keeperboy

Dear All,

Well this one is for those of you who for some reason or another despise BA cabin crew. You feel the need to pop up in nearly every BA thread even if you have no idea of the issues being discussed, simply to take a sweeping swipe at BA cabin crew, their conditions, of the 'lowliness' of the job itself.

Simply have a look at threads like "BA and attendance", "crew allowences in Willie Walshes sights", "BA again" etc etc. In fact, ANY thread with "BA" in it. You will see the same users that pop in, with something un-related, negative and derogatory to say. They don't fly, and many of them admit to not even working for BA at all. But for reasons unknown, they can't help but take a sweeping swipe at ALL BA cabin crew.

Here are a few choice quotes:

"BA = Bloody awful? Crew with attitude and with no customer service training whatsoever"

"BA longhaul offers dire customer service, but the crew don't really care because they're all asleep...."resting" from what?

"I refer to simple things like being offered a drink more than once in a twelve hour flight"

"BA crews now frantically searching the dictionairies for the word customer"

Now, I am not going to be so naieve as to say that it is simply not possible to have a bad flight on BA, or to encounter a lazy crew member. But these sweeping, vague statements are not necessary.

If you are ever on a BA longhaul flight and all the crew are sleeping, please , demand to see the CSD at once as this is completely against company policy and DOES NOT HAPPEN. Likewise ,if you receive one drink on a twelve hour flight.

I am NOT saying that people shouldn't be entitled to their own opinion, or to post about their negative experiences. But please, if you have a complaint to be made, please be a little more specific. Is it really every BA flight you travel on that offers "dire service". Was it every one of the cabin crew on your flight that had "attitude".

Otherwise, and without being sarcastic, I would be seriously interested to know what makes you all so 'anti BA'.

And finally, take a look at the SKYTRAX website. Its URL is www.airlinequality.com. Check out the "passenger opinions" pages for hundred of people that have travelled with us. The posts are overwhelmingly positive.

lesarcs1

Well, you're right, but people can only comment on their experiences.

I fly long haul economy regularly and have to admit (for various reasons) I always try to avoid BA.

With respect to cabin crew, on a recent flight from Barbados:

- All cabin crew (yes ALL, in economy anyway) treated the flight like some sort of teenage party - regularly blocking the aisles for 10 minutes at a time whilst they chatted up the groups of lads who had taken their eye.

- All cabin crew (ALL economy) offered only 1 drink to passengers for the flight - I was greeted with glares and frowns when I asked.

- No cabin crew slept on the flight, which is virtuous - however no passengers slept either due to the cackles of laughter and shouts coming from the galley.

- My girlfriend asked 3 seperate crew for a replacement headset as it only had one earpiece - all 3 suggested she could make do.

- A drink spilt in the galley was not mopped up for the entire flight - resulting in Diet Coke footprints up and down the aisle.

You are right - I'm sure this isn't representative of BA crew in general but I have never had this sort of experience with Virgin, SAA, American, Emirates or any other airline I have travelled on recently.

worldtraveller

I choose to travel BA where ever possible. I think it speaks volumes to see crew still at BA who have been there for many years. Something quite rare in the airline industry these days as many airlines (and cabin crew) see it as something to do for a 'larf' (sic) for a while before moving on elsewhere.

Keeperboy, I followed your link to SKYTRAX and can only echo what I read from recent posts:

19/07 "...well done british airways, service and staff excellent..."

19/07 "...cabin crew average to good...."

19/07 "....excellent high level of cabin staff throughout...."

10/07 "...flight attendants were great, a case of seen and not heard..."

I was also suprised to read some posts regarding other airlines, most notable Virgin. I thought their service was quite good, but the posts seem quite negative!

From my experience, BA crews are the only crew that seem to actually enjoy their job. When I fly other airlines, such as ANA or Singapore, I find the service faultless. However, they lack 'humaness' if such a word exisits. It is almost as if I am being served by robots. BA crew always seem to be able to crack a joke or have a chat, something you would never encounter on the far eastern carriers.

