No, if you look through this thread, you will find that tax will be paid in Portugal, social security in your country of residence. Some countries will tax you on top of the PT tax.

Sorry to ask but how do you pay taxes in Portugal on a UK contract? Via what method (uk payslip or something else?) and what is this % of PT taxes?

As my colleague suggested if you look through this thread you will see how it works in lots of details. Your economical employer is in PT for the rest of the details please search above

Hi pilotarosa , I read earlier in this thread you live in Italy? I didn't see any Italian gateways published for Netjets. I'm still in the selection process and if I would be so lucky to make it into the company I would be interested to have Rome as my gateway. Could you tell me how you got this?

I'm sorry, but, if you really want to get in the company maybe is better to start to read the information tha NJE provide you in the FAQ when you applied, or at least scroll down a little bit on the forum. Anyway I'm going to copy/paste exactly what's written by KURA.
"I know current NetJets pilots with other gateways. Can I apply for one of those?
Some current pilots have grandfather rights to other gateways which are no longer on the approved list."

To be honest I would really appreciate if the thread was more about the assesment process interviews, sim, personal feedback, instead of contract,taxation and payslip...
I'm sure that if you really want to join NJE for the values of the company you wouldn't bother too much about the compensation which is more than good in my opinion at the end of the month (I know is important yes, especially in this moment, but some of you looks so picky!! it looks like you have already better job other than NJE and why not stay there then?)

That's only my personal opinion I didn't want to offend anyone with this post.

Good luck to all! 😊😊😊

Well, you´re of course entitled to your personal preferences and what you want this thread to be about. Perhaps you would do yourself a favor by accepting that others have concerns that are different from yours. You´re looking to join a multi cultural company and candidates have different objectives. Don´t ask from others what you´re delivering yourself. Good luck.

Funny that you say it's the exact same amount as 23 years ago while then the euro wasn't here yet. If you did a conversion maybe add that to your comment to make it make sense? Also if you have a job opening somewhere with better conditions overall (as a few said here before, it's not only about pay) maybe tell us/open a thread about it so everyone can chase that better deal?

So doing the math for a german base:

4875€ / month gross
- 1218€ PT flat tax at 25%
- 1100 Social Security germany
= 2557€ basic net

Does this sound right? Anything else that comes on top on a monthly basis except per diems (not counting those) ?

Phhhhhhheeewwww.. Don´t spoil the illusion. The same bunch that "only" wants to focus on getting onto the wagon, and despair others from looking at the financials, are the same clowns that will be back here in 5 years from now complaining. It´s common knowledge that pilots are not the smartest bunch around when it comes to investments, but to actually be told to go somewhere else when you´re critically challenging (or enquiring) about the deal is just being blind folded and ignorant about the greater overall picture. Nothing wrong with dreaming and wanting to join NJE, but it´s certainly not like it´s a golden ticket, if you critically look at the "deal" as a career. It´s not the worst either!

Can we please stay on topic?

For the first 2 years your salary will be like this. In Germany, social security will be slightly lower at this level of income, one if the online tools produced 982 EUR per month.

Don't forget about the jump in salary after the second year AND that you will get a performance bonus for your block hours flown, plus potential extras for busy tours in summer! You can probably add 15k to 30k per year on that, depending on your fleet.

I don´t count tips, per diem or any other variables as salary - because it isn´t salary. Your bank manager probably won´t count those variable extras either, when your looking to buy property(s), asking for mortgage(s). That being said, the NJE entry level salary is not any better or worse than most airline entry jobs - so I don´t think there´s anything to be embarrassed about. It´s a life style choice to go NJE instead of a boring (relatively) airline FO job.

He has a point though. Around 2006-2007 NJE offered a starting salary of around 56 000 EUR. Now 15 years later it has jumped to 58 000. 2006 a 737/A320 job would give you a starting salary of around 35-40 000 EUR. 2019 those numbers were around 60 000 EUR starting salary. The inflation increased the entry salary in the airline world. What has happened with the GA sector in Europe?

