Leaving BA for low cost
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1. Can EZY FO's really not park?! seems odd to me!
Correct. PF taxis in after landing, and if that is the FO, then just approaching stand hands control to CM1 (Cpt) who parks, CM2 (FO, or RHS LTC) does the parking checklist and post-flight paperwork. Probably partly due to some of the guidance screens only being configured for the LHS, but mostly probably due to insurance costs given most FOs are pretty inexperienced compared to legacy/charter airlines. Exception to that is remote holding, which is holding not parking.
2. Can FO's call stop? surprised me during the sim check when the skipper took over the thrust levers on TO, hadn't seen that coming.
Also correct. FO calls what they see, captain makes the decision to Stop/Go. Exception being if there is a Trainer on the jump seat then they can also call stop if agreed with the operating captain agrees, or during command assessment at the end of command line training (where you fly with an ordinary FO in the RHS). Again, probably due to FO experience.
3. Is the atmosphere at Easy as relaxed as it seemed during the recruitment day? For the most part it's very relaxed, lots of brilliant people, really enjoyable days out.
4. How often do trips change on the roster? as a general rule I don't mind what I do on a particular day at work but I would like to know when i'm not working!
Roster stability can be hit and miss, but your days off are your days off, and you can refuse to operate into them (ie delayed duty on your last day of work, looks like it'll be landing at 1am, you can decline to work that duty). If you choose to, then you get a WIDO payment, either 1/2 rate or full rate (plus another day off) depending on how long into your day off. Often there'll be lots of roster instability in summer, but we have BALPA-agreed short notice change refusals... where we can reject a change within 48 hours if it's more than 2 hours different.
5. Hows LTN as a base?
Pass, I'm not based there.
6. Any other up to date factors which may influence my decision to take/ not take them up on an offer?
Joining as a DEC SFO, you'd be eligible to start the command process within 6 months of joining, so could realistically be in the LHS within a two years. No seniority to worry about, preferential bidding system for earlys/lates/nightstops/etc. Terms are always improving here, and fatigue management is getting better too, they're years ahead of other airlines on that one.
I'm hearing of several colleagues who left to BA who are regretting it and wanting to come back. Some got SH LGW, some got SH LHR, some got DEP LH. At least one of each wants to come back to EZY... I'd say up to 1/3 are not happy with their move!
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So questions wise,
1. Can EZY FO's really not park?! seems odd to me!
2. Can FO's call stop? surprised me during the sim check when the skipper took over the thrust levers on TO, hadn't seen that coming.
3. Is the atmosphere at Easy as relaxed as it seemed during the recruitment day?
4. How often do trips change on the roster? as a general rule I don't mind what I do on a particular day at work but I would like to know when i'm not working!
5. Hows LTN as a base?
6. Any other up to date factors which may influence my decision to take/ not take and offer
2- CM1 has the responsibility to call stop. The skipper is the only one with his hands on the thrust levers. As PM you can bring anything to CM1’s attention but the responsibility lies with CM1
3- I don’t know how things are in BA but we’re pretty relaxed in Orangeland.
4- After roster publication your days off are
sacred, they will not change and you have the ability to refuse certain changes to your schedule within 48 hours of your duty. If you opt for fixed roster you can extrapolate your days off for years in the future with the exception of the reserve months (2 a year) where you have flexible roster. Within your working days you can experience disruption but our fatigue management system is not punitive and can be used if you’re not feeling up to the task.
Can’t help you with 5 or 6 as I haven’t been LTN based or worked at BA. PM me if you have any more questions.
Kind Regards
Polo
LHS LGW
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Originally Posted by monquay 
1. Can EZY FO's really not park?! seems odd to me!
Correct. PF taxis in after landing, and if that is the FO, then just approaching stand hands control to CM1 (Cpt) who parks, CM2 (FO, or RHS LTC) does the parking checklist and post-flight paperwork. Probably partly due to some of the guidance screens only being configured for the LHS, but mostly probably due to insurance costs given most FOs are pretty inexperienced compared to legacy/charter airlines. Exception to that is remote holding, which is holding not parking.
2. Can FO's call stop? surprised me during the sim check when the skipper took over the thrust levers on TO, hadn't seen that coming.
