British Airways - CC Industrial Relations & Negotiations
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If you take part in a strike or other industrial action, you may be in breach of your contract of employment. However, if you are dismissed for taking part in strike or industrial action which is cancelled officially and is otherwise lawful, the dismissal will be unfair if it takes place fewer than twelve weeks after you started taking part in the action, and depending on the circumstances may be unfair if it takes place later
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Ballot Paper details part 3
Quite simply, as it is...
Dear Friends,
As your union, we have done our absolute level best to warn you of the disastrous situation you now face. This, quite simply, is the biggest threat to your future, promotion prospects and livelihoods that we have ever seen. It has been talked about for almost a year.
It is now here: we can only repeat our warnings to you one last time. Bassa and Amicus sections of Unite have joined together to fight for you and this in itself should tell you how serious the situation is.
Agreement is a thing of the past; from now on change will simply be imposed. Whether you are based at Heathrow or Gatwick, are main crew, purser or CSD/CM makes little difference. Up to now, your flying life has been made up of agreements, some good and some less so, but nonetheless a structure for you to work to. Not any longer; management have decided if it does not suit them then they will simply change it; what they want and when they want it.
This is not being dramatic in any way; it is reality and a blue print for the future. Reduced crewing etcetera is only the beginning. Forget travel payments and the like. How long do you think that will last? You're being distracted. They hope as your routes dwindle that you won't mind too much because you have got a "travel payment". Remember the "money back guarantee" after the '97 dispute? It was supposed to be for life, but lasted 3 years.
If you take part time, how long will your earnings and work last before you're forced back to full time to try and make ends meet, or to pay your mortage? And to what kind of agreement?
At Gatwick, current crew feel disenfranchised by the better agreements that exist at Heathrow, and in turn blame Heathrow crew for that, yet miss the obvious fact that the real blame lies with a management that simply won't offer them comparable agreements. They could do but they won't. Instead they encourage a "them and us" and "why should they have all that and you don't" attitude.
Is this to be the future for us all? Where worsening levels of change are imposed upon one area after another and rather than aspiring to better arrangements, we will all be caught in a downward spiral.
You will have only one chance. If you waste this opportunity now, you will not get another. Your agreements were hard fought for by us and the crew that have gone before us and we urge you not to surrender them meekly.
Vote YES to industrial action and show them that you're still proud to work for BA and of the job that you do but that you won't be walked over. Insist that BA returns to the table to negotiate change - not impose it.
We want to see that this company truly values its customers, in not causing them any future disruption by forcing crew into an unnecessary strike.
You're the best cabin crew in the world; you do not have to feel embarrassed to earn a decent living and to pay a mortage. You do a great job for this company; you're its public face, the reason that people fly with BA and you've earned the right to a proper wage.
Don't forget that we've not refused to accept cost savings - far from it. We've previously offered to make genuine concessions worth tens of millions of pounds, far more than any other area within BA.
Those offers were refused. Why? Because it would sadly appear that this was never really about saving money but about that good old-fashioned management principle - the "right to impose". THey want to tell you what to do and when to do it and if you don't like it, then leave. You won't be a valued employee but a commodity in a uniform that can be obtained more cheaply for them, that is far more important than you, our customers or our airline.
Now is the time for them to be sensible and to truly "put our customers first". Our board of directors must now act to protect the reputation and standing of our airline. To do otherwise would beggar belief, as any savings achieved would immediately be lost.
Dear Friends,
As your union, we have done our absolute level best to warn you of the disastrous situation you now face. This, quite simply, is the biggest threat to your future, promotion prospects and livelihoods that we have ever seen. It has been talked about for almost a year.
It is now here: we can only repeat our warnings to you one last time. Bassa and Amicus sections of Unite have joined together to fight for you and this in itself should tell you how serious the situation is.
Agreement is a thing of the past; from now on change will simply be imposed. Whether you are based at Heathrow or Gatwick, are main crew, purser or CSD/CM makes little difference. Up to now, your flying life has been made up of agreements, some good and some less so, but nonetheless a structure for you to work to. Not any longer; management have decided if it does not suit them then they will simply change it; what they want and when they want it.
This is not being dramatic in any way; it is reality and a blue print for the future. Reduced crewing etcetera is only the beginning. Forget travel payments and the like. How long do you think that will last? You're being distracted. They hope as your routes dwindle that you won't mind too much because you have got a "travel payment". Remember the "money back guarantee" after the '97 dispute? It was supposed to be for life, but lasted 3 years.
