BA Strike - Your Thoughts & Questions
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The strike is almost over Unite appears to have failed to bring down BA
The strike is collapsing. Here is a posting from a cabin crew member on BA's world wide fleet:
I thought I would give you an update from the floor!
I was rostered to operate a flight yesterday morning, which I did without any problems. I parked at the carpark and took the bus to T5 with some other crew. I definitely wasn't alone and there were probably 7 or 8 other cabin crew on the bus. I got to the CRC and found it to be very crowded. There were crew everywhere and I talked to one of the managers who said they didn't expect such a high turnout. This is why very few volunteers never got to work yesterday. If BASSA honestly believes 80% crew were on strike they are living in denial.
My flight operated with a full crew complement (no volunteers or ICC). The flight was chock-a-block but it went extremely well. All crew did an excellent job and all the passengers were pleased that they were getting to their destination.
I listened to what BF was saying yesterday and it's extremely worrying that crew will be let go after this strike. This would be compulsory redundancies in a very long time in the history of BA. Our beloved union BASSA can be held responsible for this. Well done BASSA!
This strike is almost coming to an end and I'm confident BA will deal with next weekend's strike too.
I thought I would give you an update from the floor!
I was rostered to operate a flight yesterday morning, which I did without any problems. I parked at the carpark and took the bus to T5 with some other crew. I definitely wasn't alone and there were probably 7 or 8 other cabin crew on the bus. I got to the CRC and found it to be very crowded. There were crew everywhere and I talked to one of the managers who said they didn't expect such a high turnout. This is why very few volunteers never got to work yesterday. If BASSA honestly believes 80% crew were on strike they are living in denial.
My flight operated with a full crew complement (no volunteers or ICC). The flight was chock-a-block but it went extremely well. All crew did an excellent job and all the passengers were pleased that they were getting to their destination.
I listened to what BF was saying yesterday and it's extremely worrying that crew will be let go after this strike. This would be compulsory redundancies in a very long time in the history of BA. Our beloved union BASSA can be held responsible for this. Well done BASSA!
This strike is almost coming to an end and I'm confident BA will deal with next weekend's strike too.
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From ITN
Amazing. Still banging on about how successful they are. I really would not have these people representing me. You would never know if they were telling the truth or not
Unite and the airline clashed over the impact of the first two days of a three-day walkout, giving wildly different statements about the numbers supporting the action.
Chancellor Alistair Darling said the strike was "totally unnecessary" and continued the government line that the two sides needed to resume talks.
Tony Woodley, joint leader of Unite attacked the "macho" management style of chief executive Willie Walsh and said it was time for the airline's chairman Martin Broughton and "sensible" directors to intervene.
He said that despite "propaganda" from BA about the number of staff working during the weekend's strike, he was certain that the vast majority of Unite members were taking industrial action: "Contrary to the spin from the company about this strike collapsing, only nine cabin crew have broken ranks and 80 have gone sick. I am now appealing to the BA chairman and sensible members of the board to use their influence, put passengers first, and return to the negotiating table for the good of everyone."
Mr Woodley wrote an open letter to cabin crew congratulating them on their "magnificent" support for the strike, which is due to continue on Monday, followed by a four day walkout from next Saturday.
Chancellor Alistair Darling said the strike was "totally unnecessary" and continued the government line that the two sides needed to resume talks.
Tony Woodley, joint leader of Unite attacked the "macho" management style of chief executive Willie Walsh and said it was time for the airline's chairman Martin Broughton and "sensible" directors to intervene.
He said that despite "propaganda" from BA about the number of staff working during the weekend's strike, he was certain that the vast majority of Unite members were taking industrial action: "Contrary to the spin from the company about this strike collapsing, only nine cabin crew have broken ranks and 80 have gone sick. I am now appealing to the BA chairman and sensible members of the board to use their influence, put passengers first, and return to the negotiating table for the good of everyone."
