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Southampton-3

Old 29th Mar 2024, 15:24
  #3081 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by SotonFlightpath
Yes, Heathrow is very close I pop-up there to pick-up friends relatives from time-to-time. I live approximately 6-miles north of SOU airport and the drive from home to Heathrow is usually around 50-55 minutes, that's home to the short-stay car parks.

In fact, I remember reading an article about the Southampton-born musician Craig David in an American magazine and it stated that he hailed from the 'London coastal suburb of Southampton!'
I'll give you a few more examples.

Norwegian Cruise Line, Oceania Cruises, Regent Seven Seas Cruises and Princess Cruises all list Southampton as "London Southampton" as a departure point on the their relevant website for international markets.

I had an interaction with a very irate passenger a few years ago who was furious that it took over an hour by coach from LHR to the ship. She assumed Southampton was London.

I live in a suburb of Southampton approximately 3 miles SE from SOU. From my driveway to LHR Terminal 5 it usually takes me approximately 55 minutes. This would be for an early morning departure leaving home around 4.30 am. Any later the journey time would be far longer, especially during the peak traffic hours which can extend throughout the day.

In saying that LHR is always my first preference with LGW a close second and STN a strong third. Its sad to say that although I'm local and a great fan of the airport but I've only flown in or out of it seven times in my entire life. Four of those were long before the current terminal even opened,
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Old 29th Mar 2024, 15:25
  #3082 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by SWBKCB
But can they make money with this strategy?
Yes, BUT they'd need to dump the current aspirational growth strategy and accept they need to be a niche, relatively high cost operation. It's very tough to shrink to success as most managers only know "go for growth" but actually the most long lived businesses have "right sized" brutally when times get tough. Loganair for example, has grown and shrunk on a cycle over many years but just celebrated 60 years of operations. If SOU were to focus on ATRs and similar sized aircraft and a successful FBO on the side, they'd need to slash costs out of the business and that's before you get to the debt they're carrying in extending the runway and infrastructure. Could SOU do it? Depends on whether they could service the existing debt in shrinking to profitability, it's very hard to do. You can see why they're gambling on a push for high volume leisure. Worst case is that they never get volumes high enough to make money because of the competitive environment and growth at BOH.

Not having a go at anyone, it's not a great place to be in. easyJet have to make a real base of this if SOU's strategy is to pay off.

Last edited by Skipness One Foxtrot; 29th Mar 2024 at 16:30.
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Old 29th Mar 2024, 15:31
  #3083 (permalink)  
 
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Well said Skip
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Old 30th Mar 2024, 08:57
  #3084 (permalink)  
 
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Having spent some 8 years talking about, negotiating & finally completing the runway extension (against all odds given todays green agenda), I can’t see SOU suddenly backtracking & ‘shrinking’ their way to success. As already stated, the scope of the Jet2 business was always too big for SOU given still inherent range limitations in the airports’ operational capability. However it does mean the management will need to work much harder to attract carriers other than EZY. No reason I can see why they couldn’t re-visit previous partners such as Volotea, Vueling for W routes from their extensive European bases? Maybe not likely, but the last week has certainly been a wake-up call. And per my previous note, there are many Euro cities not currently served from either SOU or BOH to choose from. So far, the Jet2 routes practically mirror those served by the current BOH carriers, though it seems they have more expansion planned post 2025 so the clock is certainly ticking - the FlyBe demise should be a summary lesson to all about the over reliance on one partner in any business…..
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Old 30th Mar 2024, 15:34
  #3085 (permalink)  
 
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Well said.

easyJet would be good on Paris, Madrid, Oporto, Rome, Berlin, Nice, Milan, Prague, Warsaw etc - routes that are not currently served and position SOU as complimentary to BOH and not in direct competition with them
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Old 30th Mar 2024, 17:01
  #3086 (permalink)  
 
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So I wanted to leave a few days for the bottom feeders to have their day in the sun.

Firstly, you have to congratulate the operator of BOH as their performance of late has been surprising to say the least. However, there are two big cautions I might add.

Firstly, their terminal, transport links etc simply wonít cope with the additional jet2 base so standby for lots of disgruntled customers and articles in the papers. I am not familiar with how jet2 operates but the size of the operation relative to the facilities as they stand today seems like a big clanger to me. This is going to cause a lot of work for their ops team. I see mention of the terminal being increased etc but as we all know planning takes around 2 years and then a further 2 years for construction etc.

secondly, BOHs performance lately does not follow the normal business development path. Out of nowhere we have seen the two existing operators grow quite a big and a new one come in with a sizeable operation all in a short period at an airport that has historically just been a small bucket and spade airport for the large retired population. Put simply, it seems suspect which usually points to distortion of the system. As I have mentioned a number of times now this illogical growth points towards huge incentives being offered in an attempt to bury your competitor if they are becoming a threat. We all know the fable of the foolish man that built his house on sand.

