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Old 24th Feb 2023, 01:54
  #41 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by aussieflyboy
Exactly, the SAME job for less pay is the issue mate…
QF flys PER-BME and the Capt gets $300K
NA flys PER-BME and the Capt gets $170K
And your point, when comparing B737 with F100 scales is what again..?
Why not compare QF 737 to 787 on the MEL-PER sector as well then..?

Comparing A320 to A320 would be technically correct yes, but that is not what you are inferring here.
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Old 24th Feb 2023, 02:43
  #42 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by RealSatoshi
And your point, when comparing B737 with F100 scales is what again..?
Why not compare QF 737 to 787 on the MEL-PER sector as well then..?

Comparing A320 to A320 would be technically correct yes, but that is not what you are inferring here.
You’re aware they fly A320s to Broome…? I was comparing a 737 to a A320
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Old 24th Feb 2023, 02:54
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Originally Posted by aussieflyboy
You’re aware they fly A320s to Broome…? I was comparing a 737 to a A320
You're aware that the figures you quoted are not A320 scales..?
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Old 24th Feb 2023, 03:31
  #44 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by RealSatoshi
You're aware that the figures you quoted are not A320 scales..?
Very aware. Why don’t you give us the correct scales. My point will still be proven.
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Old 24th Feb 2023, 04:06
  #45 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by aussieflyboy
Very aware. Why don’t you give us the correct scales. My point will still be proven.
Not saying you don't have a point, but don't use shock tactics such as quoting completely irrelevant figures to prove your point. Not associated with them, so will refrain from providing inaccurate figures

Last edited by RealSatoshi; 24th Feb 2023 at 04:59.
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Old 24th Feb 2023, 11:16
  #46 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by RealSatoshi
You're aware that the figures you quoted are not A320 scales..?
Both figures quoted are about $50k shy of actual figures atm
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Old 24th Feb 2023, 13:18
  #47 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by RealSatoshi
And your point, when comparing B737 with F100 scales is what again..?
Why not compare QF 737 to 787 on the MEL-PER sector as well then..?

Comparing A320 to A320 would be technically correct yes, but that is not what you are inferring here.
350k vs a little over 200k if that makes you happy?

737 Captain can make similar to a 787 captain be it working a lot harder for it.

Here's a question for you, Satoshi. Let's ignore real figures. How much do you think an A320 FO and an A320 Captain should be making as a comparison to the average fulltime aussie wage?
1.2x? 1.5x? 2x?

The average aussie wage. Think about all the hundreds of jobs out there. Most would be at home every night, less stress, less skill and training, and wouldn't have 180 people's lives in their hands multiple times per day dealing with schedules, fatigue, MELs, crosswind/TS/sheer/traffic in ctafs/visibility/etc
Actually, let's make it more interesting. How much should those A320 FOs and Captains make compared to the average WA wage? 1.5x more? 2x more? 3x more?
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Old 24th Feb 2023, 14:21
  #48 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by soseg
Here's a question for you, Satoshi. Let's ignore real figures. How much do you think an A320 FO and an A320 Captain should be making as a comparison to the average fulltime aussie wage?
Comparing Pilot wages to the average Aussie wage is a Fools Game for many reasons - we all know it...

Last edited by RealSatoshi; 24th Feb 2023 at 14:32.
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Old 24th Feb 2023, 20:50
  #49 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by soseg
Actually, let's make it more interesting. How much should those A320 FOs and Captains make compared to the average WA wage? 1.5x more? 2x more? 3x more?
Let’s make it even more interesting! Let’s use WA FIFO workers as a more appropriate comparison. A 19yo drillers offsider can make far more money than the average wage in a very high turnover position, s/he is compensated well not just to try (in vain) to stop them from pulling the pin but also for the varying levels of misery inflicted upon them.

Surely these factors combined with the cost of pilot training would suggest an A320 FO be provided with a few more rods!
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Old 24th Feb 2023, 22:48
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Originally Posted by RealSatoshi
Comparing Pilot wages to the average Aussie wage is a Fools Game for many reasons - we all know it...
Why is it a fool's game?

