Newbie looking to upgrade to Cirrus
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Fuji
I very much doubt that people rent out expensive aircraft like the Cirrus at the prices quoted, the truth of the matter is that most of the non equity groups are a business that is built on the basis that the monthly fees collected will more than cover the costs.
Usually these groups are quite large and full of members who all want to fly at the weekends, the truth is that the last thing the owner wants is anyone flying the aircraft as he makes far more money when the aircraft sits on the ground doing nothing. The nightmare sinario for the owner is when a very good weekday pilot shows up and flys the thing a lot during the week and eats all the owners Proffit.
Usually these groups are quite large and full of members who all want to fly at the weekends, the truth is that the last thing the owner wants is anyone flying the aircraft as he makes far more money when the aircraft sits on the ground doing nothing. The nightmare sinario for the owner is when a very good weekday pilot shows up and flys the thing a lot during the week and eats all the owners Proffit.
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Odai
Not sure if you have already been directed to the review below of the SR-20.
A lot of it is still relevant to the SR-22 so perhaps have a look over this to gain further info on the type.
Cirrus SR20 (and a bit about the SR22)
Not sure if you have already been directed to the review below of the SR-20.
A lot of it is still relevant to the SR-22 so perhaps have a look over this to gain further info on the type.
Cirrus SR20 (and a bit about the SR22)
Last edited by Nigd3; 19th Nov 2012 at 21:25. Reason: Cannot spell
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Odai, you look to have decided what you want to fly and anyone disagreeing with that, well.
You have stated you are a new PPL holder. the Cirrus is all and good, but it is set up for the tourer,
The one you are interested in has flight directors, glass flight deck with full GPS. Do you really expect us to believe you are going to practice VOR and ADF flying in somthing so simple.
I looked at that aircraft for touring and decided against it.
I will not post my reasons on here.
Part of the fun of flying is just that, the joy of looking outside and mastering your skill. If you want to fly the Magenta line, then so be it, you will be doing it most of your career anyway.
You are a PPL VFR Pilot, this means you should be looking outside more than the guages, instrument flying comes later.
I would look elsewhere, there are better ways to get hours, and take it from someone who has been there, it willnot make a jot of difference what your flying when your CV lands on the HR office desk.
You have stated you are a new PPL holder. the Cirrus is all and good, but it is set up for the tourer,
The one you are interested in has flight directors, glass flight deck with full GPS. Do you really expect us to believe you are going to practice VOR and ADF flying in somthing so simple.
I looked at that aircraft for touring and decided against it.
I will not post my reasons on here.
Part of the fun of flying is just that, the joy of looking outside and mastering your skill. If you want to fly the Magenta line, then so be it, you will be doing it most of your career anyway.
You are a PPL VFR Pilot, this means you should be looking outside more than the guages, instrument flying comes later.
I would look elsewhere, there are better ways to get hours, and take it from someone who has been there, it willnot make a jot of difference what your flying when your CV lands on the HR office desk.
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ford cortina
You are right (why pay for fancy kit if you don't plan on using it?). However if you look at previous threads started by the OP, it's clear that he's not big on listening to the advice of some very experienced pilots on here. I'm by no means massively experienced, albeit well over ten years flying, but I've been around the block long enough to know how some things work.
Hence my decision to give up with offering advice based on his questions. It's not up to us to spend his money. He's clearly found a way of hiring a Cirrus for a) less money than a C152 / PA28 and b) less money than the fuel it costs to run the aeroplane. He clearly believes he knows far more than the experienced people on here know about aviation, so I'm thinking maybe his posts are trolling for fun.
You are right (why pay for fancy kit if you don't plan on using it?). However if you look at previous threads started by the OP, it's clear that he's not big on listening to the advice of some very experienced pilots on here. I'm by no means massively experienced, albeit well over ten years flying, but I've been around the block long enough to know how some things work.
