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-   -   All borders to reopen. (https://www.pprune.org/australia-new-zealand-pacific/632861-all-borders-reopen.html)

Bend alot 26th Jan 2021 03:52


Originally Posted by morno (Post 10976190)
My wife tells me that sheíd like to travel to Sydney to see friends. No flippiní way would I risk letting her because we certainly canít afford 2 weeks quarantine if they suddenly close the borders. She agrees.

Thereís what I imagine would be a pretty common conversation in many households in Australia right now.

The worst part is booking a ticket/s and all that goes with a holiday (no refundable pre paid hire car & other) and waiting for that flight to get airborne.

It is not great but not so bad going into 14 days self isolation on return because of a few cases many miles away but in the state you visited.

But I have already booked another domestic interstate flight.

Ragnor 26th Jan 2021 08:46

So.... this one does not want an open trans Tasmin bubble but has the hide to call out Aussies for being over reactive.

Coronavirus: Trans-Tasman bubble in trouble, Jacinda Ardern says

https://cdn.newsapi.com.au/image/v1/...d673?width=650New Zealanders have been temporarily barred from quarantine-free travel to Australia following a highly infectious strain of COVID was identified on the North Island. Picture: Brett CostelloAustralia’s reaction to a highly infectious COVID case in New Zealand could dash hopes of a trans-Tasman bubble being established before Easter.

New Zealand Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern on Tuesday described Australia’s three-day halt to quarantine-free travel by New Zealanders as disappointing, and a potential threat to a trans-Tasman travel arrangement.

Australia had allowed New Zealanders to visit without the need to quarantine since late last year, but the same privilege has not been afforded to Aussies.
https://cdn.newsapi.com.au/image/v1/...c767?width=320Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern. Picture: Getty Images On Monday, Federal Health Minister Greg Hunt announced any kiwis arriving in Australia over the next 72-hours would be required to go into hotel quarantine, after a woman tested positive to a highly infectious South African strain of COVID-19 on Saturday.

The woman had been in hotel quarantine in Auckland and only returned a positive test a week after she was released.

Anyone else who had arrived in Australia from New Zealand since January 14 was urged to get tested and self-isolate until a result was returned.

Australia’s response to the case frustrated the travel industry, and Ms Ardern said she had “expressed her disappointment” in a phone call with Scott Morrison on Monday night.

“I conveyed the confidence that we have in our systems but also just acknowledged that if we are to enter into a trans-Tasman bubble we will need to be able to give people confidence that we won’t see closures at the borders that happen with very short notice over incidents that we believe can be well managed domestically,” she said.

Asked if the response was an “over-reaction” to a single COVID case, Ms Ardern said “ultimately it was a decision for Australia”.

“I certainly shared my view (with Mr Morrison) that this was a situation that was well under control, that we have had experiences in New Zealand with these situations in the past, if we’re going to run a trans-Tasman arrangement we need to be able to manage situations like this.”

Ms Ardern said she remained hopeful a trans-Tasman bubble could be established with Australia by the end of March.

“We are continuing to pursue it but what we will need to establish is a way that we can have that arrangement without seeing such disruption over events that may happen from time to time,” she said.

“One of the challenges is not every state (of Australia) has the same approach as New Zealand and that difference does add a level of complication.”

There had been no further cases in New Zealand linked to the woman with the South African strain. Of 16 close contacts identified, 15 had returned negative tests and one test was still pending.

DirectAnywhere 26th Jan 2021 09:09

Yup, the rank hypocrisy from the federal government is remarkable. One case in NZ, shut the borders, yet protest against premiers who do the same.

You can't have your cake and eat it Scott, Josh Et al. Either one case is a threat, or it's not. It's the inconsistency that's killing any chance of a recovery in aviation.

Buster Hyman 26th Jan 2021 09:11


Originally Posted by Bend alot (Post 10976256)
The worst part is booking a ticket/s and all that goes with a holiday (no refundable pre paid hire car & other) and waiting for that flight to get airborne.

You've just described Sub-Load travel.

turbantime 26th Jan 2021 09:26


Originally Posted by DirectAnywhere (Post 10976359)
Yup, the rank hypocrisy from the federal government is remarkable. One case in NZ, shut the borders, yet protest against premiers who do the same.

Equally hypocritical are Jacintaís remarks. She complains about Australia closing borders yet she keeps her borders closed to Aus.

Ragnor 26th Jan 2021 09:34

Yes Jacinta..... Sco Mo reacted the same as he did with QLD few weeks ago.

