CORK
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EI have announced internally that the have more plans for shorthaul routes ex cork for the summer of 2006, the announcement of a 4th overnighting A320 should come shortly. However in the same breath they advised they do not have any plans of flying transatlantic routes ex cork for the coming future. So the future looks bright for europe ex cork.
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Can someone clarify the situation on which planes can operate transatlantic out of Cork.
As I understand it, the A330-200, A319 and 757 can all operate tranatlantic with a full compliment of passengers and freight. All other planes would need to fly with either passengers or freight removed.
What is the situation with the A350 and the 787?
BTW It doesn't surprise me that Aer Lingus have no plans to operated transatlantic out of Cork. They don't have enough planes to operate all the routes they want out of Dublin, so Cork is well down their priority list.
As I understand it, the A330-200, A319 and 757 can all operate tranatlantic with a full compliment of passengers and freight. All other planes would need to fly with either passengers or freight removed.
What is the situation with the A350 and the 787?
BTW It doesn't surprise me that Aer Lingus have no plans to operated transatlantic out of Cork. They don't have enough planes to operate all the routes they want out of Dublin, so Cork is well down their priority list.
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Could Aer lingus not start using a high range A319 option to fly to the bos / ny that seems like the best option. Pilots that are currently operating the A320 could easily operate the A319. Any other us airliners that would operate to cork ?? how about CO or AA using their 757's . I wish AA would use their current 757 to relocate and fly bos to cork, snn already has EI using their A330 from bos to snn. I would definitely pay the extra $60 to support the flight!!
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I wouldnt doubt that either. Corks runway 35/17 is almost 7000ft and the main runway at St Maarten is 7150ft. They manage to fly heavies in and out of there all day long. So I could imagine they wouldnt have a problem flying most in and out of there. Is there room for a 1000ft extension? Either which way its up to CAA to market the place properly there is a huge amount of potential to attract a US carrier.
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mark_heg
How would an A319 pay for itself ex Cork? No freight worth discussing and about 120 pax? What would the fare be? Slattery's couldn't make a 757, half again as big as a 319, work!
As a Corkman I would love to see more ORK flights but the reality of Jetmagic's demise is that Cork pax will not pay too high a premium when SNN is 120 minutes up the road and probably nearer 90 minutes when the Shannon tunnel is done, and EI has the 7.30am to LHR.
I took a 5.5hr flight in a 319 from YYZ-UVF, I certainly wouldn't face 8+ hours in a 319 in EI econ. A319s would be interesting to the east coast of Canada but you have another 1000-2000km to go from there before you reach YYZ/BOS/EWR/JFK/PHL/DTW etc.
The fascination in Ireland with every airport having to have a link to JFK eludes me. In the UK, having every region of more than 400k having a direct link to the East Coast would fill the skies over Ireland.
How would an A319 pay for itself ex Cork? No freight worth discussing and about 120 pax? What would the fare be? Slattery's couldn't make a 757, half again as big as a 319, work!
As a Corkman I would love to see more ORK flights but the reality of Jetmagic's demise is that Cork pax will not pay too high a premium when SNN is 120 minutes up the road and probably nearer 90 minutes when the Shannon tunnel is done, and EI has the 7.30am to LHR.
I took a 5.5hr flight in a 319 from YYZ-UVF, I certainly wouldn't face 8+ hours in a 319 in EI econ. A319s would be interesting to the east coast of Canada but you have another 1000-2000km to go from there before you reach YYZ/BOS/EWR/JFK/PHL/DTW etc.
The fascination in Ireland with every airport having to have a link to JFK eludes me. In the UK, having every region of more than 400k having a direct link to the East Coast would fill the skies over Ireland.
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Yes maybe an A319 is too small but a 757 would be perfect. I would like to give cork a chance before it is written off. I do believe that if a proper schudule was in place the service would be very popular.
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an extension isnt to viable,the thing missing here is a parallel taxiway for runway35.
MarkD, slatterys didnt run the 757 because of a fuel surcharge introduced, and also the priority at the moment is passenger routes,not so much on the cargo.
regards,
MarkD, slatterys didnt run the 757 because of a fuel surcharge introduced, and also the priority at the moment is passenger routes,not so much on the cargo.
regards,
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EI-Mick
it's true, Slattery's were hosed by Ryan Int on the price and 757 is a more plausible aircraft for a T/A route given speed and payload/range. No disagreement at all. In fact, I'd love to see EI go the Continental/AA route with the 757 from SNN to spare the 330s and have said so many times.
A 319 into JFK is a different case entirely unless it was a Privatair type operation with all J and again, regularly filling that ex Cork would be tough.
mark_heg
look at the specs for 757 and 319 and you'll see the difference. However, I'd much rather see Arann get its act together, codeshare with EI and AA and deny FR any connecting DUB traffic. At the end of the day over 6 hrs widebody is always going to be substantial faster in flight time, more comfy. Also - the Slattery service wouldn't have US preclearance, right?
it's true, Slattery's were hosed by Ryan Int on the price and 757 is a more plausible aircraft for a T/A route given speed and payload/range. No disagreement at all. In fact, I'd love to see EI go the Continental/AA route with the 757 from SNN to spare the 330s and have said so many times.