Hence my decision to give up with offering advice based on his questions. It's not up to us to spend his money. He's clearly found a way of hiring a Cirrus for a) less money than a C152 / PA28 and b) less money than the fuel it costs to run the aeroplane. He clearly believes he knows far more than the experienced people on here know about aviation, so I'm thinking maybe his posts are trolling for fun.
Last edited by fwjc; 20th Nov 2012 at 19:33. Reason: Minor edit for clarity
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I went through this some years ago when renting out a new TB20GT, for four years.
Just about everybody who could fly already had their own plane. That's the basic problem, which ensures that what is left is very thin.
Airline pilots like rag and tube flying, not nice capable planes, which removes just about all remaining pilots who are current at any "tech" level.
I did get a couple of good people. One of them then lost his job and the other got his wife's thumb-down when she dropped a sprog.
The rest came with various levels of "issues". I had two instructors who messed with the plane (e.g. tampered with the fuel flowmeter to get lower fuel invoices, or claimed the duty drawback and pocketed it). One of the two was a Grade A shyster who vanished not long afterwards. I had a variety of private owners who rarely flew and some insisted on flying abroad with a map+stopwatch (not in my plane, thank you, especially not in France).
I also had to set up a Ltd Company for this (for liability limitation reasons) and then HMRC got interested over BIK.
Too much hassle, which is why almost nobody rents out anything that's half decent. The SR22 "zero equity" ventures charge a massive hourly fee, on top of an eye watering hour block purchase fee which weeds out anybody less than very determined. I suspect most of their business is a pilot taking a classy bird out to LTQ
Just about everybody who could fly already had their own plane. That's the basic problem, which ensures that what is left is very thin.
Airline pilots like rag and tube flying, not nice capable planes, which removes just about all remaining pilots who are current at any "tech" level.
I did get a couple of good people. One of them then lost his job and the other got his wife's thumb-down when she dropped a sprog.
The rest came with various levels of "issues". I had two instructors who messed with the plane (e.g. tampered with the fuel flowmeter to get lower fuel invoices, or claimed the duty drawback and pocketed it). One of the two was a Grade A shyster who vanished not long afterwards. I had a variety of private owners who rarely flew and some insisted on flying abroad with a map+stopwatch (not in my plane, thank you, especially not in France).
I also had to set up a Ltd Company for this (for liability limitation reasons) and then HMRC got interested over BIK.
Too much hassle, which is why almost nobody rents out anything that's half decent. The SR22 "zero equity" ventures charge a massive hourly fee, on top of an eye watering hour block purchase fee which weeds out anybody less than very determined. I suspect most of their business is a pilot taking a classy bird out to LTQ
Last edited by peterh337; 20th Nov 2012 at 18:05.
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Originally Posted by A and C
I very much doubt that people rent out expensive aircraft like the Cirrus at the prices quoted, the truth of the matter is that most of the non equity groups are a business that is built on the basis that the monthly fees collected will more than cover the costs.
I don't know why there's such disbelief at the wet rate, it seems perfectly within range given the typical Cirrus fuel burn and cost of Avgas at Blackpool (about 40 litres/hour and £2/litre I think)?
Originally Posted by Nigd3
Odai
Not sure if you have already been directed to the review below of the SR-20.
A lot of it is still relevant to the SR-22 so perhaps have a look over this to gain further info on the type.
Cirrus SR20 (and a bit about the SR22)
Not sure if you have already been directed to the review below of the SR-20.
A lot of it is still relevant to the SR-22 so perhaps have a look over this to gain further info on the type.
Cirrus SR20 (and a bit about the SR22)
Originally Posted by fwjc
You are right (why pay for fancy kit if you don't plan on using it?).
He clearly believes he knows far more than the experienced people on here know about aviation, so I'm thinking maybe his posts are trolling for fun.
Originally Posted by Above the Clouds
fwjc your right I spotted this a while ago with "Odai" and do believe he is just another troll, likewise I get fed up posting things that I feel maybe of use to people.