WingNut60 26th Jan 2021 13:41


Originally Posted by DirectAnywhere (Post 10976359)
Yup, the rank hypocrisy from the federal government is remarkable. One case in NZ, shut the borders, yet protest against premiers who do the same.

Thanks for that. I thought that it was going to go unremarked.
Where is the hyperbole when it's one of your own.

Sunfish 26th Jan 2021 20:33

Idle chatter. The Doctors are determining the strategies, not the politicians. The strategies and hence restrictions must change at least as fast as the virus does or we go under. We now are dealing with:

1) A British strain that is 70% more infectious.

2) A South African strain that is more infectious and more lethal.

3) An emerging Brazilian strain from Manaus that is apparently more lethal to younger people.

4) Evidence of long term neurological damage in younger people as well as apparently permanent damage to organs.

5) An outbreak in New Zealand of the South African strain that potentially has already crossed the Tasman.

Most of you seem not to understand that the threat from the virus is to do with logistics not lethality (we hope). By that I mean that the virus may not lethal to you personally but it is totally lethal to our health system because we can run out of all medical supplies (materials and people) quite easily and that causes secondary deaths from untreated conditions.

Under these circumstances "opening borders" is not possible as Britain and Europe have found out.

As for local travel, Air travel is absolutely out. You need a car in case you have to make a run for your state border. Then there is the inconvenience; friends kids spent 6+ hours in the queue at YMML on return from Queensland last night.

empacher48 27th Jan 2021 02:05


Originally Posted by turbantime (Post 10976374)
Equally hypocritical are Jacintaís remarks. She complains about Australia closing borders yet she keeps her borders closed to Aus.

At least you know where you stand with Jacinda and the State Governments. However the Federal Government has done an almighty back flip with regards to what Australians consider a Hotspot.

601 27th Jan 2021 02:14


However the Federal Government has done an almighty back flip with regards to what Australians consider a Hotspot.
How so???????


Global Aviator 27th Jan 2021 02:24


Originally Posted by Sunfish (Post 10976775)
Idle chatter. The Doctors are determining the strategies, not the politicians. The strategies and hence restrictions must change at least as fast as the virus does or we go under. We now are dealing with:

1) A British strain that is 70% more infectious.

2) A South African strain that is more infectious and more lethal.

3) An emerging Brazilian strain from Manaus that is apparently more lethal to younger people.

4) Evidence of long term neurological damage in younger people as well as apparently permanent damage to organs.

5) An outbreak in New Zealand of the South African strain that potentially has already crossed the Tasman.

Most of you seem not to understand that the threat from the virus is to do with logistics not lethality (we hope). By that I mean that the virus may not lethal to you personally but it is totally lethal to our health system because we can run out of all medical supplies (materials and people) quite easily and that causes secondary deaths from untreated conditions.

Under these circumstances "opening borders" is not possible as Britain and Europe have found out.

As for local travel, Air travel is absolutely out. You need a car in case you have to make a run for your state border. Then there is the inconvenience; friends kids spent 6+ hours in the queue at YMML on return from Queensland last night.

As I wait to board I can assure you air travel is most definitely not out. One just needs to have contingencies if required. Don’t be so alarmist, travel and tourism industries need people flying to recover.

empacher48 27th Jan 2021 03:13


Originally Posted by 601 (Post 10976896)
How so???????

A hotspot defined in the New Zealand/Australia Green Zone travel bubble would be defined as 10 cases in the community per day in urban areas and 3 cases per day in rural areas in either country. This requirement was made by the Australian Federal Government.

NZ hasnít opened a bubble with the whole of Australia because their own requirements is 28 days of no community transmission in Australia. Something that hasnít happened yet.

The Federal Government opened borders to NZ based on the hotspot definition. Then closed the border with one hour notice to NZ for a single case.

NZ is now looking at a travel bubble with states that follow their own elimination strategy. At this stage only Queensland and WA. The NZ, Queensland and WA governments know where they stand. A single case appears anywhere and the borders close.

Global Aviator 27th Jan 2021 03:36


Originally Posted by empacher48 (Post 10976911)
A hotspot defined in the New Zealand/Australia Green Zone travel bubble would be defined as 10 cases in the community per day in urban areas and 3 cases per day in rural areas in either country. This requirement was made by the Australian Federal Government.

NZ hasnít opened a bubble with the whole of Australia because their own requirements is 28 days of no community transmission in Australia. Something that hasnít happened yet.

The Federal Government opened borders to NZ based on the hotspot definition. Then closed the border with one hour notice to NZ for a single case.