When I joined before 2006, the starting salary depended on the fleet and could be as low as 42 000 EUR (approx). And even with the higher and unified starting salaries after 2007, there was no automatic jump after 2 years. We have that now, one will get a significantly higher wage in year 3: 66 300 EUR. Including the average block hour bonus and maybe a few extra days you can easily make 80k gross. Without per diems.

And what has happened to GA? In Netjets you will NEVER pay for a type rating. Elsewhere you will. Therefore you can see the "low" starting salary as a way to pay off the training cost.

As was posted a bit earlier - one does not come to NetJets for the money, but the renumeration has improved a lot over the last few years. New joiners have a pay increase after 2 years as stated above, there is an SFO pay scale (not sure when that kicks in) and we now receive a performance bonus based on block hours over the year; something that was not paid 3 years ago (so now being paid for doing something that wasn't previously). The amount is staggered depending on the number of hours flown per year but I will not post the figures here as this is a public forum.

Other improvements :

Annual leave: when I joined I received 14 days holiday for the first 2 years, increasing to 21 in year 3 and finally 28 in year 5. New joiners now receive 22 days immediately and that increases by one or two days per year based on time in (can't remember the exact time required but it is at least a few years in) to a maximum of 28 days.

Roster stability: usually a 6 on 5 off roster for short haul and 7 on 6 off for long haul. There will be those who post here they never have that, but in my experience the roster is pretty stable (can be disrupted during the summer peak period) and once the roster is published (6 weeks in advance - e.g. 15 Jan for March's roster; this can be reduced if business needs demand but is the exception rather than the rule) the company will ask you, I say again ASK you if you are prepared to change it (and you will probably be paid extra to do so).

Medical paid for but it has to be done in your off time.

Training is rostered as duty days, not done in your free time (although there are quite a few online courses to be completed for annual ground recurrent and this is not rostered at the moment).

i have done 3 type ratings so far and not had to pay for any, although there has been a bond posted.

My salary and per diem payments have always arrived on time in my bank account (apparently not the case is some other GA companies I have heard).

All in all I find it a very good package, but I am at higher end of the seniority list.

The gross salary is what it is and there are certainly (and for sure will be in the near future) opportunities that will pay more if thats what people are looking for. For me personally the package is fine and the job really something I want so I hope it'll all go well at stage 3.

Still what I find weird and unnecessary is the strange tax deal which is really unfavorable for the FO salary levels. Fully taxing and paying social security in germany would be around 300-700€ net more per months depending on marital status which is a significant sum of money over the year. I suspect things to be similar in other countries with high social security payments so I a little at loss what the purpose of this complicated setup is. It certainly would be easier to take the UK contract and tax it under the bilateral DTA. Ah well... also a thing one just has to make peace with apparently

No. The recent starting salaries are all taken from companies like Jet 2, TUI, DHL, BA, Cargolux etc. You don't have any self sponsored type rating costs there. Given the current situation it might come back again but fact is that few airlines asked experienced pilots to pay for the TR cost pre covid. Even Ryan offered some good deals with a 5 year bond if I remember correct. If a company like Netjets would ask to pay for the type rating no one would take the job. Who wants to pay for a phenom 300 rating? ...and they know this. They would have to fish for pilots with 250 hrs.

Second email asking for anyone who wants to change their dates... so seems people are canceling their stage 3 assessments? Just out of curiosity if anyone is here that did cancel, what were your thoughts that led you to pull out?

"Elsewhere you will."

Did 6 T/R in 30y + only in GA and never paid for one. 3 were on type though. So its not that straight forward.

What makes you say that in Business Aviation you pay for your own type rating? Most serious, and there´s more than NJE that fits that description, don´t make you pay for your type rating - the company will likely make you sign a training bond, but that´s it. Even VistaJet doesn´t make you pay for your type rating. Of course there are the bottom feeder companies that everybody will escape at first opportunity. The starting salary in NJE is low, the 2nd year jump to higher salary is still not impressive, and that´s just the way it is. But, as it´s been said, there plenty of other good reasons to go for NJE as an employer, salary is not one of them.