If you take part time, how long will your earnings and work last before you're forced back to full time to try and make ends meet, or to pay your mortage? And to what kind of agreement?
At Gatwick, current crew feel disenfranchised by the better agreements that exist at Heathrow, and in turn blame Heathrow crew for that, yet miss the obvious fact that the real blame lies with a management that simply won't offer them comparable agreements. They could do but they won't. Instead they encourage a "them and us" and "why should they have all that and you don't" attitude.
Is this to be the future for us all? Where worsening levels of change are imposed upon one area after another and rather than aspiring to better arrangements, we will all be caught in a downward spiral.
You will have only one chance. If you waste this opportunity now, you will not get another. Your agreements were hard fought for by us and the crew that have gone before us and we urge you not to surrender them meekly.
Vote YES to industrial action and show them that you're still proud to work for BA and of the job that you do but that you won't be walked over. Insist that BA returns to the table to negotiate change - not impose it.
We want to see that this company truly values its customers, in not causing them any future disruption by forcing crew into an unnecessary strike.
You're the best cabin crew in the world; you do not have to feel embarrassed to earn a decent living and to pay a mortage. You do a great job for this company; you're its public face, the reason that people fly with BA and you've earned the right to a proper wage.
Don't forget that we've not refused to accept cost savings - far from it. We've previously offered to make genuine concessions worth tens of millions of pounds, far more than any other area within BA.
Those offers were refused. Why? Because it would sadly appear that this was never really about saving money but about that good old-fashioned management principle - the "right to impose". THey want to tell you what to do and when to do it and if you don't like it, then leave. You won't be a valued employee but a commodity in a uniform that can be obtained more cheaply for them, that is far more important than you, our customers or our airline.
Now is the time for them to be sensible and to truly "put our customers first". Our board of directors must now act to protect the reputation and standing of our airline. To do otherwise would beggar belief, as any savings achieved would immediately be lost.
Gg
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However, we do not subscribe to the actions of British Airways in attempting to impose changes to your terms and conditions.
Most other groups within BA have had constant change to T's & C's for the ast 10 years or so, why is it so difficult for the CC Union to swallow now? Perhaps the result of years of toy throwing and feckless weak management?
So, are the impositions contractual?
Don't forget that we've not refused to accept cost savings - far from it. We've previously offered to make genuine concessions worth tens of millions of pounds, far more than any other area within BA.
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Ballot Paper details part 4
We respect that you have a choice but if you vote NO to industrial action, we will accept it, however you must fully understand the implications of doing so. You'll be voting to accept their vision of the future; a future where you no longer have agreements that are worth the paper they're written on.
Your Union will become irrelevant and so will you. A single lone staff number, managed by arbitrary decisions taken by faceless managers that you've never even heard of, let alone met. You'll no longer have a voice and will simply not be listened to anymore.
To repeat one last time, agreements reached in good faith and agreed by both sides have been broken and will continue to be broken if you sit back and do nothing. This potentially means any agreement that you currently enjoy could be removed or altered in the future when and whenever they wish, without notice. If that is your choice then so be it. We are a democracy and what you decide is what we will do.
BA will now crank up their mighty propaganda machine. You will be bombarded with ESS emails, management briefings, in-touch days etc etc. Expect a management charm offensive to show how "reasonable and caring" they are and how interested they are in your views and concerns. Expect this to last exactly as long as it takes to count our ballot. After that you'll be left on your own to count the cost that these savings will have... and so on and so on.
Then see how interested they are in YOU!
Unite is your union. It is made up of YOU and your reps are only here to do want you want us to! We all do the same job, we fly on the same aircraft and we live and work in the same community. Most of your reps are married to, or live with partners that are also crew. This job is our carreer, It's our future. We're proud to do it and long may that remain the case for us all. Being BA crew is something to be proud of, it still has prestige. Let's keep it that way.
We, like you, depend on this job and BA being successful to pay our mortgage and our bills. When Bill, Tony and James, et-al have used cabin crew as a stepping-stone and moved up the career ladder, we will all still be here. If changes are going to hurt cabin crew, then we will not be afraid or bullied from standing up and saying so, that's our job. We will always try to negotiate but when talks have been little more than a pretence, where BA do all the talking but none of the listening, then there is little left to say.