Mr Woodley wrote an open letter to cabin crew congratulating them on their "magnificent" support for the strike, which is due to continue on Monday, followed by a four day walkout from next Saturday.
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On the basis of that last [reported] bit of gibberish from Mr Woodley, I think there are strong grounds for Mr Walsh and BA to carry on under the current arrangements.
No conflict, no arguments, no negotiations ... just let Unite and BASSA fade gently into the sunset, taking their handful of militants with them.
[Ooops ... have I revealed Mr Walsh's game plan?
]
No conflict, no arguments, no negotiations ... just let Unite and BASSA fade gently into the sunset, taking their handful of militants with them.
[Ooops ... have I revealed Mr Walsh's game plan?
]
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Quote:
You deplore employees traveling in Business Class??? Try and fly 24 hours to Sydney and then get off the plane at 6.30am and be in the office for 9am to do a productive day's at work on site with a client that earns your company £1250 minimum!
Then go a day earlier. Even a nights hotel won't bust the bank comparing the difference between business and economy fares. When my old company went through the cost cutting regime, we did this and it wasn't unpleasant at all.
"To earn the company £1250" err less than the cost of the flight
Best take Evanelplus advice , go economy stay overnight in an Hotel
Jack
You deplore employees traveling in Business Class??? Try and fly 24 hours to Sydney and then get off the plane at 6.30am and be in the office for 9am to do a productive day's at work on site with a client that earns your company £1250 minimum!
Then go a day earlier. Even a nights hotel won't bust the bank comparing the difference between business and economy fares. When my old company went through the cost cutting regime, we did this and it wasn't unpleasant at all.
"To earn the company £1250" err less than the cost of the flight
Best take Evanelplus advice , go economy stay overnight in an Hotel
Jack
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"(I've recounted this before) Working for a client in HKG in the 90s. LHR-SFO two days biz for them. SFO-HKG arrive 18:00 and straight to bed. Arrived office Thursday morning knowing that the Friday was the BIG day with the three finalists in the Tender doing their presentations on a critical communications project. I was the lead consultant. So I had a day to catch up.
No. I was told the presentations had been brought forward to save a day. They had made me do both long hauls in Y as they would not pay more (PE did not exist). Result? I fell asleep during the presentations."
Sorry I do not get it?
You flew early and had a nights sleep, then arrived at the conference refreshed and ready to go but the main work had been done the day before as it had been brought forward, In which case, you would have arrived at the office at exactly the same time as you did only having slept on board on the way business class
(A night in a hotel is a much sounder sleep than on a flight)
You would have been a day late anyway but not refreshed!
Jack
No. I was told the presentations had been brought forward to save a day. They had made me do both long hauls in Y as they would not pay more (PE did not exist). Result? I fell asleep during the presentations."
Sorry I do not get it?
You flew early and had a nights sleep, then arrived at the conference refreshed and ready to go but the main work had been done the day before as it had been brought forward, In which case, you would have arrived at the office at exactly the same time as you did only having slept on board on the way business class
(A night in a hotel is a much sounder sleep than on a flight)
You would have been a day late anyway but not refreshed!
Jack
Paxing All Over The World
JackMcHammocklashing
Sorry if I did not spell it out. Within four days, I had done two days business and travelled two thirds of the way around the globe in Y (some 21 hours of flight time alone, excluding airport time). I had one night's sleep at my destination with my body clock still out by eight hours. So I fell asleep at work.
Had the client have paid for me to get better rest on the two nights I had in Y, then he would have got his money's worth out of me. But he decided to 'save' money on the flight - because it could be seen by his manager. The fact that he lost money on me being non-productive was not visible to his manager. But his staff knew that he had penny pinched and were sympathetic to my situation. So - we ALL lost.
Now, back to the subject of the thread:
LH747
Hhmmm, not quite. The mgmt have been doing that for 20 years but, due to the union's backward looking action - they will cop a huge amount of the blame.
