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Originally Posted by neville_nobody
(Post 10962961)
How long can the airlines hang on for? This madness can't go on all year. They don't have unlimited money like the State Governments seem to have.
Maybe it will take a major bankruptcy with people in their thousands unemployed for the States to get a grip on reality. |
Marks precious Pilbara is about to take a gigantic hit. Most VA QF WA based pilots are now in isolation. East coast bases can’t do internal WA. Grab your popcorn ... great job McGowan
ps lucky the hard border kept us safe |
Originally Posted by myshoutcaptain
(Post 10962964)
Marks precious Pilbara is about to take a gigantic hit. Most VA QF WA based pilots are now in isolation. East coast bases can’t do internal WA. Grab your popcorn ... great job McGowan
ps lucky the hard border kept us safe |
You mean like Virgin..................... nothing changed. |
Brisbane going into a three day snap lockdown for the sake of ONE known case. Ridiculous.
(1) Why 3 days when the incubation period is around 5 days on average but up to 14 days. (2) Its supposedly the “super Covid” U.K. strain - how did it get in if the borders have been all but shut for a year? Clearly a lot of countries are not flung enough genomic testing - the genie is well and truly out of the bottle. (3) Isn’t this proving that all out elimination isn’t working? |
Originally Posted by Dannyboy39
(Post 10962972)
Brisbane going into a three day snap lockdown for the sake of ONE known case. Ridiculous.
(1) Why 3 days when the incubation period is around 5 days on average but up to 14 days. (2) Its supposedly the “super Covid” U.K. strain - how did it get in if the borders have been all but shut for a year? Clearly a lot of countries are not flung enough genomic testing - the genie is well and truly out of the bottle. (3) Isn’t this proving that all out elimination isn’t working? |
Originally Posted by SOPS
(Post 10962974)
It came in through a Quarantine Hotel. It is time to either shut the border completely or put International arrivals out in the desert.
As I said above, ramp up HS to full potential. Citizens have ever right to continue to come home. |
Originally Posted by Global Aviator
(Post 10962976)
Or follow the procedures or tweak the procedures and follow. It really baffles me, I have been through hotel Q and I can see no way of transmission if the procedures are followed.
As I said above, ramp up HS to full potential. Citizens have ever right to continue to come home. |
National cabinet just halved arrivals into Aus effectively.
Looks like many here are getting their wishes. QF starting international in July hey.......... |
Originally Posted by Dannyboy39
(Post 10962972)
Brisbane going into a three day snap lockdown for the sake of ONE known case. Ridiculous.
(1) Why 3 days when the incubation period is around 5 days on average but up to 14 days. (2) Its supposedly the “super Covid” U.K. strain - how did it get in if the borders have been all but shut for a year? Clearly a lot of countries are not flung enough genomic testing - the genie is well and truly out of the bottle. (3) Isn’t this proving that all out elimination isn’t working? There are 9 cases today - and that cleaner has been to a lot of places whilst contagious. The Virus got in through hotel quarantine. Elimination would have worked - but for some reason we are still bringing in overseas travellers to hotel quarantine into the middle of our most populated cities. It defies any logic that this is still occurring after what happened in Victoria. It’s up to the federal government to step up and set up inbound quarantine in remote parts of the country. This would cost a significant amount of money - but significantly less than the cost of the damage that is being done through opening and closing of the borders. |
are 9 cases today - and that cleaner has been to a lot of places whilst contagious. |
Originally Posted by Colonel_Klink
(Post 10962982)
There was 1 case yesterday (the cleaner with the UK strain of the virus).
There are 9 cases today - and that cleaner has been to a lot of places whilst contagious. The Virus got in through hotel quarantine. Elimination would have worked - but for some reason we are still bringing in overseas travellers to hotel quarantine into the middle of our most populated cities. It defies any logic that this is still occurring after what happened in Victoria. It’s up to the federal government to step up and set up inbound quarantine in remote parts of the country. This would cost a significant amount of money - but significantly less than the cost of the damage that is being done through opening and closing of the borders. Qatar and Emirates said they cannot fly into remote areas, very complex and not viable. They won’t be coming. The cargo from around the globe needs to keep flowing in somehow. QF is about as useless as Virgin when it comes to International freight capability. |
Originally Posted by Dannyboy39
(Post 10962972)
Brisbane going into a three day snap lockdown for the sake of ONE known case. Ridiculous.