Nobody wants to take industrial action - nobody. But sadly the actions of our management leave us with no alternative; it's the only way left to get our voices hear before it's too late. Sometimes you just have to take a deep breath, be brave and do the right thing; we can't dress it up for you in any other way.. now is that time.
Without a strong show of support from YOU, our members, Bassa, Amicus section or even UNITE'S ability to protect you will be gone permanently and won't be coming back. We've received countless messages of support from other areas within BA, because they know if we lose this, then they're next.
It's a sad day to have to do this but we've no other options left, if we had, we would've taken them. The shadow of uncertainty hanging over us has been there long enough; it's now time to vote YES - the alternative will be too awful to contemplate. Nobody likes to make these kinds of decisions; it's easier to hope it'll all just go away but it won't. Your future career prospects and all that involves are now in your own hands.
What happens next is quite literally up to you; we've done our level best over the last year to explain what will happen to the rest of your career and what these changes will mean but at the end of the day, it's simply up to you. Don't rely on others, as they may be relying on you.
The future isn't yet written; we urge you to play your part in changing it for the better. In the end, your union is you and your are your union - it's that simple and it's now time to play your part.
It's your vote, everybody has one - please make it count.
Sincerely, all of your BAssa and Amicus CC reps.
Inscribed in the New England Holocaust Memorial
First they came for the Communists,
Why should I speak up for I wasn't a Communist?
I remained silent
Then they came for the Jews,
And I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Jew.
I remained silent.
Then they came for the trade unionists,
And I didn't speak up because I wasn't a trade unionist.
I remained silent.
Then they came for the Catholics,
And I didn't speak up because I was a Protestant.
I remained silent.
Then they came for me,
...There was no one left to speak out for me.
First they came.... is a poem attributed to Pastor Martin Niemoller (1892-1984) about the inactivity of German intellectuals to speak out following the right wing political rise to power and the purging of any opposition to their way of thinking during the late 1930's
Your Union will become irrelevant and so will you. A single lone staff number, managed by arbitrary decisions taken by faceless managers that you've never even heard of, let alone met. You'll no longer have a voice and will simply not be listened to anymore.
To repeat one last time, agreements reached in good faith and agreed by both sides have been broken and will continue to be broken if you sit back and do nothing. This potentially means any agreement that you currently enjoy could be removed or altered in the future when and whenever they wish, without notice. If that is your choice then so be it. We are a democracy and what you decide is what we will do.
BA will now crank up their mighty propaganda machine. You will be bombarded with ESS emails, management briefings, in-touch days etc etc. Expect a management charm offensive to show how "reasonable and caring" they are and how interested they are in your views and concerns. Expect this to last exactly as long as it takes to count our ballot. After that you'll be left on your own to count the cost that these savings will have... and so on and so on.
Then see how interested they are in YOU!
Unite is your union. It is made up of YOU and your reps are only here to do want you want us to! We all do the same job, we fly on the same aircraft and we live and work in the same community. Most of your reps are married to, or live with partners that are also crew. This job is our carreer, It's our future. We're proud to do it and long may that remain the case for us all. Being BA crew is something to be proud of, it still has prestige. Let's keep it that way.
We, like you, depend on this job and BA being successful to pay our mortgage and our bills. When Bill, Tony and James, et-al have used cabin crew as a stepping-stone and moved up the career ladder, we will all still be here. If changes are going to hurt cabin crew, then we will not be afraid or bullied from standing up and saying so, that's our job. We will always try to negotiate but when talks have been little more than a pretence, where BA do all the talking but none of the listening, then there is little left to say.
Nobody wants to take industrial action - nobody. But sadly the actions of our management leave us with no alternative; it's the only way left to get our voices hear before it's too late. Sometimes you just have to take a deep breath, be brave and do the right thing; we can't dress it up for you in any other way.. now is that time.
Without a strong show of support from YOU, our members, Bassa, Amicus section or even UNITE'S ability to protect you will be gone permanently and won't be coming back. We've received countless messages of support from other areas within BA, because they know if we lose this, then they're next.
