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Join Date: May 2006
Location: UK
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From the conference call today apparently some 28 resignations this month alone, that’s got to tell you something (if I got that wrong I’ll edit, was half asleep from a flight).
I’ve heard of people going to BA especially now they are taking direct to LH, Jet2, DHL ( didn’t know they were hiring again), some back to easy and the Sandpit. Everyone you speak to is looking and thinking of jumping. It’s partly from the t&c’s and work life balance but also lots still not sure it’s going to survive. They keep saying this is the year they make money…well how have we not with the loads and the ticket prices?
i don’t know how many new joiners we are getting month but I would be shocked if it’s close to that many. So the end result is already tired and fed up crews are going to be worked harder and get more tired and go sick and the circle repeats…
and to really inspire the troops the new head of flight crew pilot manager or whatever silly title he’s given himself gave us all an admonishment about the Christmas sickness….
numbers wise about 9% down on the f/o ranks for the foreseeable future and most likely staying bad as more bug out.
I’ve heard of people going to BA especially now they are taking direct to LH, Jet2, DHL ( didn’t know they were hiring again), some back to easy and the Sandpit. Everyone you speak to is looking and thinking of jumping. It’s partly from the t&c’s and work life balance but also lots still not sure it’s going to survive. They keep saying this is the year they make money…well how have we not with the loads and the ticket prices?
i don’t know how many new joiners we are getting month but I would be shocked if it’s close to that many. So the end result is already tired and fed up crews are going to be worked harder and get more tired and go sick and the circle repeats…
and to really inspire the troops the new head of flight crew pilot manager or whatever silly title he’s given himself gave us all an admonishment about the Christmas sickness….
numbers wise about 9% down on the f/o ranks for the foreseeable future and most likely staying bad as more bug out.
Join Date: May 2006
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What’s left? Potentially a fast-ish LH command and you don’t have to wear a hat. Probably the best remaining perk is that when the doors are shut and LHR is left behind, it’s still a company filled with very talented, professional and fun loving colleagues to enjoy a day or 2 downroute with.
@NatZulu; not going to get drawn into it here but what is a fact is that the vast majority of pilots were offered re-employment, and a handful were not.
You and I can speculate on the ‘real’ reasons all day, and I am certain each case has individual circumstances, but it's also clear from your posts here, and those you’ve made on the other non-anonymous forums, that not everyone shares your interpretation of events or ‘facts’. But I’m sure you’ll get your day in court, and sincerely hope you find some closure as a result.
You and I can speculate on the ‘real’ reasons all day, and I am certain each case has individual circumstances, but it's also clear from your posts here, and those you’ve made on the other non-anonymous forums, that not everyone shares your interpretation of events or ‘facts’. But I’m sure you’ll get your day in court, and sincerely hope you find some closure as a result.
@NatZulu; not going to get drawn into it here but what is a fact is that the vast majority of pilots were offered re-employment, and a handful were not.
You and I can speculate on the ‘real’ reasons all day, and I am certain each case has individual circumstances, but it's also clear from your posts here, and those you’ve made on the other non-anonymous forums, that not everyone shares your interpretation of events or ‘facts’. But I’m sure you’ll get your day in court, and sincerely hope you find some closure as a result.
You and I can speculate on the ‘real’ reasons all day, and I am certain each case has individual circumstances, but it's also clear from your posts here, and those you’ve made on the other non-anonymous forums, that not everyone shares your interpretation of events or ‘facts’. But I’m sure you’ll get your day in court, and sincerely hope you find some closure as a result.
Unless you’re privy to the facts your opinion is meaningless as it’s based on incorrect information. To assume what happened based on rumour, hearsay, conjecture, supposition etc is really not helpful. I know the facts surrounding the redundancy process at VAA whereas you don’t. Therefore you are only guessing and should perhaps question your sources and not express an opinion unless you’re 100% sure of your facts.
Join Date: Sep 2023
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Hopefully any existing or any new SO’s that may have joined with some Airbus or Boeing experience, will get into the right hand seat straight away and moved over using some common sense.
is it true all command upgrade courses are now paused with the lack of FO’s?
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Utopia
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Any lack of FO’s can be placed largely on HR
and their D&I ‘policy of the season’… where numerous suitable and qualified candidates have been turned down at final interview. You reap what you sow.
Join Date: Jul 2023
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I know from good authority that some guys got there and then had rants about “woke this and that”. Very clever…
Join Date: Feb 2001
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They do give feedback, so I can categorically confirm that I was rejected for being insufficiently "woke", or words to that effect. (in my answers to the two woke probing questions). No ranting, I thought I was towing the woke line in a pragmatic way, but obviously it didn't come out the way they wanted. Treading on egg shells these days - can do without that.
Lucky escape by the sounds of it.
Lucky escape by the sounds of it.
My point proven…
There were even some posts in this forum that were very clear about that same point. Don’t like their uniform policy? Don’t apply. Don’t like their equality & diversity vision? Don’t apply. Don’t like that you can’t sexually harass your crew down route? Don’t apply. Go to Emirates if you want conservative.
Some are as equals as the others, but some tend to get to the last interview and say things that do not align with what VA wants, then act surprised. They are entitled to choose who they hire.
There were even some posts in this forum that were very clear about that same point. Don’t like their uniform policy? Don’t apply. Don’t like their equality & diversity vision? Don’t apply. Don’t like that you can’t sexually harass your crew down route? Don’t apply. Go to Emirates if you want conservative.
Some are as equals as the others, but some tend to get to the last interview and say things that do not align with what VA wants, then act surprised. They are entitled to choose who they hire.
They do give feedback, so I can categorically confirm that I was rejected for being insufficiently "woke", or words to that effect. (in my answers to the two woke probing questions). No ranting, I thought I was towing the woke line in a pragmatic way, but obviously it didn't come out the way they wanted. Treading on egg shells these days - can do without that.
Lucky escape by the sounds of it.
Lucky escape by the sounds of it.
It was as simple as siting down with a friend from an ethnic minority, or a female pilot or anyone from LGBTQ+, or someone with a disability and ask them “how is it truly like for you in aviation, under your skin?”.
With all due respect, it’s what truly intelligent people do, instead of listening to right wing demagoguery, they would go to the source and hear the human side. You cannot replicate or replace the human experience, and you cannot tell someone how they should feel about something. You would have learned something that would make you a more round individual, and you would be more prepared to answer a question like that even if you disagreed with it, but it would come from a place of understanding and honesty.
One would argue that they were the ones who dodged a bullet. Because “woke” is simply having or marked by an active awareness of systemic injustices and prejudices, especially those involving the treatment of ethnic, racial, or sexual minorities.
It is very clear in their website, the company values and ethos, it has changed and you don’t have to like it. Most curious is that you applied whilst disagreeing with it.
Go to a BA assessment and disagree with their mission, very likely they won’t hire you, same for most airline HR assessments. You need to prove to them that you are passionate about their brand and ethos, and even if you disagree with certain aspects. Problem with the anti-woke brigade is that they are usually awful and say deplorable things, like something racist followed by “we can’t say anything these days, treading on eggshells”.
Yes you can say what you want, it is freedom of speech, not freedom from consequences. Compassion, empathy, kindness, awareness of our privileges (most pilots are), awareness of the injustices in our system etc. It’s not that hard mate.
I have recruited pilots for years and have seen a lot of ugly things in recruitment, from racism to Islamophobia, sexism etc. The way things were before weren’t great either so I can blame them from trying to be inclusive.
Last edited by Raph737; 12th Feb 2024 at 20:59. Reason: Spelling
Join Date: May 2016
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