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Jet2 Autumn 2014

Old 21st Jan 2018, 13:15
  #1141 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: UK
Posts: 522
I echo zerotohero's comments. Lifestyle is a big factor at Jet2 and personally that's worth more than a few grand to me, I don't think that there's many other companies that can compete on these terms.
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Old 21st Jan 2018, 14:01
  #1142 (permalink)  
H44
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
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Posts: 45
Zerotohero, you go on about all those benefits as if theyíre big pluses for Jet2, but then I suppose if the only airline youíve got to compare with them is Ryanair then youíre inevitably going to see Jet2 as a shining light for how all airlines should treat their employees. The fact is that all decent airlines should offer these things, and a lot more besides. Productivity must have gone down since I worked for them as I consistently did 750 hours on the 737 at a big base.

Iím glad some terms and conditions have improved at Jet2 as itís important that airlines such as them improve conditions, rather than legacy airlines being dragged down to their level, but I have never understood this parochial view of Jet2 as the only airline that provides the lifestyle that everyone craves. If you look at the provincial bases for EasyJet, Thomas Cook and TUI, they all offer better packages with similar hours.

Regarding BALPA, itís only as good as the pilot reps you have. My understanding of the ones Jet2 had a few years ago was that they approached PM in quite a confrontational manner so never really gained any traction in developing a win-win relationship with the airline management.
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Old 21st Jan 2018, 15:09
  #1143 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 1999
Posts: 250
I dont think any hostility came from the reps! IIRC it came directly, and very forcibly, from PM.
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Old 21st Jan 2018, 15:38
  #1144 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Either the back of a sim, or wherever Crewing send me.
Posts: 978
Don’t forget the extra leave every few years for length of service.
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Old 22nd Jan 2018, 12:17
  #1145 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Braintree
Posts: 17
I think topping out on a basic of 101k at Jet2 is rather low compared to the other big UK operators.

At our airline (uk charter) another 30k on top of that would get you to the Capt top scale basic, plus a further 20/25k ish in allowances and sector pay.

Jet2 Pilots shouldnít undersell themselves as weíve seen with the likes of RYR it has an affect on the overall lowering of T&Cís for the rest of us.

The pension, private healthcare, local base, paid medicals taxis and hotels etc etc..is a given at most other UK airlines and not a perk.
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Old 22nd Jan 2018, 12:29
  #1146 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Midlands
Posts: 160
Originally Posted by H44 View Post
Zerotohero, If you look at the provincial bases for EasyJet, Thomas Cook and TUI, they all offer better packages
A bit of a misunderstanding here - Zerotohero is clearly talking about the Captain package for DECs... none of EZY, TCX or TUI offer DEC at regional bases (no DEC in TUI/TCX at all) and the hours for EZY are up at the top end. Sure, you could join at LGW or a foreign base and join a long list to get home, but now youíre sacrificing Home base and lifestyle for a few years. EZY is a great package for those whoíve been there a while and worked their way up from FO.

As a FO with no basing preference the package is, as you say, better. I just think thatís not the point that Zero was discussing.
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Old 22nd Jan 2018, 15:57
  #1147 (permalink)  
H44
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
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I fully understand that he’s talking about DEC packages, and clearly the ability to go straight in as a captain is one of the big advantages in choosing Jet2 over those other airlines. However, unless your desire to be a captain ASAP overrides all other considerations, the fact is that I’m on similar money to a Jet2 captain (much lower basic, but much higher sector/duty pay) in one of the other companies mentioned. Sure, time to command is a good few years, but over the course of the next 30 odd years, my earning potential is way higher where I am. Don’t get me wrong, being a captain is great, I was one for a few years, but for me, lifestyle and variety of flying were more powerful motivators than being a captain. Each to their own of course.
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Old 22nd Jan 2018, 16:18
  #1148 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Craggy Island
Posts: 67
Some of you still don’t get it. I don’t want to join Jet2 just for the money. I want a company that suits me and pays enough to be comfortable. The current vacancies availability, versus the basing, aircraft and rostering of other companies, just doesn’t suit ME. If you are happy..... great, well done! But please stop telling me that I’m mad for choosing a company that doesn’t suit YOU.
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Old 22nd Jan 2018, 16:43
  #1149 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Either the back of a sim, or wherever Crewing send me.
Posts: 978
I’m on similar money to a Jet2 captain (much lower basic, but much higher sector/duty pay)
- You are only on similar money then as you have to work much harder.