Turning to whether this is good or bad news for SOU, itís hard on the face of it to see it as anything other than bad news. But letís look at the facts.

Firstly, could Jet2 have chose SOU instead. Was this a SOU v BOH battle that SOU lost? No. When it was announced that (rather oddly) they had not chosen to take any A320s to the late 2020s it was clear Jet2 was not going to be an option for SOU until at least the end of the decade. 737s will unlikely ever be a thing at SOU which isnít a problem at all. But at the moment Jet2 couldnít operate at SOU and wanted a base on the south coast so had no choice but to pick BOH.

Now that we have established SOU was never an option at this moment in time. How is this going to affect SOU? A key thing that everyone seems to be overlooking is that 14 out of the 16 routes announced by Jet2 are already served by FR/Tui. So this isnít really an increase of destinations served but increased frequency of existing routes. Only 3 of the routes announced are also operated at SOU and Easy is such a strong brand and SOU so much easier to get to that it shouldnít really have much affect on SOU for those routes. Lastly, something that people also seem to overlook is the fact that SOU is unlikely to ever be a package holiday focused airport like BOH, EMA etc. I donít recall it ever historically being one and I think the modern generation are more focused on seeing culture on city breaks and using AirBnBs than frying like a pig all week at the hotel pool and being chained to their food/drink offering. This is why I think Easy are hand in glove with SOU as they could provide flights to places of culture for the well off local clientele. All airlines will need to grow outside of London again and Easy is not going to move in at BOH like some crazy people are suggesting on the BOH thread. So SOU it is.

In conclusion congrats to BOH, but I think an implosion is in its future. As for SOU, fingers crossed Easy keep building their presence as it will be a big success if they do.
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Old 30th Mar 2024, 17:23
  #3087 (permalink)  
 
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If you ignore the usual RJ digs, there are some good points well made, particulalry around the need for BOH to exand their physical infrastructure - hopefully there is a plan in place ready to be rolled out.

and I think the modern generation are more focused on seeing culture on city breaks and using AirBnBs
they could provide flights to places of culture for the well off local clientele.
but these are the sorts of comments that are often made about the clientele in the SOU catchment area - may well be true, but is there any evidence that there has ever been any impact on the routes operated from SOU?.

This has always been the condundrum with SOU - great transport links, prosperous catchement area, poor route network with a range of attractive destinations tried and dropped.
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Old 30th Mar 2024, 17:56
  #3088 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Severn
Most easyJet Europe bases are at airports with restrictive operating hours. If they make bases work at these airports with time restrictions, so why not at SOU?
Below is a list of the EJU bases and shows the time that the last EJU based aircraft lands.

ORY - last based EJU flight lands at 22:30
NTE - last based EJU flight lands at 22:30
AMS - last based EJU flight lands at 22:35
BCN - last based EJU flight lands at 22:50
NCE - last based EJU flight lands at 22:55
NAP - last based EJU flight lands at 22:55
BER - last based EJU flight lands at 22:55
LYS - last based EJU flight lands at 23:05
BOD - last based EJU flight lands at 23:05
OPO - last based EJU flight lands at 23:05
BSL - last based EJU flight lands at 23:05
GVA - last based EJU flight lands at 23:10
CDG - last based EJU flight lands at 23:25
This great post also deserves a bump. SOUs operating hour restrictions stopping a low cost carrier base is fake news.
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Old 30th Mar 2024, 17:57
  #3089 (permalink)  
 
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I think most people would class you as a bottom feeder but there we go.
The increase in personal insults in these threads is getting a bit tedious.
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Old 30th Mar 2024, 18:32
  #3090 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Rivet Joint
This great post also deserves a bump. SOUs operating hour restrictions stopping a low cost carrier base is fake news.
Interesting list but SOU closes at 23:00 so half of those flights are on the wrong side of 23.00 and the ones that are not only allows for up to 30 minutes of delay.
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Old 30th Mar 2024, 18:33
  #3091 (permalink)  
 
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Merriam-Webster defines the term bottom feeder as an opportunist who seeks quick profit usually at the expense of others or from their misfortune.