NZ is now looking at a travel bubble with states that follow their own elimination strategy. At this stage only Queensland and WA. The NZ, Queensland and WA governments know where they stand. A single case appears anywhere and the borders close.

Donít forget the little ole NT accepting Kiwis..... Is that reciprocal? Have any Kiwis actually ventured North? Was a big hit in the media then went quiet, well yes I suppose it is the NT after all.

https://www.google.com.sg/amp/s/amp....ticle/12781312

Turnleft080 27th Jan 2021 05:17

In hindsight.
Going back to good old hindsight, right back, if the whole world (The whole planet) did a Victorian style lockdown even tougher i.e.
7.8 billion people stay at home, zero movements in planes/trains/buses/trams/cars/ships, a total shutdown of all industries not for 14 take it to 30 days.
That would make a good movie "The day the earth stood still". Sorry month.

However, the virus would of been suppressed and eliminated as Australia has done in every municipality. If that was done say a year ago, the second half of last
year would be virus free and the world today would be like 2019 covid free. How would this been implemented?
The WHO would of sent an APB to every government/state government. After all its the worlds governments that fund the WHO.
Drastic yes, could LA, NY, London shut down just like Melbourne. Well in hindsight they should have. Extreme short term pain
for long term gain.

Someone really stuffed up in hindsight. Next time a new virus is discovered like this then the WHO must act immediately and I mean immediately, not
ponder and monitor the situation in Wuhan which was about 3 months of procrastination. In hindsight the WHO should of advised
the Wuhan government to place a 30km ring of steal no one goes out, no one comes in. Then the virus would of been
suppressed and eliminated within the 30km radius. I wonder if we will learn from this.

dr dre 27th Jan 2021 05:34


Originally Posted by Turnleft080 (Post 10976931)
In hindsight the WHO should of advised
the Wuhan government to place a 30km ring of steal no one goes out, no one comes in. Then the virus would of been
suppressed and eliminated within the 30km radius. I wonder if we will learn from this.

The virus was in France in mid December 2019 in a patient with no history of recent international travel. Which is a sign of how quick it can spread and why Australia is quick to stop any outbreaks.

Icarus2001 27th Jan 2021 06:11


However, the virus would of been suppressed and eliminated as Australia has done in every municipality. If that was done say a year ago, the second half of last
year would be virus free and the world today would be like 2019 covid free.
No No NO.

That is not how it works. The virus would still exist and as soon as there is movement then it spreads. That is the point. It is impractical to expect to eliminate Covid. It is like trying to eliminate influenza, another corona virus, or the common cold. It is virtually impossible. That is why the talk was about "flattening the curve" to protect the health system. Then a few months ago there was a subtle shift to trying to eliminate the virus. Which is crazy talk.

PS. Australia has NOT "eliminated the virus in every municipality".

currawong 27th Jan 2021 06:13


Originally Posted by Turnleft080 (Post 10976931)
In hindsight.
Going back to good old hindsight, right back, if the whole world (The whole planet) did a Victorian style lockdown even tougher i.e.
7.8 billion people stay at home, zero movements in planes/trains/buses/trams/cars/ships, a total shutdown of all industries not for 14 take it to 30 days.
That would make a good movie "The day the earth stood still". Sorry month.

However, the virus would of been suppressed and eliminated as Australia has done in every municipality. If that was done say a year ago, the second half of last
year would be virus free and the world today would be like 2019 covid free. How would this been implemented?
The WHO would of sent an APB to every government/state government. After all its the worlds governments that fund the WHO.
Drastic yes, could LA, NY, London shut down just like Melbourne. Well in hindsight they should have. Extreme short term pain
for long term gain.

Someone really stuffed up in hindsight. Next time a new virus is discovered like this then the WHO must act immediately and I mean immediately, not
ponder and monitor the situation in Wuhan which was about 3 months of procrastination. In hindsight the WHO should of advised
the Wuhan government to place a 30km ring of steal no one goes out, no one comes in. Then the virus would of been
suppressed and eliminated within the 30km radius. I wonder if we will learn from this.

You really have been on a bender for the last 12 months haven't you.

Ragnor 27th Jan 2021 06:13

NZ do not want a bubble with Australia, Australia close to NZ because of this new strain (rightly so they did it with Brisbane) Jacinta has a sook and try to call Australia out. She should be happy that we wont be bothering her for a while about a bubble.

Next more important issue, why is Australia still closed to it self domestically? even the media have given up on borders not even mentioning it.

PoppaJo 27th Jan 2021 07:25

Why cannot every single state border, open tomorrow? I see no reason why they canít. When you stand back, and look at the current play of events, its nothing but madness.

