Merged: QANTAS/ALAEA EBA
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$200 a barrel,lets be realistic here the world wide economy is slowing ,don't be surprised if it gets back down to $70 a barrel soon
http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au...rom=public_rss
BOEING believes oil prices will come back to a longer-term trend of $US70-80 a barrel.
The US aerospace giant does not itself analyse fuel trends but said the long-term view of its advisers was that the oil price would decrease.
The US aerospace giant does not itself analyse fuel trends but said the long-term view of its advisers was that the oil price would decrease.
Join Date: Sep 2007
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Oil Price
I think we need not be worrying about which direction the price the oil price goes. We have seen a few armageddon predictions before. The millennium bug (fizzer), the green house effect (now it's politically correct to say 'climate change'). T2 & T3 (Telstra) How many mum's and dad's believed the government hipe? and of course GD has been saying Qantas is doomed for years for various reasons. Funny though $1 billion reasons seems to suggest he got it way wrong. Economists are renowned for inaccurate predictions. The weather man gets it right more of the time.
Our dispute is about the current realised profits, domestic inflation, and a reasonable and fair pay for PAST efforts and contribution.
If oil does hit $200 and the market contracts there will be job losses (no doubt) and QE may have to reduce the work force but it is all "what if's". Those who may be lucky (??) enough to retain a position with Qantas still deserve a 5% pay increase for there past contributions and to maintain there living standards. Those made redundant will be move on, retire, find other employ or reduce there living costs and go surfing.
High oil price has nothing to do with our dispute, 5% please.
Our dispute is about the current realised profits, domestic inflation, and a reasonable and fair pay for PAST efforts and contribution.
If oil does hit $200 and the market contracts there will be job losses (no doubt) and QE may have to reduce the work force but it is all "what if's". Those who may be lucky (??) enough to retain a position with Qantas still deserve a 5% pay increase for there past contributions and to maintain there living standards. Those made redundant will be move on, retire, find other employ or reduce there living costs and go surfing.
High oil price has nothing to do with our dispute, 5% please.
Join Date: Sep 2007
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What does 11 grounded aircraft, with no one to fix them, equate to as a percentage of the fleet?
But anyway, the overtime ban has no effect on the schedule, yeah right.
But anyway, the overtime ban has no effect on the schedule, yeah right.
Join Date: Nov 2007
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Gee imagine if the press wrote an article about oil at $300 a barrel then Qantas would have an even bigger argument against the unions. Wait a sec, maybe we could pretend it was going to hit $400 a barrel.
POT100 the press has been predominantly on our side. I do lots of radio interviews and an occassional one on tele and the questions are generally weighted to our cause. I always counter the lies of Qantas's pr people as does Ms Burrow. We are knuckling down for a stoush that will take soem time before it is decided.
Let us deal with the press, our and the ACTU PR company are managing our feedback and we won't be put off by some alarmist posts on this rumour site. We are more than comfortable with the position we are in right now.
POT100 the press has been predominantly on our side. I do lots of radio interviews and an occassional one on tele and the questions are generally weighted to our cause. I always counter the lies of Qantas's pr people as does Ms Burrow. We are knuckling down for a stoush that will take soem time before it is decided.
Let us deal with the press, our and the ACTU PR company are managing our feedback and we won't be put off by some alarmist posts on this rumour site. We are more than comfortable with the position we are in right now.
Join Date: Sep 2007
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PPM 9-72-003 (I think) no more engine runs! 
The harder we try to fix aeroplanes the bigger the brick wall THEY build to stop us (THEY = management).
They realy want us to fail, don't they.
The harder we try to fix aeroplanes the bigger the brick wall THEY build to stop us (THEY = management).
They realy want us to fail, don't they.
Join Date: Jan 2005
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Not due back to work for another 3-4 days and certainly won't be going back early for overtime lol,so can you spill the beans or elaborate about
PPM 9-72-003 and engine runs thanks,even a pm.
wanty.
Join Date: Nov 2007
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Thanks Hi-speed. Will see fax tomorrow.
LAMEs following the thread should note that the best way we can handle issues is to have the PPM, Cross report, Form 500 etc.... Faxed to our office, then we are armed with the information so we can take it to CASA or the press as required.
