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Old 3rd Sep 2008, 19:06
  #21 (permalink)  
 
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Hi! Murt

with reference to your cost comparison

Why didn't you go to Gateway directly and you could have got the course for 44,000 euros approx (70.000 dollars) that a saving of 36,000 euros (58,000 dollars) and if you made a mistake by not going direct, don't encourage others to make the same mistake as you made.

None of the students have anything against PRI/CCA, untill they see how much they would have paid if they had gone directly to the flight school.

So how many helicopter pilots have finished the course now and are they working?

My advice to anyone is to go directly to the school and save your money.
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Old 4th Sep 2008, 00:33
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Confused

Hi all,

I am in the process of searching for flight schools where I can complete my fixed wing, CPL, etc. I've been looking at different schools and CAA was one of them. But reading through the posts gave me a few concerns and questions:

1) There has been a lot of debate over the cost of the course. From looking at it, it seems that there is no question that going to the school directly would save me a tone of money, however; does CAA provide accommodations? Food? Transportation? or would I have to pay that on top of everything else?

2) If CAA does provide all the items I mentioned, would the extra cost not be understandable. Knowing full well that they are most certainly making a profit off of it (though the time I'd save, not to mention the $ in long distance phone bills to find an appartment, would be nice)

3) There seems to be a lot of anger (probably not the best word) towards CAA from some of their former students. Can I expect that kind of "relationship" with the CAA staff, or where there extenuating circumstances?

I appreciate any insight you lads might have. You might save me a load of $!

Cheers

D.
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Old 4th Sep 2008, 13:23
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Hi!

Yes, CCA does pay for food, accomodation and transport, but there is a bus service that will take you to the flight school at a cost of 60 dollars per month, the most you would expect to pay for food and accomodation would be 1,000 per month, things are a lot cheaper here than Ireland.

The flight school that CCA uses is Algonquin flight center, you could try and go directly to the school, have you tried Moncton Flight College, can also JJA.

The about prices are based on North Bay.

The flight schools should help get somewhere to stay.

Best of luck
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Old 5th Sep 2008, 21:00
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Flight training in Canada

Hey Winto22,

Could you advise me on the weather in North Bay, Ontario? Cause I'm interested in the flight training in Canada
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Old 7th Sep 2008, 19:06
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Angel CAA

First of all i would like to mention touch upon what THE REBEL said about the bus service to and from the school that is incorrect ,

CAA have a someone who brings u to and from the school everyday and that is included in your training cost ,

Secondly : Yes CAA does include your accomadation , transportation , meals / shopping everyday and week for each student all included in your training cost stated on the website ,
www.canadianaviationacademy.com

Just to let u know , i am current student in the programme with CAA and i have to admit i have had abosolutely no problem with them at all , they do everything they can for u ,

when u do this course you only get out of it as much as u put in to it,

if u read the post by Murt Kennedy a few posts previous to this , he is a helicopter pilot who is currently doing his training and came through CAA, read what he has to say in his opinion of the the company , facilitles , training etc,

in my opinion i the negative comments coming from X students is due to their attitude and commitment toward the programme and they honestly dont understand what their recieving for what they pay, their speaking / typing before thinking ....

honestly if u are a intrested student and thinking of coming through CAA privite mail me here on PPrune and i can set up phone call with u and answer any question u ma have

any questions or reponses feel free to reply ,
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Old 7th Sep 2008, 22:50
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Lovely plant no?
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Old 9th Sep 2008, 10:25
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Pri/caa Cowboys

having been a past student of PRI/CAA i thought i would add my experiences to the onging debate.

for prospective students this is what you need to know about the company:

- for each of the three years of its the existence the company has changed its name. (i wouldn't want to speculate why however anyone with anything between their ears can realise the significance of that)

-i believe 21 students in total have studied with or are currently studying with PRI/CAA and to date only one student has finished the course. while they were some students who indeed were not dedicated enough to finish the course i can assure they were plenty who were. (i was one)

-out of those 21 students none have gained employment through PRI/CAA

-for the fixed wing course the company charges around the 65000euros (100,000 dollars) mark i believe. a canadian would be charged around 37000 dollars for the same course in the same flight school(as of few months back)

-of course every company has to turn profits however PRI/CAA are purely motivated by profits caring little about the type of pilots they want to produce. if a student wanted to leave the course for whatever reason they can expect nothing in refunds even if they had done little flying. i know one student who left the course having paid 35000 euros, cost the company in total (and being generous) 7,000 euros received a refund of pittance. (the case is ongoing so cant really elaborate there)

-for 75000 euros a student can get a conversion to the JAR system however no one has ever done a conversion with PRI/CAA and you can be assured that they would make every mistake possible before getting it right. it would take an extra 8-12 months for all theory exams and flight conversions, who pays for food, accom and transport during this time period.