A 319 into JFK is a different case entirely unless it was a Privatair type operation with all J and again, regularly filling that ex Cork would be tough.
mark_heg
look at the specs for 757 and 319 and you'll see the difference. However, I'd much rather see Arann get its act together, codeshare with EI and AA and deny FR any connecting DUB traffic. At the end of the day over 6 hrs widebody is always going to be substantial faster in flight time, more comfy. Also - the Slattery service wouldn't have US preclearance, right?
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I would agree with any airliner using whatever aircraft from bos to cork. I travel T/A 6 times a year at least and have to endure shannon or go ork to lhr. Neither of which i like at all. I see jetblue operate A320's from boston to destinations like las vegas, seattle, oakland etc all which take 6 hrs to fly, which is on par with a T/A to the east coast from snn. I think it would be great to see any airliner operate a T/A from the cork to bos. Im tired of hearing that there wouldnt be any demand for the flights which I think is rubbish, can some one actually fly the flight for once and for all and then decide.
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I notice the US Department of Transport has a press release for the US-Canada open skies agreement but not a sausage about Cullen and his visit. Did our DofT imagine it all? 
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Cork
Speculation about transatlantic at Cork is wide of the mark. The reality is that Aerlingus will not want to know as long as Cork people will make the journey to Shannon.
I wonder do Continental and Delta management even know where Cork is?
A Cork JFK and Cork Boston service is viable, but it will require a major marketiing effort by all interests groups.
The Slattery cancellation was very unfortunate particularlly as fuel prices have come back down again. Was this the only reason why the series was cancelled?
Heard today that three senior Ryanair personel spent the day looking at facilities at Cork.
I wonder do Continental and Delta management even know where Cork is?
A Cork JFK and Cork Boston service is viable, but it will require a major marketiing effort by all interests groups.
The Slattery cancellation was very unfortunate particularlly as fuel prices have come back down again. Was this the only reason why the series was cancelled?
Heard today that three senior Ryanair personel spent the day looking at facilities at Cork.
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Have to agree with MarkD on this one....What is the fascination with T/A flights out of Cork? I would much rather ORK had greater and more numerous connections to the UK and in particular the continent.
Sure, I would love to fly T/A to ORK too, and avoid the trek to DUB or SNN, but unless it is truly viable for an airline, it ain't going to happen.
Sure, I would love to fly T/A to ORK too, and avoid the trek to DUB or SNN, but unless it is truly viable for an airline, it ain't going to happen.
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Concerning T/A from Cork. I dont believe its an idle facination from all the airports in Ireland to have T/A services. The fact is Cork has sufficient UK services (approx 19 UK destinations) with most regions covered. With maybe only 1 or 2 exceptions any additional UK services will dilute demand for the existing ones. Yes we would like to see more European routes come on stream (currently approx only 12 destinations), however if the rumours become reality then EI and FR will be increasing that number next year. The lacking areas would be Germany & Scandanavia.
The logical next step is USA, which is a untapped market.
As for whether is would be viable - the answer is YES. But is has always been denied due to the SNN stop (which it now appears never applied to ORK at all). All you have to do is see the amount of pax transiting on the early morning flts to DUB and London who's final destination is USA to show that the volumes are there, and also take into account the amount of pax who drive to Shannon to connect from there.
T/A Flights from Cork are only a matter of time. Currently EI may not be immediately interested (but is it only a matter of time). Of course what will get EI's immediate attention and launching of a US-ORK route is if AA, DL or CO (or anyone else) decide to venture into Cork.
My own opinion is that a daily JFK service by a major player with interline connections using 757/762/333 would be a complete success.
The logical next step is USA, which is a untapped market.
As for whether is would be viable - the answer is YES. But is has always been denied due to the SNN stop (which it now appears never applied to ORK at all). All you have to do is see the amount of pax transiting on the early morning flts to DUB and London who's final destination is USA to show that the volumes are there, and also take into account the amount of pax who drive to Shannon to connect from there.
T/A Flights from Cork are only a matter of time. Currently EI may not be immediately interested (but is it only a matter of time). Of course what will get EI's immediate attention and launching of a US-ORK route is if AA, DL or CO (or anyone else) decide to venture into Cork.
My own opinion is that a daily JFK service by a major player with interline connections using 757/762/333 would be a complete success.
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One of the reasons for the 'fascination' with transatlantic services is the poor state of ground transportation in Ireland. In areas of the UK that don't have transatlantic services, there is a good chance that it's possible to get a direct train into Manchester, Birmingham or Gatwick Airport.
Consider the slog of getting to Shannon. No trains. A bus which takes 2 1/2 hours. No wonder connecting in DUB, LHR or AMS is a more attractive proposition. A direct flight from Cork is better again.
However, I can see the point that it's not the best next step in the airports development. As much as new routes, I'd like to see greater frequency on existing ones - Amsterdam and Manchester returning to 2x daily, Paris going to 2x daily, all the UK routes with a frequency lower than 1x daily going to daily. As regards new routes, Frankfurt would be as important as a US route.
