DONCASTER SHEFFIELD
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: UK
Posts: 256
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Post-implementation review of the DSA controlled airspace is now under way. Due to report at the end of January.
What actually happens at Doncaster on days like Monday with almost 11 hours between departures? Do they send the staff home, switch off the lights and heating and lock the doors? Could the airspace be NOTAMed withdrawn for most of the day as there are no public transport flight to be protected?
bb
bb
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: UK
Posts: 256
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I doubt they would NOTAM the airspace as being uncontrolled, as the airport can still have activity - 737s and A319s doing circuit training at 2,500 feet, cargo flights, business jets, instrument training. If public transport flights were the only criteria then Farnborough wouldn't have a chance with their Class D application, and Bournemouth, Norwich and Tees Valley would have been withdrawn.
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: uk
Posts: 158
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
With all the posts by the doom and gloom mob on the lack of flights at DSA there would be no logic in keeping the airspace and as a GA user in the area I would be the first to campaign to get rid of it.
Nice reply from wb9999 who has highlighted two good points. 1. There is a hell of a lot more activity at many regional airports than the departure boards state thus justifying the airspace. 2. As advised that there is a lot of activity in the area I will look out even more.
Going the other way of getting rid of the airspace would not stop the training, cargo and jet activity as Cambridge is an example where this happens. My view is where commercial flights ( pax, cargo or training ) form a high percentage of the flying activity then controlled airspace must be an option. Where GA activity is higher ie CVT then an ATZ should be adequate.
Nice reply from wb9999 who has highlighted two good points. 1. There is a hell of a lot more activity at many regional airports than the departure boards state thus justifying the airspace. 2. As advised that there is a lot of activity in the area I will look out even more.
Going the other way of getting rid of the airspace would not stop the training, cargo and jet activity as Cambridge is an example where this happens. My view is where commercial flights ( pax, cargo or training ) form a high percentage of the flying activity then controlled airspace must be an option. Where GA activity is higher ie CVT then an ATZ should be adequate.
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: 6 miles 14
Posts: 641
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Fully agree. Despite flying in the area I make a point of going around their massive amount of airspace, it simply can not be justified given the number of commercial flights. I just use the transponder and skirt the edge climbing or descending to stay out of it. If you talk to them I'm told they class you as a movement and use it as justification to keep their airspace.
wb9999, Im curious how many 737s and A319s have been training in the Doncaster airspace in the last 7 days? How much of the vast volume of airspace does a jet circuit use?
3 arrivals and 3 departures on the board again today, half as busy as Teeside.
bb
3 arrivals and 3 departures on the board again today, half as busy as Teeside.
bb
I see the morning rush was over by 0900, both flight had gone. Next arrival is 1950 tonight, just remind me what the huge volume of airspace is protecting?
I guess the circuit is full of B737s and A 319s and several more waiting at the holding point for a gap? Dozens of Biz jets again fighting for a slot. Endless procession of freighters again?
How many day time flights per week does Doncaster have?
how is the airspace review going?
bb
I guess the circuit is full of B737s and A 319s and several more waiting at the holding point for a gap? Dozens of Biz jets again fighting for a slot. Endless procession of freighters again?
How many day time flights per week does Doncaster have?
how is the airspace review going?
bb
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Dubai and Sunderland
Posts: 818
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re-CAS its a very fine line having the airspace to protect an airport the size of Doncaster. I worked 20+ years doing radar in class G airspace at a busy airfield, NCL, but we always had the class D airspace close in.
I think the fare paying public should have some form of protection especially close in on an instrument approach. It is fine slagging off the level of traffic but if a mid air happen 5nm on the ILS a lot of people are going to get killed just to allow a light aircraft route through a few miles of airspace 'without' a r/t call!!
I think the fare paying public should have some form of protection especially close in on an instrument approach. It is fine slagging off the level of traffic but if a mid air happen 5nm on the ILS a lot of people are going to get killed just to allow a light aircraft route through a few miles of airspace 'without' a r/t call!!
10 DME ARC
You make a good point, but, in order to have a collision there needs to be 2 planes over the same point at the same height. 5 miles out on a 3 degree would put the plane at 1650" AGl where few light aircraft and even fewer gliders operate. But more importantly Doncaster seldom have any medium sized jets during daylight hours when other fliers are out. There are so few daytime flights that you couldn't hit one if you tried.
Doncaster clearly don't need all of the massive volume of airspace and even class "D" for this is OTT
bb
I think the fare paying public should have some form of protection especially close in on an instrument approach. It is fine slagging off the level of traffic but if a mid air happen 5nm on the ILS a lot of people are going to get killed just to allow a light aircraft route through a few miles of airspace 'without' a r/t call!!