I think a problem for some people is that they do not fly very often, or they usually use charter or low cost flights and expect the earth from the likes of BA. They remember the service that they received on carrier 'A' five years ago and compare it with the likes of BA today. However, i'm sure that if they were to fly carrier 'A' again today, they would notice a big difference. This even applies to the far eastern carriers. I in particular was a little shocked by a recent flight in Raffles Class on SQ. It appears major cost cutting has been imposed.

I say BA, keep up the good work.

Middle Seat

I find Skytrax to be a recepticle of rants, even though there are posts describing a pleasant experience. It seems to me that people find it easier to complain than to compliment.

as for BA in particular, well based on my dozen or so flights on them in the last 10 years, I'd take a BA crew any day over some of the crews I've encountered on U.S. domestic flights.

jerrystinger

I don't think you help matters by starting this topic.
I think it's unfair to say all BA flights are poor, but as a rule of thumb I prefer not to use them on longhaul flights over 8 hours because their service levels compared to other carriers isn't very good. That kind of comment is bound to upset loyal employees like yourself, keeperboy, but on a BA flight to BKK or SIN, GRU or MRU (ie v long!) you do receive the minimum - and often grudgingly. Fact.

I used to fly BA to Aus, but you would get a meal after take off and then a rushed meal 1.5hrs before landing.....and sweet FA for the 9+hrs in the middle - unless the passengers got up and ask the crew reading their papers! On Singapore, Thai, JAL and Virgin passengers are offered food and drinks (by their seats) frequently...without the "I'm due my break" attitude I used to get from BA. Sorry, but it's true.
I think other airline crews don't consider themselves superior nor do they think they do the best job in the world, but unfortunately BA has always been the opposite and had crews with over active egos. Where do BA crews get the idea that they do an amazing job from? Maybe you could enlighten us....
My wife never felt comfortable asking for anything on our AUS trips with BA and that, I think, sums things up.
As for opinions/surveys they all seem to contradict one another - according to one poll ASIANA airlines is top and BA not even in top 10! ????
I hope things change!

purr777

For me the problem with BA is the lack of consistency, especially on long flights: one trip can be good, while another can be dire. BA domestic and European are brilliant, but BA longhaul is not my first choice and not my last.
I don't give the crews the chance to have attitude as I'm not the one stacking trays!

chopperchav

I fly often, usually business and after last experience will never fly BA again. My wife had to fly on a separate flight with 2 month old baby and cabin crew wouldn't lift a finger to make journey less stressfull.
She also left pram in baggage hall and we have been unable to retrieve it from BA and have had to buy new one.
Recently flew Monarch and Easyjet and thought they were brilliant. My impression is that BA morale is rock bottom.

keeperboy

Jerrystinger I totally take on board your points re: BA service levels.

I started this topic in order to try and gain an understanding as to why some people are so anti BA to the point that they join cabin crew forums on attendance etc just to antagonise and insult us.

I guess as cabin crew we have little impact over what we actually provide in the cabin. Personally, I find it embarassing having to give the 'deli box' as the second service on a long sector such as LHR-SIN. However, that is what we have to work with. So I do my best to offer that deli box to each and every passenger with a smile and respect.

On 95% of flights that I have worked on we come around with juice and water in between services. Albeit if you happen to have your eyes closed when one of these rounds occur it may seem 'hours' before you see crew in the cabin when in reality this isn't true.

I know personally I give 110% on flights I work on. I don't think I am superior to anyone but I do think I have the best job in the world. I love it, and I like to think that it comes across in my attitude when working in the cabin. And I have to say I find most (not all) of my collegues share the same view.

We are not saying we are perfect and I am all for hearing when we fail to meet expectations, providing those expectations are real-world. But the constant negativeness towards us from people that have a personal grudge against BA or it's crews are just demoralising.

One of the great things about working for an airline is the ability to get cheap tickets on other airlines. I love to travel and use other airlines extensively. And I can say from a totally un-biased approach that we are at least 'in the middle'. There are airlines more consistant than us, but a hell of a lot more that are much worse.

As for SKYTRAX.....It states on it's website that it's 'awards' are based on the worlds BIGGEST passenger survey.

