Qantas Engineering redundances - Advice required!!!
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: in my mind
Age: 34
Posts: 37
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Qf94 ......I'm surprised that you continue to champion your cause but as you say "everyone is entitled to their opinion".
Lets just agree to to disagree..... I can see your well written rebuttles /justification and I disagee whole heartedly, but thats life.
Either way I'm willing to share a beer with you at centrelink in the new year.
Lets just agree to to disagree..... I can see your well written rebuttles /justification and I disagee whole heartedly, but thats life.
Either way I'm willing to share a beer with you at centrelink in the new year.
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: at work
Age: 44
Posts: 29
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
How about they give 204 employees the week off to attend meetings and see if the place can run without them ?
My input,
I think all licenses should be treated as equal wether its a380 or 767. Manager needed people for a course so he asked his 2 mates who do you think. 1 puts himself on and then chooses another mate. Next course the other mates on it. Thats the selection used for courses that may now give me the bullet because I'm out there doing their job whilst their in there putting themselves on courses. Isn't there a 330 course running now with 3 people on it. Give me a break.
Its not like there has been endless training either and I'm sure there are guys with credits out there not being used, so they can't say they haven't got enough of each type.
Last in first off removes any hint of discrimination at the hands of poor managers and not being in the niche' and over the years, and there's been a lot.
My input,
I think all licenses should be treated as equal wether its a380 or 767. Manager needed people for a course so he asked his 2 mates who do you think. 1 puts himself on and then chooses another mate. Next course the other mates on it. Thats the selection used for courses that may now give me the bullet because I'm out there doing their job whilst their in there putting themselves on courses. Isn't there a 330 course running now with 3 people on it. Give me a break.
Its not like there has been endless training either and I'm sure there are guys with credits out there not being used, so they can't say they haven't got enough of each type.
Last in first off removes any hint of discrimination at the hands of poor managers and not being in the niche' and over the years, and there's been a lot.
Last edited by duderanch; 14th Dec 2012 at 10:37.
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: in my mind
Age: 34
Posts: 37
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
FED SEC... our manager GH has put out a recent email in regards to bullying and intimidation. I hope he shows the same leniency afforded PC. Since he (manager of business improvement LMCE) was the first person/manager charged by FWA for bullying/Intimidtion.
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: aviation heaven, australia
Posts: 215
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
You can't possibly think that treating a 767 licence, soon to be obsolete is the same as a full B1.1 guy with a A380?
The only people who will want "last in first off" are the old timers, hoping they will not be low on the list. I bet the attitude changes when the 200+ go and its time for round 2.
The only people who will want "last in first off" are the old timers, hoping they will not be low on the list. I bet the attitude changes when the 200+ go and its time for round 2.
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: at work
Age: 44
Posts: 29
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
You can't possibly think that treating a 767 licence, soon to be obsolete is the same as a full B1.1 guy with a A380?
Probably more valuable actually. There are twice as many 767's than a380's in the fleet aren't there.
Probably more valuable actually. There are twice as many 767's than a380's in the fleet aren't there.
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: aviation heaven, australia
Posts: 215
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Duderanch, either you only have a 767 or you have no idea about how to run a business. The company will NOT KEEP A 767 only guy and CR an A380 or A330 only guy. That is why they are making you REDUNDANT......the aircraft is being made REDUNDANT.
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Sydney
Age: 53
Posts: 180
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Let the knifing and internal bickering begin,
Deadset worst part of working for Qantas is the almost clockwork like way this starts every time we need to stick together.
Deadset worst part of working for Qantas is the almost clockwork like way this starts every time we need to stick together.
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Bexley
Posts: 1,792
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
55.7 The redundancy program shall have regard to:
55.7.1 Retaining an age, skill and experience balance within areas of employment in each employment category;
55.7.2 No discrimination against employees;
55.7.3 Special efforts to minimise retrenchment of apprentices or trainees; and
55.7.4 service with the Company.
55.7.5 Qantas will consult with the employees affected and if requested by an employee their representative including an accredited representative of the Association on the process to be adopted on a case by case basis.
55.7.1 Retaining an age, skill and experience balance within areas of employment in each employment category;
55.7.2 No discrimination against employees;
55.7.3 Special efforts to minimise retrenchment of apprentices or trainees; and
55.7.4 service with the Company.
55.7.5 Qantas will consult with the employees affected and if requested by an employee their representative including an accredited representative of the Association on the process to be adopted on a case by case basis.
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Looking for the bridge of trust
Posts: 117
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Quote:
Fedsec there is a rumour going around that you guys have pushed the company hard for "last on first off"
Is this true?