Mind you, if a US route turns up, I won't be complaining.
Consider the slog of getting to Shannon. No trains. A bus which takes 2 1/2 hours. No wonder connecting in DUB, LHR or AMS is a more attractive proposition. A direct flight from Cork is better again.
However, I can see the point that it's not the best next step in the airports development. As much as new routes, I'd like to see greater frequency on existing ones - Amsterdam and Manchester returning to 2x daily, Paris going to 2x daily, all the UK routes with a frequency lower than 1x daily going to daily. As regards new routes, Frankfurt would be as important as a US route.
Mind you, if a US route turns up, I won't be complaining.
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mark heg,A319 or A320 isnt an option really for pax TA over the water,3000 miles over land in USA/Europe is fine,not Ireland to East Coast USA,not really suitable when ETOPS comes in to account.
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Just found these new pics of the new terminal. Looking very good I must say. Can't wait for it to be done 
http://www.flickr.com/photos/royskeane/show
http://www.flickr.com/photos/royskeane/show
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I agree completely with "FlyCorkInternational", I myself am one of those pax either travelling to snn or connecting in heathrow and i can assure you I am one of many.
Those pics look cool of the new terminal. Can the old terminal still be utilized? I thought i heard that Ryan air were looking into running it? or what is the story with it. I think if they were going to do it up and manage it well then let them off would bring a lot to area.
I see from the new pics that there is construction for a new hotel? Isn't the one that is already there struggling why does the airport need a new hotel? Don't we need more area for stands?? Also is the new ATC tower being built? that would be much more benefical to the area. There is also a hangar being constructed right next to the cargo ramp, wouldn't it be better to move the cargo ramp and use it for future growth?? Who is going to be using the hangar right beside the cargo ramp? Wouldnt it also make sense to move it to an area that wont be as utilized?
Those pics look cool of the new terminal. Can the old terminal still be utilized? I thought i heard that Ryan air were looking into running it? or what is the story with it. I think if they were going to do it up and manage it well then let them off would bring a lot to area.
I see from the new pics that there is construction for a new hotel? Isn't the one that is already there struggling why does the airport need a new hotel? Don't we need more area for stands?? Also is the new ATC tower being built? that would be much more benefical to the area. There is also a hangar being constructed right next to the cargo ramp, wouldn't it be better to move the cargo ramp and use it for future growth?? Who is going to be using the hangar right beside the cargo ramp? Wouldnt it also make sense to move it to an area that wont be as utilized?
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There have been some excellent contributions to this thread in the last week and through it all the nitty gritty of the business at Cork Airport is at last being examined.
Mark_Heg has a lot of it in a nutshell. Whether the business being sought for Cork is a flight to America or more new routes from EI or FR to Britain and Europe it must come down to how well the Cork Airport Authority does it's job of marketing.
Who is in charge of marketing at Cork Airport? A position as marketing boss was advertised in the newspapers during the summer to replace Mr John Smyth. Has anyone yet been appointed?
The new Ryanair routes starting next week are Dublin and London Gatwick. This alone says a lot as both Aer Arann and easyJet are all ready serving the limited markets. An unusual strategy from Ryanair to introduce new capacity on all ready established routes and from mid January Cork will be down a Stansted flight too. Very simply, why no brand new routes ex Cork from Ryanair?
Ryan2000 poses the question about the whole Slattertys New York debacle. Fuel prices began to settle down again not long after the announced cancellation of the series. Perhaps, Ryan International were going to the trough for more from Slatterys but the conspirator in me really hopes that was all. The launch of the series was within just six weeks of start.
Without getting bogged down too much about America as I would have done in the past do not be taken in by the doubt if there is viability for such a route from Cork to America.
That is a 2.5 hour spin from the enemy and which for a long, long time suited EI very well and maybe still does?
Mark_Heg has a lot of it in a nutshell. Whether the business being sought for Cork is a flight to America or more new routes from EI or FR to Britain and Europe it must come down to how well the Cork Airport Authority does it's job of marketing.
Who is in charge of marketing at Cork Airport? A position as marketing boss was advertised in the newspapers during the summer to replace Mr John Smyth. Has anyone yet been appointed?
The new Ryanair routes starting next week are Dublin and London Gatwick. This alone says a lot as both Aer Arann and easyJet are all ready serving the limited markets. An unusual strategy from Ryanair to introduce new capacity on all ready established routes and from mid January Cork will be down a Stansted flight too. Very simply, why no brand new routes ex Cork from Ryanair?
Ryan2000 poses the question about the whole Slattertys New York debacle. Fuel prices began to settle down again not long after the announced cancellation of the series. Perhaps, Ryan International were going to the trough for more from Slatterys but the conspirator in me really hopes that was all. The launch of the series was within just six weeks of start.
Without getting bogged down too much about America as I would have done in the past do not be taken in by the doubt if there is viability for such a route from Cork to America.
That is a 2.5 hour spin from the enemy and which for a long, long time suited EI very well and maybe still does?