Ryanair - 8

[Telstar]

Pee, I think it has more to do with them being isolated airports with little other traffic that FR are trying to bully into giving them more "marketing support"

[pee]

@Telstar.

True! In my opinion, however, such a policy mostly undermines Ryanair's position and in many cases profits as well. Look at this route:

Fri 12 Oct 12
Flight FR2562
12:05 Depart Tampere
16:00 Arrive Malaga
Adult 272.42 EUR

Fri 26 Oct 12
Flight FR2561
06:00 Depart Malaga
11:40 Arrive Tampere
Adult 248.21 EUR

Total 520.63 EUR

+ card fees, + luggage fees.

And now imagine; this route will be terminated! Check the mean prices - very close to this cited. What any marketing support really means when you are able to achieve this level of prices??? Nothing, believe me! No logic here at all!

[davidjohnson6]

I can see how the population of Tampere and Turku might benefit from FR flying to their airports. I'm puzzled however as to why the people of Lappeenranta would possibly want to pay any kind of marketing support to Ryanair, when so many of the passengers flying are travelling to/from a city 200 km away in a different country. Can anyone explain ?

[pee]

^^ Lappeenranta pays already. In 2011 the sum was 800 000 EUR, most of this went to Ryanair. FR wanted more, but requiring this it's losing its momentum, obviously. Indeed, how much the population of 70.000 people can afford to pay for people coming from/to the neighbouring country?

But the ability to properly assess the situation is lost not only in our small country. Look at Estonia. This (much shorter) route will be terminated as well:

Mon 10 Sep 12
Flight FR9376
11:55 Depart Tallinn
14:40 Arrive Milan Bergamo
132.14 EUR

Mon 17 Sep 12
Flight FR9375
06:55 Depart BGY
11:30 Arrive TLL
Adult 92.23 EUR
Total 224.37 EUR

Not profitable either?

[Telstar]

Pee,

As part of the "business model" FR has to be able to twist the arm of regional airports to breaking point. They establish a route with lots of marketing support, then turn around after a short time when the local economy is doing well from it and demand double or triple the money to continue. If a regional airport fights back and refuses to bow to the bully boy tactics and extortion, FR pull out. If they didn't then they would lose the nuclear option to threaten the airports with. This sometimes means that FR cut off their nose to spite their face like in the case you mentioned.

[pee]

Telstar,

Unfortunately for Ryanair, even the average passengers are more and more conscious nowadays, better informed. They realize what FR's tricks are, it's no more secret. That does not arouse sympathy even among the most loyal customers, I'm sure. As FR shows no mercy towards airports / communities (where also the local taxpayers live), customers' loyalty too is far from unconditional. As long as flights are cheap, pax continue playing with Captcha and from time to time do make some purchases. But in many cases prices have risen quite dramatically, haven't they? What does that mean?

The customers' loss can be triggered also by many other things. One group of reasons: cutting routes and lowering flight frequencies. Many pax from TMP used to connect flights in HHN. Without any guaranties, on their own. But when frequency drops to three flights per week, it's virtually impossible to connect anything. Not any more. Hence, the amount of pax on this route will go down even further, the LF on former "connecting flights" will drop as well. Cutting the branches sometimes pay, sometimes not at all.

[Jamie2k9]

Ryaniar won't be pulling out of Reus for the winter. Flights will operate from Reus to Bristol, Charleroi, East Midlands, Eindhoven, Hahn, London-Stansted and Santiago de Compostela.

Flights to Aktio, Greece from Rome and Charleroi are due to be added from May 2013.

[EI-BUD]

Ryanair 'tax free' flights:

So when Ryanair sell a flight as 'No Taxes and Charges', this usually applies to the lower fares? Seems to be??

Well it has occurred to me that is this a tactic to avoid passengers claiming refunds for taxes and charges and loading these costs into the normal fare or other fees they charge? This would mean that since the largest amount of no shows are the ones that were booked on flights with no taxes and charges, they do not have to pay a refund.

Perhaps this has been discussed before but since it always seems to be on the lowest fares it is a refund avoidance measure.

Ryanair supporters feel free to defend the rationale. MOL would certainly have a strong case to explain that it is another example of FR being lowest fares etc. So no doubt his followers will mirror this.

EI-BUD

[racedo]

Well it has occurred to me that is this a tactic to avoid passengers claiming refunds for taxes and charges and loading these costs into the normal fare or other fees they charge? This would mean that since the largest amount of no shows are the ones that were booked on flights with no taxes and charges, they do not have to pay a refund.

And your data on largest amount of no shows comes from where please ? or are you making a guess ?

As they don't make refunds for no shows not sure why its an issue.

Its like No VAT payable on something you buy in the shop, something to persuade a buyer to buy at that price.

Its a Promotional mechanic that is used and probably sounds nice to the buyer that great I'm not paying tax.

Perhaps this has been discussed before but since it always seems to be on the lowest fares it is a refund avoidance measure.

Ryanair supporters feel free to defend the rationale. MOL would certainly have a strong case to explain that it is another example of FR being lowest fares etc. So no doubt his followers will mirror this.