I didn't say I wanted to settle on the Cirrus for sure, I simply said I don't think it's a good idea to rule it out at this stage just because of some the debatable reasons given to me. I may choose an airplane now and switch later on when I feel more confident or have completed more advanced training like the IMC or night rating. I did have concerns about possibly finding myself out of my depth in the Cirrus airplane as a new PPL, but those were addressed at the beginning of the thread. Everything else was pages of posts with those who insisted they knew better arguing with myself and other members. Like I've said repeatedly, I appreciate everyone's comments and time but some of the content is just irrelevant to me and I'm not interested in debating it. I appreciate this isn't a typical route for a student looking to be financially conservative, but that is neither here nor there. I am not looking for input on what plane I should be flying or not fly and the reasons why.
All I am looking for, as I've repeatedly said, is advice on how to look for and links to available groups in the NW (I guess I should have started a new thread considering what this has descended into...). Although there has been some great advice in this thread and I now have various appointments to check aircraft out at Liverpool and Blackpool, I would still appreciate any help with this as always. Like I said, the only places I've known to check out are the UKGA classifieds and the Flyer forums. If anyone has any other suggestions that'd be great.
Last edited by Odai; 22nd Nov 2012 at 00:36.
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I would still appreciate any help with this as always. Like I said, the only places I've known to check out are the UKGA classifieds and the Flyer forums. If anyone has any other suggestions that'd be great.
You will soon suss out if the field is suitable and any options to hire what you are looking for.
have you for example been to Manchester Barton?
Occasionally I fly into Barton (SR22) and it looks really interesting and I imagine plenty of options.
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Odia
With great precision you miss the point, the aircraft you are looking at makes more money for the owner if it never flys so why should the owner encourage it to be flown ?
You as a low time PPL are a dream customer for the group, with the combination of aircraft avalabilty and the limitations of the UK weather on you as a new PPL you will not get to fly the aircraft very much and I would hazard a guess that by the end of year one your hourly cost for an hours flying will be IRO £270.
It would be interesting to get an idea of the composition of the group, because being based at an airfield with instrument approaches the last person the owner would want to rent to would be a high time pilot with an IR and business interests all over the place. Are their any guys like that in the group ?
As always only time will tell if I am correct but I have been around long enough to have seen it all before!
You as a low time PPL are a dream customer for the group, with the combination of aircraft avalabilty and the limitations of the UK weather on you as a new PPL you will not get to fly the aircraft very much and I would hazard a guess that by the end of year one your hourly cost for an hours flying will be IRO £270.
It would be interesting to get an idea of the composition of the group, because being based at an airfield with instrument approaches the last person the owner would want to rent to would be a high time pilot with an IR and business interests all over the place. Are their any guys like that in the group ?
As always only time will tell if I am correct but I have been around long enough to have seen it all before!
Last edited by A and C; 22nd Nov 2012 at 08:11.
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Non equity Cirrus
I was in the Cirrus group at Blackpool since it was formed (I was in the Piper Archer III group before that) until earlier this year.
A quick calculation, including the monthly fee, and it has worked out at about £140 per hour wet. Availability wasn't a problem for me and have had several trips with overnight stays in France and Eire. The monthly fee was £120 when I joined though.
Availability never proved to be a problem, I just booked whole days in the internet system. You can hold 3 confirmed bookings and one "trip" (multiple days) in the booking system at a time, and this worked fine for me.
Without this group I would never have got to fly a Cirrus and I am grateful for that.
A quick calculation, including the monthly fee, and it has worked out at about £140 per hour wet. Availability wasn't a problem for me and have had several trips with overnight stays in France and Eire. The monthly fee was £120 when I joined though.
Availability never proved to be a problem, I just booked whole days in the internet system. You can hold 3 confirmed bookings and one "trip" (multiple days) in the booking system at a time, and this worked fine for me.
Without this group I would never have got to fly a Cirrus and I am grateful for that.
Last edited by baldwinm; 22nd Nov 2012 at 08:26.
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harsh reality
Odai,
Nothing wrong with aspirations. Use the experience and advice given here wisely they do know what they are talking about.
Take one step at a time and get your ppl first.
the honey moon period follows (no harm with that).