(1) Why 3 days when the incubation period is around 5 days on average but up to 14 days. (2) Its supposedly the “super Covid” U.K. strain - how did it get in if the borders have been all but shut for a year? Clearly a lot of countries are not flung enough genomic testing - the genie is well and truly out of the bottle. (3) Isn’t this proving that all out elimination isn’t working? 2. it’s not “supposedly” the UK strain, it has undergone genetic testing and has been confirmed as the new strain. For a detailed explanation about why this new strain can have a much greater effect on the populace and why all states and the federal government are being very serious about today’s situation here’s a good explainer: A top scientist explains why a more infectious coronavirus variant is a bigger problem than a deadlier strain How did it get in? Easy. The carrier flew in on an international flight and infected a hotel worker whilst quarantining. 3. No, it proves bring in people from infectious countries and housing them in the middle of cities isn’t working. Some improvements have been made today (mandatory masks on flights, preflight testing before boarding a flight to Australia, a reduced cap on arrivals) but the ultimate solution (quarantining arrivals in remote locations) is not being taken. Maybe they’ve decided to accelerate the vaccine rollout to establish a basic herd immunity within the next few months and it’s not worth setting up remote isolation facilities for that time? |
Originally Posted by wheels_down
(Post 10962987)
Qatar and Emirates said they cannot fly into remote areas, very complex and not viable. They won’t be coming. The cargo from around the globe needs to keep flowing in somehow. QF is about as useless as Virgin when it comes to International freight capability.
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The logical solution is to treat all international flight crew and pax as infected, period.
We could test but even if the tests were accurate to the three sigma limit - 99.5% - which they aren't, that means one positive escaping from 20 -30 crews, which is unacceptable. nope, full quarantine. We provide self contained accommodation for the crews. Deep clean when they leave. |
It doesn't matter one iota what the arrivals cap is, when you have more people leaving than are coming home! I highly doubt that all those departing passengers will stay gone, so at some point, they will themselves want to run the gauntlet of the arrivals system. The whole "26,000 citizens to come home by Christmas" or whatever figure they give on any particular day is meaningless if they don't stop people leaving who will want to come home at some point, meaning the cycle is an endless loop.
The simple solution is to stop all international passenger arrivals. No if's, buts or maybes. IT's not exactly a politically acceptable response, but if we want Australia to reopen, it isn't going to happen while we still have hotel quarantine in place. If it got out once, you could say its' bad luck. Twice is bad management. Multiple times across multiple states, then they aren't all incompetent. I just wish it would have happened in WA!
Originally Posted by The ABC
About twice as many people are still flying out of Australia despite COVID-19 travel restrictions, compared to the number of passengers who are managing to secure flights back home.
