Terms and Endearment The forum the bean counters hoped would never happen. Your news on pay, rostering, allowances, extras and negotiations where you work - scheduled, charter or contract.

Joining Ryanair

Old 7th Nov 2017, 19:54
  #181 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: on a beach
Age: 64
Posts: 331
You are in a good company with very good conditions flying 800 hrs. a year and you are
thinking about joining Ryanair to fly more. You must be out of your mind!
beachbumflyer is offline  
Old 7th Nov 2017, 19:55
  #182 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Usually on airways
Posts: 65
No friends and privat life? more than 800h ?!
Wingman82 is offline  
Old 7th Nov 2017, 20:50
  #183 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: Anywhere and nowhere
Posts: 96
Originally Posted by Tom4 View Post
flyingmed,Ronand: Firstly thank you for advice.

For the moment I am in good company and I can truly say that we have very good conditions. But honestly I would like to fly more (do not judge me because of this), I heard that in ryr you will get 900hrs per year "with out" mercy as FO. I have got 800hrs in my last 12 months but I would like to fly more. ->this is the reason

Actually I do not want to quit right now, but I wanna look around little but. Also heard that in FlyDubai you will be "bird", but there is min. req. 1500tt.

I wish you all the best guys!
Flydubai will love you
Newcomer2 is offline  
Old 7th Nov 2017, 21:15
  #184 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: France
Age: 34
Posts: 93
Oh my god !
800hr and want to fly more !
You make me think about you do people iny airline, we are limited to 750 HR a years, but if you want you can ask to have this limit removed and go back to the normal 900hr ! Ofc no really extra salary, ... I was surprised of how many young guys took it.

This word is crazy !
Flocks is offline  
Old 7th Nov 2017, 21:16
  #185 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Neither here nor there
Age: 36
Posts: 209
You want to fly more hahahaha.... Go to Lionair they do over 1100 hrs a year. Or maybe better go to a psychiatrist!
It is people like you that are ruining it for everyone else...

Last edited by Ronand; 7th Nov 2017 at 21:40.
Ronand is offline  
Old 7th Nov 2017, 22:41
  #186 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2016
Location: The EU
Posts: 233
Why is this thread still going? It's quite clear that nobody should be "joining Ryanair" any time soon.
Vokes55 is offline  
Old 8th Nov 2017, 01:33
  #187 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Ireland
Posts: 82
What is wrong with wanting to do more of what you love. With the added bonus for a pilot of quicker logging more of the hours vital for promotion to captain. Good on you Tom4. Was once in a similar position but got slated by coworkers stating that I was driving up the pressure on others that had a life outside work, and it was not fair to older employees that couldn't keep up. Left shortly after. In the next company I quietly had a word with management and they scheduled me for some extra.
vikingivesterled is offline  
Old 8th Nov 2017, 06:58
  #188 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Uk
Posts: 2
Ah, the innocence and stupidity of youth.

Give it ten years when you've had enough of being flogged relentlessly and you may just decide , " be careful what you wish for ".

Or you can grow up and get a life outside work.
Meester proach is offline  
Old 8th Nov 2017, 09:18
  #189 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: last time I looked I was still here.
Posts: 4,510
There's aviating, sitting in the front seat, as a passenger, watching the fluffy clouds go by, romancing at the stars on your 4th night flight, wondering how the sun sank in the same window as it rose, wondering when you will get a chance to stretch your legs and get some blood flow into your muscles, wondering why your eyes feel so dry and your skin so greasy, watching the nose of the a/c follow the magenta line, watching the auto thrust control the speeds small deviations, watching the FD stay centred all the time, listening to the snores of the guy in the other seat who succumbed to the efforts of saying awake, watching the a/c follow the ILS to 500' and you doing exactly what ATC tell you to do (worse than being married) then an OMG moment as you need to sharpened up and disconnect it all to create a controlled arrival. You then spend a few moments trying to remember were you've parked you are on this day, not yesterday.
And then there's real flying. If you really want to fly lots & lots and be a real commercial pilot then join Highlands & Islands or go island hopping in Caribbean, or float plane flying in Scandinavia or west Canada, or fly for Suzi in Indonesia, or go to Botswana and fly the bush, or go to Air Alaska battle the elements. Live simple & have fun. Or you can strap an aluminium tube to your backside for hours on end and hopefully pay the mortgage and a decent car and finish with a retirement pot after 40 years with the piloting skills of a rooster and wonder what happened to the hobbies of our youth and the first 2 wives.
But hey, go for it and all success.
RAT 5 is offline  
Old 8th Nov 2017, 12:23
  #190 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: Huxley
Posts: 48
Originally Posted by Tom4 View Post
But honestly I would like to fly more (do not judge me because of this), I heard that in ryr you will get 900hrs per year "with out" mercy as FO. I have got 800hrs in my last 12 months but I would like to fly more. ->this is the reason
I have the better part of a decade in Ryanair. I will tell you what I believe an overwhelming majority of Ryanair pilots would tell you;