The first 100 hrs at least after gaining your ppl is the personal character forming basis that will stay with you until the day you stop flying.
My advice: Stay at your LOCAL airfield, get your ppl, then take 6 mths to a year to weigh up things and just enjoy the flying in the aeroplane you have learnt on.
Avoid taking offence as you seem to be doing in your often defensive manor when folks on here give you words of wisdom.
Happy flying
Nothing wrong with aspirations. Use the experience and advice given here wisely they do know what they are talking about.
Take one step at a time and get your ppl first.
the honey moon period follows (no harm with that).
The first 100 hrs at least after gaining your ppl is the personal character forming basis that will stay with you until the day you stop flying.
My advice: Stay at your LOCAL airfield, get your ppl, then take 6 mths to a year to weigh up things and just enjoy the flying in the aeroplane you have learnt on.
Avoid taking offence as you seem to be doing in your often defensive manor when folks on here give you words of wisdom.
Happy flying
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You only learn by hard experience! Many of us here have flown many types of singles and twins in bad weather summer, winter day night!
Many of those aircraft have been pretty basic and that develops your skills and situational awareness in a way that no pilot assist, all singing and dancing aircraft could possibly do.
An aircraft that makes you work and have to think for yourself means that when you do fly aircraft with all the pilot assist aids the two will compliment each other rather than one making up for a lack of skills of the pilot!
Even if you have money to burn I would still recommend that route too!
Pace
Many of those aircraft have been pretty basic and that develops your skills and situational awareness in a way that no pilot assist, all singing and dancing aircraft could possibly do.
An aircraft that makes you work and have to think for yourself means that when you do fly aircraft with all the pilot assist aids the two will compliment each other rather than one making up for a lack of skills of the pilot!
Even if you have money to burn I would still recommend that route too!
Pace
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My 2p worth.
OP, if you're just flying privately after getting your PPL then there's no reason not to upgrade to the Cirrus, or whatever else takes your fancy straight away.
On the other hand if you're hour builidng towards starting the CPL, as many others have said, it makes sense to do the hour builidng in the the same type of aircraft (and ideally the same geographical area) as you will do your CPL in. Most CPL schools do not use Cirruses (Ciri?). That's the approach I've been taking and endorsed by the school I'm planning to do my CPL with.
The PA28 you did your PPL on may well be "easy to fly" but flying to CPL standards is a different kettle of fish and you will be held up to a much higher standard in pilotage, DR navigation using a stopwatch and compass. Why not use your hour building to hone these techniques? Then you'll have an easier transition into the complex type you will do your CPL skills test on (likely to be an Arrow). You might struggle to "downgrade" to an Arrow once you've got used to a Cirrus with an avionics suite that would shame an A380!
I've tried to practise flying without any electronic assistance where possible. I found that going up in a C172 with a g430 fitted was making me lazy and over reliant on the 'magenta line'. I can imagine this would only be worse in an aircraft like the Cirrus. Going flying without a GPS no doubt seems shocking to some people but I've found it concentrates the mind, and is more reflective of the skill set you are supposed to be hour building towards.
OP, if you're just flying privately after getting your PPL then there's no reason not to upgrade to the Cirrus, or whatever else takes your fancy straight away.
On the other hand if you're hour builidng towards starting the CPL, as many others have said, it makes sense to do the hour builidng in the the same type of aircraft (and ideally the same geographical area) as you will do your CPL in. Most CPL schools do not use Cirruses (Ciri?)
. That's the approach I've been taking and endorsed by the school I'm planning to do my CPL with. The PA28 you did your PPL on may well be "easy to fly" but flying to CPL standards is a different kettle of fish and you will be held up to a much higher standard in pilotage, DR navigation using a stopwatch and compass. Why not use your hour building to hone these techniques? Then you'll have an easier transition into the complex type you will do your CPL skills test on (likely to be an Arrow). You might struggle to "downgrade" to an Arrow once you've got used to a Cirrus with an avionics suite that would shame an A380!
