SYFC will take up at least 3 mornings/afternoons and the whole saturday if you take it seriously so its quite impossible to do it serving NS. As I mentioned earlier, I've met NUS students there. Their recruitment staff are quite friendly and flexible.
Macarto, I'm an Infantry OCT in NS commissioning this december. I went through the entire RSAF selection process but choose not to sign on for some personal reasons. I was with SYFC from Jan JC1 to Apr JC2 for the 'wierd' license. I'll be doing a MEng in Aeronautics at Cambridge University after ORD. I'll make up the cross-country flights in UK for the JAA PPL. I've also started preparing for the JAA ATP papers and plan to take them some time during junior year. I think they are valid for 5yrs. After graduation I'm going to the US to finish up the CPL/IR as I have relatives there to stay with. Select flight schools in the US are JAA-complient. But I'll find out more about the SFC/STATA ab-initio instructor contracts as well. Of course during the process I'm hoping to get into SQ cadet. If not I'll go back to SYFC and get my papers converted to CAAS and try for TR/3K in a few yrs time.
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chinjinkiat - I understand better now. Thanks! By the way are you with STATA now?
singapore_flyer- Yeah but i guess SFYC won't take in candidates unless you are in student in one of the schools affiliated to them, eg. NUS, NTU and I am already past schooling hee.. but thanks for the heads up anyway!
singapore_flyer- Yeah but i guess SFYC won't take in candidates unless you are in student in one of the schools affiliated to them, eg. NUS, NTU and I am already past schooling hee.. but thanks for the heads up anyway!
Last edited by Yantz; 26th Sep 2008 at 21:09.