Members just a brief thought. As Qantas now have limited manhours available to them it is important to remember that we must -
find more defects than we can fix
This doesn't mean we go overboard or do anything we would not normally do, we just do our job properly. In a normal situation, enough Qantas LAMEs are employed to find defects and fix the ones that are reported, found or work that is otherwise required.
When we have overtime bans, this does not mean that we should find less defects. The reduction in available hours must be applied to the other side of the equation. Hope this makes sense.
cheers
LAMEs following the thread should note that the best way we can handle issues is to have the PPM, Cross report, Form 500 etc.... Faxed to our office, then we are armed with the information so we can take it to CASA or the press as required.
Members just a brief thought. As Qantas now have limited manhours available to them it is important to remember that we must -
find more defects than we can fix
This doesn't mean we go overboard or do anything we would not normally do, we just do our job properly. In a normal situation, enough Qantas LAMEs are employed to find defects and fix the ones that are reported, found or work that is otherwise required.
When we have overtime bans, this does not mean that we should find less defects. The reduction in available hours must be applied to the other side of the equation. Hope this makes sense.
cheers
Join Date: Apr 2008
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More rubbery figures to make you mad!
GD said:
"We have 36,000 people"
and
"If they get their five per cent and it goes across the workforce which is probably won't happen, it would add $360-million to the group wages bill over the next three years."
scource: ABC radio interview here: http://www.abc.net.au/worldtoday/content/2008/s2245583.htm
So I did some maths. If I am correct in assuming he means that the extra 2% over the normal "Board has signed off a 3% wages policy...take it or f*ck off" wage rise that we have all endured for the last 7 years, then the $360mil represents a whole $9.13 per employee per day for the next 3 years.
Not a lot eh, to get your workforce offside?
Well what was even more interesting...and infuriating to me is that even this figure is overstated. We can add this to the other littany of lies we have seen over the last week. Here is why:
You extrapolate this $9.13 per day increase over a year and you get an annual increase per employee of $3333.00...the extra 2%. This suggests that the average QF employee earns...wait for it...$166,650.00 per annum after the increase.
Now I know there are well paid people at QF, but there are plenty, and I suggest the vast majority, that don't earn anywhere near that. I don't! Not even half!!
I am also getting increasingly frustrated with the media, and how all this BS is not even challenged. If a dummy like me can see this, then the media are either stupid, delibrately avoiding any scrutiny, or both.
I reckon they could have given the engineers a 10% increase just with the cost of delays over this weekend. Surely there must be some big shareholders taking notice? This is just about GD's ego and ideology. It certainly can't be about the actual dollar values.
Sorry about all the maths. If someone proves me wrong, I'll delete the post.
"We have 36,000 people"
and
"If they get their five per cent and it goes across the workforce which is probably won't happen, it would add $360-million to the group wages bill over the next three years."
scource: ABC radio interview here: http://www.abc.net.au/worldtoday/content/2008/s2245583.htm
So I did some maths. If I am correct in assuming he means that the extra 2% over the normal "Board has signed off a 3% wages policy...take it or f*ck off" wage rise that we have all endured for the last 7 years, then the $360mil represents a whole $9.13 per employee per day for the next 3 years.
Not a lot eh, to get your workforce offside?
Well what was even more interesting...and infuriating to me is that even this figure is overstated. We can add this to the other littany of lies we have seen over the last week. Here is why:
You extrapolate this $9.13 per day increase over a year and you get an annual increase per employee of $3333.00...the extra 2%. This suggests that the average QF employee earns...wait for it...$166,650.00 per annum after the increase.
Now I know there are well paid people at QF, but there are plenty, and I suggest the vast majority, that don't earn anywhere near that. I don't! Not even half!!
I am also getting increasingly frustrated with the media, and how all this BS is not even challenged. If a dummy like me can see this, then the media are either stupid, delibrately avoiding any scrutiny, or both.
I reckon they could have given the engineers a 10% increase just with the cost of delays over this weekend. Surely there must be some big shareholders taking notice? This is just about GD's ego and ideology. It certainly can't be about the actual dollar values.
Sorry about all the maths. If someone proves me wrong, I'll delete the post.
Join Date: May 2008
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kotoyebe
Just checked your maths koto and you are spot on.... Asuming GD is of course talking about the 2% only not the whole 5%.... Maybe his number crunchers made a slight error in there excitment.... 
Good on ya koto. I knew it didnt
sound right but glad you put it in perspective.
Good on ya koto. I knew it didnt
sound right but glad you put it in perspective.
