British Airways - CC Industrial Relations Mk V
Couldonlyaffordafiver
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Hopefully when the dust settles in a few months, the new crew and those who remain will take a close interest in the fledgling PCCC, which I sincerely hope will not affiliate itself with Unite in any way, shape or form.
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Just received this in an email from a friend of mine:
It's regarding whether the latest comms from management will convince crew to vote NO.
Anyone else thinking along these lines?
Gg
I am BA cabin crew and this is my own viewpoint and not that of BA.
It's regarding whether the latest comms from management will convince crew to vote NO.
Trouble is, it's got to convince nearly half of the membership who voted last time to change their vote, and that's difficult to say the least. You know the worst bit? if cabin crew have a genuine grievance in future, you won't be able to go on strike, because BA will invoke exactly the same penalty. Your militant colleagues have destroyed the crew's power to look after their own interests.
Anyone else thinking along these lines?
Gg
I am BA cabin crew and this is my own viewpoint and not that of BA.
Couldonlyaffordafiver
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Lurker,
Wrong, yourself!
You're not concentrating old chap. That was covered in an earlier paragraph.
So like I said, I would suggest ST will be permanently removed from ALL cabin crew, whether they strike or not if there is a Yes vote as BA will assume that you will strike following that Yes vote.
Wrong, yourself!
You're not concentrating old chap. That was covered in an earlier paragraph.
What became clear was that voting yes means you consent to going on strike. Full stop. No-one expects it to be different this time.
We can only assume that another yes vote would again lead to an extended strike or series of strikes.
We can only assume that another yes vote would again lead to an extended strike or series of strikes.
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I don't think either one of you can be sure as you don't know how "you" is being used in this context.
if YOU (plural, group) go on strike, could mean everyone in that group could lose staff travel. Even if YOU (singular) don't.
ie.. its all about how you interpret it?
if YOU (plural, group) go on strike, could mean everyone in that group could lose staff travel. Even if YOU (singular) don't.
ie.. its all about how you interpret it?
Couldonlyaffordafiver
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Oh for Pete's sake.
Have you never heard of "reading between the lines"? That explains an awful lot.
Originally Posted by A Lurker
Therefore before you vote, I want you to be fully aware of the consequences should you vote yes and go on strike.
Originally Posted by Bill Francis' email
What became clear was that voting yes means you consent to going on strike. Full stop. No-one expects it to be different this time.
We can only assume that another yes vote would again lead to an extended strike or series of strikes.
We can only assume that another yes vote would again lead to an extended strike or series of strikes.
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I turned my back for a couple of hours and it's got worse/better. 
I simply cannot believe the obduracy of the BASSA militants, fighting ineptly their lost cause. Mr Walsh has laid it clearly on the the line what is going to happen. And all because BA want the CC at LHR to do the same as other crews at LGW?
Is this 2010? Have I entered a 1970's time-warp?
Fight hard, those of you with the brains to interpret reality. It seems evident that the BASSA leadership lives on a different planet. Happily there seem to be many who live in "today", and look to the future for themselves and BA.
I simply cannot believe the obduracy of the BASSA militants, fighting ineptly their lost cause. Mr Walsh has laid it clearly on the the line what is going to happen. And all because BA want the CC at LHR to do the same as other crews at LGW?
Is this 2010? Have I entered a 1970's time-warp?
Fight hard, those of you with the brains to interpret reality. It seems evident that the BASSA leadership lives on a different planet. Happily there seem to be many who live in "today", and look to the future for themselves and BA.
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A Lurker - just because it affects you personally (the information inside that email) doesnt mean its all up to you.. In my opinion. We can argue over this forever I suppose, we will just have to wait and see.
I'm sure BASSA will present their interpretation shortly....
I'm sure BASSA will present their interpretation shortly....
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Time to join the debate.
Hello.
I've been lurking on this forum and now have decided its time to join the debate.
I have worked with many cabin crew over the years. For three and a half of those I was cabin crew myself. Almost all the crew that I have been fortunate enough to have worked with have been very professional, genuinely cared for the passengers and enjoyed the job. The opposite, in fact, of the militants who now seem to run or are most avid in their support of BASSA. Sadly I have now seen the profesionalism, the customer care and the enjoyment of the job eroded more and more in some of our crew members. However, these people are still in a minority.