Also correct. FO calls what they see, captain makes the decision to Stop/Go. Exception being if there is a Trainer on the jump seat then they can also call stop if agreed with the operating captain agrees, or during command assessment at the end of command line training (where you fly with an ordinary FO in the RHS). Again, probably due to FO experience.
3. Is the atmosphere at Easy as relaxed as it seemed during the recruitment day? For the most part it's very relaxed, lots of brilliant people, really enjoyable days out.
4. How often do trips change on the roster? as a general rule I don't mind what I do on a particular day at work but I would like to know when i'm not working!
Roster stability can be hit and miss, but your days off are your days off, and you can refuse to operate into them (ie delayed duty on your last day of work, looks like it'll be landing at 1am, you can decline to work that duty). If you choose to, then you get a WIDO payment, either 1/2 rate or full rate (plus another day off) depending on how long into your day off. Often there'll be lots of roster instability in summer, but we have BALPA-agreed short notice change refusals... where we can reject a change within 48 hours if it's more than 2 hours different.
5. Hows LTN as a base?
Pass, I'm not based there.
6. Any other up to date factors which may influence my decision to take/ not take them up on an offer?
Joining as a DEC SFO, you'd be eligible to start the command process within 6 months of joining, so could realistically be in the LHS within a two years. No seniority to worry about, preferential bidding system for earlys/lates/nightstops/etc. Terms are always improving here, and fatigue management is getting better too, they're years ahead of other airlines on that one.
1. Can EZY FO's really not park?! seems odd to me!
Correct. PF taxis in after landing, and if that is the FO, then just approaching stand hands control to CM1 (Cpt) who parks, CM2 (FO, or RHS LTC) does the parking checklist and post-flight paperwork. Probably partly due to some of the guidance screens only being configured for the LHS, but mostly probably due to insurance costs given most FOs are pretty inexperienced compared to legacy/charter airlines. Exception to that is remote holding, which is holding not parking.
2. Can FO's call stop? surprised me during the sim check when the skipper took over the thrust levers on TO, hadn't seen that coming.
Also correct. FO calls what they see, captain makes the decision to Stop/Go. Exception being if there is a Trainer on the jump seat then they can also call stop if agreed with the operating captain agrees, or during command assessment at the end of command line training (where you fly with an ordinary FO in the RHS). Again, probably due to FO experience.
3. Is the atmosphere at Easy as relaxed as it seemed during the recruitment day? For the most part it's very relaxed, lots of brilliant people, really enjoyable days out.
4. How often do trips change on the roster? as a general rule I don't mind what I do on a particular day at work but I would like to know when i'm not working!
Roster stability can be hit and miss, but your days off are your days off, and you can refuse to operate into them (ie delayed duty on your last day of work, looks like it'll be landing at 1am, you can decline to work that duty). If you choose to, then you get a WIDO payment, either 1/2 rate or full rate (plus another day off) depending on how long into your day off. Often there'll be lots of roster instability in summer, but we have BALPA-agreed short notice change refusals... where we can reject a change within 48 hours if it's more than 2 hours different.
5. Hows LTN as a base?
Pass, I'm not based there.
6. Any other up to date factors which may influence my decision to take/ not take them up on an offer?
Joining as a DEC SFO, you'd be eligible to start the command process within 6 months of joining, so could realistically be in the LHS within a two years. No seniority to worry about, preferential bidding system for earlys/lates/nightstops/etc. Terms are always improving here, and fatigue management is getting better too, they're years ahead of other airlines on that one.
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MXP, NCE: A very long time... very!
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Sorry for the thread drift... I genuinely thought EZY were the champion of Standard Airbus SOP, allowing the FO to taxi and park. Was it changed recently?. BTW, please could someone tell me exactly which stand parking guidance system is calibrated for the LHS. Looking at the history books of aviation, there was one and I haven't come across it in my 10 year career yet.
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Money wise you are better off on the continent (France, Italy or Germany).
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Sorry for the thread drift... I genuinely thought EZY were the champion of Standard Airbus SOP, allowing the FO to taxi and park. Was it changed recently?. BTW, please could someone tell me exactly which stand parking guidance system is calibrated for the LHS. Looking at the history books of aviation, there was one and I haven't come across it in my 10 year career yet.
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AMS stop line and guidance is set up for LHS also. Who cares anyway? Shouldn’t base the job on who parks. Also don’t think the insurance covers the Fo. Personally I think it’s the best short haul job going. People are awesome and fairly relaxed across the network.