Doncaster clearly don't need all of the massive volume of airspace and even class "D" for this is OTT
bb
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Doncaster
Age: 63
Posts: 454
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Be nice. Wish its big brother would come back though! That was probably the highlight of the airport's reborn history and sorry for being spottery.
Last edited by johnnychips; 18th Dec 2013 at 23:08. Reason: Not offending RAF buffs!
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Leeds, West Yorkshire
Posts: 1,152
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Looks like Ryanair maybe dropping there 2x Doncaster-Sheffield routes this summer. The 1x weekly Tenerife service is no longer on sale while it looks like the 3x weekly Gerona (Barcelona) route is been moved over to Leeds/Bradford.
Last edited by LBIA; 14th Jan 2014 at 09:46.
Looks like Ryanair maybe dropping there 2x Doncaster-Sheffield routes this summer. The 1x weekly Tenerife service is no longer on sale while it looks like the 3x weekly Gerona (Barcelona) route is been moved over to Leeds/Bradford.
bb
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Doncaster
Age: 41
Posts: 556
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I emailed DSA today to see if this was the case, I had this reply.
Dear Mr Wheeler.
We can confirm that Ryanair will cease operations from Doncaster Sheffield as of March 2014.
Unfortunately, at this time, we have no long term plans to replace the flights lost.
I hope this answers your questions.
And that was it, not even an email signature.
So now there are only Thomson (several flights down on summer 2013) Wizz (slightly reduced) and Thomas Cook (the same frequencies I believe)
Absolutely no chance of anyone adding to these offerings.
Sad, sad times for my local airport.
Dear Mr Wheeler.
We can confirm that Ryanair will cease operations from Doncaster Sheffield as of March 2014.
Unfortunately, at this time, we have no long term plans to replace the flights lost.
I hope this answers your questions.
And that was it, not even an email signature.
So now there are only Thomson (several flights down on summer 2013) Wizz (slightly reduced) and Thomas Cook (the same frequencies I believe)
Absolutely no chance of anyone adding to these offerings.
Sad, sad times for my local airport.
Speaking purely theoretically...
- Who owns DSA ? 100% Peel or do other parties like local councils or other companies have a stake ?
- What hard constraints exist on Peel to prevent them announcing airport closure at a time of their choice ? An example might be a clause in the planning permission from the council requiring the land have only aviation use
- Is there a shortage of homes, office space, warehouses or light industrial units near the airport ?
- Is Network Rail really prepared to reopen Finningley station (albeit at a new location) ?
- Is the structure of the main buildings in reasonably good repair and weatherproof ?
- Does the runway, control tower or ILS need any major works done soon ?
- Are local residents broadly in favour of an airport or do they always complain about noise ?
- What's the view of the council towards the airport ? Are the council in a serious financial disaster or just struggling to make ends meet like many other local councils ?
- Are Thomson and Wizz broadly happy with the airpory or do they ddsperately want to leave ?
- Who owns DSA ? 100% Peel or do other parties like local councils or other companies have a stake ?
- What hard constraints exist on Peel to prevent them announcing airport closure at a time of their choice ? An example might be a clause in the planning permission from the council requiring the land have only aviation use
- Is there a shortage of homes, office space, warehouses or light industrial units near the airport ?
- Is Network Rail really prepared to reopen Finningley station (albeit at a new location) ?
- Is the structure of the main buildings in reasonably good repair and weatherproof ?
- Does the runway, control tower or ILS need any major works done soon ?
- Are local residents broadly in favour of an airport or do they always complain about noise ?
- What's the view of the council towards the airport ? Are the council in a serious financial disaster or just struggling to make ends meet like many other local councils ?
- Are Thomson and Wizz broadly happy with the airpory or do they ddsperately want to leave ?
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: In the sticks
Posts: 9,858
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
This would be the sort of place I would like to work as I head for retirement. The downside would be no doubt a small wage but on the positive side no stress, a close community of staff so there was always someone to talk to and next to nothing to do all day. Seems like heaven to me!
Looking at photos of the terminal it seems to be a quality building at a quality airport. What a shame it is all starting to unravel.
Looking at photos of the terminal it seems to be a quality building at a quality airport. What a shame it is all starting to unravel.
Last edited by LTNman; 17th Jan 2014 at 04:49.
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Doncaster
Posts: 193
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
davidjohnson6 asks some good questions. People saying the airport should never have been opened because it wasn't needed are missing a point. Figures do sometimes go up. Where they do go up they CAN go up. But somehow they don't on a regular basis. I am starting to fall in line with the pessimists. But I don't think it is because people don't want to use the place etc. etc. People want to use the place but it seems increasingly like someone else isn't keen on it flourishing. Please read this carefully before shooting me down. It isn't an optimistic post.