Sorry I do not get it?
Had the client have paid for me to get better rest on the two nights I had in Y, then he would have got his money's worth out of me. But he decided to 'save' money on the flight - because it could be seen by his manager. The fact that he lost money on me being non-productive was not visible to his manager. But his staff knew that he had penny pinched and were sympathetic to my situation. So - we ALL lost.
Now, back to the subject of the thread:
LH747
Whilst it only takes a matter of days for the few mindless fools from the Unite leadership to call a strike and tear it all down.
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Amazing. Still banging on about how successful they are.
Do you really expect Unite to say; "support for the strike has been less than expected, it looks like BA is going to win but we are continuing with the strike because we don't have any better ideas"?
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Someone took the time to research and refute the BS from the BASSA Ministry of Disinformation:
Since this Union have been lying to everyone, its members included, for more than a year, none of their current litany of lies raises even a gentle eyebrow to those in the know.
The following is a point-by-point break down of Unite The Union’s press releases yesterday morning, Saturday the 20th of March:
- Unite The Union Release: British Airways has managed to fly only one third of its normal scheduled departures
- BA Strike Fact: British Airways publicly stated it would be operating 65% of its regularly scheduled flights during the strike a week prior to the strike. British Airways actually exceeded its estimates of 65% by reinstating more than 20 flights when more cabin crew than expected reported for duty.
- United The Union Release: BA’s flagship terminal T5 is a ghost town as passengers stay away
- BA Strike Fact: By all reported by witnesses on the ground, Heathrow Terminal 5 was very active. Passengers activity may have been a bit lighter than usual, however the first day of the strike was a Saturday and some people has swapped flights t avoid the strike, however by all independent eye witness reports T5 was busy.
- Unite The Union Release: The first long haul BA flight out (10am) was to Abu Dhabi
- BA Strike Fact: The first British Airways long haul flight to depart was in fact flight BA 117 to New York’s JFK at 8:20am. It departed on-time.
- Unite The Union Release: From 12.20pm until 2.30pm only 10 flights departed from Heathrow, normally there would be 50 during the same period
- BA Strike Fact: Between 12:20pm and 2:30pm the departure board from BAA’s London Heathrow Airport shows that 34 British Airways flights pushed back and departed the airport.
- Unite The Union Release: 20 more planes had been moved to Cardiff to be parked, and a further 20 flown to Shannon, in western Ireland, to sit out the strike
- BA Strike Fact: British Airways positioned and parked no aircraft at either Cardiff or Shannon.
- Unite The Union Release: By 2pm, only one flight to JFK airport had departed – normally there are five
- BA Strike Fact: Three British Airways flights from London Heathrow to New York’s JFK had departed before 2:00pm. BA 117 departed on-time at 8:20am; BA 175 departed 17 minutes late at 11:00am; BA 177 departed onetime at 1:35pm. Later in the day BA 115 departed on-time at 4:00pm and BA 179 departed on-time at 5:55pm.
- Unite The Union Release: At Gatwick, one third of flights have failed to take off
- BA Strike Fact: British Airways operated well above 66% of its London Gatwick flights. Independent reports verify that crews staffing at Gatwick were at expected levels.
It is worth nothing that yesterday during the strike various independent sources verified that 52.5% of British Airways’ Heathrow based cabin crews had reported for duty, as well as 97% of Gatwick’s cabin crew personnel. In various press statements Unite The Union has stated that 80% of its members were supporting the strike and not reporting to duty. The numbers issued by Unite, even in comparison to non-union cabin crews working during the strike, do not add up to 80% of its union members supporting the strike.
- Unite The Union Release: British Airways has managed to fly only one third of its normal scheduled departures
- BA Strike Fact: British Airways publicly stated it would be operating 65% of its regularly scheduled flights during the strike a week prior to the strike. British Airways actually exceeded its estimates of 65% by reinstating more than 20 flights when more cabin crew than expected reported for duty.