Never felt pressured with fuel decisions etc and on the odd occasion I have had to go fatigue in 15 years never questioned once. Preferential bidding for me personally has been superb.
Never felt pressured with fuel decisions etc and on the odd occasion I have had to go fatigue in 15 years never questioned once. Preferential bidding for me personally has been superb.
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FO can sling it down the runway at 130 knots with a twenty knot crosswind but can’t taxi it in a straight line at 3 knots and apply a little gentle braking to stop when the guidance tells them to. Makes perfect sense to me (sic). If the guidance is for the LHS only then whats wrong with a transfer of control to park on stand at the limited number of airfields that that situation applies to? Not exactly a hard remedy to a non existent problem really.
I agree it’s not really a big deal in the greater scheme of things but its an absolutely pathetic SOP.
I agree it’s not really a big deal in the greater scheme of things but its an absolutely pathetic SOP.
So to you it's not important, but important enough to label "pathetic"?
Maybe leave your house a bit more. There's an abundance of non aviation relqted things to stimulate your mind out there.
Sciolist (look it up) of the first order
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FO can sling it down the runway at 130 knots with a twenty knot crosswind but can’t taxi it in a straight line at 3 knots and apply a little gentle braking to stop when the guidance tells them to. Makes perfect sense to me (sic). If the guidance is for the LHS only then whats wrong with a transfer of control to park on stand at the limited number of airfields that that situation applies to? Not exactly a hard remedy to a non existent problem really.
I agree it’s not really a big deal in the greater scheme of things but its an absolutely pathetic SOP.
I agree it’s not really a big deal in the greater scheme of things but its an absolutely pathetic SOP.
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You don’t join an airline for its SOPs, I’m pretty sure of that one. If it were the case I doubt anyone would join BA (monitored approaches). That being said, I’m sure most take them their stride when they get there. Just my two cents
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But time to command should in theory be similar anywhere... if you're willing to move for your command.
Anyone who's an SFO in a small base (NCL etc) , or highly sought-after base (MXP), will be waiting (a very long time) for a captain to leave, or an aircraft to be added, for a command position to be available.
Anyone who is in a big base (LGW, LTN etc) with a high turnover, or is willing to move to one will not have to wait long for command once eligible for a course. Many will come to LGW for command and go onto the transfer list again to get back to where they want. Personal preference.
Short notice refusals are agreements between the company and the unions so will vary from country to country.
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You don’t join an airline for its SOPs, I’m pretty sure of that one.
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Speak for yourself. The SOP is what makes the job what it is. I've been at airlines with god awful SOPs where yabba yabba yabba and pointless box ticking and duplication is the order of the day and I've been at airlines with simple, smart SOPs where duplication is next to zero. Guess which one had more incidents? Some SOPs truly wear you down. And in an industry with so much else to wear you down, that matters. You're kidding yourself if you think other wise.
How complicated aviation SOPs has become!
In my time in Big Airways the pilot flying the sector took over at engine start, after normally being included in the pre flight fuel decisions etc. Personally I also briefed the Senior CC to discuss any inflight problems firstly with the P2 when flying the sector, as good pre command experience.
The whole flight was conducted from the appropriate seat, taxi ,flying to touchdown (prior to the introduction of the MA after the BEA merger) taxi in and parking. Obviously if the parking guidance was set up for the LHS then then handover took place at a convenient time near the Stand. On a P2 sector they also were able to call Stop on takeoff, his/hers hand remained on the thrust levers until V1. That SOP remains today.
The only P2 restrictions I remember were Cat 1 limits, and X wind limit 15/20kts I think, and of course the Capt. always carried out low vis approaches/Autolands. Also on my type, A/P off A/T off.
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To revive an old post, in part thanks to the current climate at BA, I'm wondering how many are still like minded to leave. I meet people on the jet bridge regularly who are at their wits end and I'm one of them.
If you're looking to leave, where to?
If you're looking to leave, where to?
well that can take you places...
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If I were going to nitpick an SOP that just is a bit odd, it’s the Non handling pilot selection of reverse.
I would much prefer to work for an outfit though that has an oddity like that though but trusts me as an experienced professional to pull the thrust levers from RHS or call stop as the heavy in the middle seat. Suppose it comes down to trust and experience.