It's a sad day to have to do this but we've no other options left, if we had, we would've taken them. The shadow of uncertainty hanging over us has been there long enough; it's now time to vote YES - the alternative will be too awful to contemplate. Nobody likes to make these kinds of decisions; it's easier to hope it'll all just go away but it won't. Your future career prospects and all that involves are now in your own hands.
What happens next is quite literally up to you; we've done our level best over the last year to explain what will happen to the rest of your career and what these changes will mean but at the end of the day, it's simply up to you. Don't rely on others, as they may be relying on you.
The future isn't yet written; we urge you to play your part in changing it for the better. In the end, your union is you and your are your union - it's that simple and it's now time to play your part.
It's your vote, everybody has one - please make it count.
Sincerely, all of your BAssa and Amicus CC reps.
Inscribed in the New England Holocaust Memorial
First they came for the Communists,
Why should I speak up for I wasn't a Communist?
I remained silent
Then they came for the Jews,
And I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Jew.
I remained silent.
Then they came for the trade unionists,
And I didn't speak up because I wasn't a trade unionist.
I remained silent.
Then they came for the Catholics,
And I didn't speak up because I was a Protestant.
I remained silent.
Then they came for me,
...There was no one left to speak out for me.
First they came.... is a poem attributed to Pastor Martin Niemoller (1892-1984) about the inactivity of German intellectuals to speak out following the right wing political rise to power and the purging of any opposition to their way of thinking during the late 1930's
I now have typer's cramp, but have enough strength to make a cross in the NO box.
Gg
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Glamgirl
Quote:
'We want to see that this company truly values its customers, in not causing them any future disruption by forcing crew into an unnecessary strike.
You're the best cabin crew in the world; you do not have to feel embarrassed to earn a decent living and to pay a mortage. You do a great job for this company; you're its public face, the reason that people fly with BA and you've earned the right to a proper wage'
Thank for enlightening a long time customer of BA who has 3 Club flights booked in the near future for my wife & myself. Re the above statement, I fail to see how this fits in with the so called mission statement. Is there any reason why I should not set about cancelling these flights & booking with another airline? I assume that no one will be filling the vacant seats.
Please continue with your mission to make your hard working colleagues see some common sense.
'We want to see that this company truly values its customers, in not causing them any future disruption by forcing crew into an unnecessary strike.
You're the best cabin crew in the world; you do not have to feel embarrassed to earn a decent living and to pay a mortage. You do a great job for this company; you're its public face, the reason that people fly with BA and you've earned the right to a proper wage'
Thank for enlightening a long time customer of BA who has 3 Club flights booked in the near future for my wife & myself. Re the above statement, I fail to see how this fits in with the so called mission statement. Is there any reason why I should not set about cancelling these flights & booking with another airline? I assume that no one will be filling the vacant seats.
Please continue with your mission to make your hard working colleagues see some common sense.
Last edited by fincastle84; 17th Nov 2009 at 20:01. Reason: sp.
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CFC
Glad to see that you're still around. Why won't you provide an answer to my earlier questions. Post #3311 refers, please see below.
Quote:Although I am ONLY a BA customer I have spent my life working in the aviation industry, initially flying in the RAF & latterly working for a small airline based at BOH, which sadly failed last year due to the economic climate. I therefore have first hand experience of being unemployed!
I fail to understand BASSA's position during these difficult times. As BA is haemorrhaging money daily how will closing down the company improve either the balance sheet or pay the wage bill? Once the strike is over, what are their plans for regaining the loyalty of their passengers who have just enjoyed a ruined Christmas?
I apologise if this seems a simplistic series of questions but your detailed replies may help me to understand exactly what is going on. Come on you BASSA folk, let's here your answers to these important questions, PLEASE!
Quote:Although I am ONLY a BA customer I have spent my life working in the aviation industry, initially flying in the RAF & latterly working for a small airline based at BOH, which sadly failed last year due to the economic climate. I therefore have first hand experience of being unemployed!
I fail to understand BASSA's position during these difficult times. As BA is haemorrhaging money daily how will closing down the company improve either the balance sheet or pay the wage bill? Once the strike is over, what are their plans for regaining the loyalty of their passengers who have just enjoyed a ruined Christmas?
I apologise if this seems a simplistic series of questions but your detailed replies may help me to understand exactly what is going on. Come on you BASSA folk, let's here your answers to these important questions, PLEASE!
