Is Ukraine about to have a war?
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Hanging off the end of a thread
Posts: 30,839
Received 1,715 Likes
on
743 Posts
Anyone think it’s Putin just testing Biden’s resolve to see what he is made off? Ramp it up to see the response, which he can then use to access his future moves.
Russia is already under pretty comprehensive US and EU sanctions, so much so that the Russian foreign minister Lavrov noted that they are treated as an enemy.
Consequently one wonders whether they might perhaps act accordingly and reincorporate the Ukraine back into Russia.
I don't think Europe or the US are positioned to prevent it and the performance to date of the Ukrainian military has not been impressive. Perhaps that is why the Ukraine is so eager to be accepted into NATO.
Consequently one wonders whether they might perhaps act accordingly and reincorporate the Ukraine back into Russia.
I don't think Europe or the US are positioned to prevent it and the performance to date of the Ukrainian military has not been impressive. Perhaps that is why the Ukraine is so eager to be accepted into NATO.
If Russia invades Ukraine - which has been independent for over 30 years - it'll be like the invasion of Afghanistan - a wake up call for the West, massive US rearmament & it'll end in the collapse of the Russian Government (again)
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Near the Black Sea
Age: 47
Posts: 25
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
But should war BE avoided? Russia has invaded a sovereign country. Surely it should be that countries moral obligation to do everything they can to reunite and retake their country?
You can listen to the arguments about how these people are ethnic Russians. But that doesn’t hold water. If they want to be Russian they can move to Russia. Taking the Crimea as a case in point, only 60% of the population were ethnic Russians, and only about 60-70% of those supported annexation so less than half the region wanted this.
You can listen to the arguments about how these people are ethnic Russians. But that doesn’t hold water. If they want to be Russian they can move to Russia. Taking the Crimea as a case in point, only 60% of the population were ethnic Russians, and only about 60-70% of those supported annexation so less than half the region wanted this.
As to the invasion, check how many Ukrainian units, in Crimea, changed sides after the new, unelected government came to power in Ukraine. If only all invasions were so bloodless!
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Near the Black Sea
Age: 47
Posts: 25
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I will wait till all the evidence is public and make an informed decision.
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Near the Black Sea
Age: 47
Posts: 25
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Pledge to all of those here who are preaching of upholding international laws and protecting sovereign countries integrity: would you please write to your MP's, Prime ministers, Presidents, Kings....whatever and tell them to get Kosovo back to Serbia.
I am so interested to see how that would roll out.
I am so interested to see how that would roll out.
You mean self defence like attacking Finland, Poland and the Baltic countries? Or more recently Chechnya? And even more recently, Ukraine. Yes, Russia DID invade Ukraine. Theres no IF in it.
Afaik, the problem started when the Ukraine government prohibited the use of Russian in Ukrainian schools, a clear signal that the large Russian speaking minority was unwanted.
Perhaps the responsible people should visit Canada, which successfully defused an analogous threat from their francophone Quebec based minority.
Perhaps the responsible people should visit Canada, which successfully defused an analogous threat from their francophone Quebec based minority.
This truly is the age of info wars with all this hardcore agitation and propaganda even in this innocent forum. However these phrases sound as stupid as ever and won't win any new sympathies.
Fascinating that they still feel like trying.
Fascinating that they still feel like trying.
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: UK
Age: 53
Posts: 0
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Afaik, the problem started when the Ukraine government prohibited the use of Russian in Ukrainian schools, a clear signal that the large Russian speaking minority was unwanted.
Perhaps the responsible people should visit Canada, which successfully defused an analogous threat from their francophone Quebec based minority.
Perhaps the responsible people should visit Canada, which successfully defused an analogous threat from their francophone Quebec based minority.
It sure is easier to live with than bombs in mail boxes, police squads all over and unending 'security restrictions'.
Ecce Homo! Loquitur...
As I was saying.....
Putin is eyeing up much bigger prize than Donbas conquest in Ukraine says US General
A top US General has argued that Russia's troop buildup on Ukraine's eastern borders is a distraction and that the Kremlin is preparing for a different attack.
Lieutenant General Ben Hodges said in an interview with Espresso TV that Mr Putin has his eyes set on capturing the Black Sea Coast in the south.
The former commander of the United States Army Europe explained: "The Kremlin is interested in establishing full control over the Black Sea coast, including Mariupol, Odessa and Berdyansk.
“All this movement of Russian forces is most likely a diversionary manoeuvre to strike and capture the water canal connecting Crimea to the Dnieper River. And then, it will become a springboard for further capture of the Black Sea coast."