An ABC analysis of the latest government data reveals that in 2020, outbound passenger movements continued to outpace arrivals, in some months by a factor of three to one. It is unclear how many of the departing passengers held Australian passports, but it is feared more pressure will be placed on hotel quarantine arrangements when some eventually decide to return. Almost 40,000 Australians stranded overseas have registered with the Department of Foreign Affairs and Trade as wanting to come home but have so far been unable to secure return flights. "The list is growing with more and more Australians leaving the country," warned Australian Airports Association CEO James Goodwin. "Three people are leaving for every one person returning and that is putting added pressure on the hotel quarantine system and for all those other stranded Australians who are desperate to come home." Since March 25 last year, Australians have been banned from leaving the country unless they receive a formal exemption from the Australian Border Force Commissioner for reasons such as compassionate grounds. On March 20, the Federal Government also banned people who were not citizens or permanent residents from being allowed to enter Australia unless they met limited travel exemptions. According to figures produced by the Bureau of Infrastructure and Transport Research Economics, more than 46,000 people flew out of Australia in August last year, while just over 15,000 arrived. A similar three-to-one ratio of outgoing passengers compared to incoming passengers was recorded in September, while in October departures almost doubled the number of arrivals into Australia. In April, the month immediately after the international travel ban was announced, 53,000 passengers flew out of Australia compared to just over 16,000 who arrived here. Mr Goodwin said the Federal Government should now consider using military aircraft and bases to help repatriate and quarantine the thousands of citizens who remain stranded overseas. Source |
Why the F do we have to call it covid-19 or corona virus and not China virus
But it’s fine to call it “UK strain” or South African strain” ? |
Originally Posted by spektrum
(Post 10962998)
Why the F do we have to call it covid-19 or corona virus and not China virus
But it’s fine to call it “UK strain” or South African strain” ? |
What he said. 👍👍
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Originally Posted by spektrum
(Post 10962998)
Why the F do we have to call it covid-19 or corona virus and not China virus
But it’s fine to call it “UK strain” or South African strain” ? |
Originally Posted by Paragraph377
(Post 10963005)
Because the Governments are gutless and don’t want to upset the Chinese. These a#sholes caused/created/spread this virus so the entire world should stand against them and cut them off completely. I mean seriously, they have infected the entire globe in a way that is killing hundreds of thousands, destroying entire economies and turning the world into one that will be awful for years to come. And what has the global powers done?? SFA. Too scared to act. And an even more pathetic UN that can only say; “we are disappointed in you China that you won’t let inspectors in”. It’s a joke, an absolute joke.
It looks like int travellers now need a negative covid test before boarding a flight to oz,would that have been a given for at least the last 3+ months considering whats going on overseas. |
Originally Posted by dr dre
(Post 10962990)
3. No, it proves bring in people from infectious countries and housing them in the middle of cities isn’t working. Some improvements have been made today (mandatory masks on flights, preflight testing before boarding a flight to Australia, a reduced cap on arrivals) but the ultimate solution (quarantining arrivals in remote locations) is not being taken.
Australia over the coming months will need to accept that even with vaccination, small numbers of cases will keep popping up - unless you want to keep sending international passengers to Nauru, Christmas Island or Alice Springs forever and ever. I and 10,000 Englishmen will be swarming BNE in December 2021 for a test match - a game worth about $80m to the local economy. Are the Aussies really going to turn that down?! |
Originally Posted by wheels_down
(Post 10962987)
Qatar and Emirates said they cannot fly into remote areas, very complex and not viable. They won’t be coming. The cargo from around the globe needs to keep flowing in somehow. QF is about as useless as Virgin when it comes to International freight capability.
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Originally Posted by Dannyboy39
(Post 10963019)
This wasn't the point I was trying to make. The vaccine will not get rid of the virus 100% and possibly will not stop transmission. The virus is endemic across a high proportion of the world and will take many years for it to shift.
The vaccine is to stop a pandemic, not a virus if that makes sense. But it’s fine to call it “UK strain” or South African strain |
Originally Posted by dr dre
(Post 10963026)
It’s not about stopping infections of the SARS-COV-2 virus. It’s about slowing the spread of the COVID-19 disease and subsequent pandemic from that disease the virus causes. Yes, they know that zero infections for life will be impossible to achieve. But they know that herd immunity will send the reproduction number below zero. It will cause the virus to die out. A vaccine will protect vulnerable populations. Will full eradication be possible? Maybe, but that will take decades.
The vaccine is to stop a pandemic, not a virus if that makes sense. |
I see Western Australia has now closed its border to all Queenslanders.
Back to where we were a couple of months ago. Seems to be a very hasty decision By Mr. McGowan but he is well known for rushing into these decisions. Sure , he is protecting his West Aussies but perhaps he could have waited until the 3 day Brisbane lockdown has finished and the Health Authorities analyse their findings. Shoot first and ask questions later seems to be his trademark!! |
Originally Posted by Dannyboy39
(Post 10963019)
I and 10,000 Englishmen will be swarming BNE in December 2021 for a test match - a game worth about $80m to the local economy. Are the Aussies really going to turn that down?! |
Originally Posted by Dannyboy39
(Post 10963029)
It makes perfect sense - but it is not what APAC nations are trying to do, hence actions in BNE for 3 cases out of 2.5m+ population. The R number is virtually zero in these countries. There are more cases in my small 1,000 person village than in QLD.