BA came 5th overall and achieved a 'four star' rating.

PropellerPaul

I flew B.A. shorthaul about two weeks ago & I have to say they were very good. It was an A319, two thirds full & it appeared like there were loads of crew. Being Crew myself, for a number of years, I have to say they couldn't have been more proffessional & the purser on the flight I could have 'hugged' she was so lovely! Now I'm not starting A 'Let's Knock This Airline...' thread, but has anyone ever flown with Air Canada...? Oh my god, I've never met such a bunch of crew that didn't get-on & were arguing with each other during the cabin service. The 'Demo' was a joke. No individual screen. Un-comfy seat. average food.. Anyway, the point I'm trying to make is that every single flight is different, and so are we, so what's good for you might not be good for me... we could go on for ever, but I do think B.A. is up there with the major players as being an airline of choice..

jetsetterbfs

I must say I have not always been a huge supporter of BA - I have, in my own personal experiences had some rather unpleasant flights.

However, having had a few recent flights I will take it all back - I've found the BA crew to be more than helpful. My colleague and I (travelling on a staff ticket) were given a tour of the aircraft, including the crew rest areas - which are pretty unknown in my airline! The purser in economy also filled a bag with wine, beer, miniatures etc. for us, and managed to get us an upgrade on the following sector. I am aware that this is probably very against company policy, but it made such a difference to have been given that extra special treatment.

Besides all that, the crew were always coming through offering juice and water. I never felt the need to press my call bell for anything. (Not that I would, anyway!) Compared to Qantas, they were superb. With Qantas, I was offered lunch and breakfast - drinks on top. That was all I had on a thirteen hour flight. Very disappointing.

That's not to say I still haven't had the unpleasant experiences, but the same could be said for my airline, and any airline. If I have appeared "anti-BA" in the past, it has not been the case. I am actually quite pro-BA as an airline, but anti- some (minority) BA crews' attitudes towards my own airline and staff. It is the crew who think they are special because they work for BA that cause me annoyance. I agree they are in a large minority, but they are perhaps the most vocal on this message board.

That, I believe, is why you may find a lot of "anti-BA" sentiment. It is always those with the most stringent views who express the firmest opinions.

Bring on the moderates!

The Greaser

All airlines have good crews, all have bad crews. I returned from Orlando on Virgin recently where the service, against my previous Virgin experiences, was absolutely hopeless, the girls did the absolute minimum necessary and were very surly with it. Some of them clearly seemed hungover. I haven't flown BA for along time but I am sure that on average they are no better or worse than most other airlines.

emmathestar

every airline can be picked on, i happen to think BA are,as they say, the worlds favourite airline.

Say your opinion yes, slag them off on every post, no.
xxx

keeperboy

I think BA has a bit of a bad rep because some years ago it went through a phase when staff morale was really low, therefore customer service suffered. In the late 80's early 90's they really were the worse airline around. However, BA has come out the other end now, and over the last 18 months taken on over 1,000 new cabin crew which has given 'fresh breath' into the company.

'The Worlds Favourite Airline' wasn't actually a self attached arrogant title because we thought we were so great either. BA branded itself 'Worlds favourite airline' the first year that it carried more international passengers than any other airline in the world.

Thanks for the positive and even average posts guys! Nice to hear that some people enjoy flying with us.

TopBunk

Keeperboy

Your defending your colleagues does you proud, and I'm sure that you do give 110% every flight.

BA Shorthaul do deliver a fine service about 99% of the time, to a pretty high and consistent level.

The problem BA faces is in Longhaul, where, face up to it, for a substantial proportion of the crews, the prime driver is getting the service done so that the breaks can be maximised. This, as has been said earlier, is in direct contrast to virtually every other European, Middle East and Asian carrier. It is something that needs to be addressed and is the reason for the 'inconsistency' referred to earlier.