- United The Union Release: BA’s flagship terminal T5 is a ghost town as passengers stay away
- BA Strike Fact: By all reported by witnesses on the ground, Heathrow Terminal 5 was very active. Passengers activity may have been a bit lighter than usual, however the first day of the strike was a Saturday and some people has swapped flights t avoid the strike, however by all independent eye witness reports T5 was busy.
- Unite The Union Release: The first long haul BA flight out (10am) was to Abu Dhabi
- BA Strike Fact: The first British Airways long haul flight to depart was in fact flight BA 117 to New York’s JFK at 8:20am. It departed on-time.
- Unite The Union Release: From 12.20pm until 2.30pm only 10 flights departed from Heathrow, normally there would be 50 during the same period
- BA Strike Fact: Between 12:20pm and 2:30pm the departure board from BAA’s London Heathrow Airport shows that 34 British Airways flights pushed back and departed the airport.
- Unite The Union Release: 20 more planes had been moved to Cardiff to be parked, and a further 20 flown to Shannon, in western Ireland, to sit out the strike
- BA Strike Fact: British Airways positioned and parked no aircraft at either Cardiff or Shannon.
- Unite The Union Release: By 2pm, only one flight to JFK airport had departed – normally there are five
- BA Strike Fact: Three British Airways flights from London Heathrow to New York’s JFK had departed before 2:00pm. BA 117 departed on-time at 8:20am; BA 175 departed 17 minutes late at 11:00am; BA 177 departed onetime at 1:35pm. Later in the day BA 115 departed on-time at 4:00pm and BA 179 departed on-time at 5:55pm.
- Unite The Union Release: At Gatwick, one third of flights have failed to take off
- BA Strike Fact: British Airways operated well above 66% of its London Gatwick flights. Independent reports verify that crews staffing at Gatwick were at expected levels.
It is worth nothing that yesterday during the strike various independent sources verified that 52.5% of British Airways’ Heathrow based cabin crews had reported for duty, as well as 97% of Gatwick’s cabin crew personnel. In various press statements Unite The Union has stated that 80% of its members were supporting the strike and not reporting to duty. The numbers issued by Unite, even in comparison to non-union cabin crews working during the strike, do not add up to 80% of its union members supporting the strike.
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ChicoG
I think that any information released by either BA or BASSA may be open to interpretation.
Although BA 177 to JFK did leave on time it was empty of pax and only had three flight crew on board,presumably sent out to pick up a crew who were in place in jfk and who would have to opperate back ,plus pax of course.
Just wonder how much of all this is mis-information.
Although BA 177 to JFK did leave on time it was empty of pax and only had three flight crew on board,presumably sent out to pick up a crew who were in place in jfk and who would have to opperate back ,plus pax of course.
Just wonder how much of all this is mis-information.
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Although BA 177 to JFK did leave on time it was empty of pax and only had three flight crew on board,presumably sent out to pick up a crew who were in place in jfk and who would have to opperate back ,plus pax of course.
There is no attempt at misinformation in the author's statements.
If you read it again, UNITE never mentioned passengers, either.
- Unite The Union Release: By 2pm, only one flight to JFK airport had departed – normally there are five
- BA Strike Fact: Three British Airways flights from London Heathrow to New York’s JFK had departed before 2:00pm. BA 117 departed on-time at 8:20am; BA 175 departed 17 minutes late at 11:00am; BA 177 departed onetime at 1:35pm. Later in the day BA 115 departed on-time at 4:00pm and BA 179 departed on-time at 5:55pm.
- BA Strike Fact: Three British Airways flights from London Heathrow to New York’s JFK had departed before 2:00pm. BA 117 departed on-time at 8:20am; BA 175 departed 17 minutes late at 11:00am; BA 177 departed onetime at 1:35pm. Later in the day BA 115 departed on-time at 4:00pm and BA 179 departed on-time at 5:55pm.