See above posts with no constructive criticism and posted with glee with the intention to antagonise. A statement of fact rather than an insult in my case. I will not be giving any of them the attention they crave and hope the other genuine posters do the same.
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Old 30th Mar 2024, 18:44
  #3092 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Rivet Joint
This great post also deserves a bump. SOUs operating hour restrictions stopping a low cost carrier base is fake news.
If Easy thought there was reward in any of your listed destinations then they would have been at the front door when the runway extension was completed.
They have dipped there toe in SOU,nothing very exciting,in fact underwhelming , unless there is some startling announcement for 2025 for SOU in the coming weeks then I don't see Easy as a long term prospect, what happens then is in AGS hands!
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Old 30th Mar 2024, 19:47
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Originally Posted by SWBKCB
The increase in personal insults in these threads is getting a bit tedious.
Please accept my apologies, I also get tired of them but unfortunately bit at RJ's usual digs for once, which was poor form. Post shall be removed.

But I stand by one of his points Bournemouth will have a plan for this level of expansion and wont just implode, the rigby group/rca seem to have their heads on straight and the aviation division is profitable for them. In my opinion I feel Southampton may need new owners looking at Aberdeen as well. Of course we await to see If easy do expand or base but that seems to be the only option at the moment, and always a bit risky to pin your hopes on just one option.
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Old 30th Mar 2024, 19:57
  #3094 (permalink)  
 
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RJís point about incentives

easyJet will need an incentive to operate from SOU just as much as Jet2 will need one from BOH.

In business, itís always wise to seek more than one quote from a supplier or in this case an airport. I would be very surprised if easyJet were not pitching the two against each other in order to obtain a better deal at SOU. If they arenít then how do they keep their costs in check?


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Old 30th Mar 2024, 19:57
  #3095 (permalink)  
 
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A bit of good news seems the first easyJet to ALC tomorrow is sold out.
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Old 30th Mar 2024, 20:13
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Good news indeed!

Seems that Ryanair flights from Bournemouth to Alicante pretty much sold out for the entire week next week too - I guess Easter holidays?
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Old 30th Mar 2024, 20:16
  #3097 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Rivet Joint
This great post also deserves a bump. SOUs operating hour restrictions stopping a low cost carrier base is fake news.
Which is why SOU would be no good with similar timed schedules as It can NEVER extend past 2300, not even for a minute so just a few minutes delay would render over 80% of those flights as non-entities. Most of those would need to be established by 2245-2250 to stand any chance of being accepted.
End result would mean regular diversions, particularly in the peak season.
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Old 30th Mar 2024, 21:17
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Heathrow operates with stringent night period restrictions. Airlines adapt. Airports worldwide manage successfully.
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Old 30th Mar 2024, 21:38
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Originally Posted by Rivet Joint
This great post also deserves a bump. SOUs operating hour restrictions stopping a low cost carrier base is fake news.
Well that’s what I was thinking in an earlier post I made. Granted, some of the longer-distance destinations will never be viable from SOU, but if one looks at Jet2’s timings for their proposed new routes, we can see that there will be 27 weekly flights, so that’s two out and back rotations per aircraft on six days a week, and one double rotation and one single on the remaining day.

All of the flights are early morning and early/mid afternoon departures. If EZY were to base two aircraft at Southampton, and utilise them on routes to destinations such as Palma, Alicante, Faro, Malaga, Ibiza, Corsica, Paris CDG, Barcelona, Rome, Corfu, Copenhagen, Budapest, Edinburgh, Manchester, Jersey, Nice, Isle of Man etc, just as an example, all of these could be operated within SOU’s opening hours. If Belfast, Glasgow and Geneva could continue as presently utilising aircraft from those bases, I’m sure it would be successful.

It would need a serious, and I mean serious, marketing and promotional push, no make that a blitz, by the airport well before the services begin to build awareness, but it could be done.

Last edited by SotonFlightpath; 31st Mar 2024 at 07:01.
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Old 30th Mar 2024, 22:04
  #3100 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by SotonFlightpath
Well thatís what I was thinking in an earlier post I made. Granted, some of the longer-distance destinations will never be viable from SOU, but if one looks at Jet2ís timings for their proposed new routes, we can see that there will be 27 weekly flights, so thatís two out and back rotations per aircraft on six days a week, and one double rotation and one single on the remaining day.

All of the flights are early morning and early/mid afternoon departures. If EZY were to base two aircraft at Southampton, and utilise them on routes to destinations such as Palms, Alicante, Faro, Malaga, Ibiza, Corsica, Paris CDG, Barcelona, Rome, Corfu, Copenhagen, Budapest, Edinburgh, Manchester, Jersey, Nice, Isle of Man etc, just as an example, all of these could be operated within SOUís opening hours. If Belfast, Glasgow and Geneva could continue as presently utilising aircraft from those bases, Iím sure it would be successful.

It would need a serious, and I mean serious, marketing and promotional push, no make that a blitz, by the airport well before the services begin to build awareness, but it could be done.
Unfortunately this is not the narrative that most on this thread wish to hear. I do however agree with your thoughts and Iím sure is eminently doable.
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