PPRuNe Person
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Well typed, Gg. So there is nothing new in what BASSA are saying, it just comes across as a long emotional plea, very short on substance and high on rhetoric.
In today's BA, that kind of approach no longer works with our management, who seem to be very hard-bitten. They (management) are playing a very serious game and BASSA's leader(s) seem to have totally missed the bus as to how to talk to mgt.
Talk of "BA imposing not negotiating" still missing the point that the negotiating deadline was 30/6/09! (June 30th for our American readers)
When the dust settles from this I feel that BASSA members will be in a vacuum, something will have to fill that.
In today's BA, that kind of approach no longer works with our management, who seem to be very hard-bitten. They (management) are playing a very serious game and BASSA's leader(s) seem to have totally missed the bus as to how to talk to mgt.
Talk of "BA imposing not negotiating" still missing the point that the negotiating deadline was 30/6/09! (June 30th for our American readers)
When the dust settles from this I feel that BASSA members will be in a vacuum, something will have to fill that.
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So first BASSA pinch the Iwo Jima memorial image, now they're invoking the memory of the Holocaust in their efforts to win support? Have they lost all sense of reality?
fincastle84,
Your Christmas travel plans are safe. What BASSA are undertaking here is merely a 'consultative’ or ‘indicative’ ballot - kind of like a referendum - and it has absolutely no effect on BA flights because it cannot be used as a strike platform. And I bet there aren't that many BASSA members that are truly aware of that. I'll say it again - BASSA cannot call a strike on this ballot.
It would appear that the main reason BASSA are doing this is window dressing - trying to pressure the company (because it does upset BA's punters and some take their business elsewhere) and trying to cover up all the bluster issued earlier, "If they impose, we will ballot." But it is largely useless and meaningless - they can't do a thing with the result, except perhaps issue more juvenile edicts and claptrap. Hollow nonsense, all of it!
Enjoy your holiday!
Your Christmas travel plans are safe. What BASSA are undertaking here is merely a 'consultative’ or ‘indicative’ ballot - kind of like a referendum - and it has absolutely no effect on BA flights because it cannot be used as a strike platform. And I bet there aren't that many BASSA members that are truly aware of that. I'll say it again - BASSA cannot call a strike on this ballot.
It would appear that the main reason BASSA are doing this is window dressing - trying to pressure the company (because it does upset BA's punters and some take their business elsewhere) and trying to cover up all the bluster issued earlier, "If they impose, we will ballot." But it is largely useless and meaningless - they can't do a thing with the result, except perhaps issue more juvenile edicts and claptrap. Hollow nonsense, all of it!
Enjoy your holiday!
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I would have voted no!
Tiramisu,
I resigned union membership way before talk of IA, but will have great pleasure in helping crew our planes over the coming months no matter what Unite try and do!
I resigned union membership way before talk of IA, but will have great pleasure in helping crew our planes over the coming months no matter what Unite try and do!
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Ballot Paper Details
I'm quite appalled that Unite has ended the letter with the New England Holocaust memorial inscription. It's completely over the top and in bad taste. I hope others see it that way too!
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I'm quite appalled that Unite has ended the letter with the New England Holocaust memorial inscription
Especially as it would more aptly be written: First they came for Belfast with Glasgow, Birmingham, Manchester, Regional Shuttle and finally Gatwick following. Don't suppose they'll ever get the irony will they?
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Today's News
How will BASSA respond to this? Don't they think PWC are corrupt? Also interesting that they expect the deal to be formalised in February. One would assume that's because they expect BASSA's court case to have collapsed by then (if there's still a BASSA around to fight it, that is). Also, I can't see how Roger Maynard's position can be anything but good. He is ideally placed with knowledge of all three organisations, and whilst perhaps he should not have a vote on any issue, can surely offer a unique perspective on the whether the merger suits everyone concerned.
LONDON (Dow Jones)--British Airways PLC (BAY.LN) pension trustees have asked PricewaterhouseCoopers to advise them on how a potential merger with Iberia Lineas Aereas de Espana SA (IBLA.MC) could affect funding into BA's pensions schemes, a person familiar with the matter said Tuesday. The previous valuation and analysis didn't consider Spanish carrier Iberia in any funding plans, he said. In addition, lawyers will assess Roger Maynard's role as he is chairman of British Airways Pensions and a director at Iberia, the person added. A spokesman for BA said the airline remains confident there is no conflict of interest. According to a preliminary deal that the two companies hope to formalize in February, Iberia can walk away if talks between BA and its pension trustees don't suit the Spanish carrier. Both parties have agreed on a break fee of EUR20 million should either side walk away.
