Oxford Aviation Training (OAT) - Who has got a job?

[New FO]

It's not all doom and gloom...moaners!

I'm from 243 at OAT. Certainly most of us are in jobs and pretty quickly, we all got in just before the summer lul. As are 244, actually, lucky buggers (u included moo man) got jobs before us! 241 are all in except about 1. 240, definitely mostly in. Of course there are the odd stragler and sometimes the ones that genuinely were unlucky at sim checks. However, its the odd stragglers you usaually see on here because the rest of us are busy! However, they should be busier, sorry to let you down guys but there are no joibs on here. Those looking for jobs...how muny recruiters business cards are in your wallet? If the answer is 0, stop scaring others, get off ur arses and do something about it! I dont want an argument because thats not exactly conducive to the moaners getting jobs and I'd hate to see anyone get nothing after such an investment. BUT BEWARE EVERYONE, A LARGE AMOUNT OF PEOPLE SCARING YOU ARE MOANING ON A FORUM ON WHICH THEY WONT TELL YOU THEIR NAME INSTEAD OF GETTING OUT THERE AND JOB SEARCHING!

[finals]

don't be put off!

To all those making choices about flying schools....

Please please please don't be put off by messages on here from students from various schools regarding any particular flying school. The vast majority of students who chose integrated courses at reputable places like OAT, Cabair, FTE etc... get commercial airline jobs - it may take a week, may take a month, may take a year.

Remember, most of the threads on this website from ex-students are from those who don't have jobs yet. This means that for those looking in from the outside, all there seems to be is resentment and regret...

Most people who have got jobs in the airlines either don't have the time or just don't feel the need to go on websites like these to write about the flying school they went to (i'm on leave at the moment so thought i'd have a look to see how much OAT-knocking there is on here). I finished at Oxford in November and had a job offer a few weeks later. Almost everyone on my course is now either flying jets around Europe or waiting to begin type ratings. And that's within 6 months of finishing the APP.

Go and see the flying schools, look at the stats for job success, and make sure you listen to those who did get jobs as well as those who didn't.

One final point..... every day I check-in at work, it's like an OAT re-union. That says something........

[captwannabe]

If you had read my posts properly, you would have realised that I am not anti-Oxford or anti-integrated courses, but I am merely pointing out other options. I made factual points stating that CTC have better graduate placement than any other FTO. I also said that other integrated courses (such as FTE, which is less expensive) have the same prospects for their graduates as Oxford, which is also true. Is there something wrong with comparing other FTOs? It seems there is a case of Can't Read/Won't Read on these forums. Just because I'm not singing Oxford's praises (nor am I criticising them!), doesn't mean that I'm anti-Oxford. If someone mentions another FTO in the same sentence as Oxford, people take offence, and think there is criticism aimed at Oxford. I think that you have to compare the different FTOs because if people read only about Oxford, they will think Oxford is the only way. If you think Oxford is the right place for you out of all your options, then by all means, go for it!

[Johny Speedbrakes]

New OAT Programme?

Capt. Wanabee,

Good point re FTO's. I remeber very well the uncertainty feeling before ATPL training. I was in the same course as New FO and we both acheived the same grades and even shared the same appartment in Arizona.

However now he has a great job and I don't. (Well done New FO by the way ) Am I concearned ........... not too much. OAT keep in regular contact and I'm always praying for an airline to answer one of my e-mails!

I couldn't fault OAT in their training, I acheived better grades and first time passes in all flying tests there - far better that I thought I could acheive.

I couldn't possibly say which FTO course is better - probably all very similar or if you should train intergrated or modular.

I have heard a rumor though "student rumor network" that OAT are starting a new scheme with GECAT called (or nicknamed) the GPP. I can think of at least four large carriers students have gone to.

Having been unsucessful @ GECAT I'm slightly biased. (Make sure you can get sim checked on B737 is all I'll say!)

Good luck and feel free to ask any thing. I've got quiet a bit of spare time on my hands at the moment!!

[Mooneyboy]

I was Oxford modular very similar similar situation to Johny Speedbrakes ( was probaly out in Arizona same time but us mods got the fantastic Seneca V to play with). Finished MCC and JOT in March.

Can't say I have too many complaints with Oxford at all. Groundschool was very good got me all first time passes high average. CPL/ME was great Seneca V, desert, pool and Streets of New York . The IR took a little longer than it should have done due to weather and tech ( their fleet looking tired) but had great instructor who put a lot of effort and time into his instruction. MCC and JOT great fun, challenging and really felt like all your training coming together, a shame the sim broke for a week though mid training. Afterwards about a month later OAT put me forward to GECAT, got through to interview but failed there which was all my own fault.