I've tried to practise flying without any electronic assistance where possible. I found that going up in a C172 with a g430 fitted was making me lazy and over reliant on the 'magenta line'. I can imagine this would only be worse in an aircraft like the Cirrus. Going flying without a GPS no doubt seems shocking to some people but I've found it concentrates the mind, and is more reflective of the skill set you are supposed to be hour building towards.
Last edited by taxistaxing; 22nd Nov 2012 at 14:16.
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Odai
Odai
Get your PPL first.
The only other aircraft in your area is a PA-28 Arrow that may satisfy your needs, however shares/ costs can be expensive.
There is nothing wrong with the basic warrior.
Cheap hour building would be to join the scheme at the flying school you are learning at. (Saving money at this stage is key) unless money is not an issue.
Get your PPL first.
The only other aircraft in your area is a PA-28 Arrow that may satisfy your needs, however shares/ costs can be expensive.
There is nothing wrong with the basic warrior.
Cheap hour building would be to join the scheme at the flying school you are learning at. (Saving money at this stage is key) unless money is not an issue.
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Thanks again for the responses.
007Helicopter, this is what I'm doing at the moment, I'm making appointments to turn up and have a look at various aircraft/clubs etc and hope to try and get a feel for the place when I go. At the moment looking at Blackpool and Liverpool (the latter being much more convenient due to distance). At Blackpool I'm looking at AGL, Westair, and Flybpl. At Liverpool I'm looking at LFS, Lomac, and the Azure flying club.
The only other local fields I know of are Warton, Barton, Hawarden and Woodvale.
There doesn't seem to be any clubs open to the public at Warton, nor at Hawarden or Woodvale. As I understand it, Woodvale is an RAF base with Warton and Hawarden belonging to BAE and EADS respectively. Unless I'm missing something?
I am currently based at Barton having done almost all of my PPL training there. It's not somewhere I'd really want to stay for my PPL, at least not for a long term thing like a non equity contract. The main reason for this is its poor suitability during the bad weather over the winter (airfield closing due to flooding etc).
A and C, I understand your point but I think you're being hugely pessimistic. Your estimate for the actual hourly rate assumes I'd fly less than once a month. My schedule at the moment is quite flexible so I'd be looking to fly closer to about 1-2 hours a week. So a conservative estimate is more likely to be around £120 per hour (assuming 6 hours a month, £90/hr, £150/month, landing fees etc). That's not too different from estimates for the 150s/PA28s etc I've found. Especially when you consider that equity shares are not an option at this stage.
Baldwinm, thanks for the insight into the group. When I visited AGL at Blackpool the person showing me around let me have a look at the booking system to see what typical availability was like. It didn't seem bad at all and I don't forsee issues with being able to fit in a couple of hours a week.
Kestrel, just to clarify these plans are all for after I gain my PPL.
Pace, I appreciate this point, but what I'm saying is that just because the equipment is there, it is not the case that I will rely on it. There is nothing to stop me from purely hand flying something like the Cirrus and only relying on DR navigation. If anything, trying to keep up with landmarks and calculating track error angles at 140KIAS whilst handling a slippery airplane has to be more difficult than the challenge posed by a typical (stable) PA28.
Taxistaxing, I am not yet certain I want to fly commercially. However, I am planning my flying on the basis that I will do the CPL to be on the safe side.
I am not sure what you are saying in your post - are you saying that I should learn in an aircraft that is similar to what I will fly for the CPL so that I am used to it and therefore find it easier to fly, or that I should find an aircraft that is more difficult to fly therefore preparing me better for the more demanding challenges during CPL training? If it is the latter I still maintain flying something like a Cirrus over a PA28 or similar is ideal, considering it is more difficult to fly and demands a higher level of accuracy?
Unless your point is that I'd simply be tempted to just use autopilot and GPS.
I agree with your comments, but there's nothing to stop me from flying even something like the Cirrus with just the basic instruments, a map, and a good view outside.
Thanks again,
Odai.