The two airlines hope to close their merger by November 2010. Since the trustees' last review, BA has paid about GBP1.8 billion into its two pension plans in the past three years. -By Kaveri Niththyananthan, Dow Jones Newswires
Ironically, even a deep crawl for updated news finds nothing new on the ballot issue. Perhaps our roving journos on here didn't get the full text of the letter until it was too late for the deadline. It would be nice if someone picked it up and pulled it apart though. Perhaps they too are scared of bricks through their windows or the like.
Perhaps it will be all a damp squib. I think the "No's" are still in the lead here (although obviously we are only talking about the ones brave enough to post without fear of reprisals).
It's also interesting to see them now referring to the "tens of millions" of savings they purportedly offered. Are they now backing down from the lie of the 175 million figure? I have yet to check if that fabricated figure is still on the Unite website. Or are they now just being honest. In which case, given that they knew that 140 million was needed, why didn't they do the simple maths in the first place?
...Er.... sickening...... totally sickening.....
VOTE NO AND RESIGN FROM BASSA!
LONDON (Dow Jones)--British Airways PLC (BAY.LN) pension trustees have asked PricewaterhouseCoopers to advise them on how a potential merger with Iberia Lineas Aereas de Espana SA (IBLA.MC) could affect funding into BA's pensions schemes, a person familiar with the matter said Tuesday. The previous valuation and analysis didn't consider Spanish carrier Iberia in any funding plans, he said. In addition, lawyers will assess Roger Maynard's role as he is chairman of British Airways Pensions and a director at Iberia, the person added. A spokesman for BA said the airline remains confident there is no conflict of interest. According to a preliminary deal that the two companies hope to formalize in February, Iberia can walk away if talks between BA and its pension trustees don't suit the Spanish carrier. Both parties have agreed on a break fee of EUR20 million should either side walk away.
The two airlines hope to close their merger by November 2010. Since the trustees' last review, BA has paid about GBP1.8 billion into its two pension plans in the past three years. -By Kaveri Niththyananthan, Dow Jones Newswires
Ironically, even a deep crawl for updated news finds nothing new on the ballot issue. Perhaps our roving journos on here didn't get the full text of the letter until it was too late for the deadline. It would be nice if someone picked it up and pulled it apart though. Perhaps they too are scared of bricks through their windows or the like.
Perhaps it will be all a damp squib. I think the "No's" are still in the lead here (although obviously we are only talking about the ones brave enough to post without fear of reprisals).
It's also interesting to see them now referring to the "tens of millions" of savings they purportedly offered. Are they now backing down from the lie of the 175 million figure? I have yet to check if that fabricated figure is still on the Unite website. Or are they now just being honest. In which case, given that they knew that 140 million was needed, why didn't they do the simple maths in the first place?
...Er.... sickening...... totally sickening.....
VOTE NO AND RESIGN FROM BASSA!
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While the current BASSA Worshiping crew live in LA LA Land and the rest of the world moves on, without sounding rude do you have any idea when or if this New Fleet will even come to light?
Im on of those recruited at the start of the year (which now feels like a life time ago) and have not had any flying experience im not sure the exact number of us 'new recruits' they have swimming around but it can't be small because when i selected an interview date i had the choice out of 3 weeks worth! Having said that on my assessment out of 22 only 7 of us were kept behind for 'admin' ie you got the job we need all your details and for you to sign all these air side pass documents etc etc!
While BA is making huge losses and some people think its acceptable to go to HKG on a 5 day trip and be paid £800, i am in no doubt that i will be joining on some lesser contract if that ever comes to light. The main reasoning behind this post is when can BA start implementing their IMPOSED New Fleet structure? how would it work? im guessing it would have to have a significant long haul element as in any trip that has a box payment/b2b payment etc etc etc? How would they even train us and even get us into the rostering system? They would need huge numbers on this new contract?
Its just the current cabin crew at BA i've spoken to actually categorically deny any New Fleet and say it will never come to light! But instead us waiting in the wings will join on a new contract and fly along side them! Clearly they don't grasp basic maths of 14 crew fly to HKG, on a 3 day trip followed by 2 days mbt and not on £800 in pay! as opposed to 14 crew on a 5 day trip with only 2 on new contracts?