On a daylight flight to the eastern seaboard of the USA, while the break required is either 20 or 40 minutes, crew frequently take about 1h30 minimum - this on a flight which:

• Most passengers are awake for the full duration of
• It is daylight outside
• It is UK daytime
• The flight is about 8 hours max long

One of the big problems in BA is the separation of CC into IFS (In Flight Service) from FC in Flight Ops, with the resultant non-accountability of the CC to the Captain for the service delivery.

woodpecker

TopBunk

Further to you comments regarding sectors "across the pond", sectors the other way to TLV used to be shorthaul with the Cabin Crew on duty for the entire flight.

Converting to the B777 I thought I had left TLV behind me but there it was, now a longhaul service.

I was amazed to see the CSD allocating bunk rest on a sector of 4hr 30mins. This was at a time when the Carribean was being operated with AML cabin crew who did twelve hour, two sector, duties with no rest facility at all!

Bart O'Lynn

Its quite simple. Ba lhr longhaul is jobsworth unionised over managed (badly) shambles. Anything else is just posturing and denial.
Its not about hating them , its about fact. Each individual is capable of high standards and personnal pride but the self perpetuating jobswoth monster they join soon asimilates them, or overshadows them or deals with them.

Keeperboy , your arguments, though valid in the world of BA have no effect on people on this board who do twice the duties that ba do without all the trimmings. Thats also a fact, so trying to justify the BA work ethic to people who work twice as hard is just pissing agianst the wind.

TFlyguy

As has been said before you will always get the good and the bad no matter which airline you fly with!

However, for attitude, you need look no further than VS crews in Concord House at LGW!

Is it SO difficult to say "Thank you" for holding the lift doors? Is it SO difficult to say"Could you press floor 2 please"? Apparently the answer is "yes" it is too difficult!

I am also amazed by a previous comment saying the Cabin Crew should be accountable to he Captain for the on-board service - we dont tell you how to fly - don't tell us how to push a cart!

Bart O'Lynn

TF,

The captain is the accountable manager in, law, on the aircraft when it is doors closed and despatched. The captain is usually (except Ba) the accountable manger for all aspects of the flight.Its not about telling you how to do your job, rather ensuring that the job is done properly, and people are accountable for their shortcomings. This authority is usually devolved to the senior for practicable purposes and then to the maincrew etc etc.. However the lawful instructions that you give out to passengers, (and all your authority in the cabin) has its legitimacy in being issued on BEHALF OF THE AIRCRAFT COMMANDER ,( not the csd,senior etc etc)who in turn is mandated through the air navigation order.

This break in the chain of command at BA is the problem as the cabin seem only answerable to themselves, or a like minded greater organism. A dangerous situation. For a further organic analogy or comparison. If you dont clean the mould in fridge it becomes wide spread and thus the norm. A fridge cant clean itself.

No need to get on your high horse about being told to do your jobs, but as an aside you are not qualified to tell us how to fly, or i'm sure you would,but I am completely upto speed as to how to do your job as an ex cabin crew member.

Additionally people have the same opinion of your company at concorde house, if TF signifies what i think it does.

on time is the only time

KTPops

TFlyGuy, Seriously! I find that so offensive!

On the one hand you are talking about not tarring everyone with the same brush because of a handful of bad experiences then you go and perpetuate the that this thread is based on!

As workers within the customer service industry we should know by now that we are always going to encounter rude people and (SHOCK HORROR) that is going to include crew from another, or indeed our own airline. All this " I hate BA" or "VS crew are so up themselves" nonsense is so childish and petty, it reminds me of being at school!

I personally judge people on my own experience. If you are rude to me then I look at YOU and not your uniform. You won't catch me on the back of the crew bus slagging off BA or BMI, oh, and for the record if you hold the door for me, I WILL say "thank you" despite having that ghastly red uniform on.

KTP

TFlyguy

Well thank you for your courtesy KTPops - it IS appreciated.

I have nothing against "the red uniform" indeed i have good freinds who fly the Virgin Skies (was going to say "fly the flag" but I'm sure that would annoy others!)

And I also like to take others as I see them - and i'm afraid that in Concorde House that IS what i see!

Just the other week I saw a VS lady almost trip over her luggage rather than just ask me to press floor 2.

I dont ask too much just basic manners.