It will likely be due to Covid.

Reading back through the thread, can someone please explain what "Tour based pay" is? Is that something you get as new joiner or is that only applicable with some seniority?

Also regarding the vacation days, do you take 6 days and get the preceding and following 5 days OFF too or will the pattern change that you start a new tour immediately after a vacation?

Thanks guys for answering all the questions on the thread, it's really helpful.

"elsewhere you will" well actually not really, never paid a type rating in 20 years + career.

There's a general feeling among NJE pilots that outside NJE conditions are not good, roster being the first argument, but in fact not really, you find better packages, in terms of salary, vacation, pension plans, and even roster.
Exemption of course, if you want to live in Aberdeen or Malaga, chances are that your best option is NJE, but in the major European cities you can find better gigs. And yes, I am an ex NJE and loved it for the most part, colleagues is real asset, there's a great atmosphere among crews.
Roster is stable, but the trade-off is salary below average standard and no decent pension plan still...you can't have it all! Job security? Well in our industry forget about job security and not better at NJE, look at what happened a few months ago...

I know enough companies that will make you pay for an almost useless Citation-rating (on the market), or similar types. You may be able to negotiate your way out of it. At least in Netjets and Vista you know the deal beforehand.
I don't think that 70 to 80k is a "low" wage for the first 2 years. Don't forget that in quite a few countries you won't pay any additional tax on top of the tax at source in Portugal. You really need to compare net salaries in this case, not solely the gross pay. And you also need to have a look where you can find jobs, realistically. BA? Forget it. I just had a look at Condor at PPJN: 66.4k starting salary and a bit of overtime pay. That's less than Netjets, after tax. Or ASL Airlines Belgium: 43.8k in the first year, then 59.8k in the second year. As well much less than NJE. Air Hamburg: 36k to 42k starting salary, depending on fleet. THAT is low. The list goes on.

No, at Netjets you won't be bathing in money. Your motivation should be to come here for the lifestyle and on top of it the money is quite okay. The variable income can be up to 30k or 40k extra per year, don't forget this! Extra work required, though. As a captain it is easy to make 150k to 200k a year, with all the bonuses and a bit of extra work.

Hi, that's great for you and all the others who had the privilege to jump to other jobs and types without being asked to invest any money. I don't want to and don't need to defend NJE. It's nice to hear from all of you that there's a world outside Netjets that offers decent and even better conditions! From what we hear from other ex-NJE drivers, many - not all! - of them are jumping from one employer/owner to another. I would not enjoy that, I can tell you. What is all the money of world good for, if you regularly have to fear about your contract.
Yes, last year was (another) dark chapter of this company and I myself was directly affected by it. Luckily it all turned around after a few months and we are all back in our jobs with our old salaries, types and vacation. In general, though, I will still say that job security is rather high with NJE, compared to many other employers on the European market. Again, it is great to hear that there are great contracts out there and that you guys were able to secure them. All is good.

TBP is an additional bonus on top of the regular block hour productivity bonus. Depending on what options you take for the summer months (June-September), you will make something between 100 and almost 160 EUR extra per hour, after reaching a certain number of planned block hours during a tour. This was the first year that we tested this, those who were approved to take part in it (some fleets are under-crewed, some are over-crewed), some people took 15k home, others up 30k, just for summer.

No. You take vacation blocks. Less than 9 days and they will add 2 wrap-around days on each side of this block. 10 days vacation or more, 3 days will be added at both ends. If you take a block of 18 days within one calendar month, the entire month will be off with wrap-around days on ONE side of the next or previous month only. And yes: it will/may disrupt your roster pattern.

Thanks for the explanation - much appreciated!

I suppose all fleets for newjoiners are undercrewed and busy and would qualify for the TBP scheme?

I have no idea, really. I am not involved in any part of the selection, fleet training or planning.