You're an apologist for Network's poor wages. Now it's time to defend them.

How much more should an a320 pilot be making compared to the average aussie doing presumably the average job? Easy question to answer.

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Old 25th Feb 2023, 00:55
  #51 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by soseg
Why is it a fool's game?
You're an apologist for Network's poor wages. Now it's time to defend them.
How much more should an a320 pilot be making compared to the average aussie doing presumably the average job? Easy question to answer.
Mate, I think you are misreading the room on this one...I'll just put this here from another thread to quell your fears...
Originally Posted by RealSatoshi
Well, let's just start by saying that flying a Boeing 787 = "The Same Job" as flying a Boeing 787 et al.
There are low cost passengers and low cost services, but Boeing and/or Airbus never designed Low Cost Pilot versions of the same type...
Coat, Hat, Door
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Old 25th Feb 2023, 01:14
  #52 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by RealSatoshi
Mate, I think you are misreading the room on this one...I'll just put this here from another thread to quell your fears...

Coat, Hat, Door
You must be a politician. Great at avoiding questions.
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Old 25th Feb 2023, 03:16
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Originally Posted by Jc31
100% pass rate on internal upgrades on both fleets in the last 18 months. Not one failure
Does that include F100 to A320 left to left seat?
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Old 25th Feb 2023, 05:56
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Network A320 pilots should be at least aiming for parity with mainline 737 wages and conditions.
Network F100 pilots should be at least aiming for better than NJS 717 wages and conditions.
Similar wages and conditions for similar jobs.

There are ways of doing unofficial industrial action. Do the bare minimum as a starting point.
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Old 25th Feb 2023, 09:18
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Originally Posted by kellykelpie
um - it takes around 20 years to get a 737 command in Qantas. Parity for someone who joined the Network recently is a bit rich isn’t it?
One could argue that it would take considerably less if QF Management had mainline pilots operating the routes Network are operating…
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Old 25th Feb 2023, 09:20
  #56 (permalink)  
 
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I fail to see how an individual companies time to command has anything to do with deserving more pay. 🤦‍♂️


Originally Posted by kellykelpie
um - it takes around 20 years to get a 737 command in Qantas. Parity for someone who joined the Network recently is a bit rich isn’t it?
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Old 25th Feb 2023, 21:28
  #57 (permalink)  
 
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NAA - The bin chicken scabs of the airline world.

No wonder they get excited when it‘s announced there’s some 30 year old, clapped out A320s on the way.
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Old 25th Feb 2023, 22:04
  #58 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Slippery_Pete
NAA - The bin chicken scabs of the airline world.

No wonder they get excited when it‘s announced there’s some 30 year old, clapped out A320s on the way.
You wont find more than a handful of pilots at NAA who were around at the time where the term “scab” come into our industry. Absolutely zero justification for the use of that word to be aimed at the NAA pilot group.

Keep you your jaded and toxic comments to yourself Pete, clearly you don’t understand what that word actually means. 🤦🏼‍♂️
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Old 26th Feb 2023, 00:05
  #59 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Slippery_Pete
NAA - The bin chicken scabs of the airline world.
Charming. Does it ever occur to some of you skygod wankers that quite a few people lost their livelihoods during the pandemic, and if those people want to live in a particular part of the world, they're left with little choice but to accept what's available in the local market?
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Old 26th Feb 2023, 00:59
  #60 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by dusty99
I fail to see how an individual companies time to command has anything to do with deserving more pay. 🤦‍♂️
Because QF Management only allows their existence through low pay?

20% churn rate per year. Broken system. Provide a viable career path for existing Mainline Crew. Requires a complete change in mindset.

I’ll accept the current model if QF Management demonstrates savings achieved with low T & C’s Vs costs of training, admin etc etc.

Till that cold day arrives in hell I expect QF Management to abide by their own promulgated “non negotiable business principles “ ie “recruiting the right people into the right jobs”. As a poster on Qrewroom highlights those same principles state:“Our future success is underpinned by our people being skilled, motivated and supported to do great things.”
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