007Helicopter, this is what I'm doing at the moment, I'm making appointments to turn up and have a look at various aircraft/clubs etc and hope to try and get a feel for the place when I go. At the moment looking at Blackpool and Liverpool (the latter being much more convenient due to distance). At Blackpool I'm looking at AGL, Westair, and Flybpl. At Liverpool I'm looking at LFS, Lomac, and the Azure flying club.
The only other local fields I know of are Warton, Barton, Hawarden and Woodvale.
There doesn't seem to be any clubs open to the public at Warton, nor at Hawarden or Woodvale. As I understand it, Woodvale is an RAF base with Warton and Hawarden belonging to BAE and EADS respectively. Unless I'm missing something?
I am currently based at Barton having done almost all of my PPL training there. It's not somewhere I'd really want to stay for my PPL, at least not for a long term thing like a non equity contract. The main reason for this is its poor suitability during the bad weather over the winter (airfield closing due to flooding etc).
A and C, I understand your point but I think you're being hugely pessimistic. Your estimate for the actual hourly rate assumes I'd fly less than once a month. My schedule at the moment is quite flexible so I'd be looking to fly closer to about 1-2 hours a week. So a conservative estimate is more likely to be around £120 per hour (assuming 6 hours a month, £90/hr, £150/month, landing fees etc). That's not too different from estimates for the 150s/PA28s etc I've found. Especially when you consider that equity shares are not an option at this stage.
Baldwinm, thanks for the insight into the group. When I visited AGL at Blackpool the person showing me around let me have a look at the booking system to see what typical availability was like. It didn't seem bad at all and I don't forsee issues with being able to fit in a couple of hours a week.
Kestrel, just to clarify these plans are all for after I gain my PPL.
Pace, I appreciate this point, but what I'm saying is that just because the equipment is there, it is not the case that I will rely on it. There is nothing to stop me from purely hand flying something like the Cirrus and only relying on DR navigation. If anything, trying to keep up with landmarks and calculating track error angles at 140KIAS whilst handling a slippery airplane has to be more difficult than the challenge posed by a typical (stable) PA28.
Taxistaxing, I am not yet certain I want to fly commercially. However, I am planning my flying on the basis that I will do the CPL to be on the safe side.
I am not sure what you are saying in your post - are you saying that I should learn in an aircraft that is similar to what I will fly for the CPL so that I am used to it and therefore find it easier to fly, or that I should find an aircraft that is more difficult to fly therefore preparing me better for the more demanding challenges during CPL training? If it is the latter I still maintain flying something like a Cirrus over a PA28 or similar is ideal, considering it is more difficult to fly and demands a higher level of accuracy?
Unless your point is that I'd simply be tempted to just use autopilot and GPS.
I agree with your comments, but there's nothing to stop me from flying even something like the Cirrus with just the basic instruments, a map, and a good view outside.
Thanks again,
Odai.
Last edited by Odai; 24th Nov 2012 at 18:26.
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Odai
One of the Blackpool Cirrus groups has been connected with someone who is to appear at Preston Crown Court in the near future.
If I was you I would make sure of the stability of group before parting with money.
And yes you are correct that I am very pessimistic when it comes to aircraft costs............ After thirty years in the business I am usually correct when it comes to costs, I think that the group has got it's cost predictions wrong if you get the flying at the rate you state, in short it is not financially sustainable.
If I was you I would make sure of the stability of group before parting with money.
And yes you are correct that I am very pessimistic when it comes to aircraft costs............ After thirty years in the business I am usually correct when it comes to costs, I think that the group has got it's cost predictions wrong if you get the flying at the rate you state, in short it is not financially sustainable.
Last edited by A and C; 25th Nov 2012 at 07:17.
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Odai, from your OP, I understand you have about 55 hours and have not yet completed your Private Pilot License.
I don't know anything about the Cirrus, except that it seems to show up in the news when the owner by poor planning or general incompetence has to pull the chute. Destroying the aircraft, usually, but saving his butt, and his passengers.
Much is made of it being a slippery type, and just like in a high performance glider, the approach speed must be nailed.