I would STRONGLY advise against joining Ryanair because you want to fly a few more hours.

I would fairly strongly advise against joining for any reason except impending financial ruin.

They couldn't possibly care less about staff. If you get cancer, they'll ring you every few months - they wont ask how you are, they will only ask when you can get back to the line.

You will be treated extremely rudely by crew control/rostering/anyone you have contact with. I know some who was denied parental leave for their child being born, because they hadnt worked there long enough (they had worked there for several years but Ryanair had recently, and without many options, changed their contract).

You get paid wrong - "ah Yeah, well you'll get the rest in next month's pay or the month after" - "next month? Wait that doesn't sound*other guy hangs up*

People on the outside always reply to these things "ah sure well it's not great there, but I can live without being cuddled and babied by an employer"

Those that join, without exception, change their tune when they experience the misery Ryanair has to heap on people seemingly randomly.

Most of your terms and conditions, except the very low basic pay (Ä20-25k for FOs and Ä60-70k for Captains)- are non-contractual and subject to change at a moment's notice.
I.e 5/4 roster (how's that going), annual leave (hahahaha), sector pay (upto >50% of your income, depending on rank). So on and so forth.

Ever been fatigued (now I'm into dangerous legal ground)? Nobody has, Michael says it's impossible. Even when you are sent out of base for months at a time.

I could go on.

That is why they're stuffed, don't believe the spin; they are very stuffed. It is not business as usual.
TheMightyAtom is offline  
Old 8th Nov 2017, 12:55
  #191 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: London
Posts: 8
TheMightyAtom / Vokes55 speak the truth.

My husband worked his ass off for O'Leary for seven years. He came to the end of his tether (could write reams as to the reasons why but you already get the gist of attitude towards their 'contractors' in this and other threads) and left 18 months ago.

Shortly after leaving a brown envelope turned up on our doorstep....HMRC were investigating us for tax fraud. It was no coincidence, I know, and am communicating with, other pilots who have encountered the exact same treatment. On leaving they received the brown envelope too....

Ryanairs attitude - you dare to walk away? then we will dob you in to HMRC so you can battle with the tax man following the way in which we instructed you to join as 'self employed' ..... honestly, you couldn't make this stuff up!

Please, don't even consider joining Ryanair.
AgainstTheMachine is offline  
Old 9th Nov 2017, 09:53
  #192 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Southern Europe
Posts: 215
Was once in a similar position but got slated by coworkers stating that I was driving up the pressure on others that had a life outside work, and it was not fair to older employees that couldn't keep up. Left shortly after. In the next company I quietly had a word with management and they scheduled me for some extra.
VoilŠ ... Everyone was happy !
-The coworkers on the previous outfit were happy that you left ...
-You were happy as you finally had the opportunity to be hero and stand out of the pack ...
zerograv is offline  
Old 12th Nov 2017, 17:38
  #193 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Ireland
Posts: 82
Except maybe management. Within a few years all my ex coworkers where either pensioned off early or moved on into contracting. Helped on their way with some short-term economical incentives that was a financial win for them but not the profession.
vikingivesterled is offline  
Old 14th Nov 2017, 09:27
  #194 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Far East
Posts: 54
As a Capt in FR on a FR contract based in the UK , what happens at age 60? I was told that this contract expires and you revert to just the self employed hourly rate type of deal.
Is this correct or is the FR contract maintained through to 65 if desired?
wisecaptain is offline  
Old 14th Nov 2017, 10:58
  #195 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: In the twilight zone
Posts: 216
So, I have to pay for coffee and water, then I'll burn more fuel.
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...or-union-fight
The Range is offline  
Old 14th Nov 2017, 12:09
  #196 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Essex
Posts: 14
Originally Posted by wisecaptain View Post
As a Capt in FR on a FR contract based in the UK , what happens at age 60? I was told that this contract expires and you revert to just the self employed hourly rate type of deal.
Is this correct or is the FR contract maintained through to 65 if desired?
FR contract through to 65. There are a few guys on a FR contract over 65.
800driver is offline  
Old 14th Nov 2017, 22:58
  #197 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Hiding from the mother in law
Posts: 56
Re Ranges Bloomberg article. I must say the arrogance of Mr Barry Norrisís comments is rather astonishing. In what way are the Ryanair pilots massively overplaying their hand? It seems to me that 400,000 unhappy passengers as a result of a little boo boo associated with a tad of a hiccup with pilot leave, might just lend a touch of weight to the slim possibility that just maybe, pilots are quite useful to an airline, dare I say it, even crucial.