Yes it is. Prefered by members as opposed to interviews. Required by EBA. Company want it to compose 1% of your total score. ALAEA want it to be 99%. Not settled yet but it will definately make up part of the decision but not all.
Company want other things that we find highly offensive such as an OHS Rep getting as many points for holding that position as a person would get for holding a 767 licence.[QUOTE]
Well that makes it as clear as mud, which is probably to each individual's advantage. You have to say, if a score system is adopted to be fair, an even weight needs to be given to "last on first off". I think 99% one way or the other is a bit crook.
Fedsec there is a rumour going around that you guys have pushed the company hard for "last on first off"
Is this true?
Yes it is. Prefered by members as opposed to interviews. Required by EBA. Company want it to compose 1% of your total score. ALAEA want it to be 99%. Not settled yet but it will definately make up part of the decision but not all.
Company want other things that we find highly offensive such as an OHS Rep getting as many points for holding that position as a person would get for holding a 767 licence.[QUOTE]
Well that makes it as clear as mud, which is probably to each individual's advantage. You have to say, if a score system is adopted to be fair, an even weight needs to be given to "last on first off". I think 99% one way or the other is a bit crook.
Last edited by The Bungeyed Bandit; 14th Dec 2012 at 21:08.
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Bexley
Posts: 1,792
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Well that makes it as clear as mud, which is probably to each individual's advantage. You have to say, if a score system is adopted to be fair, an even weight needs to be given to "last on first off". I think 99% one way or the other is a bit crook
To put it a different way. To be somewhat realistic and comply with the EA I reckon half your score should be based on years as LAME/service with company and the other half based on licences you hold. In an Engineers world, I would pick up the phone to the manager Harris and say - Hey mate this is what I reckon is fair. He would most likely agree.
In the Qantas world it is more like this. We have meetings, they turn up with 10 Lawyers and argue that LOFO is discrimination against younger people. We say wtf did you agree to it in the EA then. They get offended that someone swore and remind us that their are ladies present. Then one of the managers will swear. They show some Ppt presentations about the word "regard" trying to pretend that the entire clause is meaningless because regard is not the same as obligate. We say, we will see you in FWA. They say hold on, we are willing to negotiate and put a starting bid of 1% value to LOFO. Its like a circus.
I know why the company can't make any profit.
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Bexley
Posts: 1,792
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
55.7.1 says it all.
The "needs of business" will have precedence over the others.
The "needs of business" will have precedence over the others.
The words don't mean that. One of the important parts of 55.7.1 is the word "balance". There is nothing in it that says "precedence".
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: australia
Posts: 333
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I just hope it's fairer than previous selection processes.
then again if they are closing down the place do they care
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: On the chopping board.
Posts: 929
Likes: 0
Received 4 Likes
on
2 Posts
Mr FedSec, a quick question.
Is it possible to dismiss members from our union?
Just asking a simple question, not implying anything.
Is it possible to dismiss members from our union?
Just asking a simple question, not implying anything.
Last edited by Ngineer; 14th Dec 2012 at 23:26.
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: aviation heaven, australia
Posts: 215
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Fed Sec,
Where does it say specifically "last in first off"? 55.7.4 service with the Company could be read as "well you have been around a long time so see you later"......
Where does it say specifically "last in first off"? 55.7.4 service with the Company could be read as "well you have been around a long time so see you later"......
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Exodus
Posts: 19
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
LOFO will protect some useless ass LAME's; is there a way that ALAEA and the company can weed these types of pricks out?
These guys have a habit of surviving these "changes". I'm not a LAME, so it doesn't affect me much... Except for the fact that I may be accompanying some decent LAME's to Centrelink, whilst these (3) pests remain on the fort.
These guys have a habit of surviving these "changes". I'm not a LAME, so it doesn't affect me much... Except for the fact that I may be accompanying some decent LAME's to Centrelink, whilst these (3) pests remain on the fort.
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: at work
Age: 44
Posts: 29
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Duderanch, either you only have a 767 or you have no idea about how to run a business. The company will NOT KEEP A 767 only guy and CR an A380 or A330 only guy. That is why they are making you REDUNDANT......the aircraft is being made REDUNDANT.
Ouch, empire 4 have a heart. They may well make me redundant. And if they do I'll be in new job in 6 months whilst your probably stressing out about redundancies again. Either way the outlook is pretty dire.
Until we see what they'll use I guess we all toss and turn at night.
Ouch, empire 4 have a heart. They may well make me redundant. And if they do I'll be in new job in 6 months whilst your probably stressing out about redundancies again. Either way the outlook is pretty dire.
Until we see what they'll use I guess we all toss and turn at night.