My employer has stood down staff for the next few weeks. Then when looking at the current numbers, and Iím sick of hearing of all my friends about to sell the home, completely not necessarily, does not need to happen.

Domestic Market should have been thriving next month.

currawong 27th Jan 2021 07:40

Whether its states, or local government areas or even individual suburbs, generally the policy has been "open when possible, restricted when necessary".

If cases had not escaped international quarantine again and again, we would have been unrestricted months ago.

goodonyamate 27th Jan 2021 07:59


Originally Posted by empacher48 (Post 10976911)
A hotspot defined in the New Zealand/Australia Green Zone travel bubble would be defined as 10 cases in the community per day in urban areas and 3 cases per day in rural areas in either country. This requirement was made by the Australian Federal Government.

NZ hasnít opened a bubble with the whole of Australia because their own requirements is 28 days of no community transmission in Australia. Something that hasnít happened yet.

The Federal Government opened borders to NZ based on the hotspot definition. Then closed the border with one hour notice to NZ for a single case.

NZ is now looking at a travel bubble with states that follow their own elimination strategy. At this stage only Queensland and WA. The NZ, Queensland and WA governments know where they stand. A single case appears anywhere and the borders close.

as SComo said...if you canít go from nsw to qld then you most certainly wonít be going from NZ to QLD. Palachook and McGoose donít control that border.

wheels_down 27th Jan 2021 20:31


Originally Posted by PoppaJo (Post 10976966)
Why cannot every single state border, open tomorrow? I see no reason why they canít. When you stand back, and look at the current play of events, its nothing but madness.

My employer has stood down staff for the next few weeks. Then when looking at the current numbers, and Iím sick of hearing of all my friends about to sell the home, completely not necessarily, does not need to happen.

Domestic Market should have been thriving next month.

Buy a lotto ticket your wish was granted.

No Idea Either 27th Jan 2021 21:57

Palachook says QLD open next week........😀😀😀😀

WingNut60 27th Jan 2021 22:28

Does anyone have a logical explanation for how the person in NZ managed to get through two weeks in quarantine and two negative tests and then come down ill several days after being released from quarantiine.
Looks about as likely as virgin birth to me.

RubberDogPoop 28th Jan 2021 00:15

How about...they interacted in their last two days in quarantine with passengers that were in the early stages of their own stay? Not a lot of virginity required...

WingNut60 28th Jan 2021 00:42


Originally Posted by RubberDogPoop (Post 10977642)
How about...they interacted in their last two days in quarantine with passengers that were in the early stages of their own stay? Not a lot of virginity required...

Exactly. But I thought that couldn't happen.
I am just a bit surprised that there hasn't been a bit more noise about the circumstances of it happening.

Servo 28th Jan 2021 00:53

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-01-...kland/13088496

They are still trying to trace how she became infected, whether from touching something, aircon or some other way. All very interesting.

What I find surprising is someone going on holiday to Europe, including working in Spain whilst there was a pandemic about. Came home, quarantined for 14 days and goes on another holiday within NZ. Obviously it is not stopping her from living her life.

The HQ system is the BIG hole in the swiss cheese at the moment. Hopefully it wont be Australia's or NZ's undoing.............

DHC8 Driver 28th Jan 2021 02:08


Originally Posted by Turnleft080 (Post 10976931)
In hindsight.
Going back to good old hindsight, right back, if the whole world (The whole planet) did a Victorian style lockdown even tougher i.e.
7.8 billion people stay at home, zero movements in planes/trains/buses/trams/cars/ships, a total shutdown of all industries not for 14 take it to 30 days.
That would make a good movie "The day the earth stood still". Sorry month.

However, the virus would of been suppressed and eliminated as Australia has done in every municipality. If that was done say a year ago, the second half of last
year would be virus free and the world today would be like 2019 covid free. How would this been implemented?
The WHO would of sent an APB to every government/state government. After all its the worlds governments that fund the WHO.
Drastic yes, could LA, NY, London shut down just like Melbourne. Well in hindsight they should have. Extreme short term pain
for long term gain.

Someone really stuffed up in hindsight. Next time a new virus is discovered like this then the WHO must act immediately and I mean immediately, not
ponder and monitor the situation in Wuhan which was about 3 months of procrastination. In hindsight the WHO should of advised
the Wuhan government to place a 30km ring of steal no one goes out, no one comes in. Then the virus would of been
suppressed and eliminated within the 30km radius. I wonder if we will learn from this.