Join Date: Mar 2005
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What a mess!
Today, Sunday 1 June:
QF11 and QF1 both rescheduled till tomorrow!
QF583 (747-300) cancelled at the 11th hour due to water leakage!
$$$$$$
I think this airline is falling apart! That must affect about 900-1000 pax!
Today, Sunday 1 June:
QF11 and QF1 both rescheduled till tomorrow!
QF583 (747-300) cancelled at the 11th hour due to water leakage!
$$$$$$
I think this airline is falling apart! That must affect about 900-1000 pax!
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My point is proven. Big Unit and Negative Feedback, you both resort to childish name calling and unprofessional/inept behaviour.
In actual fact I know a lot of professional LAME's and they have my full respect. Your cause also had my support (with some reservation). As I said "it had". "LAME's" like you will lose this for all, as you will effectively lose public support, with your denegration of anybody who would dare question your motives and actions.
On top of this you have the audacity to also have a go at our defence force personnel!! The crazziness of the situation may be getting to you.
You have lost my support. It is amazing what a small vocal minority can do!
In actual fact I know a lot of professional LAME's and they have my full respect. Your cause also had my support (with some reservation). As I said "it had". "LAME's" like you will lose this for all, as you will effectively lose public support, with your denegration of anybody who would dare question your motives and actions.
On top of this you have the audacity to also have a go at our defence force personnel!! The crazziness of the situation may be getting to you.
You have lost my support. It is amazing what a small vocal minority can do!
cpiom = wingers. The troll is using the same style of manufactured anger. First appeared about twelve hours after wingers signed off.
By the way,
Mr. Dixon is using "polly speak". What that phrase sounds like to the average man is:
"It would add $360 million to the Group wages billover the next three years
The annualised rate is about $120 million per year or perhaps a reduction in profits of ten percent, based on the current 1 to 1.4 billion per year figure. Not a lot really to keep your staff on side is it?
Then of course there is the question of the cost savings that could be generated by an engaged workforce, but of course anyone who has worked in maintenance knows that the marketer who brings in $100 million in new business gets rewarded, but the backroom guys who just saved the company $100 million never even get noticed.
Or, to put it another way, if you think training and experience are expensive, try ignorance instead.
But it's not really about money anyway, it's all about Mr. Dixon and his ego isn't it.
By the way,
it would add $360-million to the group wages bill over the next three years."
"It would add $360 million to the Group wages billover the next three years
The annualised rate is about $120 million per year or perhaps a reduction in profits of ten percent, based on the current 1 to 1.4 billion per year figure. Not a lot really to keep your staff on side is it?
Then of course there is the question of the cost savings that could be generated by an engaged workforce, but of course anyone who has worked in maintenance knows that the marketer who brings in $100 million in new business gets rewarded, but the backroom guys who just saved the company $100 million never even get noticed.
Or, to put it another way, if you think training and experience are expensive, try ignorance instead.
But it's not really about money anyway, it's all about Mr. Dixon and his ego isn't it.
Join Date: May 2008
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Wrong Sunfish, but keep trying, you seem to have a lot of time on your hands rather than spending it with your family! (as you all keep stating)
kotoyebe, did you take into account sick leave, super, annual leave, long service leave, workers comp?? just to name a few of the extra's
So call me a troll or management at lest I am willing to take a level headed approach to the situation and not resort to childish name calling!!!
Fed Sec of the ALAEA this highlights the fact your members have been failing in their jobs as certifying LAME's in the past as a/c have left on time, and now the statements are out there insinuating they are finding defects to the detriment of the company and passengers for the advantage of their own financial benefit. Might send this to the press. Remember this is where your wages come from. No LAME's no Fed Sec and no political carrer.
You are all suppose to be responsible and up-standing citizens of the community. You and your union are failing in that respect.
kotoyebe, did you take into account sick leave, super, annual leave, long service leave, workers comp?? just to name a few of the extra's
"I am also getting increasingly frustrated with the media, and how all this BS is not even challenged. If a dummy like me can see this, then the media are either stupid, delibrately avoiding any scrutiny, or both."
"This doesn't mean we go overboard or do anything we would not normally do, we just do our job properly. In a normal situation, enough Qantas LAMEs are employed to find defects and fix the ones that are reported, found or work that is otherwise required."
You are all suppose to be responsible and up-standing citizens of the community. You and your union are failing in that respect.