-after you pay approximatley 63,000 dollars for food, accomodation and transport you can expect a job instructing.

-as of the beginning of 2008 instructors in Algonquin Flight Centre ( AFC, where you would do your flight training) were getting paid 150 dollars a wk base pay and 20$ per hour of flying. around 8000 p.a. they told me. (thats why there is plenty of instructing jobs in canada and why you would mostly likely get a job instructing on your own)

-after paying 75000euros for something that costs roughly 45000e (taking into a/c conversion) you will have to hand over another 8000 dollars for your instructors rating. in middle of 2008 PRI/CAA was offering its irish students 100 dollars a wk base pay to be instructors and perhaps a watch or something if you do well. (no $ for flight time)

-PRI/CAA did offer us jobs in Africa instead of instructing but that was just another empty promise.

-on the rotary side of things PRI/CAA offer their course for around 80000 euros (120,000 dollars) i believe. the same course can be got for less than 50,000 dollars. check out helicopters canda in north bay want to check the prices out. they used to take the rotary students from PRI/CAA but that relationship soon went sour like most PRI/CAA's.

- one PRI/CAA student just finishing the rotary course was told to off! by the company when he asked about employment as per his contract. to be fair they told him to go home and come back in 9 months when they will have a job for him which guarantees no hours flight time. again PRI/CAA

- the one shinning light with PRI/CAA was the fixed wing flight school (AFC) they have an affiliation with. i felt the flight training itself was very good however PRI/CAA has recently bought shares in the school so im sure it will be operated more like a business rather an aviation orientated school.

-as will all prospective flight schools you should talk to present and if possible past students. however you should be aware of "planted" students like winto22 and ricardo for this company. they care only for themselves, hoping to get students over so they get flight time as instructors, and dont concern themselves with the consequences of students taking out such large loans for no good reason.

in the end aviation it is a very difficult road to walk through however rest assured PRI/CAA will not help you get to end of the road in good shape. all they want is your money and once they have that good luck trying to get anything from them then. your negotiating tool is gone. canada itself is a great country with great people so i wouldnt be too worried about going over there without company. people should be wary of paying lump sums in adavance for flying for with they way the industry is at the minute people will get burned with schools closing because of high fuel prices.

sorry if i rambled on, its been another night of restless sleep thinking about how PRI/CAA me over
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Old 9th Sep 2008, 11:02
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Not to overshadow anything said in that post, all very good points based on your experience I'm sure, but....

-i believe 21 students in total have studied with or are currently studying with PRI/CAA and to date only one student has finished the course.
As of a few weeks ago that's now 2 Not to be pedantic but I think he deserves acknowledgement!

And just to briefly add there seems to be a big difference with the fixed wing versus rotary. I get the impression that the heli-lads are looked after a LOT better than the fixed wing, and encounter a lot less hassle.
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Old 9th Sep 2008, 12:19
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Radio interview CAA students (South Ease Radio)

I heard last week on a local regional radio station 2 young guys who were about to leave for Canada and start training with CAA.

The radio presenter was interviewing them as part of a morning show, I was somewhat surprised to hear what they said on air and I have to say it was a great free advertisement for CAA.

One of the guys spoke about returning to Ireland after a year or so once finished his training and I don't recall him mentioning anything in relation to conversion in the interview.

The other said that he was guaranteed a job as an instructor for the second year and the from that 3rd year on he would be placed as a pilot with an airline . He said "CAA have direct link with Air Canada & have placed pilots there in the past" Also stated was the fact that CAA would provide a job placement for anyone continuing to year 3. The second guy seemed to agree with the statement. The guy not returning to Ireland after training seemed to feel he would guaranteed a job with the Canadian national carrier in year 3!

I'm not trying to knock the training organisation here or the guys but they both said that their parents were helping them out with loans for training! I don't think that a job is a given with any training organisation these days and to choose a school based on that is misleading.

I hope these parents have not re-mortgaged their homes to cover the training. Again I'm not trying to bash the school or the two young guys. I don't know if it is just me but as part of enrollment exams etc (please don't start a debate about FTO enrollment exams and how they serve one simple purpose) you need to perform well in a verbal reasoning test. What is it with some people who read and advert or some "here say" on a website that justifies what they want to do and manage to take from it only what they want to hear and not look at both the pros and cons of any training organisation.

Again this is not a criticism of CAA, but from the interview it gave the distinct impression that these guys had only considered what they were going to do after completing training. They spoke as if walking into a job was a given. They never mentioned how difficult or intense the training would be. This makes you wonder have they really considered everything involved in the course. They also stated CAA would find them a job!