The above information would seem to be independently verifiable, as are most of his other points, aren't they?
Whereas ALL of UNITE/BASSA's claims are not.
(Several people wrote to Sky and BBC News asking them to send someone to Cardiff and verify UNITE/BASSA's claims - miraculously, UNITE then claimed that all 40 aircraft that they "claimed" were parked at Shannon and Cardiff had been mysteriously moved back to Heathrow - which I assume costs a lot more in parking fees?).
I think UNITE's unsubstantiated claims are there for all to see. Of course, the proof of the pudding is in the eating, so to speak.
Another pair of claims just now on Sky:
BA state 98% of CC turned up for work at Gatwick yesterday, and 53% at Heathrow.
Unite claim only 13.5% turned up for work.
Who do you think is right? (For a start, who actually has access to the employee attendance information?)
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The King of Spin
In the fog of war truth is the first casualty. Don't forget that Bassa/UNITE have at their disposal the finest example of the black art of propaganda namely Charlie Whelan. Mind you what he knows about aviation will not add up to a row of beans but heh does that matter to idealogues such as him.
I'm sure that a number of the departures from T5 were only carrying freight BUT the important point is that there would be a CC complement on board to operate the return as well as keep aircraft rotations as close to the programme for a full bounce back on Tuesday.
I have just heard an interview with an investor from Schroeders who are one of the biggest holders of BA stock. No panic there. As far as they are concerned BA needs to get its operating costs down and the current actions by the airline have their support.
I'm sure that a number of the departures from T5 were only carrying freight BUT the important point is that there would be a CC complement on board to operate the return as well as keep aircraft rotations as close to the programme for a full bounce back on Tuesday.
I have just heard an interview with an investor from Schroeders who are one of the biggest holders of BA stock. No panic there. As far as they are concerned BA needs to get its operating costs down and the current actions by the airline have their support.
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Shareprice says it all!
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AS to what is being reported as fact and what isn't, you need to take it all with a pinch of salt.
Unite in their usual incompetence are however stating it as it is, as they are talking about passenger flights continuing on their way with passengers. Remove all the flights that departed empty (freight only) from the BA statistic and it will look rather different.
That comment has nothing to do with my personal view on the situation or who I support.
Unite in their usual incompetence are however stating it as it is, as they are talking about passenger flights continuing on their way with passengers. Remove all the flights that departed empty (freight only) from the BA statistic and it will look rather different.
That comment has nothing to do with my personal view on the situation or who I support.
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With friends like these, who needs enemies?
Teamsters supporting BA cabin crew? O dear.
The history of the teamsters demonstrates how entrenched organised labour in the US is a long way from doing good for the common man. Or exercising any cooperation during national emergencies. The teamster priority has always been to make sure that any jobs available go to their own membership. Good old Jimmy Hoffa. Nice to see the family tradition being carried on.
I couldn't imagine the Teamsters having any kind of presence at JFK. Philadelphia, perhaps.
(We used to be amused by the adverts of THE SICILIAN ASPHALT COMPANY. Concrete overshoes provided.)
The history of the teamsters demonstrates how entrenched organised labour in the US is a long way from doing good for the common man. Or exercising any cooperation during national emergencies. The teamster priority has always been to make sure that any jobs available go to their own membership. Good old Jimmy Hoffa. Nice to see the family tradition being carried on.
I couldn't imagine the Teamsters having any kind of presence at JFK. Philadelphia, perhaps.
(We used to be amused by the adverts of THE SICILIAN ASPHALT COMPANY. Concrete overshoes provided.)
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Effect
''Contrary to the spin from the company about this strike collapsing, only five cabin crew have broken ranks and 80 have gone sick," Unite's joint leader Tony Woodley said." (FT)
He appealed to the BA board to bypass Walsh and resolve the dispute to halt a second round of industrial action due to start Saturday, which is targeting the busy Easter holiday period.