Last edited by cpiom; 1st Jun 2008 at 20:13.
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Lost touch with reality
CPIOM. I think you have lost the plot.The fed sec is just re-enforcing our comittment to work practices.None of us would change the way we do our jobs just because there is industrial action on.we are to professional for that!
CPiom, definitely a troll - repeating previous charges by another troll.
Also obviously not a LAME or anyone who has ever inspected any aircraft which is obvious from the accusation that LAME's have ignored defects in the past.
Here is a hint CPiom, the rules, procedures and criteria pertaining to the maintenance of any aircraft, not just the Qantas Fleet, require that certain work be performed by people who are trained, suitably experienced, and who have demonstrated competency in their field of work in order to be licensed to perform it.
The reason for that being the case is that very high levels of skill, judgement, experience and expertise are required to distinguish between what is actually a defect within the meaning of the rules and regulations and what is not, otherwise trained monkeys could maintain aircraft couldn't they?
...And the exercise of that right to make judgement, conferred on LAME's by CASA, requires time, something Qantas did not realise until overtime bans went into force.
No LAME's no Fed Sec and no political carrer.(sic)
Here is a hint CPiom, the rules, procedures and criteria pertaining to the maintenance of any aircraft, not just the Qantas Fleet, require that certain work be performed by people who are trained, suitably experienced, and who have demonstrated competency in their field of work in order to be licensed to perform it.
The reason for that being the case is that very high levels of skill, judgement, experience and expertise are required to distinguish between what is actually a defect within the meaning of the rules and regulations and what is not, otherwise trained monkeys could maintain aircraft couldn't they?
...And the exercise of that right to make judgement, conferred on LAME's by CASA, requires time, something Qantas did not realise until overtime bans went into force.
Just found an interesting website about narcissism...
This quote kinda jumped out of the page at me.......
...and this one...
http://www.narcissism.operationdoubles.com
This quote kinda jumped out of the page at me.......
A narcissist remains forever such an infant. His world revolves around him. The people in it are but objects for him to use and control — existing for his sake, not their own. Like levers on a control panel or tools to be damaged through heavy use or livestock to be consumed. There to fulfill his needs and enhance his image. Beyond that, they have no importance. It never occurs to him that he owes them anything in return or that he should consider the effects of his actions on them.
An object has no feelings. It is not a person. It is not even a being in the usual sense of the word. You might grab an object like a screwdriver and abuse it by using it to pry something open, knowing that by using it this way you might break it. But you think nothing of breaking a screwdriver. Damaging that screwdriver is nothing. There are plenty more where that one came from.
The only thing that matters is what you want = getting open that thing you're trying to pry open with the screwdriver.
That screwdriver is of no account. It would be absurd to regard it as a having a right to better treatment. In fact, it has no right to be: it exists for your sake, for you to use and abuse as you please. It's basically just an extension of yourself, a tool, an executioner of your will, not its own.
That's what YOU are to a narcissist.
Narcissists (and psychopaths) just use other people, all other people. Any way they please. In other words, they don't relate to other people. Which is an abbreviated way of saying that they don't relate to other human beings as a human being.
An object has no feelings. It is not a person. It is not even a being in the usual sense of the word. You might grab an object like a screwdriver and abuse it by using it to pry something open, knowing that by using it this way you might break it. But you think nothing of breaking a screwdriver. Damaging that screwdriver is nothing. There are plenty more where that one came from.
The only thing that matters is what you want = getting open that thing you're trying to pry open with the screwdriver.
That screwdriver is of no account. It would be absurd to regard it as a having a right to better treatment. In fact, it has no right to be: it exists for your sake, for you to use and abuse as you please. It's basically just an extension of yourself, a tool, an executioner of your will, not its own.
That's what YOU are to a narcissist.
Narcissists (and psychopaths) just use other people, all other people. Any way they please. In other words, they don't relate to other people. Which is an abbreviated way of saying that they don't relate to other human beings as a human being.
...and this one...
The good thing about accepting it is that there is no hating such a person. You can't hate what you can't relate to. You can no more hate a narcissist for being a narcissist than you can hate a snake for being a snake. You don't take it personally when a snake bites you. Don't take it personally when a narcissist does, either. It wasn't you. It wasn't anything you did. You were just there, that's all. Handy.
http://www.narcissism.operationdoubles.com