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Jet2 Autumn 2014

Old 18th Oct 2016, 21:46
  #941 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Either the back of a sim, or wherever Crewing send me.
Posts: 892
The last number of direct entry FOs I flew with (one ex Jet2 and one ex Air Baltic) didn't get through. That's not to say they won't ever get through it but it's by no means a given.
Which is exactly why people moving because they think they have a better chance of getting an upgrade sooner is not the smartest idea, especially when you factor in the probability of having to move away from home.
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Old 19th Oct 2016, 18:31
  #942 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Centre of Universe
Posts: 269
Some FOs join as cadets and do 4 years in Ryanair and when the command comes around they don't make it
I'm getting too old. Cadet and 4 years later a Commander flying with a cadet.
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Old 20th Oct 2016, 14:30
  #943 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Either the back of a sim, or wherever Crewing send me.
Posts: 892
Cadet and 4 years later a Commander flying with a cadet.
Therein lies the common issue these days, far too much expectation of having the command just because they've hit the magic xxxx hours threshold. The fact that they haven't really been round the block and learnt more life skills seems to be irrelevant to them.
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Old 20th Oct 2016, 16:07
  #944 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: EU
Posts: 1,218
Too many people are getting their command who shouldn't.

Last edited by Mikehotel152; 21st Oct 2016 at 18:50. Reason: Typo
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Old 20th Oct 2016, 19:59
  #945 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Either the back of a sim, or wherever Crewing send me.
Posts: 892
And to be fair, there are quite a few who don't get who really should.
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Old 20th Oct 2016, 21:38
  #946 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: North London at last
Posts: 91
So true JFP and Mikeh152. 10 years in, 4 redundancies, 3 years in ME, 7000 hours and I have had to go back to two stripes to get into our national.
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Old 21st Oct 2016, 08:39
  #947 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Eurozone
Posts: 150
I understand you can apply after 6 months and all boxes ticked
Under the new system that is a minimum of six months after the date of release to line. That is more like a year and possibly more on the 757 if you don't start line training until the winter season.

The good news is that providing you meet the criteria you will get a hearing unlike those airlines where you wait 15 years plus just because of your joining date or inside leg measurement or whatever those who slam the door and pull up the ladder have decided this week.

10 years in, 4 redundancies, 3 years in ME, 7000 hours and I have had to go back to two stripes to get into our national.
Try 21 years, more redundancies than will fit on the page, more than 10000 hours and all your friends hinting it is maybe time to give up, then ask for sympathy. Two stripes and a head full of grey hair is a bit embarrasing on the car park bus but it's only a uniform at the end of the day and most of the punters haven't a clue what the braid signifies. Two stripes is also a lot better than none at all.
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Old 21st Oct 2016, 11:13
  #948 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Sand free now
Posts: 193
So right JS. It is totally bonkers that seniority is only achievable within a company and is not transferable. No other industry still runs such an outdated system. This is why we have trashy terms and why we have children in the left hand seat.
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Old 22nd Oct 2016, 05:35
  #949 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Hooverville
Age: 79
Posts: 27
At one end of the scale you have seniority, at the other you have nepotism. Somewhere in the middle you have a meritocracy.

If for example you have 10 go for say 5 upgrade positions and all 10 day make the grade, then seniority is as good as way to order ascension as any.

Rotten industry? Maybe, or maybe just a byproduct of a rotten society.....
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Old 22nd Oct 2016, 10:33
  #950 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: uk
Posts: 289
Yes, Kirk. All of that.
Trouble with a meritocracy is that one is at the mercy of someone's idea of how much merit one has. In other words "Your face has to fit".
Seniority works when it works. It can be ridiculous. It worked for me just because the company I worked for was expanding so fast the line was going down faster than they could fill the gap. You still had to tick the boxes.
Much as I hate to admit it (don't know why I hate to admit it, I'm obviously as irrational as some training departments..!) but FR seem as close as anyone to getting it right.
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Old 22nd Oct 2016, 16:59
  #951 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: here
Posts: 31
Even in a seniority based airline, nepotism still exists.
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Old 22nd Oct 2016, 17:52
  #952 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Hooverville
Age: 79
Posts: 27
If you're selected or get through it's just, if you don't it's nepotism.

Is it really that difficult to see what constitutes a face that fits in? It's almost an in-house aptitude test and the faces that normally fit in are, by and large intelligent and normal. The real exceptions almost invariably define the meaning of nepotism. And the accusers of nepotism invariably define the meaning of misfits, not face not fits.....

Regarding the excellence of the RYR method;
The Pikeys training department and robust SOP's, coupled with very young aircraft are a proven product. I've flown with ex-LTC RYR on old aircraft and they were next to useless when it came to real world problems. Only quoted to say that there really is no perfect model, or employer.....and compared to other industries, which I've been in, pissing about in aircraft is still a million miles away from the drudgery that most working people suffer through every day of their working lives.
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Old 22nd Oct 2016, 19:39
  #953 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: here
Posts: 31
Well said kirk-out.
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Old 23rd Oct 2016, 09:16
  #954 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: LHS 737-800
Posts: 50
That is an interesting view point. I know
an ex RYR LTC (KLM UK before RYR) that was at Atlantic. A very competent individual and well able to deal with "first world problems". Are we talking about the same person?

You lack credibility.

Last edited by Lazydogg; 23rd Oct 2016 at 21:20.
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Old 23rd Oct 2016, 12:00
  #955 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Where the company needs me not where I want to be!
Posts: 400
Remember that everyone can have an off day.

Sometimes I go in and feel and operate what I perceive to be sharp as and on the ball like a real pro.

Some days I make many stupid errors and feel like a plank in the left seat. Ultimately though as long as it's a safe aircraft and gets A-B I don't really care if I forget to call MSA or do an RVSM altimeter check. As long as the situational awareness is there it's ok.

People can weigh to heavily on the polish sometimes and forget it's the overall operation that matters.
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Old 23rd Oct 2016, 14:59
  #956 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: uk
Posts: 289
That's the truth.
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Old 23rd Oct 2016, 15:45
  #957 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Either the back of a sim, or wherever Crewing send me.
Posts: 892
Dare we get this back to Jet2 recruitment details rather than its current bogged down state of FR vs Jet2 and Command upgrade procedures.

Jet2 will recruit getting on for 200 pilots for 2017, some have already started, I would imagine plenty of spaces are left to fill. Due to expansion the vacancies cover all pilot positions, from ab-initio right through to DEC Training Captains. ALL those that are eligible for internal upgrades are being offered the opportunity to prove themselves, from SFO to Captain, Captain to LTC, LTC to TRI and TRI to TRE.
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Old 25th Oct 2016, 07:40
  #958 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: UK
Posts: 74
Originally Posted by Johnny [email protected] Pants View Post
from SFO to Captain, Captain to LTC, LTC to TRI and TRI to TRE.
Says the TRE!

Other career paths are available.
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Old 25th Oct 2016, 11:05
  #959 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Either the back of a sim, or wherever Crewing send me.
Posts: 892
Says the TRE!
Sorry, I'm not with you?? Yes, I am a TRE, I followed that exact pathway to get there. Is my statement not correct?

All of those positions are available to those that qualify.
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Old 25th Oct 2016, 11:13
  #960 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: UK
Posts: 72
SFO > SFI > TRI ?
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