Oxford have done exactly what they said. Good quality training, no extra costs ( apart from partially IR 1st time but didn't reqire extra training) and tried to find me a job. No regrets about going to Oxford what so ever would do it again but maybe APP if had to start from scratch 0 time.

Position now. No job . Checking email endlessly hoping for something after loads of CVs sent, ring them up but they always seem to be busy but I am very fortunate to get multi pistion time in every few weeks so I can't complain.

Regards

Mooneyboy

[Craggenmore]

Where shall I start?

Once finished, my course (pre-APP) were all dropped like we had the plague but two months later, and surprise, surprise, the first APP course all had jobs within a month of finishing (several of whom I'm still in touch with btw ).

To our minds, OAT told/rigged/bribed/pleaded with the airlines to 'try' their new product so all recruitment via OAT was put on hold until the APP'ers started to graduate, meaning that we couldn't get a foot in the door for love nor money. This was, ahem, 'revealed' by the chap from Channex at the BALPA EOC 2005 who asked me why I hadn't secured an interview since leaving OAT, to which I replied that airlines such as his were currently only recruiting APP'ers. A redder face and stuttering voice would be hard to imagine!

Thankfully 2 years on, we have all found jobs by ourselves but we still feel sad that our memories are not as pleasant as the APP'ers, who as one poster said, is like a reunion when he turns up at work! How nice for him...

[PAPI-74]

Yes....how nice indeed.

[737atlast]

guys...

hmmm I think Oxford where an absolutely pitiful money grabbing organisation. I finished in April 2002, few months after sept 11th, so the market was very very slack. My issues started when the market picked up they were not interested in older courses. A certain tall bloke there was the most unhelpful and didnt really seem to have a clue what was happening, maybe he just head his head in the clouds.

I managed to get a job three years after finishing on the 737 at Tfly. Very happy now and glad I didnt have to rely on these bandits.


737

[TurboJ]

I smypathise with those OAT students who have failed to secure employment after spending so much cash. However, there is nothing worse than listening to whining OAT students who seem to think that the FTO owes them a job.

Try a wife, 2.4 kids, full time job working 24hr roster, fitting in modular courses around annual leave and days off and then 2.5 yrs later trying to find a job by networking, hour building, 200 CVs etc etc etc......and only now 4yrs after gaining a PPL aged 28, I have a nice jet type rating on my licence.

Guys / girls, now you have been spoon fed the requirements and obtained your shiny new licence, go and do some work and find yourself a job. It won't come to you.

[scroggs]

TurboJ, well done on your achievement. However, if people have paid for a service then they should receive it, and if they don't receive it they are entitled to complain.

However, they should complain to those who are in a position to do something about their complaint, which is not the readers of this forum - though reading these complaints may well influence those currently deciding where to go.

Scroggs

[bluepeely]

Is there any truth in the saying " An Atpl licensce is not as important as to where you got it" ?????

Or is it the FTO's dangling a large carrot in the eyes of us impressionable wannabee's

[Cirrus_Clouds]

This is a very interesting post.

Firstly, I wish you guys/women all the best in getting your first job and support you 100%, I would even consider FI if it came to it.

I am in a position where i'm about to start an ATPL and this has just confirmed my suspicions. For every good experience there is a bad.

I am currently researching into where to do my training, whether to do it along side a job or not. One thing that's telling me about this is the "marketing/advertising" that makes it all sound it's rosy, stating there is a higher chance of success, this doesn't gurantee success still. Every company does this and as an individual looking around I am putting this aspect aside; but sure, I want to train some where, where my chances of employment are great.

It's pure luck in my option (with the help of others yes) whether one gets a job. Your chances may be higher if you pay integrated, but we all know it's a gamble/risk.

If I were in the same position you guys, I would be *loody *issed off, but it was a risk you decided to take. This is what is preventing me from doing Integrated as the consequences wouldn't be pleasant to say the least!!

I think if one worked alongside flight training, one would "minimize" any regrets/debt matters. It is VERY difficult to say what is the right decision, only you can make that, as there are so many ways into flying.

I have had lots of experience working my arse for a company producing commercial software and then get treated like *hit, after they've got what they want. This is business and nothing will change (one thing I've learnt from life experiences so far).

If I were in your situation, I would do exactly what your doing now, even approaching them directly for free assistance (after you've paid them all that cash!) in obtaining this first job and doing what ever you can do to ensure you keep "flying" and make yourself appealing to the airlines or whoever.