Is New Fleet realistic?
Will it happen?
When? How?
Its just i can't wait for BA forever and my application is valid until August 2010! In the mean time i want to start other jobs but i don't want to do so in the new year and get a call for BA!
Also i think its relatively hilarious that the STRIKE is based on IMPOSITION! i thought New Fleet was the biggest threat, clearly they realized you can't strike based on speculative future earnings! Its like the blind leading the blind you should read some of the posts on cabincrew.com they will literally make you laugh out loud! Its like children are positing without even reading facts or understanding things! LA LA Land is the best way to describe it.
I hope everyone is well and this doesn't generate some back lash of comments! Its just NF is on the table and around but so little is known about how they can even implement it effectively to get the savings they want!
Hope everyone has a good day. :-)
Im on of those recruited at the start of the year (which now feels like a life time ago) and have not had any flying experience im not sure the exact number of us 'new recruits' they have swimming around but it can't be small because when i selected an interview date i had the choice out of 3 weeks worth! Having said that on my assessment out of 22 only 7 of us were kept behind for 'admin' ie you got the job we need all your details and for you to sign all these air side pass documents etc etc!
While BA is making huge losses and some people think its acceptable to go to HKG on a 5 day trip and be paid £800, i am in no doubt that i will be joining on some lesser contract if that ever comes to light. The main reasoning behind this post is when can BA start implementing their IMPOSED New Fleet structure? how would it work? im guessing it would have to have a significant long haul element as in any trip that has a box payment/b2b payment etc etc etc? How would they even train us and even get us into the rostering system? They would need huge numbers on this new contract?
Its just the current cabin crew at BA i've spoken to actually categorically deny any New Fleet and say it will never come to light! But instead us waiting in the wings will join on a new contract and fly along side them! Clearly they don't grasp basic maths of 14 crew fly to HKG, on a 3 day trip followed by 2 days mbt and not on £800 in pay! as opposed to 14 crew on a 5 day trip with only 2 on new contracts?
Is New Fleet realistic?
Will it happen?
When? How?
Its just i can't wait for BA forever and my application is valid until August 2010! In the mean time i want to start other jobs but i don't want to do so in the new year and get a call for BA!
Also i think its relatively hilarious that the STRIKE is based on IMPOSITION! i thought New Fleet was the biggest threat, clearly they realized you can't strike based on speculative future earnings! Its like the blind leading the blind you should read some of the posts on cabincrew.com they will literally make you laugh out loud! Its like children are positing without even reading facts or understanding things! LA LA Land is the best way to describe it.
I hope everyone is well and this doesn't generate some back lash of comments! Its just NF is on the table and around but so little is known about how they can even implement it effectively to get the savings they want!
Hope everyone has a good day. :-)
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bks...
...don't forget the hundreds of us who were recruited between April-June 08 and are still waiting for news. Although I suspect we'll be kicked out of the pool soon; many already have.
I really do hope you guys have better luck than we did and at least get an offer, whatever it may be.
I really do hope you guys have better luck than we did and at least get an offer, whatever it may be.
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Carnage_matey,
The wording on the strike ballot is required to make it a lawful ballot. The question has to specifically ask if the crew are willing to strike (or take action short of a strike), followed by specifying the person/persons who will have the authority to call for strike action.
The ballot must also contain the phrase explaining about how 'you may be in breach of contract but dismissal for this will be deemed unfair blah blah blah'.
From what I can see it seems to be a valid ballot for a strike. See here
http://www.berr.gov.uk/files/file18013.pdf
Looks like the BASSA ballot is pretty much exactly like the sample in Annex 2.
The wording on the strike ballot is required to make it a lawful ballot. The question has to specifically ask if the crew are willing to strike (or take action short of a strike), followed by specifying the person/persons who will have the authority to call for strike action.
The ballot must also contain the phrase explaining about how 'you may be in breach of contract but dismissal for this will be deemed unfair blah blah blah'.
From what I can see it seems to be a valid ballot for a strike. See here
http://www.berr.gov.uk/files/file18013.pdf
Looks like the BASSA ballot is pretty much exactly like the sample in Annex 2.
Last edited by spin_doctor; 18th Nov 2009 at 08:14.