I'm not going to give you any advice at all, at your stage of experience you still have a lot to learn. But please can I say to all you chaps who find the GPS an exceedingly useful device, which I used extensively and happily when it first appeared, do not spend so much time looking at your fancy instrumentation, but look out for other aircraft. Not a word has been said about lookout in this entire discussion.
I don't know anything about the Cirrus, except that it seems to show up in the news when the owner by poor planning or general incompetence has to pull the chute. Destroying the aircraft, usually, but saving his butt, and his passengers.
Much is made of it being a slippery type, and just like in a high performance glider, the approach speed must be nailed.
I'm not going to give you any advice at all, at your stage of experience you still have a lot to learn. But please can I say to all you chaps who find the GPS an exceedingly useful device, which I used extensively and happily when it first appeared, do not spend so much time looking at your fancy instrumentation, but look out for other aircraft. Not a word has been said about lookout in this entire discussion.
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To clarify, I do not yet have 55 hours - rather, I expect to complete my PPL around the 55 hour mark.
The reason it has taken so many hours is down to a very long break that I had to take in the middle of my PPL (about 2.5 years).
The reason it has taken so many hours is down to a very long break that I had to take in the middle of my PPL (about 2.5 years).
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Mary meagher got it one. You are expecting to be a PPL pilot, which means VFR flying, you should be spending most of your time with your head outside of the cockpit learning to navigate by sight, hand fly, trim etc.
I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but if you do get your CPL/IR ME and get a job on jets, there is a good chance you will be flying some basic stuff.
Jet2 have a mainly 737 classic fleet, which means you will need to know your scan, the glass on the classic is not much o be fair, I should know, I fly a 300.
I don't really understand why you feel the Cirrus is different from a 172 etc, they all are the same, they fly and if you mess up they can and will bite you.
The problem is simple, you have already decided to go for the Cirrus, you just want someone to agree its the correct choice.
I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but if you do get your CPL/IR ME and get a job on jets, there is a good chance you will be flying some basic stuff.
Jet2 have a mainly 737 classic fleet, which means you will need to know your scan, the glass on the classic is not much o be fair, I should know, I fly a 300.
I don't really understand why you feel the Cirrus is different from a 172 etc, they all are the same, they fly and if you mess up they can and will bite you.
The problem is simple, you have already decided to go for the Cirrus, you just want someone to agree its the correct choice.
Last edited by ford cortina; 24th Nov 2012 at 21:47.
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Cirrus chute pull
Perhaps I should not be giving a bit of honest advise and keep my mouth shut, we did quite well out of the first Cirrus chute deployment in the UK, perhaps a few more would futher line the pockets !
Last edited by A and C; 25th Nov 2012 at 09:49. Reason: A request for more clarity
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ford cortina
I have to agree with you wholeheartedly.
mary meagher
This is a really good point, well made. And so true.
A and C
Again, nowhere near your experience, but enough to know that you are right (from personal experiences)
Odai
Before you go much further with your commercial aspirations, have you confirmed that you can get a Class 1 medical? The only certain way to do this is to go to Gatwick and get yourself one. Otherwise you'll be wasting your time, and could be exploring a whole wide world of GA flying, including touring and having real fun instead. In that case, leaping straight into a Cirrus is a completely different kettle of fish since GA flying is a different proposition to commercial training.
The problem is simple, you have already decided to go for the Cirrus, you just want someone to agree its the correct choice.
mary meagher
do not spend so much time looking at your fancy instrumentation, but look out for other aircraft
A and C
you are correct that I am very pessimistic when it comes to aircraft costs............ After thirty years in the business I am usually correct when it comes to costs
Odai
Before you go much further with your commercial aspirations, have you confirmed that you can get a Class 1 medical? The only certain way to do this is to go to Gatwick and get yourself one. Otherwise you'll be wasting your time, and could be exploring a whole wide world of GA flying, including touring and having real fun instead. In that case, leaping straight into a Cirrus is a completely different kettle of fish since GA flying is a different proposition to commercial training.