The current terms and conditions for cabin crew are amongst the best in our industry. I believe that there has been safeguards put in place so that current crew do not see a huge erosion of those terms. I think this is wholly appropriate. A massive reduction in earnings would cause unnecessary pain to our crew, who have built their lives and aspirations on their current and ligitimate earnings. However future crew would know what the new set of remunerations would be before they signed their contracts and would be able to judge, before signing, if the job was for them.
I fear that the strength of the BASSA rhetoric, and the inability of the crew to question the BASSA reps without censure will lead to a strike and with it a tearing up of current terms and conditions. This in turn will lead to a loss of our most able and talented crew who realise that their various degrees that they have held will now open other doors that will allow them to keep the standard of living that they now have.
I would like to keep our current crew (even if, after the latest BASSA missive, they will no longer wish to socialise with the flight crew when on trips
) I believe that most still hold their professionalism dear and are still proud to work for this company. I think it would be very wrong for a strike to be called for the spurious reason of fighting an imposition which most crew seem to have found not much of a problem at all. The company was forced into this imposition because they were faced by reps who would not negotiate in any meaningful way. I think that if if a "No" vote was returned the company would do its utmost to protect the current earnings of crew. I think if a "Yes" vote is returned, all cabin crew contracts and terms and conditions would be in very serious jeopardy.
I really hope for a "No" vote.
Regards
CaptainBarbosa.
I've been lurking on this forum and now have decided its time to join the debate.
I have worked with many cabin crew over the years. For three and a half of those I was cabin crew myself. Almost all the crew that I have been fortunate enough to have worked with have been very professional, genuinely cared for the passengers and enjoyed the job. The opposite, in fact, of the militants who now seem to run or are most avid in their support of BASSA. Sadly I have now seen the profesionalism, the customer care and the enjoyment of the job eroded more and more in some of our crew members. However, these people are still in a minority.
The current terms and conditions for cabin crew are amongst the best in our industry. I believe that there has been safeguards put in place so that current crew do not see a huge erosion of those terms. I think this is wholly appropriate. A massive reduction in earnings would cause unnecessary pain to our crew, who have built their lives and aspirations on their current and ligitimate earnings. However future crew would know what the new set of remunerations would be before they signed their contracts and would be able to judge, before signing, if the job was for them.
I fear that the strength of the BASSA rhetoric, and the inability of the crew to question the BASSA reps without censure will lead to a strike and with it a tearing up of current terms and conditions. This in turn will lead to a loss of our most able and talented crew who realise that their various degrees that they have held will now open other doors that will allow them to keep the standard of living that they now have.
I would like to keep our current crew (even if, after the latest BASSA missive, they will no longer wish to socialise with the flight crew when on trips
) I believe that most still hold their professionalism dear and are still proud to work for this company. I think it would be very wrong for a strike to be called for the spurious reason of fighting an imposition which most crew seem to have found not much of a problem at all. The company was forced into this imposition because they were faced by reps who would not negotiate in any meaningful way. I think that if if a "No" vote was returned the company would do its utmost to protect the current earnings of crew. I think if a "Yes" vote is returned, all cabin crew contracts and terms and conditions would be in very serious jeopardy.I really hope for a "No" vote.
Regards
CaptainBarbosa.
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Evening all
Well today was quite a big day for me! I officially went and told BASSA that I wished to end my membership effective immediately and that I did not want any deduction taken from my next pay-packet. I'm in it alone now guys.. so when the s**t hits the fan, I shall be turning to some of you here for advice and support. Now, having done that, I had better not use my S/T - I use it a lot and don't see why I should be punished!
Well today was quite a big day for me! I officially went and told BASSA that I wished to end my membership effective immediately and that I did not want any deduction taken from my next pay-packet. I'm in it alone now guys.. so when the s**t hits the fan, I shall be turning to some of you here for advice and support. Now, having done that, I had better not use my S/T - I use it a lot and don't see why I should be punished!
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What some crew seem to be forgetting is that the management is different from '97. WW will remove staff travel permanently and if crew don't report for duty when the strike is over because they can't get to work they will be liable for disciplinary actions (EGXXX).