lifestyle and variety of flying were more powerful motivators
- that lifestyle of having to go to work more?? Variety of flying - Jet2 have 50odd routes dependent on your base, so unless you are talking about long haul and the detrimental effects that has on your lifestyle, I can't see variety as an issue.
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Old 22nd Jan 2018, 20:38
  #1150 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: UK
Posts: 25
Originally Posted by Johnny [email protected] Pants View Post
long haul and the detrimental effects that has on your lifestyle
Have you ever flown long haul as part of the operating crew on a proper long haul aircraft with crew rest areas and everything or are the detrimental effects you are talking about all hear say?

Having worked for Jet2 in the past and now flying LH I fully agree with what H44 wrote before. The Jet2 operation did get boring and I find much more variety flying for my current outfit.

How much comparison material do you have Johnny?
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Old 22nd Jan 2018, 22:59
  #1151 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Braintree
Posts: 17
I'd argue that Long-haul can offer a better lifestyle as you only go to work 3 to 4 times a month, do a a quick 24 hour stopover then have the rest of the week at home. Certainly the case having seen my two long-haul mates rosters.
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Old 23rd Jan 2018, 05:50
  #1152 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: UK
Age: 46
Posts: 210
Originally Posted by Johnny [email protected] Pants View Post
- You are only on similar money then as you have to work much harder.

- that lifestyle of having to go to work more?? Variety of flying - Jet2 have 50odd routes dependent on your base, so unless you are talking about long haul and the detrimental effects that has on your lifestyle, I can't see variety as an issue.
Still drinking that Kool Aid Johnny? Plenty of people have left Jet2 to fly long haul, very few complain about detrimental effects, and believe me, many were bored of flying to ALC and AGP at Jet2...

Not a criticism at all, and each to their own, live and let live etc. But please stop peddling that it is the best around, and everyone else has to work harder/longer/detrimentally...
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Old 23rd Jan 2018, 09:03
  #1153 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: London
Age: 41
Posts: 138
To bad PPRuNe doesn’t offer a like button. If it did “I’m off!” his/her post deserves a massive like!

An absolutely spot on post!
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Old 23rd Jan 2018, 10:06
  #1154 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: uk
Posts: 549
It is correct to say that everyone is different and fair enough that personal preference is key. I have flown long haul for 16 years and eventually thought that it was mega tedious and the time zone changes left me in a zombie like state while I attempted to recover until the next trip. I don't drink kool aid or any other North American soft drink but I have personally found Jet2 to be a breath of fresh air. Generally, 'reasonableness' prevails and issues such as basings are not contentious in that the company takes the mature view that people are more content to live near their homes. Quelle surprise. It is rather like working for an airline 20 years ago whereby it is possible to have a flexible and sensible approach to operational and personal issues. It's a thumbs up from me.
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Old 23rd Jan 2018, 10:40
  #1155 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Either the back of a sim, or wherever Crewing send me.
Posts: 978
Believe me, I am aware it's not the best there is, there is always room for further improvement, but there have been some significant gains over the past few years.

Have you ever flown long haul
You know that I haven't.

How much comparison material do you have Johnny?
I merely have to use the anecdotes of the not insignificant numbers of people that have joined from LH airlines detailing their jet lagged states during their days off to realise that there is a detrimental effect of the LH lifestyle.

But please stop peddling that it is the best around
Where have I stated that it is the best around? I just get fed up of people that don't really know running their often misguided judgements that we are treated so badly and attempt to put some positivity into why there are so many people who enjoy working for Jet2, after all we don't seem to have any trouble finding high quality people willing to leave other airlines (both of high and low repute) to join.
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Old 25th Jan 2018, 09:03
  #1156 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Eurozone
Posts: 153
I did longhaul for a number of airlines for nearly 15 years. I'm glad I did it, had lots of fun and saw places that I would otherwise never have seen.