If you want to see what it looks like when this strain is released upon an unvaccinated population and why leaders here are being strict then watch this video:
Originally Posted by RodH
(Post 10963031)
Seems to be a very hasty decision By Mr. McGowan but he is well known for rushing into these decisions. Shoot first and ask questions later seems to be his trademark!! |
dr Dre . If I am correct Tas, Sa and NSW have not “closed “their borders to Queenslanders but have pace restrictions on them.
West Australia has “closed” its borders to all Queenslanders that are not exempt. Quite a difference. |
Originally Posted by RodH
(Post 10963041)
Quite a difference.
And word is it was Palaszczuk herself who wanted all other states to declare the hotspot and impose restrictions. I think she, and all other leaders, know the new strain is a whole new ballgame compared to the previous variants of the virus. |
Originally Posted by Dannyboy39
(Post 10963019)
This wasn't the point I was trying to make. The vaccine will not get rid of the virus 100% and possibly will not stop transmission. The virus is endemic across a high proportion of the world and will take many years for it to shift.
Australia over the coming months will need to accept that even with vaccination, small numbers of cases will keep popping up - unless you want to keep sending international passengers to Nauru, Christmas Island or Alice Springs forever and ever. I and 10,000 Englishmen will be swarming BNE in December 2021 for a test match - a game worth about $80m to the local economy. Are the Aussies really going to turn that down?! |
Now the media and Gov have scared the sh!t out of everyone I doubt they will want to fly anytime soon.
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Originally Posted by Ragnor
(Post 10963054)
Now the media and Gov have scared the sh!t out of everyone I doubt they will want to fly anytime soon.
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Originally Posted by SOPS
(Post 10963053)
I think you are dreaming if you think you are coming to a cricket match in 2021... You really don’t understand what is going on.
Japanese Olympics postponed from 2020 to 2021, nope, Try July/ August 2022. |
I’m sick of it also, NSW has 4 cases today media report it as another outbreak when in fact they’re all locked up already due to family members having it. Yes it’s a new strain in the way it’s more transmissible it’s not more deadly.
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Originally Posted by Ragnor
(Post 10963063)
Yes it’s a new strain in the way it’s more transmissible it’s not more deadly.
Adam Kucharski, an assistant professor at the London School of Hygiene & Tropical Medicine, said that, in general, a variant that’s 50% more transmissible is a bigger problem than a variant that’s 50% more deadly. A top scientist explains why a more infectious coronavirus variant is a bigger problem than a deadlier strain |
The more deadly a virus the definitely less a problem it is because it kills the hosts too fast to spread, COVID19 is in the Goldilocks zone, it’s not massively deadly but incredibly infectious, this results in mass infections thus much more deaths due to economy of scale, it’s a real bitch.
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Originally Posted by spektrum
(Post 10962998)
Why the F do we have to call it covid-19 or corona virus and not China virus
But it’s fine to call it “UK strain” or South African strain” ? |
I am in China, and going abroad is a difficult task due to the severe epidemic! The government directly prohibits tourism and only allows to go out on business!
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Originally Posted by Foxxster
(Post 10963061)
indeed.I think people need to reset their expectations regarding international travel. Regardless of the vaccines, 2021 will mirror 2020. There may be isolated travel such as between Australia and Vanuatu , Fiji and NZ but to Europe, America etc, forget it.
Japanese Olympics postponed from 2020 to 2021, nope, Try July/ August 2022. My bet is cancelled outright, can't really see running the summer/winter back to back, just IMHO. Hopefully more people are starting to understand this virus is a moving target and not a fixed one hence all the forward planning and ramp up dates are simply hope and (at times) totally unrealistic. I'd punt domestic not before second half '21, start talking about international in '22. China Virus - love the observation and logical connection, PC crowd will be having conniptions! :D:D:D |
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