These guys were in their late teens and had just finished school. I'm not sure why only two people have completed the training at CAA but it sounded to me (and this is just my opinion) from the interview that these guys were caught up in a romantic dream of flying and not considered that Canada is a long way from home. A long way from parents who insisted you sit and study for your exams. A long way from the friends you grew up with and Canada as a nation it is still a different culture to home. Most importantly it is a very long way from home comforts and on hand family support when going through the ups and DOWNS of what can be in itself an intensive and stressful training and study regime.

Regardless of the dream of soaring in the clouds it is vitally important to keep ones feet planted firmly on the ground to ensure sound decisions. Something that is a must in the aviation industry given the weight of responsibility carried by the professionals.
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Old 9th Sep 2008, 12:43
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Exclamation

... what county/radio station was this?

Firstly:
He said "CAA have direct link with Air Canada & have placed pilots there in the past" Also stated was the fact that CAA would provide a job placement for anyone continuing to year 3. The second guy seemed to agree with the statement.
This is a lie. Straight to the point - it's a lie. Call it marketing if you want, but having these two guys with the wool over their eyes saying this before they head over like it's gospel leads me to believe it's more than just "clever marketing". It is a lie. Fact.

Algonquin Flight Centre is owned in part by a training captain for Air Jazz, a subsidiary of Air Canada if I recall correctly, who flies a CRJ for them. During my time there he was rarely around and had very little input into the school apart from the business side of things. From what I hear that has changed more recently so fair enough. So you might think, ok, that's not a lie...

However I can confirm that no graduate of CAA/PRI/whatever it is this week has EVER been placed in Air Canada or any airline. 2 graduates here people, I'm one of them. I'm converting my JAA at the moment completely on my own, by choice, same as the other guy - who I don't want to talk on behalf of here really.
My point here is they are lying about past students, and it's stomach turning to think people are being taken in by it face value.
Stomach turning because they lied to me, and the other 9 students who started with me, when we joined telling us they had past students and work placement - to find once we got there that we were the first year of the course.


Secondly:
These guys were in their late teens and had just finished school. I'm not sure why only two people have completed the training at CAA but it sounded to me (and this is just my opinion) from the interview that these guys were caught up in a romantic dream of flying and not considered that Canada is a long way from home. A long way from parents who insisted you sit and study for your exams. A long way from the friends you grew up with and Canada as a nation it is still a different culture to home. Most importantly it is a very long way from home comforts and on hand family support when going through the ups and DOWNS of what can be in itself an intensive and stressful training and study regime.

Regardless of the dream of soaring in the clouds it is vitally important to keep ones feet planted firmly on the ground to ensure sound decisions. Something that is a must in the aviation industry given the weight of responsibility carried by the professionals.
Extremely extremely well said. I really hope that kids in their teens and even those older take heed of this. It should be made a sticky post here! Fair play to you Pjlot
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Old 9th Sep 2008, 12:58
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Hi Zyox

The Radio Station was South East Radio based in Wexford. If I can find the interview on archive I will post it here, I might try and call the researcher of the show in the radio station!

After hearing the interview i was quite annoyed that what can only be described as two young guys just out of leaving cert wishing to follow a dream (and lets face we all have dreams) seemed to have made their decision built on falsities, from whom or where these false statements came I don't know.

I feel bad for them and for their parents and the big training loans. I hope it works out for them but from what I have read there seems to be a very large percentage of participants who don't complete the training at PRI CAA
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Old 9th Sep 2008, 13:21
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Thanks for that Pjlot.

I saw the ad on TV recently for CAA. Was kinda horrified then just ended up grinning at all the photoshops of their new logo onto everything. Also was some press coverage during our stay in Canada, reporter for the Sunday Tribune who made friends with the 2 guys running the show it seems. Took quotes from guys and added lots of his own flavour to them no doubt under instruction from PRI/CAA. There was some coverage in a Kerry newspaper too I think. All planted of course, with a spin put on all the stories.
Got told at the weekend there was some feature in the Sunday Business Post as well.

Cringeworthy stuff how much they're spending on advertising through whatever means to suck people in. If they spent that money and effort on improving the service and making a proper honest go of their company they could be on to a real winner. I always said they had potential and stuck up for them at times, but now it seems there really is no way they are going to change
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Old 10th Sep 2008, 23:52
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In from the cold...