Given that new or mutant viruses emerge continuously, following your proposal, we would have to lock the world down forever! Whilst I agree that a more assertive approach by the WHO may have alleviated much of the pain and suffering we have endured from Covid19, I don't believe that a worldwide lockdown would be either desireable or feasible.

currawong 28th Jan 2021 03:52

This day one year ago I had to overnight at a well known east coast destination.

At check in everyone else in the que was wearing a mask.

All had clearly just arrived from China, none had taken the time to book ahead...

It was at that point I realized they might know something that we didn't.

Green.Dot 28th Jan 2021 05:23

Low-cost airlines may be Ďbetter positionedí for 2021 challenges

https://www.cnbc.com/2021/01/28/avia...-for-2021.html

WhisprSYD 28th Jan 2021 05:26


Originally Posted by currawong (Post 10977689)
This day one year ago I had to overnight at a well known east coast destination.

At check in everyone else in the que was wearing a mask.

All had clearly just arrived from China, none had taken the time to book ahead...

It was at that point I realized they might know something that we didn't.

itís amazing the early signs that were missed by many at the size of the problem ahead..
around this time last year I was contemplating taking the kids to Chinatown to watch the CNY celebrations, but had been following some of the news on Twitter and thought better of it.

Funnily enough my in-laws flew in on CSN early/mid January 2020 and my father in law developed Ďthe worst flu heís ever hadí a couple of days after landing with a cough that hung around for about 6 weeks..
was on his ass for 2 weeks so naturally isolated, but no word about testing back then.


blubak 28th Jan 2021 06:50


Originally Posted by No Idea Either (Post 10977579)
Palachook says QLD open next week........😀😀😀😀

Did it in her usual'look how good i am' bitch face attitude.
What about showing some respect & talking to NSW premier first,she really is a piece of work.

WhisprSYD 28th Jan 2021 07:29


Originally Posted by blubak (Post 10977735)
Did it in her usual'look how good i am' bitch face attitude.
What about showing some respect & talking to NSW premier first,she really is a piece of work.

not to mention the announcement came at the same time as a request to the fed government for more support for their struggling tourism industry

Ragnor 28th Jan 2021 08:20

She has finally realised tourism industry does not work without tourist. Hopefully Sco Mo cuts all this JK and funding of certain sectors. It just might make these premiers think a little more rationally.

601 28th Jan 2021 14:10


Did it in her usual'look how good i am' bitch face attitude.
I feel as though I am back in Kindy with her "media events"

Now now boys and girls we have to be goody goodies for a couple more days before you can go outside or before Gran can come from Sydney for a visit.

blubak 28th Jan 2021 20:43


Originally Posted by Ragnor (Post 10977772)
She has finally realised tourism industry does not work without tourist. Hopefully Sco Mo cuts all this JK and funding of certain sectors. It just might make these premiers think a little more rationally.

Its taken her a long long time to work that fact out,i guess she has had too many media events to front up to!
I have read many comments that point this out over the last 9 months or so & now she has finally had to admit it.
Talk about double standards,describes her perfectly.

Traffic_Is_Er_Was 28th Jan 2021 22:59

One of Anna's staff must have misread the calendar and told her NSW School Holidays start on Monday.

Ragnor 28th Jan 2021 23:27

Queen P was on the tube this morning trying to out more pressure on the Federal Government Sco Mo has a thin line to walk on here with an election at the end of the yr. Queensland Ppl know she had decimated tourism with her knee jerk un educated over reactions to borders. Now Sco Mo will have to clean up her mess.

Green.Dot 28th Jan 2021 23:33

Well there you go Almighty Anastasia. Keeping Queenslanders ďsafeĒ (lol) has come at a cost.

The state of all world economies will be very interesting come the end of the year.

WhisprSYD 29th Jan 2021 02:16


Originally Posted by Ragnor (Post 10978392)
Queen P was on the tube this morning trying to out more pressure on the Federal Government Sco Mo has a thin line to walk on here with an election at the end of the yr. Queensland Ppl know she had decimated tourism with her knee jerk un educated over reactions to borders. Now Sco Mo will have to clean up her mess.

might be giving her too much credit here, but itís actually pretty shrewd politically..

1. ĎSlam borders shutí to keep her QLDers safe in the lead up to the election.

2. Continue the scaremongering until thereís a sniff of a federal election.

3. Open up to the dirty southerners at the same time you request more federal help to prop up the industry you helped decimate

4. Put the liberal government in a position where the state that unexpectedly won them the last election may hit 20% unemployment in the lead up to an election unless you keep the money printers going..


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