UK SAR 2013 privatisation: the new thread
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 101
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From: England
It has been stated that 'those in the know' are unlikely to be posting on this thread.
The vitriol contained in some of the responses to comments questioning if things are going smoothly are suggestive of, at the very least, an emotional attachment to the project and, more likely, a vested interest in it.
All of which would imply that 'those in the know' are indeed posting here and very actively too.
The vitriol contained in some of the responses to comments questioning if things are going smoothly are suggestive of, at the very least, an emotional attachment to the project and, more likely, a vested interest in it.
All of which would imply that 'those in the know' are indeed posting here and very actively too.
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 18
Likes: 0
From: UK
Crab; I'm so glad I don't have to work with you. You must be an absolute misery to work with.
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 101
Likes: 0
From: England
A New Law
Godwin's Law states' "As an online discussion grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving Nazis or Hitler approaches 1".
Similarly, I propose a law for PPrune threads along the lines of:
As a PPrune thread grows longer, and a commenter feels they are starting to lose the argument, the probability of revealing the name of their antagonist approaches 1.
Given that his anonymity has been lifted a number of times by those unable to counter his arguments successfully I propose the above be known as 'Crab's Law'.
Any seconders?
Similarly, I propose a law for PPrune threads along the lines of:
As a PPrune thread grows longer, and a commenter feels they are starting to lose the argument, the probability of revealing the name of their antagonist approaches 1.
Given that his anonymity has been lifted a number of times by those unable to counter his arguments successfully I propose the above be known as 'Crab's Law'.
Any seconders?
Avoid imitations
Joined: Nov 2000
Aviation Qualifications: ATPL
Posts: 15,111
Likes: 1,085
From: Wandering the FIR and cyberspace often at highly unsociable times
Re NVG and the length of time it might take to train crews.. As an ex military NVG instructor who helped convert a civilian SAR outfit to use them, it seems to me that some are forgetting that civilian SAR ops don't need to be covert.
What requirement is there for winching under NVG? Surely, there isn't one. Use the gogs for nav assist to fly to the scene but go white light once there. Make the place like daylight and look out using the naked eye. It makes life much more simple, rather than practice bleeding!
What requirement is there for winching under NVG? Surely, there isn't one. Use the gogs for nav assist to fly to the scene but go white light once there. Make the place like daylight and look out using the naked eye. It makes life much more simple, rather than practice bleeding!
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 297
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From: Sunnyvale Rest Home for the Elderly
What requirement is there for winching under NVG? Surely, there isn't one. Use the gogs for nav assist to fly to the scene but go white light once there. Make the place like daylight and look out using the naked eye. It makes life much more simple, rather than practice bleeding!
Joined: Apr 2000
Aviation Qualifications: ATP+Mil
Posts: 10,959
Likes: 1,814
From: EGDC
Shy, the RAF SAR Force is well versed in mixing white light and NVG and you are right, winching on purely NVG references is less than ideal since the relatively poor visual acuity (20/35 at best) on goggles means that very accurate positioning is difficult so white light references are preferable.
The problem is when to transfer from NVG to white light and that depends greatly on the conditions at the time - light levels, cloud, rain etc - we teach pilots to approach the scene on goggles and switch on hover/flood/steerable spot lights to see how much 'blowback' (like using full beam in fog) they get.
Sometimes you can get a good white light picture early and use that to establish the hover for the recce, sometimes you end up completing the recce on goggles and only switch to white light fully just before winching - it depends on the situation and available references.
This where being able to open the cockpit sliding door (a la Wessex and Sea King) really helps - shame that isn't an option with S92 or AW 189!
Over the water for a very small vessel or a person, an NVG hover is often best (if HT/AHT isn't workable) as it often gives you a decent visual horizon to work from - again it depends on the night and the wind (light winds leave you in a recirculating ball of spray which is horribly disorientating on NVG).
Because of the variability of the conditions, a lot of training is required, in different conditions, to make sure the crews can deal with whatever they are faced with. A short 'here are NVGs chaps, it's just more hovering' course might look OK on paper but really won't be adequate unless you are just ticking boxes.
Add in the fact that many flights have to deal with everything from flat calm overwater to !!!!ty conditions in blowing snow in the hills then you can see that a proper NVG training package will be required.
Hopefully the goggles on the new SAR service will be at least as good as the NG700s currently used by the SAR Force.
Crab's Law - like it. It usually starts with name calling and personal insults before the 'outing' but I have pretty thick skin.
The problem is when to transfer from NVG to white light and that depends greatly on the conditions at the time - light levels, cloud, rain etc - we teach pilots to approach the scene on goggles and switch on hover/flood/steerable spot lights to see how much 'blowback' (like using full beam in fog) they get.
Sometimes you can get a good white light picture early and use that to establish the hover for the recce, sometimes you end up completing the recce on goggles and only switch to white light fully just before winching - it depends on the situation and available references.
This where being able to open the cockpit sliding door (a la Wessex and Sea King) really helps - shame that isn't an option with S92 or AW 189!
Over the water for a very small vessel or a person, an NVG hover is often best (if HT/AHT isn't workable) as it often gives you a decent visual horizon to work from - again it depends on the night and the wind (light winds leave you in a recirculating ball of spray which is horribly disorientating on NVG).
Because of the variability of the conditions, a lot of training is required, in different conditions, to make sure the crews can deal with whatever they are faced with. A short 'here are NVGs chaps, it's just more hovering' course might look OK on paper but really won't be adequate unless you are just ticking boxes.
Add in the fact that many flights have to deal with everything from flat calm overwater to !!!!ty conditions in blowing snow in the hills then you can see that a proper NVG training package will be required.
Hopefully the goggles on the new SAR service will be at least as good as the NG700s currently used by the SAR Force.
Crab's Law - like it. It usually starts with name calling and personal insults before the 'outing' but I have pretty thick skin.