I've seen this in many other cases, people going to excellent uni's, going away with excellent grades, but.... In the end it's persistence, luck, who you know that puts you where you are today.

Keep plugging away!!!!!!!! and REMAIN POSITIVE (I know how hard it is)

[LongGoneSilva]

I was a student on 245.

Just to keep things up to date, aside from the four guys taken on by BA and two sponsored pilots, no one (on a course of 18) has had any joy on the job front. We generally finished about 2 months ago and hopefully this drought is more a reflection of the slower summer job market.

A few of my colleagues have had some promising leads recently, both through Oxford and off their own backs, so hopefully the market is picking up again.

I have heard mixed opinions on just how much assistance the careers team have been. But ultimately, if they have no airlines asking for graduates, there isn't a great deal they can do.

My two cents worth... I had a great time at Oxford and believe they run a good course, though I obviously have nothing to compare it against. BUT... if you want an almost guarenteed job when you finish and can get in, go to CTC (I believe they have a 97% employment rate).

Best of luck to everyone looking

[Permafrost_ATPL]

Just to go back to the distance learning thing for a second, make sure you put it on your CV if you did it that way. I didn't because I thought it might not fit the profile of the "team/group" orientated pilot (one gets paranoid writing a cv!). But many captains I've flown with were impressed that I managed all first time passes and >90% average on a distance learning course. I didn't realise at the time that so many people gave up on it and joined the full time classroom option.

As for OAT vs others... Yes they don't have as good a record as CTC. But their record is still pretty good for the APP. It's just not reasonable to expect guaranteed employment for the profession we've all chosen. No matter how hard flight schools try to recruit people with "the right stuff", not every graduate will have performed the way they were supposed to.

So yes you still take a gamble spending 100K. If OAT don't recommend you to airlines, you are probably worse off than if you went to a small school (read the posts on Flybe not selecting OAT graduates from the online application). But if you work hard and get the grades, the 100K gamble is very likely to pay off.

Different story if you go the modular way at OAT though. Less money to gamble, but:

1) You'd be foolish to think that OAT won't try harder to place APP guys (even if you have very good grades)

2) Some of the airlines who work with OAT simply do not take modular candidates, even recommended ones (BA being the most significant one).

Worked for me though :-)

P

[elevengflyer]

Originally Posted by Permafrost_ATPL

1) You'd be foolish to think that OAT won't try harder to place APP guys (even if you have very good grades)

2) Some of the airlines who work with OAT simply do not take modular candidates, even recommended ones (BA being the most significant one).

Yeah, quite right, comes back to the old argument, same exams, same aircraft, same licence, same instructors, different sum paid to FTO, different opportunity - spot the difference!

[captwannabe]

Their recommendation is what helps to get your foot in the door me thinks

[aftab]

flybe did nt accept applications from oxford, why is tht??

[Permafrost_ATPL]

Of course this is a rumour network, so you can never trust anything 100%. But there has been various posts talking about FlyBe not picking non-recommended OAT graduates from their database and there's never been anybody denying that fact. Ian Cheese has always said that they take both integrated and modular students, and you'll find many posts on PPRuNe from modular students who got the job at FlyBe from applying by email (in the old days) or online. But they never seem to be OAT modular students!

I apologise if it's not true, so if you're OAT modular and got the job by applying online, please post!

P

[dartagnan]

Originally Posted by swidd

professionalism, aptitude and personality .

you are right, during my conversion, many pilots in my school have failed their IR , even 2 to 3 times.

I have flown with many pilots, some are really good, and some are really bad.I have seen pilots who have never been soloed and have been send back home after 70-80 hours flight time.It has nothing to do with schools, money,...

[approach320]

So...what happens after?

Hello everybody,

I know there has always been a controversy between people who think OAT is good...or OAT is bad....

But I just wanted to ask 1 simple question.
Just so you know, I have been to OAT already, visited the facilities and talked to people, and the fact is...that I really like it.
But....what happens after you graduate? It's true that they do send people to BA's inteviews or other ones...but the majority of people don't get selected. So....what's the point on having gone to OAT for your training if, even having been recommended, you don't get that job offer that you are dreaming of?? You are in the same place that everybody finds even if you haven't gone to Oxford : NO JOB.

And....with the 200 hrs or so that you get in OAT...where are you going to get a job interview even if you have OAT's brand in your CV?? It doesn's matter, right??

Well....thanks for your answers and happy flyings!!