He added that Moscow did not need to make a decisive move in the Donbas at present and preferred to use the simmering conflict as a means to further undermine Kiev.
"The Russians do not need a decisive attack on the Donbas now," he said. "The Donbas is needed to continue destabilization in the region and to inhibit Ukraine's integration with the West. The goal of the Russian Federation is to keep the situation in the region in a state of chaos."
https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/ar...blem-for-putin
Crimea’s Water Crisis Is an Impossible Problem for Putin
Putin is eyeing up much bigger prize than Donbas conquest in Ukraine says US General
A top US General has argued that Russia's troop buildup on Ukraine's eastern borders is a distraction and that the Kremlin is preparing for a different attack.
Lieutenant General Ben Hodges said in an interview with Espresso TV that Mr Putin has his eyes set on capturing the Black Sea Coast in the south.
The former commander of the United States Army Europe explained: "The Kremlin is interested in establishing full control over the Black Sea coast, including Mariupol, Odessa and Berdyansk.
“All this movement of Russian forces is most likely a diversionary manoeuvre to strike and capture the water canal connecting Crimea to the Dnieper River. And then, it will become a springboard for further capture of the Black Sea coast."
He added that Moscow did not need to make a decisive move in the Donbas at present and preferred to use the simmering conflict as a means to further undermine Kiev.
"The Russians do not need a decisive attack on the Donbas now," he said. "The Donbas is needed to continue destabilization in the region and to inhibit Ukraine's integration with the West. The goal of the Russian Federation is to keep the situation in the region in a state of chaos."
https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/ar...blem-for-putin
Crimea’s Water Crisis Is an Impossible Problem for Putin
Last edited by ORAC; 12th Apr 2021 at 14:20.
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Hanging off the end of a thread
Posts: 30,839
Received 1,715 Likes
on
743 Posts
etudiant
Afaik, the problem started when the Ukraine government prohibited the use of Russian in Ukrainian schools, a clear signal that the large Russian speaking minority was unwanted.
Perhaps the responsible people should visit Canada, which successfully defused an analogous threat from their francophone Quebec based minority.
Afaik, the problem started when the Ukraine government prohibited the use of Russian in Ukrainian schools, a clear signal that the large Russian speaking minority was unwanted.
Perhaps the responsible people should visit Canada, which successfully defused an analogous threat from their francophone Quebec based minority.
https://www.dispropaganda.com/single...n-exchange-for
So many other agreements have broken , it could easily be a chicken and egg thread .
The good news is Ukraine just blinked . They are backtracking on previous statements made by the stand up comic and calling for dialogues.
The good news is Ukraine just blinked . They are backtracking on previous statements made by the stand up comic and calling for dialogues.
Lieutenant General Ben Hodges - I've heard him speak - very very impressive. Not your gung-ho kill everything type but measured, very thoughtful and crystal clear
Definitely a man to listen to
Definitely a man to listen to
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Near the Black Sea
Age: 47
Posts: 25
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I looked into the Crimean Tatar issue and yeah the evidence is damning...
From the Human Rights Watch: "crimea-persecution-crimean-tatars-intensifies"
Since 2015 a grand total of 26 Tatars have been convicted and jailed. They are all part of a group, Hizb-ut-Tahrir, that has been designated as a terrorist group in Russia, Germany and several others.
Even by the HRW's own words these people have broken the law.
Not really mass persecution, is it?
From the Human Rights Watch: "crimea-persecution-crimean-tatars-intensifies"
Since 2015 a grand total of 26 Tatars have been convicted and jailed. They are all part of a group, Hizb-ut-Tahrir, that has been designated as a terrorist group in Russia, Germany and several others.
Some of the detainees do not deny some level of affiliation with Hizb-ut-Tahrir, but all deny any involvement in a terrorist organization. Under Russian law, participation in a terrorist group (article 205.5, part 2 of the Russian Criminal Code) is punishable by a prison sentence of 5 to 10 years.
Not really mass persecution, is it?
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Near the Black Sea
Age: 47
Posts: 25
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
It is great to see that Ukraine cares so much for the oppressed people in Crimea that they even deny them water... If they really wanted to win the minds and hearts of the people, they should surely give them the water.
As for Russia attacking Ukraine, it seems the world thinks that the Russian government and military are stupid or insane. Russian citizens will not stand for such a thing and the government will lose all popularity very rapidly.
According to historical data, Hitler was also impressive during his public speeches. Look where it got the world.
As for Russia attacking Ukraine, it seems the world thinks that the Russian government and military are stupid or insane. Russian citizens will not stand for such a thing and the government will lose all popularity very rapidly.
According to historical data, Hitler was also impressive during his public speeches. Look where it got the world.