If you have 200 duty days/year and 22 vacation days, does that equal 178 days of engagement in total or are vacation not entirely deducted from the 200 days (if you get what I mean)?
What would a roster look like if you're on part time? Would you still have 6 days ON and then more than 5 days OFF, or would it be less days ON in a row..?
Always being away for 6-7 days in a row might be a deal-breaker for me in the long run, so I'd like to see if there are any ways to mitigate that a little or if it's just something that's part of the deal.
Again many thanks for all your answers, really helpful.

Most tours will be 6 days (7 days for large cabin fleets but that will not be for new hires). You will occasionally get a 4 or 5 day tour to accommodate training or vacation but 6 is the standard you can count on 90% of the time.
If you don’t want to be away from home regularly for 6 days at a time then don’t join NJE. Simple really. Also don’t join with intention of going straight on to part time. It won’t work out for you.

Yes, vacation days count towards duty days and need to be substracted from the year total. With 22 vacation days you end up with 178 days and that also includes all recurrent and ground training! Your net flying days would therefore be something like 160 to 165 days a year. If you volunteer of extended days, you work more, but you obviously also make more.

I never took part-time, so I cannot comment on it with full confidence. As a new joiner you will probably not be able to apply for FW (flexible work patterns) for the first year, or two. But I might be wrong on this! There are several FW-programs to have you work more or less than the 200 standard days a year. People who are on a reduced FW-program will work normal tour-lengths and then have longer off-periods between them. Keep in mind that summer months MAY be excluded from this and you will just work less between October and May. But I am not an expert on this part of the contract/policy.

Thank you guys, appreciate it. :ok:

Yes, I absolutely agree with that. NJE is probably not for "advanced captains trying to make a career". You have to be realistic and look at an upgrade only after 7 to 10 years, depending on how the company is doing. At the moment we are growing, most of our FOs will be upgraded within the next 2 years (or so), but should there be a dip in the economy next year or the year after, this will change again. After all, this is aviation! You know, I know, we all know it. Anything can happen. Last year me and 100+ crew members and many from the office were at the receiving end, because somebody panicked and thought that he could run this company like a regular legacy airline. It wasn't nice, it was drama. Luckily many of us crew are back.

Hmmm, handling agents earn 80k a year? Where!?

Any UK based drivers used parental leave whilst with NJE? Despite being part of employment law, I have found past employers do not understand it well or do not have any system in place to allow employees to use it. I am hoping this isn't the case with someone with the calibre of NJ.

But you know that there is a difference between the bag of gold that you leave with FBOs and what the handling staff gets paid as salary, right?

Last time I saw, the starting salary wasn't 80K at Netjets? Whatever happens after 2 years is a different story, starting salary is 58K isn't it?
No you compare gross salaries. Your tax depends on your individual circumstances so when you talk salaries you talk gross. Regardless of industry.
No one with the experience required to join NJE would pay for an XLS rating. If they pay they pay for A320 or 737 rating most of the time.

My point was that the GA salary hasn't followed the inflation while the airline salaries have. You seem to take it personal. I know NJ is a good company to work for, just saying the entry level salary is not what it used to be.

Hi Moonwalker,

no, I do not take it personal, why should I? Actually, the less qualified pilots Netjets is able to find, the better for us here, because the company will have to increase our salaries and conditions.

Have you read the posts of the last few days? Yes, your starting salary will be 58k. But you will probably make another 15k to 30k extra from block hours, that's something that you need to factor into the equation. And as you won't pay any local tax in quite a few countries, comparing net salaries is also okay. Example: when you start with Air Hamburg on a large cabin aircraft, living in Germany, you'll make a net salary of about 27k EUR per year. With NJE you will end up with at least 31k EUR. That's 4.000 EUR more while possibly having a better life-style. And now add a yearly block hour bonus of 15k EUR, you will take a good chunk of that home, too.

By all means, if you don't like the salary and if it is of utmost importance, then NJE won't be for you. I do agree with that! But I do not think that we are grossly underpaid. Or have you seen captains on Phenom 300s who make in excess of 140k per year, gross?