Thank you BASSA and all strikers, you'll s***w up our jobs forever!
Well done and congratulations!
Hopefully when the dust settles in a few months, the new crew and those who remain will take a close interest in the fledgling PCCC, which I sincerely hope will not affiliate itself with Unite in any way, shape or form.
Thank you. Please be assured the PCCC will distance itself from UNITE. We have a completely different appproach and mindset.
I'm BA Cabin Crew and the above represent my personal views and not those of BA.
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BACrewboy - Well done, you should be proud of yourself for having the courage to distance yourself from something you don't believe in. Many of your colleagues have told me they feel the same, but will still be voting YES...... Defies all logic.
You will find more support outside of bassa than you think!
You will find more support outside of bassa than you think!
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Well today was quite a big day for me! I officially went and told BASSA that I wished to end my membership effective immediately and that I did not want any deduction taken from my next pay-packet. I'm in it alone now guys.. so when the s**t hits the fan, I shall be turning to some of you here for advice and support. Now, having done that, I had better not use my S/T - I use it a lot and don't see why I should be punished
We're all here for you anytime at all. You are not alone.
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Wrong - the letter says should you vote yes and go on strike
If, as a group, you vote to strike you each, individually, lose ST.
Hope that clears it up.
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That is how I understood it too.
The pressure will be on for a no vote to keep Ts and Cs.
Staff travel may not sway people as you can get cheaper tickets from Easy Jet etc and it's a guaranteed seat.
Personally I haven't used staff travel in years.Never any spare seats when I want to go away.
The pressure will be on for a no vote to keep Ts and Cs.
Staff travel may not sway people as you can get cheaper tickets from Easy Jet etc and it's a guaranteed seat.
Personally I haven't used staff travel in years.Never any spare seats when I want to go away.
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Wrong - the letter says should you vote yes and go on strike
Since the company cannot know whether you as an individual have voted 'yes' or 'no' this clearly applies in the wider sense.
If, as a group, you vote to strike you each, individually, lose ST.
Hope that clears it up.
Since the company cannot know whether you as an individual have voted 'yes' or 'no' this clearly applies in the wider sense.
If, as a group, you vote to strike you each, individually, lose ST.
Hope that clears it up.
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Wrong - the letter says should you vote yes and go on strike
Since the company cannot know whether you as an individual have voted 'yes' or 'no' this clearly applies in the wider sense
If, as a group, you vote to strike you each, individually, lose ST.
Hope that clears it up
If, as a group, you vote to strike you each, individually, lose ST.
Hope that clears it up
Not necessarily. It won't be hard for the company to see who comes into work and who doesn't. Those that don't will presumably be the ones who lose out. BA aren't going to penalise those who make the effort to come in.
Last edited by Looking Up; 22nd Jan 2010 at 17:29.
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For the sake of sanity.........
A Lurker,
As much as I am enjoying this 'debate' of the minor issue of ST for crew if they strike?!?!?
, are you being equally pedantic with your reps?
IE are you pestering them for TRUE info and facts? Are you asking why the have decided to effetely tell all pilots to 'FOXTROT OSCAR?'
If you really are interested in accurate information what are you doing to ensure your reps adhere to you obviously high standards?
Frankly, if you all can do now is argue about the comparably ‘insignificant' and miss the bigger issues then I truly do despair!!!!
SS
A Lurker,
As much as I am enjoying this 'debate' of the minor issue of ST for crew if they strike?!?!?
, are you being equally pedantic with your reps? IE are you pestering them for TRUE info and facts? Are you asking why the have decided to effetely tell all pilots to 'FOXTROT OSCAR?'
If you really are interested in accurate information what are you doing to ensure your reps adhere to you obviously high standards?
Frankly, if you all can do now is argue about the comparably ‘insignificant' and miss the bigger issues then I truly do despair!!!!
SS
617
Staff travel may not sway people as you can get cheaper tickets from Easy Jet etc and it's a guaranteed seat.
Personally I haven't used staff travel in years. Never any spare seats when I want to go away.
Personally I haven't used staff travel in years. Never any spare seats when I want to go away.
) serve LHR and the LoCo tickets can often be much more expensive than an ID90.