The argument that love or loathe, Ryanair and by association OíLeary have been a successful model, is not deniable. Indeed, there is no reason to say that this success should not continue. But to effectively say by implication that pilots are overplaying the influence that they have on that success indicates to me a level of arrogance because I doubt very much that in his position it is naivety. If you accept the premis that pilots do have an influence on any success, it follows that they have an equal influence over failure. If it is true that shareholders would rather see flights grounded for 6 months than a unionised workforce, it also indicates a level of ignorance as to how successful unionisation can and I reiterate CAN be. I will be honest, I was wary of joining BALPA and indeed there are still huge flaws, but it at least made my company look at itself. Of course we can discuss many other issues of the other benefits and equal forms of cover, but this isnít my point. It is more that a unionised airline can still be successful and beneficial to all.

My final point and Iím aware Iím starting to ramble, is that the pilots thus far have shown incredible restraint and in fact Iím sure the general populous would be astonished to hear the pay rises that are being turned down. Those that do know are likely saying that pilots must be massively overpaid already then. The point they would be missing is that this isnít all about money. Going back to my company, a few years back it was not a happy ship. Pilots were leaving at a high rate and those that remained were constantly fearful. This isnít about my company though so I wonít go into the ins and outs, but suffice to say, with BALPA in place although generally in the background, things changed very rapidly. Yes, we did get a generous pay rise, but far from industry leading, and yes, we did get a couple of perks thrown in, but nothing to shout about, but the main thing was the cultural shift. We felt less and less, day by day that we had to fear the management, that sim sessions would be fair, promotions genuinely on merit and a feeling we could report genuine errors openly and we would be dealt with justly. This was more about the right people in the right job than anything. The result of this is that although we know (if you believe the offer) that we could make significantly more money moving to Ryanair, I know of nobody considering such a thing. We are recruiting easily and retaining more than we ever have. This is quite a statement knowing what is on offer out there now in the industry.

To sum it up, the pilots are far from being greedy and are seeking fairness, security and stability as their priority beyond money. This has been clearly demonstrated by the lack of uptake of the offer on the table. Essentially, I believe their hand is as strong as they chose to make it, in fact, no significant hands have been played yet. I think the players have only just been dealt their cards. We will see just how strong the pilots hands are in due course. Iím certainly looking forward to the river card.
Harves is offline  
Old 15th Nov 2017, 07:29
  #198 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: Europe
Posts: 1,548
Ah, the innocence and stupidity of youth.
youth is sadly allocated incorrectly (wasted) on the young...
Rated De is offline  
Old 15th Nov 2017, 09:58
  #199 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Somerset
Posts: 101
Originally Posted by 800driver View Post
FR contract through to 65. There are a few guys on a FR contract over 65.
I am not so sure about this as the contract states 60!
thebeast is offline  
Old 15th Nov 2017, 11:03
  #200 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: UK
Age: 78
Posts: 3,682
Not Ryanair I know, but my last company contract stated that the normal retirement age was 60 but, in exceptional circumstances, this could be extended to 65 with the agreement of both parties. I flew until I was 65.
JW411 is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us Archive Advertising Cookie Policy Privacy Statement Terms of Service

Copyright © 2018 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.