I was considering the CAA option. I even have my medical in Dublin next week! Having read the posts here I have to reconsider the trip Canada. So, my question is, how would one go from zero to being ready for the cockpit of a 737 as quickly as possible without paying over the top? Can you recommend an alternaive to CAA?
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Old 11th Sep 2008, 00:00
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why don't all of you determine what airline or country you ultimately want to work for or in then contact the airline or some of the airlines in said country and ask them where they prefer their candidates train?

this may help you narrow your search

in canada the rumour is that if you are former military or have a university degree then you score more points with our national flag carrier Air Canada

you may also score more points if you went to an accredited aviation college

if the airlines you speak to don't care where you train then you'll have to find the cheapest option
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Old 14th Oct 2008, 21:04
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Flight Instructor CAA

Is there anyone who knows approx. how much it is possible to fly as an instructor fixed wing at CAA, and what they pay hr for flight instruction?
Working in FL,USA for the time , consider to move to Canada.
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Old 20th Oct 2008, 13:37
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A disgraced former student has set out in unison with some collaborators to inflict criminal damage to our Company. It is their intention to discourage and upset students studying with us in Canada. These individuals have been identified through their internet service providers and are being investigated by the revelant legal authorities in Ireland and also by their Canadian counterparts. A dossier collating patent falsehoods are being compiled for prosecution.
I love this, do you even know what criminal damage is? Do you think that by using the name "CAA Legal" you can somehow make people scared of you? Pathetic.

First of all, criminal damage can be defined as "crimes where any person without lawful excuse intentionally or recklessly destroys or damages any property belonging to another.", this has nothing to do with a brand being accused of bad business.

Secondly, if the laws in Ireland set out by Data Protection Commisoner is anything like the United Kingdom (which I'm sure they are) you have no right to gain such private details from the ISP and thus will have no clue about those posting and to further complicate your wonderful post; this being a private law case I highly doubt any official authority would even bother to help you out when this isn't a criminal matter.

Perhaps you should sack your lawyer or stop talking mince.
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Old 20th Oct 2008, 15:25
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For all of ye interested in going to CAA/PRI but are now reconsidering after reading this forum you should try this. Its quite obvious that there are some pretty pissed x-students of CAA here that they’ve made a career out of slagging them. Not to undermine what these guys have been through but I wanted to know how things are now. I rang Tony in the Killorglin office and asked him to set up a call with one of the students over there. Since I didn’t know if I wanted to go for fixed wing or rotary he set me up with a call from both. I ended up speaking to a few students in each house since they all live together and they had nothing but glowing reviews for the place. I even asked about the stuff posted here and we had a bit of a laugh about it. I got the real ‘inside scoop’ and I’m told that the students want for nothing and actually were given way more than what they were promised or thought. My point is that all of these guys that I spoke to can’t be ‘planted’ as is said on this forum. Whatever happened before is long since in the past and I just want to do my training where everything else is taken care of for me and its cheaper then what I would get here plus everyone who does their research knows that Canada is the best for pilot training with the weather and seasons. If you don’t want this option then go to the school yourself but I couldn’t be arsed. I’ll be over to Canada in February.
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Old 21st Oct 2008, 03:34
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My two cents

Just to throw my two cents in. I came over to study the rotary course, through CAA. I started in May and received my commercial license last week, so I took me just over five months to get qualified. I had basically one on one tuition through Gateway Helicopters, which was second to none, I was put up in very nice and comfortable accommodation, the company have treated me well. I know that you could do it privately and it may be cheaper, but it has been hassle free for me, and living with guys who are studying the same course and going through it, was very beneficial for me also.

Obviously some previous students seem to have a problem with CAA, i can't comment on that as I wasn't here then, but I have no complaints at all. I'm working with the guys at the minute to sort out work after Christmas and looking forward to it.

Well there you go.
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Old 22nd Oct 2008, 17:44
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Hi! CCA legal,

Extract from the home page of your web site,
CAA \ WelcomeCanadian Aviation Academy (CAA) strives to provide all of our students with the necessary skills to become a Professional Helicopter Pilot. This is a challenging and exciting career - that also requires hard work and dedication.

Hundreds of successful graduates are now employed as helicopter pilots in Canada as well as around the world. Ground school and flight training are designed to provide graduates with the skills and attitude necessary to operate helicopters efficiently and safely in remote and isolated locations throughout the world. The emphasis in our program is on professionalism and learning operational skills.



How many of the students that came over to North Bay are now working in the industry?
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Old 22nd Oct 2008, 19:32
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ive been trying to make a post here but i mustve been doing it wrong so this one might work rite. i was thinking of going with caa until i heard about this site, now im not so sure. its true they have been changing there name and website a lot, i first saw it last year and theres been a fair price change alrite. can some lads who are over there tell me exactly how many ppl have qualified and have jobs now? if caa can gaurantee jobs at the end of the day then it would seem ok to me, it looks like a good setup too me and you can even fly a heuy helicopter as part of youre training who else lets you do that? since dere saying theyve hundreds working around the world why cant some of them come on here and give testimonials? that would sort out whos telling lies and who isnt. sorry to put ye on the spot caa but i have to be sure before i hand over the cash the other thing that worries me is what happens if i deciede half way through that being a pilot is not for me or im not good at it or get sick, will u still be refunded all the cash youve paid over with the costs subtracted, or is the money payed nonrefundable? if u cant get the money back then im not taking the chance me da would ing kill me!!
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