So why exactly if the strike is so effective does Woodley wish to bypass Walsh?
He appealed to the BA board to bypass Walsh and resolve the dispute to halt a second round of industrial action due to start Saturday, which is targeting the busy Easter holiday period.
So why exactly if the strike is so effective does Woodley wish to bypass Walsh?
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He appealed to the BA board to bypass Walsh and resolve the dispute to halt a second round of industrial action due to start Saturday
As the airline and union traded claims about the impact of the strike, Tony Woodley, Unite’s joint general secretary, said he was trying to contact Martin Broughton, BA chairman, to help end the dispute before a second four-day stoppage next Saturday.
Mr Broughton told the Financial Times last night he had no intention of intervening “because Willie Walsh is doing a great job” and the entire board supported him.
“The ball is in Tony Woodley’s court,” Mr Broughton said.
Mr Broughton told the Financial Times last night he had no intention of intervening “because Willie Walsh is doing a great job” and the entire board supported him.
“The ball is in Tony Woodley’s court,” Mr Broughton said.
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If I was BA for the next strike period i'd operate a full flying programme and have the "spare" sub chartered aircraft sitting at LHR as back up aircraft.
OK a few flights may be cancelled and a few punters would miss out but the strike will have lost it's direction and crew will report.
Lastly, why are all the Unite Officials from Liverpool....
OK a few flights may be cancelled and a few punters would miss out but the strike will have lost it's direction and crew will report.
Lastly, why are all the Unite Officials from Liverpool....
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Regarding the mysterious increase from 85 to 140 parked aircraft at Heathrow. I recall Unite saying at the time that they announced the alleged 85 aircraft with the other 20 at Cardiff and 20 at Shannon that this was because there was only room for 85 maximum at Heathrow.
I know nothing of the facts here but I can tell that someone is either contradicting themselves or even possibly telling porkies and not doing it in a clever way.
It was also very telling to hear yesterday of Unite calling for the intervention of the BA Chairman & Board which was rejected by a firm announcement from the Chairman this morning declaring support by the Board for its CEO commenting further that they thought the CEO was handling the situation very well.
Spending substantial money on international travel to the US seeking their union support was also a marginal play.
These are all clear signs of a side that is losing the negotiation and we will expect to hear and see even more desperate, and even bordering on pathetic, statements and actions in the days ahead.
Unite handled the negotiation competently, if not somewhat clumsily, up until calling strike action a week ago Friday when they had secured their best offer yet. What they failed to learn is that with the substantially increased pro-employee statutory employment legislation, when compared to the '70s, the power of strike action today lies in the threat and not in the action.
They could also do with sharpening their business negotiation skills which anyone who has the responsibility for running a business realises that in any negotiation the optimum tightness for the screw is to turn it until the head falls off and then back off by 1/4 turn but, ooops, by then the head has already fallen off!
I know nothing of the facts here but I can tell that someone is either contradicting themselves or even possibly telling porkies and not doing it in a clever way.
It was also very telling to hear yesterday of Unite calling for the intervention of the BA Chairman & Board which was rejected by a firm announcement from the Chairman this morning declaring support by the Board for its CEO commenting further that they thought the CEO was handling the situation very well.
Spending substantial money on international travel to the US seeking their union support was also a marginal play.
These are all clear signs of a side that is losing the negotiation and we will expect to hear and see even more desperate, and even bordering on pathetic, statements and actions in the days ahead.
Unite handled the negotiation competently, if not somewhat clumsily, up until calling strike action a week ago Friday when they had secured their best offer yet. What they failed to learn is that with the substantially increased pro-employee statutory employment legislation, when compared to the '70s, the power of strike action today lies in the threat and not in the action.
They could also do with sharpening their business negotiation skills which anyone who has the responsibility for running a business realises that in any negotiation the optimum tightness for the screw is to turn it until the head falls off and then back off by 1/4 turn but, ooops, by then the head has already fallen off!