I am also glad that I now fly to AGP and ALC (and TFS) because for all the good times and they used to be very good indeed, once you hit the 50 mark it just becomes exhausting and rather than getting into your gladrags after landing and painting the town red in Las Vegas or sitting on a Caribbean beach until daft O'clock drinking redstripe all you feel like doing is collapsing into bed and staying there for as long as possible. When the timeshift gets you up at 5.30am and you stagger down for breakfast you come to the horrible realisation that checkout is only a few hours away followed by a night sector back to Blighty where the biggest challenge is trying to keep your eyes open until the sun rages through the windscreen at 20 West and you end up sitting there like one of the Blues brothers wearing shades at 4 in the morning, with yesterdays papers plastered across the inadequate Boeing sunscreens to stop your eyes from watering. Even more glamorous is crawling out of the crew rest after 3 hours of fitful sleep, broken by a desperate need to pee, into the same sunrise and trying to gather sufficient mental capacity to talk on the HF or even land the sodding thing.

Its all great fun in your 30's and even 40's but once into your 6th decade you hit a brick wall physically and possibly emotionally since your constant absences mean that your other half no longer knows you, has become totally independent over the years and your presence at home is nothing more than a nuisance. Ditto the kids. You start to wonder how on earth you are going to get along when your rapidly approaching retirement finally happens. Many relationships do not survive that, even if they get that far.

Long haul is great, a must have experience for anyone in this game and although not everybody wants to do it, most probably want to give it a try. I would say do it and make sure you do it when you are still young enough to enjoy all that it can offer. The days of long stopovers in the sun might be fading but its a big world out there and you might as well see it and get paid for doing so if the opportunity arises. There are some who slog on around the globe until 65 but they must have the constitution of a Jedi, I'm pretty good for my age but I'm damned if I want to do it again, I don't think I could.

So, fill your boots with the big jets. The clouds look the same out of the windscreen of a 747 as they do out of a Cessna, as previous posters have said, its all lifestyle. The best option is to be in an airline that offers both and to those that are, good for you, for those of us who have been less fortunate in life's lottery and are in the twilight of our careers, there are a lot worse places to be than J2. Twenty minutes from work, no horrible commute, own bed most of the time, getting to know the wife again and discovering that we did in fact get hitched because we liked one another and still have things in common, being paid a fair whack on time every month, not having to look over our shoulders as the next redundancy hovers and having a life/interests outside of flying.

Shorthaul - maybe boring in your 30's/40's but great in your 50/60's as many ex longhaulers will testify.

Just my 2 bobs worth.

Last edited by zeddb; 25th Jan 2018 at 09:15.
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Old 25th Jan 2018, 10:08
  #1157 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: London
Posts: 6
An interesting thread , the whole LH v SH debate .
After flying SH for many many years and now in the LH game ( Iím 52 ) 3 different airlines , I can safely say that I MUCH prefer LH ,
Just thinking of those long summer months of slot delays , French strikes etc .....
Pretty standard to have a run of 5 earlies with the odd TFS and ACE chucked in for good measure , dragging yourself out of bed at 03:30 knowing that you will most definitely be late and it will probably be nearing a 13hr day !
Whilst now the longest sector is 11hrs and I can get off the AC and have a few beers with the crew ( some times a few nights down route but mostly bullets ) return home and have 4 days off with my family

Swings and roundabouts.....
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Old 25th Jan 2018, 10:37
  #1158 (permalink)  
Gender Faculty Specialist
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
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So, in conclusion, pilots choose what best suits them individually and only the sad egoists have a constant need to hype their own and denigrate the others.
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Old 25th Jan 2018, 12:17
  #1159 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Midlands
Posts: 160
Redbird1

Which long-haul outfit did you manage to get a DEC gig at, if you don’t mind me asking? Or did you choose to downgrade for lifestyle and he chance to try long-haul. I don’t think many Skippers will give up a command in their 50s unless they were fortunate enough to get in to BA long-haul at such a late stage in their careers. Glad it works for you though, as stated previously this thread only highlights the egos of individuals rather than the intention of the thread which was info on Jet2.

I did short-haul in my twenties, got bored and flew some big stuff then came back for lifestyle. Jet2 suits Captains who want regional bases and to be home most nights. Not sure about short-haul FOs as that’s not my field.
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Old 25th Jan 2018, 17:36
  #1160 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2018
Location: London
Posts: 6
I gave up Command and I am now in Virgin , been here for around 5 years now . Hopefully I wonít bump into Snapper he doesnít sound very pleasant.
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