As refunds take in a charge then not sure why its an avoidance scheme.

I have no data but would suggest that even with the legacy carriers the number of actual refunds on taxes are actually very very small so its pretty much a non issue.

I personally know nobody who has ever claimed back taxes from a flight they didn't turn up for, that takes in all carriers.

Its a not worth the hassle kind of thing...................you will always get some, but they the ones who calculate interest to the nearest penny and complain to the bank.

I also very much doubt that MO'L is aware of what promotion is happening, where. The exception being very very large promotions i.e. 99cent/pence ones as thats why the marketing and pricing department is there for. Given promotions happening in different countries every week, why would he, aside from knowing one is happening he doesn't need the detail ?

[DomyDom]

FR at MAN

Jamie2K9,

Please can you give any hints as to whether FR are likely to expand again at MAN for Summer 2013 and if so what new routes if asny are being considered?

Thanks, DomyDom

[Jamie2k9]

Please can you give any hints as to whether FR are likely to expand again at MAN for Summer 2013 and if so what new routes if asny are being considered?

Thanks, DomyDom

Don't think it will be the 6 a/c as MOL claimed at launch just because it remains two for winter. Wonder how MAG feel about FR breaking the deal and could fail to meet there target but it happens at most airports FR talk about big plans but most of the time they don't happen. There is a few routes being dropped from October and they are not the seasonal type so unlightly to return which leaves a few gaps.

Flights with no taxes & charges manily tend to be weak routes and on routes with high compitation as well as large number of flights. Take routes between IRL-UK, if they had taxes and charges charged then the flights would be empty, I know some they charge full fare depending when booked etc. Example:

Dublin-Manchester - €36 taxes
Manchester-Dublin - €41.86 taxes
That is before all EU/FR extras

I would say the IRL-UK flights have the higest no show rates. Would say there is low numbers who claim taxes back as its an effort and most people couldn't be bothered doing it but I could be wrong.

[DomyDom]

Don't think it will be the 6 a/c as MOL claimed at launch just because it remains two for winter. Wonder how MAG feel about FR breaking the deal and could fail to meet there target but it happens at most airports FR talk about big plans but most of the time they don't happen....

Thanks Jamie. Not compleletly unexpected I guess based on past form. It looks like expansion at MAN for this year will come largely from EZY, Wizz etc. This confirms MANs strategy of diversification of airline providers it the most appropiate one.

[EZY7117LPL]

Wizz Air? at MAN? What do you base this on?

[chaps2011]

Lot of rumours at Manchester at present with more news due fairly soon
I don`t know the ins and outs but rumours are coming from several different sources from within airport and with Wizz dropping routes from both LPL and DSA over next few weeks

Ian

[j636]

Ryanair have confirmed that negotiations about a new order are underway and it will be for 300 aircraft over 15 years, didn't say what aircraft company.

[Jack1985]

Ryanair have confirmed that negotiations about a new order are underway and it will be for 300 aircraft over 15 years, didn't say what aircraft company.

Cant see Boeing wanting to lose an order of that size! Ryanair also adding routes from Barcelona (BCN) and Madrid to Tenerife North from 7 Nov.

[PPRuNeUser0176]

Ryanair have announced that KIR-STN will increase form 3 to 7 weekly flights effective from 7 November. They even issued a Press release which is strange..

[EI-BUD]

I wonder were AerLingus looking at LGW KIR??? If Knock is a success no reason why this could not be replicated from KIR..?

[davidjohnson6]

For many months (possibly since the widespread introduction of Captcha), the 'Timetables' feature on the Ryanair website has not worked.
Thus, even to find out whether a flight operates a given route on a specific day (as opposed to finding out the price), it seems the only way is to make a dummy booking, and go through the Captcha screen.

I'm capable of looking at 3rd party sites, but I expect Ryanair's own website will have more reliable information about Ryanair flights, as opposed to some other site, like skyscanner.
I can understand why MOL wants to make it difficult to compare prices against other airlines via Captcha, but timetable information is public domain, so presumably there is less need to protect it.

Is there any way to find out whether a flight operates on a particular day more than a month in advance and know what times it departs / arrives, without having to keep going through Captcha tests ?

[Cyrano]

Originally Posted by davidjohnson6

Is there any way to find out whether a flight operates on a particular day more than a month in advance and know what times it departs / arrives, without having to keep going through Captcha tests ?

Well, it may not answer the question 100%, but just in case you're not aware, Google is not bad these days for simple timetable searches. For example "dublin rodez flights" gives me the timetable on the route (sorry, dodgy formatting below is my fault not Google's):

Code:

Flights from Dublin, Ireland (DUB) to Rodez, France (RDZ)
Flights	
Non-stop flights:	2 per week, 2h 10m duration
Airlines:	Ryanair
−
Schedule of non-stop flights
Valid through Oct 19

6:50 am→	9:55 am	DUB-RDZ	-	-	-	-	-	-	S	Ryanair 9864

12:15 pm→	3:25 pm	DUB-RDZ	-	-	T	-	-	-	-	Ryanair 9864

All flights from Dublin - All flights to Rodez

Might help a little?