Network EBA

[gordonfvckingramsay]

Because giving all Qantas group (subsidiary) pilots appropriate remuneration for doing the same job as mainline pilots undermines the point of subsidiaries, which is to grow said subsidiaries while shrinking mainline. Taking away their ability to lower the pilot cost base might mean Qantas have to get back to running one airline….god forbid!!

[Sameoldsameold]

Nope. Sorry, you don't get to be paid mainline pay just cause you wear a fancy hat and fly a jet with a red tail. If you want to get paid mainline rates then join mainline at the bottom of the list like everyone else.

[aussieflyboy]

Originally Posted by Scooter Rassmussin

Pilots in other operations are just biding their time before going to Qantas .
.

I think you’ll find Qantas is towards the bottom of the list of places pilots are heading. Who wants to sit in the back seat for 17 hours when you could have a window seat and be paid 40% more?

[Beer Baron]

Originally Posted by aussieflyboy

I think you’ll find Qantas is towards the bottom of the list of places pilots are heading. Who wants to sit in the back seat for 17 hours when you could have a window seat and be paid 40% more?

Haha, yeah sure. If you want the window seat, bid for the 737. It’s available from day 1 and the pay rise is closer to 100%.

[walesregent]

Originally Posted by neville_nobody

Well let's hope this doesn't end in a Pyrrhic victory with all the customers leaving and going to other operators followed by a lambasting in the media about greedy pilots bankrupting the airline.

Leaving for where? Is there any individual operator (or combination of operators) who can handle network’s workload on top of their own? That’s one of the main issues we have- Network lacks competition and uses it to squeeze clients and staff for maximum profit. Those operators are stretched and would need to expand dramatically to offer clients a stable alternative. Where will they get the crew and equipment? Who would take the risks to finance such a rapid expansion?

I’m aware that this all hinges on everyone behaving rationally but, at the very least, mining companies are very much aware of how much their businesses depend a well resourced transport provider. Maybe mainline takes it back, but they aren’t exactly flush with spare capacity.

[CaptCloudbuster]

Over 40 flights cancelled on Thursday past. QF sending B737 Pilots to Dallas to train, no spare capacity here. The System is streeeeeetched to the limit ATM.

[neville_nobody]

Originally Posted by walesregent

Leaving for where? Is there any individual operator (or combination of operators) who can handle network’s workload on top of their own? That’s one of the main issues we have- Network lacks competition and uses it to squeeze clients and staff for maximum profit. Those operators are stretched and would need to expand dramatically to offer clients a stable alternative. Where will they get the crew and equipment? Who would take the risks to finance such a rapid expansion?

No not one operator but if it is spread it between Skippers, National Jet, Virgin and Alliance I’m sure you could keep your mine operating. I’d be curious what the Mining Companies take on all this is. If they are sympathetic to QF then they will probably put up with the disruption.

[ShandywithSugar]

"If they are sympathetic to QF then they will probably put up with the disruption."

Doubtful. They had a reliable service prior and were moved to the incumbent. Most probably wish they were seeing the old work horse again.

Heard it's hot in Perth today? This week's looking even hotter.

[CaptCloudbuster]

Never get in the way of Gina or Twiggy and a $.

She’s not even sympathetic enough to her own kids.

Hell will freeze over before she lends any favour to the QF Group!

[stevieboy330]

Why aren't the big mining companies & their FIFO staff more concerned about what's going on here ? If I was getting on a QF jet with a pilot who is pissed off, underpaid & feeling intimidated and threatened by their employer that would worry me a lot ! These guys are flying fast jets with 100 plus passengers into busy airports with no Air Traffic Control, around terrain and weather, short runways, old airframes often very early hours of the morning with very inexperienced First Officers. Zero support from QANTAS management.....Sounds like a recipe for disaster to me! QANTAS you can't say you didn't know, this has been going on for a long time now.

[walesregent]

Originally Posted by neville_nobody

No not one operator but if it is spread it between Skippers, National Jet, Virgin and Alliance I’m sure you could keep your mine operating. I’d be curious what the Mining Companies take on all this is. If they are sympathetic to QF then they will probably put up with the disruption.

hopefully we get some significant improvements but I doubt we’ll get anywhere near the point Qantas decides it’s not worth it. Amongst other things they would be kissing goodbye to a lot of platinums

[walesregent]

Originally Posted by stevieboy330

Why aren't the big mining companies & their FIFO staff more concerned about what's going on here ? If I was getting on a QF jet with a pilot who is pissed off, underpaid & feeling intimidated and threatened by their employer that would worry me a lot ! These guys are flying fast jets with 100 plus passengers into busy airports with no Air Traffic Control, around terrain and weather, short runways, old airframes often very early hours of the morning with very inexperienced First Officers. Zero support from QANTAS management.....Sounds like a recipe for disaster to me! QANTAS you can't say you didn't know, this has been going on for a long time now.

Lack of awareness? I guess they deal with countless external service providers and, although transport is pretty vital, they probably don’t give it as much thought as we do. A bit surprised Qantas accepts such a glaring risk but I guess there are a tonne of scapegoats in middle management if they don’t manage to pin responsibility for an incident on the flight crew.

[gordonfvckingramsay]

https://michaelwest.com.au/qantas-pi...ltants-galore/

We have another Joe Aston on our hands! Some very good reporting here, accurate to a tee.

[Fred Gassit]

The mining companies send their safety guys on a jump seat ride every 6 months or so. The pilots have been telling them the same stuff for years now, nothing changes…they don’t give a sh*t.
(Roy Hill employees pay to go to their own Xmas party)

[framer]

The mining companies send their safety guys on a jump seat ride every 6 months or so.

I would love to see the checklist they are ticking off when they do that. I can’t imagine a non- pilot safety specialist would be able to accurately assess a flights safety any more than a pilot would be able to assess a supermarket owners advertising budget.

[Zeta_Reticuli]

Originally Posted by framer

I would love to see the checklist they are ticking off when they do that. I can’t imagine a non- pilot safety specialist would be able to accurately assess a flights safety any more than a pilot would be able to assess a supermarket owners advertising budget.

Everything in mining is a box ticking exercise. Safety is an after thought. And tbh Twiggy and Gina do not give a **** about their staff or safety, just don't die on their site... Bhp and Rio aren't any different. Rio being one of the worst. If they operated their own aircrafts there would be smoking craters dotted throughout the Pilbara and Goldfields. Everything is done to leave a paper trail.

[Fred Gassit]

To be fair to these guys the ones I’ve dealt with certainly have an aviation background.
It just felt like a pointless exercise, probably quite frustrating for them too.

[stevieboy330]

I'm not so much having a go at the mining companies, it's more of a criticism of QF that this stuff going on outside of the EBA dispute. The company does not appear to be addressing issues like employee wellbeing & moral. They don't seem to care about their Pilots at all, rather see them as adversaries. It's a very flawed approach, quite frankly a pretty dangerous one.

[DirectAnywhere]

Originally Posted by stevieboy330

The company does not appear to be addressing issues like employee wellbeing & moral. They don't seem to care about their Pilots at all, rather see them as adversaries. It's a very flawed approach, quite frankly a pretty dangerous one.

You’re new here, aren’t you?

[Chronic Snoozer]

I blame the industrial laws. They encourage adversarial negotiation, without mandating it. Locking out employees? Threats to send new equipment to lower paid groups? PIA? It's gladiatorial.